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candyman93
Joined: 02 Dec 2009
Posts: 34888
Location: Adopt a Brownie 2012: TJ Ward
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 Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 1:04 am Post subject: |
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| buno67 wrote: | | fte88 wrote: | | He's vastly overrated, IMO. He's a "QB guru" that has never developed a QB. It's interesting to say the least. He's not coming here regardless, if he wants a big market. |
can you honestly name a coach who is truly a QB guru and has developed many good QBs through out the years?
the only coach that comes to mine that helped develop two very good QBs is Holmgren with Brett and Hasselbeck |
David Cutcliffe coached both Manning bros in college
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buno67
Joined: 15 Mar 2007
Posts: 24099
Location: Chubs for Chud
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 1:30 am Post subject: |
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| candyman93 wrote: | | buno67 wrote: | | fte88 wrote: | | He's vastly overrated, IMO. He's a "QB guru" that has never developed a QB. It's interesting to say the least. He's not coming here regardless, if he wants a big market. |
can you honestly name a coach who is truly a QB guru and has developed many good QBs through out the years?
the only coach that comes to mine that helped develop two very good QBs is Holmgren with Brett and Hasselbeck |
David Cutcliffe coached both Manning bros in college |
I'd say those two are more about pedigree than development.
I can't think of any coach outside of holmgren that groomed two QBs to studs
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fte88
Joined: 23 Oct 2011
Posts: 1474
Location: Cleveland Heights, OH
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 2:52 am Post subject: |
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| buno67 wrote: | | fte88 wrote: | | He's vastly overrated, IMO. He's a "QB guru" that has never developed a QB. It's interesting to say the least. He's not coming here regardless, if he wants a big market. |
can you honestly name a coach who is truly a QB guru and has developed many good QBs through out the years?
the only coach that comes to mine that helped develop two very good QBs is Holmgren with Brett and Hasselbeck |
Point taken. But Gruden has developed 0, so I'm sticking my my original statement. |
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hornbybrown
Joined: 25 Jan 2008
Posts: 12843
Location: dunedin new zealand
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 4:35 am Post subject: |
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Only thing that will stop him being our coach is if he and banner can work together.
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Estonianzulu
Joined: 11 Jan 2007
Posts: 19771
Location: Middle of Nowhere VA
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 7:32 am Post subject: |
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| buno67 wrote: | | fte88 wrote: | | He's vastly overrated, IMO. He's a "QB guru" that has never developed a QB. It's interesting to say the least. He's not coming here regardless, if he wants a big market. |
can you honestly name a coach who is truly a QB guru and has developed many good QBs through out the years? |
The problem is, has Gruden ever developed a QB for long term play?
He was good at taking ancient QB's and getting things out of them, but when he didn't have a veteran, he was quick triggered and inconsistent. He never developed a young roster, both the Raiders and the Buccs fell off the cliff after winning the Super Bowl.
Now, he can get things out of his players and in his prime he got a lot done. But, he's going to be 5 years removed and wont have DC Like Monte Kiffen. There are worse coaches we could bring in, but I won't feel particularly confident about Gruden.
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Drew_Carey
Joined: 10 Mar 2012
Posts: 1478
Location: Seattle - Cleveland
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 8:14 am Post subject: |
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I'd pass Gruden seems like a terrible fit,
I like his experience but that is about it.
Browns should look for a new coach hit,
And go out and hire Mitt.
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paul-mac
Joined: 12 Jul 2009
Posts: 6384
Location: Scotland
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 8:43 am Post subject: |
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I think I've seen this "report" every year since Tampa fired him :p
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ReggieCamp
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
Posts: 8680
Location: Canonsburg, PA
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 8:56 am Post subject: |
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| paul-mac wrote: | | I think I've seen this "report" every year since Tampa fired him :p |
Yeah, no kidding. The op is a fan, so I'm sure that prompted the thread, but I'll believe him coming back when I see it.
Never been a big Chucky fan, so do not want. Of course, if the Browns hire him, then I'll love him.
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Estonianzulu
Joined: 11 Jan 2007
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Location: Middle of Nowhere VA
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 9:18 am Post subject: |
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| ReggieCamp wrote: | | Of course, if the Browns hire him, then I'll love him. |
I forced myself to do that with Mangini, I'm not doing it again.
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ReggieCamp
Joined: 06 Dec 2006
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Location: Canonsburg, PA
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 9:27 am Post subject: |
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| Estonianzulu wrote: | | ReggieCamp wrote: | | Of course, if the Browns hire him, then I'll love him. |
I forced myself to do that with Mangini, I'm not doing it again. |
Yes you will.
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buno67
Joined: 15 Mar 2007
Posts: 24099
Location: Chubs for Chud
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 10:49 am Post subject: |
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| Estonianzulu wrote: | | buno67 wrote: | | fte88 wrote: | | He's vastly overrated, IMO. He's a "QB guru" that has never developed a QB. It's interesting to say the least. He's not coming here regardless, if he wants a big market. |
can you honestly name a coach who is truly a QB guru and has developed many good QBs through out the years? |
The problem is, has Gruden ever developed a QB for long term play?
He was good at taking ancient QB's and getting things out of them, but when he didn't have a veteran, he was quick triggered and inconsistent. He never developed a young roster, both the Raiders and the Buccs fell off the cliff after winning the Super Bowl.
Now, he can get things out of his players and in his prime he got a lot done. But, he's going to be 5 years removed and wont have DC Like Monte Kiffen. There are worse coaches we could bring in, but I won't feel particularly confident about Gruden. |
yeah i know he never developed a QB but im just coming to realize that there isnt really a thing as a QB guru in the NFL. There is no coach in the NFL that has shown the ability to develop good NFL QBs. Like IMO there are College offensive gurus who are able to plug QBs into their system and they excel at it but I dont see those coaches being QBs gurus because their QBs dont do much at the next level and etc.
Yeah Gruden never developed a young roster, he was always handed the keys to a pretty decent rosters/team and was able to push them into stud teams
yeah Gruden hasn't coach for 5years but he has been involved in the game since he has been out of coaching. I think when coaches completely leave the game and try and come back that they have trouble because they haven't seen the game pass them by. With Gruden, He left the coaching but then just headed up to the booth. So he has the chance to see the game develop and change over the years because its been his job to watch and break down the game. So if he comes back to coaching he inst trying to fit a square peg in a round hole.
The one thing I like about Gruden is his energy he can bring to the team. I feel like the past couple coaches: Romeo, Mangini, and Shurmur have all been pretty boring guys and would show no emotion. I think with younger guys a coach has to be emotional when it comes to football. I want to see a coach who gets excited and jumps around after a big play and i want to see a coach errupt on a player when they screw up. IMO, thats the best kind of coaching towards younger players. With older guys they know how things work and can get away not getting fired up or yelled at but with young guys or inexperienced guys you need a coach like Gruden who gets fired up
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fatpig
Joined: 15 Apr 2008
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Location: cleveland
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 11:30 am Post subject: |
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i agree with everything Buno said above. Gruden has fire and his energy will transfer to the players.
i do think Gruden or another big-name coach will come to the Browns. we finally have an owner who cares and will be taken seriously. and lets be honest, if a coach were to come here and turn the Browns around their legacy would be sealed. if a coach comes here and fails, it won't have much impact on their legacy because so many have tried and failed before him.
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DawgX
Joined: 08 Aug 2006
Posts: 9909
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 11:34 am Post subject: |
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It says he wants to coach a big market team, so Cleveland doesn't qualify. Besides, I don't know why so many people want Gruden to be the head coach of the Browns. I wouldn't be totally opposed to hiring him, but there's several other candidates who I'd prefer over him. His brother Jay Gruden is someone I much rather have coach the Browns.
Yes, Gruden won a Super Bowl but the Buccaneers were usually rather mediocre after that. He's an offensive-minded coach yet Tampa's offense was never particularly good. I just don't get why so many people want him. Is it just because he's a big name coach?
Who would you guys rather have: Jay Gruden or Jon Gruden? I already said I'd much rather have Jay Gruden.
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BocaRatonBrown1
Joined: 30 Oct 2008
Posts: 965
Location: Boca raton
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 11:34 am Post subject: |
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There have been many QB guru's if you look even recently.
Holmgren
Favre
Hasselbeck
Walsh with Holmgren
Montanna
Young
Gruden
Gannon
Johnson
Don Shula
Bob Greise
Dan Marino
Bill Belichick
Tom Brady
- Vermeil
Kurt Warner
Trent Green
These are just the recent ones & I am sure you can think of many more.
Notice all these guys where either average college "NFL" type QBs not the Mike Vicks, John Elways, Lucks etc... |
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BrownsDynasty
Joined: 13 Feb 2006
Posts: 912
Location: Williamsburg, VA
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 12:13 pm Post subject: |
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I'd rather hire Chip Kelly
and I don't even like Chip Kelly that much
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