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nicfre2011


Joined: 15 Mar 2011
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 12:45 pm    Post subject: Jovan Belcher Reply with quote

With Dwayne Bowe, Branden Albert, and to a much lesser extent Glenn Dorsey receiving the majority of attention as far as our pending free agents go, Jovan Belcher doesn't receive as much attention.

My question is, what do you think we should do with Belcher? Re-sign him to a long term deal or look to an alternative opposite Derrick Johnson?

Belcher (age 25, 6'-2", 228 lbs.) is currently playing under the RFA tender amount of $1,927,000.

Cory Greenwood
Cory Greenwood (age 27, 6'-2", 235 lbs.) is under contract through 2015 but he seems to be Derrick Johnson's primary backup and irregardless I am not sure I am comfortable with Greenwood even sniffing significant playing time.

2013 total salary $656,250
2014 total salary $756,250
2015 total salary $771,250

Edgar Jones
Edgar Jones (age 27, 6'-3", 262 lbs.) is currently playing under a 1 year contract of $700,000 and will be a free agent this offseason.

Brandon Siler
Brandon Siler (age 26, 6'-2", 239 lbs.) is also currently playing under a 1 year contract of $700,000 and like Jones, he is also scheduled to hit free agency this upcoming offseason.

What kind of contract do you think Belcher could be looking for? Also, if you were GM, what direction would you go in as far as our inside linebacker spot opposite Derrick Johnson?
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nicfre2011


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 12:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Personally I see Belcher as one of those players that has been a pleasant surprise considering he initial expectations for him as an undrafted rookie free agent. But I also think he is the type of player that while he isn't necessarily a glaring weakness, he is one of those players that you are always looking to upgrade if the opportunity presents itself.

That being said, if I were the GM, I would approach Belcher about re-signing a multi-year contract on the value level of an average starting inside linebacker and maybe even try and squeeze his agent a little bit to accept a generally below market deal to stay with the team. If Belcher and his agent have the expectations of signing a bigger contract I would talk with the coaching staff about letting Belcher hit the market and see if there is a solid demand or not.

At the same time I would look to re-sign Edgar Jones, who I think is one of our standout special teamers and arguably our best player on the coverage unit. The same would go for Siler as far as re-signing goes. I would offer both players 1 year deals for an increase in what they were making last year.

When the draft rolls around I would look at several inside linebacker targets irregardless of whether any or all of Belcher, Jones, and Siler were re-signed. If I could grab one of the inside linebackers on my board, I would let them compete for roster spots, Belcher included.

If I could get Belcher re-signed to a team-friendly deal, I would have him as the projected likely starter with the rookie competing for a backup role with Jones and Siler. If the rookie shows enough versatility, I would even consider cutting Greenwood with the rookie filling his spot behind Johnson and have Jones and Siler backup Belcher.

The idea would be that the rookie would get experience at the NFL level and play special teams with the eventual goal of replacing Belcher when he is ready.
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nicfre2011


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 1:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Would you guys be comfortable with letting Belcher walk (assuming his contract request was higher than expected) and re-signing Siler and Jones, and drafting a rookie? That would leave us with Siler as the projected starter and the rookie/Jones as the primary backups to Siler.
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Mikek163


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 1:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nicfre2011 wrote:
Would you guys be comfortable with letting Belcher walk (assuming his contract request was higher than expected) and re-signing Siler and Jones, and drafting a rookie? That would leave us with Siler as the projected starter and the rookie/Jones as the primary backups to Siler.


Yeah but I would be sad to see him go. We dont need him as much as we used to since we're running more and more sub packages.
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bigschmadt00


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I do not want to let him walk, because that's just unnecessary. Offer him a deal for like 3yrs, $1.5MM guaranteed, and maybe $5MM overall. That will be palatable if he becomes a back-up, but appropriate considering his contributions should he continue to start.
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kylecumberland


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 1:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think he is an average- good run stuffer. He is SUCH a liability in coverage though. Every game I see teams pick on us in the middle of the field and Belcher is the reason for that. I consider ILB a major weakness, along with QB and CB. Those are the 3 spots we MUST upgrade. I am willing to give Jeff Allen another year or even bring Ryan Lilja back for another year. I am also willing to start someone like Shaun Smith or Pituatioa at DE to fill the hole Dorsey leaves. I don't think they are much of a drop off from Dorsey and they can be solid 1 year stop gaps. But we must get a QB, ILB and CB IMO.
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nicfre2011


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 2:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bigschmadt00 wrote:
I do not want to let him walk, because that's just unnecessary. Offer him a deal for like 3yrs, $1.5MM guaranteed, and maybe $5MM overall. That will be palatable if he becomes a back-up, but appropriate considering his contributions should he continue to start.


Bigs, the only reason it wouldn't be unnecessary is if he felt his value was higher than the front office was willing to spend. Keep in mind that he just received almost $2 million from his restricted tender offer. So I am not sure that he would be looking for a deal that would atleast average more than that. I agree in the length, but I am not sure that contract would be enough to get a deal done.
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nicfre2011


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kylecumberland wrote:
I think he is an average- good run stuffer. He is SUCH a liability in coverage though. Every game I see teams pick on us in the middle of the field and Belcher is the reason for that. I consider ILB a major weakness, along with QB and CB. Those are the 3 spots we MUST upgrade. I am willing to give Jeff Allen another year or even bring Ryan Lilja back for another year. I am also willing to start someone like Shaun Smith or Pituatioa at DE to fill the hole Dorsey leaves. I don't think they are much of a drop off from Dorsey and they can be solid 1 year stop gaps. But we must get a QB, ILB and CB IMO.


I agree with you kyle on you assessment of Belcher. He is pretty limited and because of that I do think we need to address the position long term. Personally, I am looking for a player that projects to fill a Daryl Washington-type of role - meaning he has very good to excellent range and is not a liability in coverage. Also, Belcher doesn't provide much in the way of a blitz presence, and I would really like to have someone on the roster that alteast gives us the option of sending someone from the inside to get pressure.
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bigschmadt00


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 2:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nicfre2011 wrote:
bigschmadt00 wrote:
I do not want to let him walk, because that's just unnecessary. Offer him a deal for like 3yrs, $1.5MM guaranteed, and maybe $5MM overall. That will be palatable if he becomes a back-up, but appropriate considering his contributions should he continue to start.


Bigs, the only reason it wouldn't be unnecessary is if he felt his value was higher than the front office was willing to spend. Keep in mind that he just received almost $2 million from his restricted tender offer. So I am not sure that he would be looking for a deal that would atleast average more than that. I agree in the length, but I am not sure that contract would be enough to get a deal done.

Well through in another $2MM in escalators if he sees a certain number of snaps per season, to make sure he stays motivated, and we're not investing money we'll never get a return on.

I just can't see Belcher getting a lot of attention on the UFA market. Sure, he could probably get about what I laid out, but in a new system and all that, just doesn't make much sense.
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nicfre2011


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 2:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bigschmadt00 wrote:
nicfre2011 wrote:
bigschmadt00 wrote:
I do not want to let him walk, because that's just unnecessary. Offer him a deal for like 3yrs, $1.5MM guaranteed, and maybe $5MM overall. That will be palatable if he becomes a back-up, but appropriate considering his contributions should he continue to start.


Bigs, the only reason it wouldn't be unnecessary is if he felt his value was higher than the front office was willing to spend. Keep in mind that he just received almost $2 million from his restricted tender offer. So I am not sure that he would be looking for a deal that would atleast average more than that. I agree in the length, but I am not sure that contract would be enough to get a deal done.

Well through in another $2MM in escalators if he sees a certain number of snaps per season, to make sure he stays motivated, and we're not investing money we'll never get a return on.

I just can't see Belcher getting a lot of attention on the UFA market. Sure, he could probably get about what I laid out, but in a new system and all that, just doesn't make much sense.


through =/= throw.

Laughing

I don't see Belcher being the darling of free agency either. I just don't see the value in re-signing him to anything below a discount as he is pretty much a one trick pony.

Also, I have to believe players really don't care for the escalators and would much prefer a bigger signing bonus. If he does come slinking back due to a lack of interest in free agency, then I see him being more open to taking a reasonable discount.
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Buckweath


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As long as Derrick Johnson keeps his high level of play, Belcher is good enough for that LB corps and should be kept.
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bigschmadt00


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 2:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nicfre2011 wrote:
through =/= throw.

Laughing

I don't see Belcher being the darling of free agency either. I just don't see the value in re-signing him to anything below a discount as he is pretty much a one trick pony.

Also, I have to believe players really don't care for the escalators and would much prefer a bigger signing bonus. If he does come slinking back due to a lack of interest in free agency, then I see him being more open to taking a reasonable discount.


Wink

Anywho, I think it makes sense to attempt to get Belcher locked up for a reasonable offer, maybe even a tad excessive, to keep us from having a NEED draft a replacement, or a sign a UFA that's gonna cost nearly that much anyway.
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Arrowhead86


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 3:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I want Belcher on the team in a back up role on defense and a starter for special teams.

Some mentioned he's good enough next to DJ or that we sub package so much it's not a liability to have him as the starter. I disagree with both sentiments.

I want a 3 down LB next to DJ so we don't have to always be so obvious in the kind of D we're playing. I want a guy that excels in coverage, blitzing, and run defense so we can stay in more base D without such liability against the pass.

Especially with how in vogue TE heavy offenses are. They present such balance for offenses in blocking or receiving and we need to match such balance on defense from our base.

Look at teams like Chicago and SF that are able to play so much base D effectively - I envy that.

Question is - is that guy out there and will he be available to us 2nd round or beyond?

Skov?
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nicfre2011


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Arrowhead86 wrote:
I want Belcher on the team in a back up role on defense and a starter for special teams.

Some mentioned he's good enough next to DJ or that we sub package so much it's not a liability to have him as the starter. I disagree with both sentiments.

I want a 3 down LB next to DJ so we don't have to always be so obvious in the kind of D we're playing. I want a guy that excels in coverage, blitzing, and run defense so we can stay in more base D without such liability against the pass.

Especially with how in vogue TE heavy offenses are. They present such balance for offenses in blocking or receiving and we need to match such balance on defense from our base.

Look at teams like Chicago and SF that are able to play so much base D effectively - I envy that.

Question is - is that guy out there and will he be available to us 2nd round or beyond?

Skov?


I am not a big fan of Skov. I would much prefer someone like Kiko Alonso or my personal preference Gerald Hodges.
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Arrowhead86


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 6:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nicfre2011 wrote:
Arrowhead86 wrote:
I want Belcher on the team in a back up role on defense and a starter for special teams.

Some mentioned he's good enough next to DJ or that we sub package so much it's not a liability to have him as the starter. I disagree with both sentiments.

I want a 3 down LB next to DJ so we don't have to always be so obvious in the kind of D we're playing. I want a guy that excels in coverage, blitzing, and run defense so we can stay in more base D without such liability against the pass.

Especially with how in vogue TE heavy offenses are. They present such balance for offenses in blocking or receiving and we need to match such balance on defense from our base.

Look at teams like Chicago and SF that are able to play so much base D effectively - I envy that.

Question is - is that guy out there and will he be available to us 2nd round or beyond?

Skov?


I am not a big fan of Skov. I would much prefer someone like Kiko Alonso or my personal preference Gerald Hodges.


cool man - I'll take a look at them!
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