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Kiper's early draft picks for the A.F.C. North
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mistakebytehlak


Joined: 20 Nov 2005
Posts: 45103
Location: Brooklyn, NY
PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 12:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Drew_Carey wrote:
Could be worse...


The only way its worse is if we draft a
FB
K
or
P
in the first round

and the likelihood of that happening is so slim that pragmatically- no it couldn't be worse.

we're 2-7 and looking at a top 10 draft pick, we need talent at any level on the defense and we're gonna draft an offensive guard even though our OL has stepped up in a huge way the past couple weeks?
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candyman93


Joined: 02 Dec 2009
Posts: 42150
PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mistakebytehlak wrote:
Drew_Carey wrote:
Could be worse...


The only way its worse is if we draft a
FB
K
or
P
in the first round

and the likelihood of that happening is so slim that pragmatically- no it couldn't be worse.

we're 2-7 and looking at a top 10 draft pick, we need talent at any level on the defense and we're gonna draft an offensive guard even though our OL has stepped up in a huge way the past couple weeks?


For some reason, some of the fans on this site have an o-line fetish
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nugpimpen


Joined: 18 Feb 2006
Posts: 20660
Location: 10 Miles South of Cleveland
PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mistakebytehlak wrote:
Drew_Carey wrote:
Could be worse...


The only way its worse is if we draft a
FB
K
or
P
in the first round

and the likelihood of that happening is so slim that pragmatically- no it couldn't be worse.

we're 2-7 and looking at a top 10 draft pick, we need talent at any level on the defense and we're gonna draft an offensive guard even though our OL has stepped up in a huge way the past couple weeks?

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IDOG_det on the incredible sig!
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cattleman78


Joined: 13 Oct 2005
Posts: 6988
Location: ohio
PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

candyman93 wrote:
mistakebytehlak wrote:
Drew_Carey wrote:
Could be worse...


The only way its worse is if we draft a
FB
K
or
P
in the first round

and the likelihood of that happening is so slim that pragmatically- no it couldn't be worse.

we're 2-7 and looking at a top 10 draft pick, we need talent at any level on the defense and we're gonna draft an offensive guard even though our OL has stepped up in a huge way the past couple weeks?


For some reason, some of the fans on this site have an o-line fetish


Nothing wrong with liking the off. line but it is wrong to push guard as our biggest need. Last year I and others pushed hard for at least a second round right tackle. Some on here wanted a 4th or 5th round right tackle. Now it seems most like Schwartz. Pashos was so weak. Greco and Lauvao are not near as bad as Pashos. Both have played decent. Thomas and Mack are both A type players. Schwartz may join them. Greco and Lauvao have the ability to become B type players. And who knows about Pinkston.

Reason I'm pushing for a new starter at free safety. Young for the most part is weak. Saying that though I'm not pushing for a first round starter at free safety because I don't see a first round safety in this class. Maybe there is one late first round.

Guard is not as weak as some on here think. We need an impact player on defense more than anything.
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cattleman78


Joined: 13 Oct 2005
Posts: 6988
Location: ohio
PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mistakebytehlak wrote:
Drew_Carey wrote:
Could be worse...


The only way its worse is if we draft a
FB
K
or
P
in the first round

and the likelihood of that happening is so slim that pragmatically- no it couldn't be worse.

we're 2-7 and looking at a top 10 draft pick, we need talent at any level on the defense and we're gonna draft an offensive guard even though our OL has stepped up in a huge way the past couple weeks?


The very worse is drafting a first round bust but since we can't see three years down the road I have to say I agree with you. Bob Frantz of the Lorain paper graded our team. He gave our off. line the highest grade of any unit a B+. I might not quite go that high but I think the off. line unit probably is our strongest right now. We have two A type players in Thomas and Mack on the off. line What other unit has two A type players?

My main point is our off. line is not the reason we are losing. They do need to cut down on penalties though.
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ReggieCamp


Joined: 06 Dec 2006
Posts: 9351
Location: Canonsburg, PA
PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cattleman78 wrote:
mistakebytehlak wrote:
Drew_Carey wrote:
Could be worse...


The only way its worse is if we draft a
FB
K
or
P
in the first round

and the likelihood of that happening is so slim that pragmatically- no it couldn't be worse.

we're 2-7 and looking at a top 10 draft pick, we need talent at any level on the defense and we're gonna draft an offensive guard even though our OL has stepped up in a huge way the past couple weeks?


The very worse is drafting a first round bust but since we can't see three years down the road I have to say I agree with you. Bob Frantz of the Lorain paper graded our team. He gave our off. line the highest grade of any unit a B+. I might not quite go that high but I think the off. line unit probably is our strongest right now. We have two A type players in Thomas and Mack on the off. line What other unit has two A type players?

My main point is our off. line is not the reason we are losing. They do need to cut down on penalties though.

Our D-line isn't too far behind the O-line. Hopefully, that will become apparent now that we're healthy. Rubin and Taylor are quality starters, and the young DT's are at least quality depth, maybe more. We do need help at DE, though. Aside from Sheard, it's a fairly sad group.

P.S. cattleman, please check your pm inbox. Thx.
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BrownsDog23


Joined: 19 Dec 2011
Posts: 457
Location: United States
PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 9:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wouldn't be against taking a OG if we traded back. I haven't been impressed with the play of our guards at all. DT are generally not great passrushers. The #1 priority of the interior of the line is to run block. We get no push up front and Richardson is met in the backfield far to often.
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bruceb


Joined: 15 Dec 2006
Posts: 6904
Location: Rocky River, OH
PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 9:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It comes down to: Who is the BPA at whatever position we draft?

No more complicated than that if you want to build a winning team for the long term.
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mistakebytehlak


Joined: 20 Nov 2005
Posts: 45103
Location: Brooklyn, NY
PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 11:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bruceb wrote:
It comes down to: Who is the BPA at whatever position we draft?

No more complicated than that if you want to build a winning team for the long term.


and no guard will be BPA in the first
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cattleman78


Joined: 13 Oct 2005
Posts: 6988
Location: ohio
PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 12:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mistakebytehlak wrote:
bruceb wrote:
It comes down to: Who is the BPA at whatever position we draft?

No more complicated than that if you want to build a winning team for the long term.


and no guard will be BPA in the first


Not where we draft. Where some playoff teams in the first round drafts they will be. Warmack will go in the 1st round somewhere if healthy.
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mistakebytehlak


Joined: 20 Nov 2005
Posts: 45103
Location: Brooklyn, NY
PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 2:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cattleman78 wrote:
mistakebytehlak wrote:
bruceb wrote:
It comes down to: Who is the BPA at whatever position we draft?

No more complicated than that if you want to build a winning team for the long term.


and no guard will be BPA in the first


Not where we draft. Where some playoff teams in the first round drafts they will be. Warmack will go in the 1st round somewhere if healthy.


sure lot a good decastros been for the steelers

no guard will be BPA in the first
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cattleman78


Joined: 13 Oct 2005
Posts: 6988
Location: ohio
PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mistakebytehlak wrote:
cattleman78 wrote:
mistakebytehlak wrote:
bruceb wrote:
It comes down to: Who is the BPA at whatever position we draft?

No more complicated than that if you want to build a winning team for the long term.


and no guard will be BPA in the first


Not where we draft. Where some playoff teams in the first round drafts they will be. Warmack will go in the 1st round somewhere if healthy.


sure lot a good decastros been for the steelers

no guard will be BPA in the first


Decastro has been hurt. Kevin Zeitler has played well for the Bengals.
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Estonianzulu


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Joined: 11 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 9:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mistakebytehlak wrote:


sure lot a good decastros been for the steelers

no guard will be BPA in the first


Im going to disagree with you here just a bit. If you are sitting late in the round and all your "first round" picks have gone except a guard, you take the guard. No reason to reach on a player you have graded out lower just because he's not a guard.

Picking a Guard at pick 30 is not exactly a stretch.
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ditchdigger


Joined: 09 Jan 2005
Posts: 16732
Location: Gahanna, OH
PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 1:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Estonianzulu wrote:
mistakebytehlak wrote:


sure lot a good decastros been for the steelers

no guard will be BPA in the first


Im going to disagree with you here just a bit. If you are sitting late in the round and all your "first round" picks have gone except a guard, you take the guard. No reason to reach on a player you have graded out lower just because he's not a guard.

Picking a Guard at pick 30 is not exactly a stretch.


That is the sweet spot for a guard, but only if you're a team that just missed the Super Bowl and have a need there.

We don't qualify.

If we trade down to 30, and the best player on the board is the top guard on the board, we should trade down again.
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mistakebytehlak


Joined: 20 Nov 2005
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Location: Brooklyn, NY
PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 4:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Estonianzulu wrote:
mistakebytehlak wrote:


sure lot a good decastros been for the steelers

no guard will be BPA in the first


Im going to disagree with you here just a bit. If you are sitting late in the round and all your "first round" picks have gone except a guard, you take the guard. No reason to reach on a player you have graded out lower just because he's not a guard.

Picking a Guard at pick 30 is not exactly a stretch.


if you take a guard even at 30, you HAVE to know that guy is gonna be one of the best in the game in year 1 or 2.

usually PLENTY of impact players on the board in that range, usually at RB, WR, S, CB, flawed pass rushing DEs, overachieving yet physically limited LBs, one track DTs.

why take arguably the second least important position player there?

jahri evans, carl nicks, marshall yanda all were mid round picks. you can get top flight guard talent in the mid rounds.

iupati sure has gotten good ROI for the niners
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