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iPwn
Joined: 10 Oct 2009
Posts: 36209
Location: Stand United
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 Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 12:54 am Post subject: |
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| sadjag wrote: | | iPwn wrote: | | sadjag wrote: | | iPwn wrote: | | Regardless of who the QB is, this season is lost. Best case scenario, we beat 5 of the next 6 teams (not really that unreasonable when you see who they are), but what does it matter? We can go 6-10. Does it really make us feel better giving up on our QB, believing we need to replace him and pushing ourselves likely out of contention for one? |
What's the point in giving Gabbert 6 more games? I cannot think of anything he could possibly show in 6 games that we havent seen in the past 20+ starts. Look I was all for giving Gabby the year to show that he's our guy but the writing is on the wall guys. You play Henne because he gives us the best chance too win, Period. And if along the way it's evident Gabbert gives us the best chance too win we put him in.
Let's face it neither of these guys are very good / the future. |
You can't see what he could show in 6 games? Really? A guy who hasn't even had two years to start, and is making slow gains, can't possibly show growth to finish out the season? Is that what you're saying?
Are you saying that he can't play well against the 30th ranked defense (Titans x 2), the 26th ranked defense (Bills), the 27th ranked defense (Patriots), 21st ranked defense (Dolphins) and 14th ranked defense (Jets) and give more of an indication as to whether he can grow as Eli Manning did? |
What I'm saying is that we have seen alot of Gabbert. He could come the last 3rd of the season and look like the GOAT, but probably not. Gabbert had this season too show that he could be the man and he hasn't. Look around the league, name another rookie QB that has started for the better part of 2 years and played as badly as Gabby has. The kid's been given his shot and he failed whether we all accept it now or in 6 weeks is irrelevant. I wish he was Eli I really do.... but he's not, neither is he Aikman or Elway. |
What separates his rookie season from Eli's? What separates his sophomore season from Eli's?
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 | samgurl775 wrote: | | It's alright iPwn, you're my #1. |
| EliteTexan80 wrote: | | I AM TRYING TO BE PWNY! AND I AM NOT! AND THIS VEXES ME SORE!!! |
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Its A Sabotage
Joined: 14 May 2010
Posts: 28460
Location: Do. Your. Job.
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 12:54 am Post subject: |
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| iPwn wrote: | Just for funsies.
Let's say that because those defenses he'll be playing won't be good, that he will have 2 games like his Minnesota game, two games like the Green Bay game and two like the first half of the Oakland game. Those defenses are bad, so I don't think it's unreasonable to suggest that he could play something like that. Not saying he will, but it's possible with the level of competition he'll be playing against and with the receivers appearing to finally be stepping up.
294/478 61.5% 3,228 yards 6.7 YPA 19TDs 6INTs 89.49 Passer Rating
If, by some possibility, he finished with those stats (playing the equivalent of about 14.5 games, mind you), do you think it's maybe possible that he would have shown enough to warrant us not drafting a QB with our first pick?
I am, in no way shape or form, suggesting that he will play like that, but if he does, does that maybe tell us that we need to trust in his development and not draft Geno and instead get more pieces to bolster the D or his o-line?
By shutting him down, you're basically saying that nothing he can show you in those last 6 games will sway you from ending his career as your starter. But I certainly think that he could do just that by stringing a few of his better performances together against subpar competition. |
If you shut him down, you give the team over to Shad. By this I mean, Gene is fired for bot getting the right Quarterback (among everything else) and that Mike and his entire staff failed because they were all brought in to make Blaine work.
However, you let the season play out, it is still lose-lose Blaine showed he is terrible in the public eye (Thursday night against Colts) and now Henne is the savior and if he does put up those numbers he is still "average" and who the hell cares, he is Alex Smith, and no one wants an Alex Smith.
I don't think we take a first round quarterback next year regardless, and any talent adviser, whether GM or scout has to see that this class just isn't there in terms of start right away (hell developmental) Quarterbacks, and will be playing for 2014...which is why I think both Gene and Mike stay the year, giving Shad an out terminating all 3 essentially a year early (IIRC all 3 had 3 years to start the year). Rather we stockpile the talent on the lines and defense and give the new rookie (2014 QB) a fighters chance. But then the issue becomes, do you want Gene, with a poor track record one last go at things?
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| green24 wrote: | | Sabo is the best poster on FF |
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iPwn
Joined: 10 Oct 2009
Posts: 36209
Location: Stand United
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 1:01 am Post subject: |
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| Mr. V wrote: | | iPwn wrote: | | jagman777 wrote: | | I went to your avy's seminar for extra credit open |
How was it? I love the guy. |
Who is it? I don't recognize him. |
Neil deGrasse Tyson, a world renowned astrophysicist.
Apparently the sexiest, as well..
If you love science and comedy, you'll love his podcast show.
https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/startalk-radio-show-by-neil/id325404506?mt=2
Enjoy.
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| samgurl775 wrote: | | It's alright iPwn, you're my #1. |
| EliteTexan80 wrote: | | I AM TRYING TO BE PWNY! AND I AM NOT! AND THIS VEXES ME SORE!!! |
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Its A Sabotage
Joined: 14 May 2010
Posts: 28460
Location: Do. Your. Job.
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 1:07 am Post subject: |
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Michio Kaku >>>> Neil deGrasse Tyson
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Tugboat
Joined: 30 Mar 2011
Posts: 1322
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 1:20 am Post subject: |
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As far as the who to start next debate goes, Gabbert vs Henne...
It's not an easy situation. I can see merit with both sides. My first question though, is Gabbert's health. Is he even going to be 100% next week? If he's still 'hurting', it could be a bit of an escape-hatch for this situation as far as Mularkey/Gene are concerned.
Realistically, Henne seemed to have a swagger to him once he got a break from him WRs, that Gabbert just doesn't appear to possess. Not only is there the popular backlash that would come with going back to Gabbert, but i worry it sends the wrong message to the rest of the team as well. While it's true, it can't feel good to basically have the staff affirm that, "this season is done for us, we're mailing it in...it's now all about seeing what Gabbert can do." I mean, it's essentially true, but if you're out there busting your hump on the field, that's still gonna sting.
However...let's be realistic, it's Henne. If he starts the next game, odds seem just as good that he comes out looking like a total lame duck, thows a bunch of picks and shuts everyone up, as they are that he replicates todays performance. Unless we're really afraid that Henne could win us a bunch of games down the stretch?
I think the best scenario might just be to 'convince' Blaine that he's not '100%' next week, let Henne start...fall on his face, and have Gabbert come back the next week. The biggest risk there, is that the Titans might just be bad enough to make Henne look good again...in which case you have a minor disaster on your hands.
| iPwn wrote: | | sadjag wrote: | | iPwn wrote: | | Regardless of who the QB is, this season is lost. Best case scenario, we beat 5 of the next 6 teams (not really that unreasonable when you see who they are), but what does it matter? We can go 6-10. Does it really make us feel better giving up on our QB, believing we need to replace him and pushing ourselves likely out of contention for one? |
What's the point in giving Gabbert 6 more games? I cannot think of anything he could possibly show in 6 games that we havent seen in the past 20+ starts. Look I was all for giving Gabby the year to show that he's our guy but the writing is on the wall guys. You play Henne because he gives us the best chance too win, Period. And if along the way it's evident Gabbert gives us the best chance too win we put him in.
Let's face it neither of these guys are very good / the future. |
You can't see what he could show in 6 games? Really? A guy who hasn't even had two years to start, and is making slow gains, can't possibly show growth to finish out the season? Is that what you're saying?
Are you saying that he can't play well against the 30th ranked defense (Titans x 2), the 26th ranked defense (Bills), the 27th ranked defense (Patriots), 21st ranked defense (Dolphins) and 14th ranked defense (Jets) and give more of an indication as to whether he can grow as Eli Manning did? |
I think it's absolutely possible that Gabbert could show us something in the final 6 games. If people are ready to anoint Henne the starter for the rest of the season based on this one good game (where he clearly ran out of steam in the second half and got a TON of help from his WRs making great plays), what if Gabbert were to put up TWO good games at some point in the next 6?  It could happen.
| Adrenaline_Flux wrote: | "PLAY HENNE SO WE HAVE A CHANCE TO WIN"
but... we're 1-9 |
Exactly. It just doesn't make sense to be in 'win now' mode right now. But honestly, i'm not sure there's much of a difference in wins between Gabbert and Henne right now either.
I really just don't know how i'd handle the situation, but it's a delicate balance of team morale, doing what's best for this organization long-term, seeing what we've got at various positions, and for Gene/Mularkey, trying not to get fired.
At the moment, i'm honestly leaning towards the best situation being Gabbert being 'banged up' next week, let Henne start. Either he falls on his face and we put a quick end to this shenanigans, or he actually plays respectably again and we a)wonder how bad Gabbert really is, b)have a better chance to evaluate where the rest of our offense is, and c)maybe we have an interim solution, and can draft a 2nd/3rd round QB this year to compete with Henne and Gabbert next season in camp. A 3-way competition a la Seattle this season. And who knows, maybe letting Henne take a start away from Gabbert clues him in acutely to the fact that his job isn't 'guaranteed' just because of his draft pedigree. Maybe it lights a fire under his behind and he comes back and truly takes the bull by the horns and assumes control of this team after Henne proves he is indeed extremely human.
Tough situation though. |
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Jaguarfan
Joined: 27 Nov 2011
Posts: 11866
Location: Scarlet Town
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 2:12 am Post subject: |
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What needs to happen IMO:
Give Gabbert a week to "Rest his elbow/shoulder" and see if Henne looks good next week.
If he doesn't, start Gabbert.
If he does, keep him in.
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| TheVillain112 wrote: | | Can you gif the old man trying to lure the girl in using the fishing pole with a dollar bill on it? |
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JaguarCrazy2832
Joined: 28 Jun 2008
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 1:47 pm Post subject: |
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i feel like the worst thing that could happen is henne comes in and is above average/better than gabbert
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Jaguarfan
Joined: 27 Nov 2011
Posts: 11866
Location: Scarlet Town
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 2:06 pm Post subject: |
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| JaguarCrazy2832 wrote: | | i feel like the worst thing that could happen is henne comes in and is above average/better than gabbert |
Right.
And if he plays worse, bench him. Not that hard.
If anything, Henne playing well could save Mike, not get him fired. Gene, he's out, that's pretty much a given, but good QB play and good team play could show that Gabbert was holding the team back.
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Kempes on the sig
| TheVillain112 wrote: | | Can you gif the old man trying to lure the girl in using the fishing pole with a dollar bill on it? |
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charles shelton
Joined: 22 Jan 2007
Posts: 1666
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 2:47 pm Post subject: |
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I didn't get to watch the game. What was the deal with the offensive explosion? Reading the box scores, looks like our wrs finally made some plays. Was Henne that good? Or did he just benefit from some good wr play? How was the pass protection? Did we expose some weaknesses in Houston's defense or were some key guys injured or something?
-Charles |
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EliteTexan80
Joined: 30 Apr 2007
Posts: 37207
Location: Three time Mr. fanTASTic!
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 3:35 pm Post subject: |
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First off - great, exciting game yesterday! It literally came down to the wire, I don't know if I have ever been on the edge of my seat as I was yesterday. That was arguably the most intense game I have ever seen, you could see that both teams (minus the Texans' secondary) left it all on the line yesterday. It was awesome to see the young buck Justin Blackmon vs the old hand, Andre Johnson...both of those two put on a show at WR yesterday. Was quite the game to watch.
Great game, good luck for the rest of the season!
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Adrenaline_Flux
Joined: 19 Dec 2008
Posts: 15437
Location: The Iowa
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 3:39 pm Post subject: |
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| EliteTexan80 wrote: | First off - great, exciting game yesterday! It literally came down to the wire, I don't know if I have ever been on the edge of my seat as I was yesterday. That was arguably the most intense game I have ever seen, you could see that both teams (minus the Texans' secondary) left it all on the line yesterday. It was awesome to see the young buck Justin Blackmon vs the old hand, Andre Johnson...both of those two put on a show at WR yesterday. Was quite the game to watch.
Great game, good luck for the rest of the season! |
Thanks ET and I agree.
Hopefully now Blackmon is on his way to being more like Andre.
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sadjag
Joined: 02 Mar 2012
Posts: 852
Location: jax
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 5:38 pm Post subject: |
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| iPwn wrote: | | sadjag wrote: | | iPwn wrote: | | sadjag wrote: | | iPwn wrote: | | Regardless of who the QB is, this season is lost. Best case scenario, we beat 5 of the next 6 teams (not really that unreasonable when you see who they are), but what does it matter? We can go 6-10. Does it really make us feel better giving up on our QB, believing we need to replace him and pushing ourselves likely out of contention for one? |
What's the point in giving Gabbert 6 more games? I cannot think of anything he could possibly show in 6 games that we havent seen in the past 20+ starts. Look I was all for giving Gabby the year to show that he's our guy but the writing is on the wall guys. You play Henne because he gives us the best chance too win, Period. And if along the way it's evident Gabbert gives us the best chance too win we put him in.
Let's face it neither of these guys are very good / the future. |
You can't see what he could show in 6 games? Really? A guy who hasn't even had two years to start, and is making slow gains, can't possibly show growth to finish out the season? Is that what you're saying?
Are you saying that he can't play well against the 30th ranked defense (Titans x 2), the 26th ranked defense (Bills), the 27th ranked defense (Patriots), 21st ranked defense (Dolphins) and 14th ranked defense (Jets) and give more of an indication as to whether he can grow as Eli Manning did? |
What I'm saying is that we have seen alot of Gabbert. He could come the last 3rd of the season and look like the GOAT, but probably not. Gabbert had this season too show that he could be the man and he hasn't. Look around the league, name another rookie QB that has started for the better part of 2 years and played as badly as Gabby has. The kid's been given his shot and he failed whether we all accept it now or in 6 weeks is irrelevant. I wish he was Eli I really do.... but he's not, neither is he Aikman or Elway. |
What separates his rookie season from Eli's? What separates his sophomore season from Eli's? |
I just want too make sure we're on the same page Pwn. I'm not saying Gabbert's never going to be good or that he couldn't turn around and play great the last 6 games, but for me I'm 95% sure. I've hit the point where I've seen enough and I think He's done. If you want too see the rest of the season before you make that decision then I understand. If you want too wait until the end of 2013 I think your insane.
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JaguarCrazy2832
Joined: 28 Jun 2008
Posts: 73945
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| Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 2:08 pm Post subject: |
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| EliteTexan80 wrote: | First off - great, exciting game yesterday! It literally came down to the wire, I don't know if I have ever been on the edge of my seat as I was yesterday. That was arguably the most intense game I have ever seen, you could see that both teams (minus the Texans' secondary) left it all on the line yesterday. It was awesome to see the young buck Justin Blackmon vs the old hand, Andre Johnson...both of those two put on a show at WR yesterday. Was quite the game to watch.
Great game, good luck for the rest of the season! |
thanks ET, it was nice to see blackmon step up his game and see that AJ is still a beast
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Its A Sabotage
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JaguarCrazy2832
Joined: 28 Jun 2008
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| Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 2:21 pm Post subject: |
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thanks IAS!
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