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Bengals #1 problem
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THE DUKE


Joined: 28 Feb 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 9:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Binns and Jones have both been hurt, not AWOL.
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ochocinco4pres


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 9:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The line was fantastic. They kept a clean pocket. They are the reason we won yesterday.

Btw I'm on the boat to give Peerman more touches
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theJ


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 9:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

THE DUKE wrote:
Binns and Jones have both been hurt, not AWOL.

I'll admit i didn't think about that, but i think i'd rather see the starting three as Green-Sanu-Hawkins. Sanu offers a physicality at the position that no one on the team has (even Green). I like the way he bodies up guys and makes tough catches.

ochocinco4pres wrote:
Btw I'm on the boat to give Peerman more touches

Me too.
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LondonBengal


Joined: 07 Feb 2010
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 9:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Carson4MVP wrote:
LondonBengal wrote:
NextBigThing wrote:
Dalton is the "problem".


Dalton throws for 4 TD's, no INT's today, in a 31-13 beat down of the defending World Champs. Andy is on pace for 4000+ yards to easily pass last years Pro Bowl year, and possibly beat some all-time club passing records.

Dalton sure didn't look like a 'problem' today.

'NBT', if you think Dalton is such a problem, would you like to name a quarterback in the draft or on the FA list to go after who is likely to surpass Dalton next year for us ?


It is easy to take his best game of the year and say he isn't the problem. But, he really hasn't been the solution either. Before today's game, he was 24th in the league in total QBR. Hell even after today's "amazing" game against the almighty Giants D, he moved up to 18th... Not really lighting the world on fire, he is just ahead of the mighty Sam Bradford and the infallible Christian Ponder.


Wrong IMO.

Dalton HAS been the solution.

Has everyone forgotten where we were after Palmer walked out on us ? We were in an unholy mess, and Dalton has played a big part in getting us competetive again. He led us to the play-offs last year, and we're still in the hunt this year (just).

I'm sure not saying Dalton is anywhere close to perfect, or in the Brady/ Manning/ Brees league yet, but I maintain that he sure has done a job for us. Dalton maybe #18. but a bigger factor is where our running game is ranked. All QB's need an effective run game, and we've discussed this endlessly elsewhere..

If Dalton isn't the answer, presumably then we drop Andy to QB #2 or trade him, don't re-sign Gradkowski, and sign who exactly to replace Dalton ? Which guy in the draft or on the FA list replaces Dalton from week 1 next year ?

I think the Bengals think Dalton is a keeper, and I predict that the Bengals will give Dalton a big contract before very much longer.
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LondonBengal


Joined: 07 Feb 2010
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 10:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Carson4MVP wrote:
Andy Dalton, just does not have the ability to cover up any other issues, even with a great deal of weapons around him.


So; again; after we've then cut or traded Dalton after this season, who do we go after in the draft or FA to replace him ?

Or are we saying that we should have taken Kaepernick or Mallett last year ?
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THE DUKE


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 10:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

theJ wrote:
THE DUKE wrote:
Binns and Jones have both been hurt, not AWOL.

I'll admit i didn't think about that, but i think i'd rather see the starting three as Green-Sanu-Hawkins. Sanu offers a physicality at the position that no one on the team has (even Green). I like the way he bodies up guys and makes tough catches.

ochocinco4pres wrote:
Btw I'm on the boat to give Peerman more touches

Me too.


Agreed on both points. Right now Sanu should he our #2, with Baby Hawk in the slot.

Peerman is our most dynamic RB right now, which is sad.
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Carson4MVP


Joined: 30 Mar 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 11:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

LondonBengal wrote:
Carson4MVP wrote:
Andy Dalton, just does not have the ability to cover up any other issues, even with a great deal of weapons around him.


So; again; after we've then cut or traded Dalton after this season, who do we go after in the draft or FA to replace him ?

Or are we saying that we should have taken Kaepernick or Mallett last year ?


Ok. Yes he did "carry" us to the playoffs last year, in which we had the easiest SOS in the NFL, and did not beat a single team who finished with a winning record. Yesterday's "big" win, was his first win against a team with a winning record. Everytime he has to face a tougher defense, he fails. The Giants D is so bad, quiet AJ Green called them out for it, and that was the first time I have ever heard him give another team bulletin board material... Then he went out and toasted them. So it isn't saying much about the Giants. Yes they won the superbowl last year, but a year is a BIG difference in the NFL.

I like Dalton, he is a great game manager. If he were with a team like NE or even SF he would be good enough to get them to a championship. But with the build of our team, I think the best he will do for us is a 9-7 or 10-6 record and an early exit from the playoffs. He doesn't have the talent to beat a top defense with his arm. If we had a top 5-7 RB, say if we drafted Doug Martin last year instead of Kirkpatrick, the team could go further.

As to who I would replace him with? It is hard to say FA wise because you never know who will be re-signed or franchised. But with draft picks, take your pick of the rookie QB's next season. There is probably 10 coming out that have more TALENT then Dalton. I wouldn't be against taking a QB in the first or second and letting him learn for a couple years from Dalton and letting him leave after his contract is up, or trading him for a 2nd or 3rd after next year.
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INbengalfan


Joined: 21 Jan 2006
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Location: Richmond, IN
PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 12:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know it's your opinion, but nonsesnse from my perspective. dalton is a game manager, which is what a Ohio River offense needs (yeah, the west coast offense started here under Linde Infante while Bill Walsh was the QB coach). Solidify the line so he doesn't have pressure in his face all the time, get a running game going and the defensive backfield lightensd up to where the WRs can go off. Throw in more defensive stops on third down, which menas drives start further up the field, and Dalton is fine.
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theJ


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 12:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Carson4MVP wrote:
LondonBengal wrote:
Carson4MVP wrote:
Andy Dalton, just does not have the ability to cover up any other issues, even with a great deal of weapons around him.


So; again; after we've then cut or traded Dalton after this season, who do we go after in the draft or FA to replace him ?

Or are we saying that we should have taken Kaepernick or Mallett last year ?


Ok. Yes he did "carry" us to the playoffs last year, in which we had the easiest SOS in the NFL, and did not beat a single team who finished with a winning record. Yesterday's "big" win, was his first win against a team with a winning record. Everytime he has to face a tougher defense, he fails. The Giants D is so bad, quiet AJ Green called them out for it, and that was the first time I have ever heard him give another team bulletin board material... Then he went out and toasted them. So it isn't saying much about the Giants. Yes they won the superbowl last year, but a year is a BIG difference in the NFL.

I like Dalton, he is a great game manager. If he were with a team like NE or even SF he would be good enough to get them to a championship. But with the build of our team, I think the best he will do for us is a 9-7 or 10-6 record and an early exit from the playoffs. He doesn't have the talent to beat a top defense with his arm. If we had a top 5-7 RB, say if we drafted Doug Martin last year instead of Kirkpatrick, the team could go further.

As to who I would replace him with? It is hard to say FA wise because you never know who will be re-signed or franchised. But with draft picks, take your pick of the rookie QB's next season. There is probably 10 coming out that have more TALENT then Dalton. I wouldn't be against taking a QB in the first or second and letting him learn for a couple years from Dalton and letting him leave after his contract is up, or trading him for a 2nd or 3rd after next year.

Too early to bail IMO. You said yourself he doesn't have the talent around him. Take another year of building and see where we are this time next year. If the running game picks up and the defense returns to form, you could see this team win 11-12 games. Dalton hasn't been awesome this year (he's had some great games, some bad), but i know he's been better than last year. I've seen improvement. And that's enough for me (and the coaches) to give him at least another two years.

Bailing on QB's every two years is a great way to always be in rebuild mode. At some point you have to say "ok, what we have isn't ideal. I'd love to have Tom Brady, but let's try to find a way to make Joe Flacco/Alex Smith work".
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Carson4MVP


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

theJ wrote:
Too early to bail IMO. You said yourself he doesn't have the talent around him. Take another year of building and see where we are this time next year. If the running game picks up and the defense returns to form, you could see this team win 11-12 games. Dalton hasn't been awesome this year (he's had some great games, some bad), but i know he's been better than last year. I've seen improvement. And that's enough for me (and the coaches) to give him at least another two years.

Bailing on QB's every two years is a great way to always be in rebuild mode. At some point you have to say "ok, what we have isn't ideal. I'd love to have Tom Brady, but let's try to find a way to make Joe Flacco/Alex Smith work".


I am not saying bail on Dalton, in my previous posts I said the talent level isn't good enough to win with Dalton. I just answered London's question as to if you replace him what I would do. My main point is, a top 5-7 QB or RB will fix most of our offensive woes. Dalton doesn't have the talent to enter the Brady, Mannings, Brees or Ryan sphere. So if we get a top 5 RB in the next 2-3 years, you will see everything come together with this exact nucleus. However, if we keep taking bums off the scrap heap to play RB, we top out as a borderline playoff team with Dalton.
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theJ


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 3:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Carson4MVP wrote:
theJ wrote:
Too early to bail IMO. You said yourself he doesn't have the talent around him. Take another year of building and see where we are this time next year. If the running game picks up and the defense returns to form, you could see this team win 11-12 games. Dalton hasn't been awesome this year (he's had some great games, some bad), but i know he's been better than last year. I've seen improvement. And that's enough for me (and the coaches) to give him at least another two years.

Bailing on QB's every two years is a great way to always be in rebuild mode. At some point you have to say "ok, what we have isn't ideal. I'd love to have Tom Brady, but let's try to find a way to make Joe Flacco/Alex Smith work".


I am not saying bail on Dalton, in my previous posts I said the talent level isn't good enough to win with Dalton. I just answered London's question as to if you replace him what I would do. My main point is, a top 5-7 QB or RB will fix most of our offensive woes. Dalton doesn't have the talent to enter the Brady, Mannings, Brees or Ryan sphere. So if we get a top 5 RB in the next 2-3 years, you will see everything come together with this exact nucleus. However, if we keep taking bums off the scrap heap to play RB, we top out as a borderline playoff team with Dalton.

That i will agree with.
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NextBigThing


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

running the ball = keep ball out of greens hands.

I wish you guys had gone ham for peyton. now you need to draft someone
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theJ


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NextBigThing wrote:
running the ball = keep ball out of greens hands.

I wish you guys had gone ham for peyton. now you need to draft someone

Peyton would have never come to Cincy. He had his own list of teams he wanted to play for. If Seattle wasn't on that list, neither was Cincy.

And i agree, they need to draft a RB. I'm so glad you agree with us. Very Happy
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Carson4MVP


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 6:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NextBigThing wrote:
running the ball = keep ball out of greens hands.

I wish you guys had gone ham for peyton. now you need to draft someone


AJ can't get the ball every play. I just want a RB who can be effective with 15-20 touches a game and keep the defense honest. Spiller, J. Charles, or DMC come to mind. This offense would be elite. You would have a hard time doubling AJ or stacking the box.
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Carson4MVP


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 11:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

An interesting name that will be a FA next year and it appears as if the Dolphins are not going to resign him would be Reggie Bush. Unfortunately, he has never played in the cold regularly and I am not sure how he would fare in the AFCN. I think a RB who can get 60-70 yards on 15 carries and snag a few receptions out of the backfield is exactly what we need and Bush has the talent to do so.

Another thing, why do we insist on putting Hawkins in the slot? I would have no problem with him lining up in the backfield from time to time like Harvin does or like Randall Cobb does for GB. Those teams ensure that their playmakers touch the ball 15+ times a game by getting creative with them, and we seem to be 5 years behind most teams offensively every year. It is as if we are watching NFL films greatest hits from the early 2000's to make our play book. Why not try to innovate more?
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