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Week Nine: Buccaneers (3-4) @ Raiders (3-4)
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youngbuc20


Joined: 15 Dec 2009
Posts: 1218
Location: Bradenton, FL
PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RoeKG wrote:
Lil' Shorty wrote:
The offense is finally doing what it had the potential to, and with 3 backup linemen too. Shocked Martin is absolutely dominant and there is absolutely no ceiling for this kid. He has gotten better and better as the season has gone on! Id love to see him rush for 1,500+ and 12+ TDs. I know Luck and RG3 are QBs and all but if he did that then he has to be in the talk for Rookie of the Year.

Cut Blount on Monday. Never felt this way until today. The dude is trash and despite our horrible pass D he almost single handily lost us the game with that fumble. Maybe you put some of that on Freeman with the exchange but i dont care. Martin never had a problem all day or all season for that matter. DJ Ware and Michael Smith will be fine backups.

We have the #1 Rush D and the #32 Pass D. Eh? Think Any new DC should be able to keep the run D good but Sheridan needs to be fired at the end of the year. We do have a poor secondary but being that bad in pass D, regardless of how good your rush D is is inexcusable. Bye bye Bill.


Asking to fire Sheridan is a little to harsh for me. When teams can't run the ball on you, what are they going to do? Pass. When you have the lead like we have for a huge amount of time this season, what are teams going to do? Pass.

Look at the stats and numbers all you like, but the situations skew the numbers. Yes, the pass defense needs improvement, but with our very low sack total I think it's clear that we need pressure for the pass defense to succeed which is true everywhere. We need Clayborn and our other DEs to be healthy as much as we need a #1 corner.


Also the lack of talent at the defensive back position. Our best cornerback is Eric Wright(which isn't saying much)who has also been battling injuries. Behind him we have Biggers, McDonald, Leonard Johnson(rookie UDFA) and Lewis(who isn't even good enough to warm our bench).
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Diesel00


Joined: 09 Aug 2008
Posts: 295
PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

youngbuc20 wrote:
RoeKG wrote:
Lil' Shorty wrote:
The offense is finally doing what it had the potential to, and with 3 backup linemen too. Shocked Martin is absolutely dominant and there is absolutely no ceiling for this kid. He has gotten better and better as the season has gone on! Id love to see him rush for 1,500+ and 12+ TDs. I know Luck and RG3 are QBs and all but if he did that then he has to be in the talk for Rookie of the Year.

Cut Blount on Monday. Never felt this way until today. The dude is trash and despite our horrible pass D he almost single handily lost us the game with that fumble. Maybe you put some of that on Freeman with the exchange but i dont care. Martin never had a problem all day or all season for that matter. DJ Ware and Michael Smith will be fine backups.

We have the #1 Rush D and the #32 Pass D. Eh? Think Any new DC should be able to keep the run D good but Sheridan needs to be fired at the end of the year. We do have a poor secondary but being that bad in pass D, regardless of how good your rush D is is inexcusable. Bye bye Bill.


Asking to fire Sheridan is a little to harsh for me. When teams can't run the ball on you, what are they going to do? Pass. When you have the lead like we have for a huge amount of time this season, what are teams going to do? Pass.

Look at the stats and numbers all you like, but the situations skew the numbers. Yes, the pass defense needs improvement, but with our very low sack total I think it's clear that we need pressure for the pass defense to succeed which is true everywhere. We need Clayborn and our other DEs to be healthy as much as we need a #1 corner.


Also the lack of talent at the defensive back position. Our best cornerback is Eric Wright(which isn't saying much)who has also been battling injuries. Behind him we have Biggers, McDonald, Leonard Johnson(rookie UDFA) and Lewis(who isn't even good enough to warm our bench).


I would say our best Corner right now is Johnson. Biggers got picked on allor by Palmer yesterday. We are hurting bad for corners right now.
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BBando


Joined: 18 Feb 2011
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Location: Tampa Bay
PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Guys you are overrating how how big of a deal a pass d is. You don't need to have a beastly one to make the playoffs. Sheridan just doesn't have the CBs yet. It will get better. We have E.J. Biggers and freaking Myron Lewis starting. As for the pass rush. Lets get everyone healthy. Even though I wouldn't mind adding a beast DT. But CB is definitely option 1. Just calm down. The number 1 thing is stopping the run in the NFL. Which we have been great at.
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Lil' Shorty


Joined: 23 Nov 2007
Posts: 3117
Location: NC...surrounded by lame Panther fans.
PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 11:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RoeKG wrote:
Lil' Shorty wrote:
The offense is finally doing what it had the potential to, and with 3 backup linemen too. Shocked Martin is absolutely dominant and there is absolutely no ceiling for this kid. He has gotten better and better as the season has gone on! Id love to see him rush for 1,500+ and 12+ TDs. I know Luck and RG3 are QBs and all but if he did that then he has to be in the talk for Rookie of the Year.

Cut Blount on Monday. Never felt this way until today. The dude is trash and despite our horrible pass D he almost single handily lost us the game with that fumble. Maybe you put some of that on Freeman with the exchange but i dont care. Martin never had a problem all day or all season for that matter. DJ Ware and Michael Smith will be fine backups.

We have the #1 Rush D and the #32 Pass D. Eh? Think Any new DC should be able to keep the run D good but Sheridan needs to be fired at the end of the year. We do have a poor secondary but being that bad in pass D, regardless of how good your rush D is is inexcusable. Bye bye Bill.


Asking to fire Sheridan is a little to harsh for me. When teams can't run the ball on you, what are they going to do? Pass. When you have the lead like we have for a huge amount of time this season, what are teams going to do? Pass.

Look at the stats and numbers all you like, but the situations skew the numbers. Yes, the pass defense needs improvement, but with our very low sack total I think it's clear that we need pressure for the pass defense to succeed which is true everywhere. We need Clayborn and our other DEs to be healthy as much as we need a #1 corner.

I see what you are saying and you have a very good point. I mean our CBs are absolutely killing us. It doesn't help them at all that our run D is so good and we still arnt putting enough pressure on the QB. However, Sheridan did this crap in NY too. I really don't have faith in the kind of D he runs in passing situations. Still isolating CBs that are getting beaten up all day long. Shout out to Leonard Johnson though. Played like a champ yesterday. All I'm saying I guess is that Schiano should evaluate Sheridan at the end of the year and depending on what DCs are available, make a change. I mean I doubt Sheridan's D is the reason our run D is so good or why we have so many plays for negative yards.
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YoungBucs15


Joined: 14 Jan 2009
Posts: 3708
PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 12:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The catch to this whole 32nd rank pass defense is that this is a very bend but don't break part of our defense.

While we have given up huge amount of yards, we have only given up 13 td's through the air will get 13 int's. There is plenty of teams that have given up the same amount or more. We have the same amount as 2 of the top 5 pass defenses. To me, YPG is a nice stat but not an overall stat that you should judge your defense by. I'm not trying to stand behind Lewis or Biggers as our CB's as I knew once Lewis was in he was gonna give up a TD, which he didn't let me down. However I think Leonard starts across from Biggers the rest of the season and we look for Biggers replacement next year. We have given up the big plays but I think that our red zone defense in general is pretty high up there limiting points. Can't find the exact ranking but last i checked it was pretty good.

The same could be said about our rush defense, while we give up few yards. The 20 something game this week helped balance us back out from the Vikings and Redskins game, however we have given up 6 rushing TD's. To me the Texans have the #1 rush defense. 0 td's, no runs over 40 allowed and 6 fumbles.

Ultimately we can't expect everything to turn around in one off-season with Schiano. I would think that most of us would rank our biggest issues coming into this season would be stopping the run, establish an offense and rush the passer. So far we have done 2 of the 3 and I think if Clayborn was still in we would see that improved as well. Similar to our run defense last year tanking when McCoy went out, it's happening to our sacks numbers with Clayborn out. It shows that while we have drafted the talent for starters. We are still hindered by the lack of depth on the team. And when turning the roster around like we have, we have to build our starters first and the depth will come along.
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bucsfan333


Joined: 15 Jun 2007
Posts: 24446
Location: the mitten
PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 1:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think (and hope) that once Bowers starts getting more playing time, and maybe even starts, that our pass rush should improve. But that's not really saying much. Laughing Neutral

If we can ever have a healthy Clayborn/Bowers/Bennett rotation, we might not be half bad at getting after the QB. I still want a speed rusher, a guy that can rush up field and consistantly force the QB to step up into McCoy's arms. Any semblence of a pass rush would make our CBs look at least average.

Leo is a darkhorse to be a full time starter if he can improve over our last eight games. He's looked pretty good, but we're comparing him to our other lulzy CBs. He looks elite comparitively. Hopefully he gets more playing time as the season goes on.

Black might be able to replace Barber. Might. I don't know how he'd do with more playing time, but he hasn't been too bad in our rotation.
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ravishingone


Joined: 07 Jan 2007
Posts: 2611
Location: Leola
PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 1:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

YoungBucs15 wrote:
The catch to this whole 32nd rank pass defense is that this is a very bend but don't break part of our defense.

While we have given up huge amount of yards, we have only given up 13 td's through the air will get 13 int's. There is plenty of teams that have given up the same amount or more. We have the same amount as 2 of the top 5 pass defenses. To me, YPG is a nice stat but not an overall stat that you should judge your defense by. I'm not trying to stand behind Lewis or Biggers as our CB's as I knew once Lewis was in he was gonna give up a TD, which he didn't let me down. However I think Leonard starts across from Biggers the rest of the season and we look for Biggers replacement next year. We have given up the big plays but I think that our red zone defense in general is pretty high up there limiting points. Can't find the exact ranking but last i checked it was pretty good.

The same could be said about our rush defense, while we give up few yards. The 20 something game this week helped balance us back out from the Vikings and Redskins game, however we have given up 6 rushing TD's. To me the Texans have the #1 rush defense. 0 td's, no runs over 40 allowed and 6 fumbles.

Ultimately we can't expect everything to turn around in one off-season with Schiano. I would think that most of us would rank our biggest issues coming into this season would be stopping the run, establish an offense and rush the passer. So far we have done 2 of the 3 and I think if Clayborn was still in we would see that improved as well. Similar to our run defense last year tanking when McCoy went out, it's happening to our sacks numbers with Clayborn out. It shows that while we have drafted the talent for starters. We are still hindered by the lack of depth on the team. And when turning the roster around like we have, we have to build our starters first and the depth will come along.


Very well written, and let's not forget there is a lot of inexperienced players on that side of the ball. More playing time will make guys better in pass defense. McCoy has played only 1 1/2 years, Bowers in his second year, Teo Nasheim is basically a rookie, Foster in his second year, David a rookie. In the secondary, Barron is a rookie, Johnson is a rookie, Black just got playing time this year, so they are very green back there. With playing experience and coaching this part of the defense will get better. Do they need more talent added in the offseason? Absolutely.
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Calibucsfan


Joined: 05 Sep 2011
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 1:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BBando wrote:
Guys you are overrating how how big of a deal a pass d is..

Joking right?

Look at the Giants game. Thats exactly what will happen in the playoffs with that secondary
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BBando


Joined: 18 Feb 2011
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 2:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Calibucsfan wrote:
BBando wrote:
Guys you are overrating how how big of a deal a pass d is..

Joking right?

Look at the Giants game. Thats exactly what will happen in the playoffs with that secondary
You know how the Pats had one of the worst pass defense in NFL history last year. What I am trying to say. We have scrubs at cbs right now. Bill Sheridan, Monte Kiffin, - LeBeau etc couldn't do anything with these garbage CBs we got. E.J. Biggers is our number 1 corner. This dude wouldn't even be 3rd string for the majority of the league. You can't polish a turd into a gem. With that said. Lets get some decent CBs and come back to this.
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 2:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stats can be deceiving though. We given up only 13 passing tds but when we went up against a top qb we've been scorched. Bree's threw 4tda and 400 yds. Manning threw for 500 and 3 tds. Then Palmer who is on the downside ripped it up.

Ryan with Julio and roddy with tony G will have a field day if we don't adjust.
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Calibucsfan


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 3:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
Stats can be deceiving though. We given up only 13 passing tds but when we went up against a top qb we've been scorched. Bree's threw 4tda and 400 yds. Manning threw for 500 and 3 tds. Then Palmer who is on the downside ripped it up.

Ryan with Julio and roddy with tony G will have a field day if we don't adjust.

The thought of EJ Biggers lining up against Julio Jones makes me sick
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DaRealdeal


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 3:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maybe we'll go after Stanford Routt. He was just waived by the Chiefs.

http://twitter.com/adamteicher/status/265537057693249536

Quote:
To make roster room for Shaun smith, #Chiefs waived Stanford routt

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REDandPEWTER


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 4:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DaRealdeal wrote:
Maybe we'll go after Stanford Routt. He was just waived by the Chiefs.

http://twitter.com/adamteicher/status/265537057693249536

Quote:
To make roster room for Shaun smith, #Chiefs waived Stanford routt


Ehh I wouldn't put in a waiver claim for him. His salary is pretty high. Maybe if he clears waivers but idk if he'd improve our secondary or make it worse.
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Calibucsfan


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree, lets get him IF he clears waivers.

He is bad...but not EJ Biggers bad...so it would be a small upgrade
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DaRealdeal


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 4:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
DaRealdeal wrote:
Maybe we'll go after Stanford Routt. He was just waived by the Chiefs.

http://twitter.com/adamteicher/status/265537057693249536

Quote:
To make roster room for Shaun smith, #Chiefs waived Stanford routt


Ehh I wouldn't put in a waiver claim for him. His salary is pretty high. Maybe if he clears waivers but idk if he'd improve our secondary or make it worse.

I wouldn't either, not with that contract, but if he clears waivers he's definitely better than some of the garbage that we have trotted out there this season.
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