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Turkey Day GDT Texans v Lions Week 12
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Underwood


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

X_Factor_40 wrote:


I was also wondering (I didn't read much of the GDT)... what is everyone's opinion on the Suh "Kick" or whatever you want to call it? Do you think it was intentional? I'm honestly not sure if it was or if it wasn't. His reputation certainly doesn't help his case, and he's weird with the media and I thought not talking kind of made him look bad. But, I'd like to hear what you guys had to say on the issue. Please don't freak out on me about it.. I'm just looking for an honest opinion.


I'm in the camp that thinks the kick was intentional, but the placement probably wasn't. I think he needs to be suspended again.
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lumberjackchris


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 2:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

texandominance wrote:
lumberjackchris wrote:
ServantofYHWH wrote:
We bust Kubs chops a lot but that play call for the bootleg in over time was a fantastic call that gave us a shot at making a 30 yard fg opposed to a 50 yarder.


Btw.... Cut Shayne Graham!


Link?


I think he is saying that we should, not that we did


Dangit TD got my hopes up Crying or Very sad
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ServantofYHWH


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

lumberjackchris wrote:
texandominance wrote:
lumberjackchris wrote:
ServantofYHWH wrote:
We bust Kubs chops a lot but that play call for the bootleg in over time was a fantastic call that gave us a shot at making a 30 yard fg opposed to a 50 yarder.


Btw.... Cut Shayne Graham!


Link?


I think he is saying that we should, not that we did


Dangit TD got my hopes up Crying or Very sad


Lol my bad Chris Laughing
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Dawgtx


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 5:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I was also wondering (I didn't read much of the GDT)... what is everyone's opinion on the Suh "Kick" or whatever you want to call it? Do you think it was intentional? I'm honestly not sure if it was or if it wasn't. His reputation certainly doesn't help his case, and he's weird with the media and I thought not talking kind of made him look bad. But, I'd like to hear what you guys had to say on the issue. Please don't freak out on me about it.. I'm just looking for an honest opinion.


I think the kick was intentional. I think he knew where Schaub was at, and made a swipe at him. I think kicking him where he kicked him was not intentional.

There was a little bit going on all day long seemed to me. An extra push, shove hit....and Suh's antics was just another case.
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EliteTexan80


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Post game thoughts:

- Sorry for the delay on this. Between talkin' Texans and managing this site with Webby, my batteries have been needing a recharge in terms of "EliteTexan80" on footballsfuture.com. Serving as a Global Mod is tiring at times; You sometimes forget that you're entitled to be a fan, amongst the warnings and SPAM and Mod recruitment jobs I get at times. I needed to unplug for a few days. What better time to do so than this week, where we give thanks for all that we have?

- 10 quarters of football over five days. I'm not the only one who needs a break, that much is for certain. This Texans team just ran the gauntlet, and were taken to the limit in a span of five days. They need the extra days off; If anyone has earned it, it's them.

- So, the Matt Schaub/Andre Johnson show keeps chugging along. Another 300+ day. Another 150+ day. This time, it was against a pass defense that was top 10, so no "Oh, it was just the Jags," nonsense we heard last week. These two have found themselves in a groove, and said groove is opening up lanes for Arian Foster, who was workmanlike in his 100+ outing. This offense is starting to sharpen up, like a serrated blade. Get that defense on point once again, and you have something that not many would be able to compete with, regardless of where games are played, or who's playing in said game.

- Dumb rule. Simply put, dumb rule. It worked to our advantage, but I know a dumb rule when I see one. Justin Forsett was down, and Jim Schwartz not understanding how to handle it cost them. But, I don't like to win on things like that, because that's all everyone is going to focus on. Not that we pushed the Lions out of FG range late in the game, not that we held Calvin Johnson to 2/37 in the last three quarters of the game, not that the Texans trio all had massive games - all the networks are going to talk about is that dumb rule.

- Kareem Jackson is right now running for the 2nd best defender on this team this season. The gap between him and NFL MVP JJ Watt is a pretty big one, but the gap between Jackson and #3 (Glover Quin or Danieal Manning?) is nearly as big as well. To say that Jackson has come a long way is a massive understatement; The guy has turned him game around, a complete 180 from the Jackson we saw in 2011 and 2010. Where in the past he was the weak link, this season he has been the glue that has kept this secondary together, drawing the tough assignments and making big plays when he picks his spots. If JJ Watt wasn't the NFL MVP, then Jackson would be getting love as the best Texans' defender.

- BTW, JJ Watt is the NFL MVP. Peyton Manning, Eli Manning, Aaron Rodgers, Matt Ryan, Adrian Peterson? Yeah, take a back seat to the best defensive player in the NFL, the centerpiece of the Texans unit and the most disruptive DL since Reggie White and Bruce Smith. JJ Watt is something special, and he's the biggest catalyst to the Texans' 10-1 record. He's singlehandedly won games for the team, and this past week is another reminder of how he is the best player in all of football in 2012.

- Forget suspending Ndonkeykong. He should be arrested for his thuggish ways. What he's done over the course of his career goes beyond what should be allowed in football, and someone needs to put him in handcuffs and throw him in a jail cell before he seriously hurts someone. There's a way to play this game, and Suh does NOT seem to get that. I wouldn't shed a tear if an OL were to roll on his leg and break his tibia/fibula and end his career, and I like to think of myself as a level headed fan who doesn't overreact to good and bad behavior. This guy is worse than Albert Haynesworth in terms of this sort of behavior, and you know it's bad when Fat Al is looking at you and saying "Damn, that fool is psycho..."
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Grasspike


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dawgtx wrote:
Quote:
I was also wondering (I didn't read much of the GDT)... what is everyone's opinion on the Suh "Kick" or whatever you want to call it? Do you think it was intentional? I'm honestly not sure if it was or if it wasn't. His reputation certainly doesn't help his case, and he's weird with the media and I thought not talking kind of made him look bad. But, I'd like to hear what you guys had to say on the issue. Please don't freak out on me about it.. I'm just looking for an honest opinion.


I think the kick was intentional. I think he knew where Schaub was at, and made a swipe at him. I think kicking him where he kicked him was not intentional.

There was a little bit going on all day long seemed to me. An extra push, shove hit....and Suh's antics was just another case.


What Dawgtx said. He pretty clearly extended his leg in an effort to kick Schaub (rigidly flexing your leg straight out is not a natural position when hurtling through the air, not to mention the angle of his leg was begging for a hip/groin injury, which NFL bodies are trained to avoid), but I doubt he had the goal of kicking Schaub in the 'nads. Not because he would think that was a low blow, but because it would have been too difficult to aim a kick that well.
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lumberjackchris


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/11/26/matt-schaub-ndamukong-suh-is-not-houston-texan-worthy/


I love Schaub Cool
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Apollo Stallion


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 2:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

lumberjackchris wrote:
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/11/26/matt-schaub-ndamukong-suh-is-not-houston-texan-worthy/


I love Schaub Cool


While the "kick" got more attention due to the particularly sensitive area it targeted, there was a play just a few downs later that was more troublesome as Suh drug Schaub down by the inside shoulder pads and drove him face first into the turf in what I would best call a "reverse horse collar" (donkey collar?). Suh didn't make a single tackle in the game but still hit Schaub 5 times and this one looked to my eye similar to the Cutler hit with Suh violently trying to use the ground as a weapon and concuss or break ribs, shoulders, clavicles. It was actually this hit that got Kubiak up in the refs face after the change of possession as it clarified that Suh was out of control and intending to injure.

I personally loved seeing Kubiak getting all over the ref both in the sense that he finally understands that "working a ref" is an important role of a head coach and that he signaled to his team that they needed to stand up and protect our season too. I don't know if anyone else caught Antonio mixing it up on the very next series, but in a contained "send a message without getting flagged" manner he has evolved to since the first Ravens game last year where he was justified but still crossed the line and hurt the team. We will never know, but it is possible that the refs were being hyper vigilant in not blowing the whistle on the Forsett play because Kubiak had already been working them and was just a bit in their head, not to mention Rick Smith's power on the competition committee which is something they are all aware of on gamedays. I used to get all bent out of shape with the Steelers seemingly getting every darn call, but Cowher was a master at playing it cool with the refs until he really needed to get "the chin" working and the Rooneys power in the league office always seemed to skew things a bit in their direction, but frankly the way they handle bs in their organization has reinforced the league's faith (Ben has been squeaky clean since his suspension got reduced). These are still humans in charge and Jim Schwartz has a few marks on his record (although I thought taking accountability was a class move and I love that he's stuck Titus in time out for repeatedly acting like a child).

As for Suh, frankly it hurts the Texans a bit if he gets suspended this week since they play our closest division rival, the Colts. I doubt there is enough evidence there to prove his intent and the "multiple offenses" prosecution didn't hold up for Ed Reed, so I doubt it would for Suh. What I do wish would happen in the NFL would be like in the Tour De France where the stage winner is automatically tested and other front runners can be targeted if their performance seems "suspect." In the case of Suh, it wouldn't shock me at all to find a chemical connection to these games where he is clearly unable to contain his base emotions and I'd bet it's more than adderall, but even that is enough to draw a suspension. It cracks me up that we talk about "player safety" yet the employers (the NFL) don't even have the power to test an employee that could possibly be under the influence of drugs in the workplace (the field).
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lumberjackchris


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 6:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apollo Stallion wrote:
lumberjackchris wrote:
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/11/26/matt-schaub-ndamukong-suh-is-not-houston-texan-worthy/


I love Schaub Cool


While the "kick" got more attention due to the particularly sensitive area it targeted, there was a play just a few downs later that was more troublesome as Suh drug Schaub down by the inside shoulder pads and drove him face first into the turf in what I would best call a "reverse horse collar" (donkey collar?). Suh didn't make a single tackle in the game but still hit Schaub 5 times and this one looked to my eye similar to the Cutler hit with Suh violently trying to use the ground as a weapon and concuss or break ribs, shoulders, clavicles. It was actually this hit that got Kubiak up in the refs face after the change of possession as it clarified that Suh was out of control and intending to injure.

I personally loved seeing Kubiak getting all over the ref both in the sense that he finally understands that "working a ref" is an important role of a head coach and that he signaled to his team that they needed to stand up and protect our season too. I don't know if anyone else caught Antonio mixing it up on the very next series, but in a contained "send a message without getting flagged" manner he has evolved to since the first Ravens game last year where he was justified but still crossed the line and hurt the team. We will never know, but it is possible that the refs were being hyper vigilant in not blowing the whistle on the Forsett play because Kubiak had already been working them and was just a bit in their head, not to mention Rick Smith's power on the competition committee which is something they are all aware of on gamedays. I used to get all bent out of shape with the Steelers seemingly getting every darn call, but Cowher was a master at playing it cool with the refs until he really needed to get "the chin" working and the Rooneys power in the league office always seemed to skew things a bit in their direction, but frankly the way they handle bs in their organization has reinforced the league's faith (Ben has been squeaky clean since his suspension got reduced). These are still humans in charge and Jim Schwartz has a few marks on his record (although I thought taking accountability was a class move and I love that he's stuck Titus in time out for repeatedly acting like a child).

As for Suh, frankly it hurts the Texans a bit if he gets suspended this week since they play our closest division rival, the Colts. I doubt there is enough evidence there to prove his intent and the "multiple offenses" prosecution didn't hold up for Ed Reed, so I doubt it would for Suh. What I do wish would happen in the NFL would be like in the Tour De France where the stage winner is automatically tested and other front runners can be targeted if their performance seems "suspect." In the case of Suh, it wouldn't shock me at all to find a chemical connection to these games where he is clearly unable to contain his base emotions and I'd bet it's more than adderall, but even that is enough to draw a suspension. It cracks me up that we talk about "player safety" yet the employers (the NFL) don't even have the power to test an employee that could possibly be under the influence of drugs in the workplace (the field).


http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/11/26/no-suspension-for-suh-for-kicking-schaub/

Good thing he's not getting suspended
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 9:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think you overestimate the power of working the refs, Apollo. They're not the replacement refs who are overwhelmed by the star power of coaches and players. They have to get calls right or they're let go, even more so now with their new CBA. Job security is a lot more important than coach's opinions, no matter how well-stated or expletive-laced the argument is.
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Apollo Stallion


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 1:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Grasspike wrote:
I think you overestimate the power of working the refs, Apollo. They're not the replacement refs who are overwhelmed by the star power of coaches and players. They have to get calls right or they're let go, even more so now with their new CBA. Job security is a lot more important than coach's opinions, no matter how well-stated or expletive-laced the argument is.


But they did get the calls right. The Forsett play was close enough to not blow a whistle and replay was there to reverse the call if Schwartz didn't act like a bafoon and think throwing his little red flag to rub the refs nose in it was worth risking it not being reversible. Kubiak respectfully approaches refs and asks if it's reviewable and they say yes or no, while Schwartz is an a-hole about it and screws his team (again). I think you are being naive if you don't acknowledge the "halo" around Brady and Manning and that certain receivers (including AJ) get the benefit of the doubt and sometimes practically call their own PI penalties by choosing when to react to a questionable play. Coaches are no different and the Mays hit on Kubiak and the Texans reaction at the league office finally signaled that Schaub and the Texans deserved some protection from the thugs out there.

BTW - I just saw the Jared Allen hit that ended Lance Louis season. Cheap, cheap, cheap. I watched Semi-Pro game on Bryant Gumble's HBO show where a guy was killed (yes, dead) on a blindside hit like that. He's the next one that should be brought in for immediate testing as he was again out of control, just like the game where he went at Schaub's knees on three straight plays. There are days I wish football was like hockey and you could just send a goon out there to police the Allen's and Suh's of this game if the league won't.
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longhorntexan


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 6:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apollo Stallion wrote:

BTW - I just saw the Jared Allen hit that ended Lance Louis season. Cheap, cheap, cheap. I watched Semi-Pro game on Bryant Gumble's HBO show where a guy was killed (yes, dead) on a blindside hit like that. He's the next one that should be brought in for immediate testing as he was again out of control, just like the game where he went at Schaub's knees on three straight plays. There are days I wish football was like hockey and you could just send a goon out there to police the Allen's and Suh's of this game if the league won't.


I watched the Around the NFL segment on ESPN the other day and they said Suh would probably get suspended because of his past history and they won't give him the benefit of the doubt.

When they were talking about the Allen hit, they said he might get a fine but won't get suspended because he doesn't have a history and therefore gets the benefit of the doubt. So laughable.
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lumberjackchris


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 6:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How in the heck does Suh get fined 30k and Brandon Harris gets fined 21k for his hit on Logan.....
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 7:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

lumberjackchris wrote:
How in the heck does Suh get fined 30k and Brandon Harris gets fined 21k for his hit on Logan.....


Thats a joke, Harris finally plays and they take his WHOLE CHECK


Quote:
“They took my whole paycheck,” Harris said.



http://blog.chron.com/ultimatetexans/2012/11/texans-corner-harris-fined-21000-for-hit-on-lions-returner/
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lumberjackchris


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 8:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

amazingandre wrote:
lumberjackchris wrote:
How in the heck does Suh get fined 30k and Brandon Harris gets fined 21k for his hit on Logan.....


Thats a joke, Harris finally plays and they take his WHOLE CHECK


Quote:
“They took my whole paycheck,” Harris said.



http://blog.chron.com/ultimatetexans/2012/11/texans-corner-harris-fined-21000-for-hit-on-lions-returner/


Ya maybe the NFL should make it a percentage system, cause that's ridiculous.
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