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The Fate of Whiz
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Total Votes : 30

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JohnnyV


Joined: 04 Jan 2008
Posts: 2205
Location: Chicago, Illinois
PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 4:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stchamp98 wrote:
JohnnyV wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
JohnnyV wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
younggun1273 wrote:
I don't care if we go after a coach with a recognized name or not, I just want to see this team take that leap into a consistent legitimate playoff contender. When Greg Schiano, Mike Smith, and Joe Philbin were hired, no one expected much but they all hit the ground running and showed improvement. That's what I want to see. Look at the Colts. They switched their defensive scheme entirely and had a depleted roster yet are now 6-3.

We are also ranked 25th in penalties per game. So we aren't very disciplined either.


Bolded: Colts aren't a great example. For 1, their success is only made possible by finishing with one of the worst regular seasons in league history and acquiring Andrew Luck in the process. That's not skill, that is (no punt intended) pure luck. For 2, they've played a pretty child-like schedule. Jacksonville twice, Cleveland, Tennessee, Miami at home. Still have games against Buffalo, Tennessee and Kansas City and if things continue on as they have, a Houston team resting starters in week 17 (That game is in Indy too). They beat Green Bay and that's nice but all of their losses come against the only other good teams they've played. And 2 of those losses were 20+ point losses.

The Colts aren't what they appear to be.


They hit the lottery with TWO once in a franchise type quarterbacks.

Yet we haven't had one like ever.


Have to finish 1-15 to get there. I have no interest in that.


I'd rather go 1-15 than be stuck with double digit loses year after year after year which is what this franchise has been cursed with for the most part.


You go ahead, I'm not with ya on this one. Being happy for 1-15 isn't in my DNA.


The Falcons had a disaster season, got Matt Ryan. Up until this year, Carolina's bust year was well worth it for Cam.

I'm not claiming I'd be happy with 1-15, but it's common sense to know that you are perhaps getting a player that will benefit your franchise far longer than you are with say the 5th, 6th or 7th player overall.

Yes, it depends on the year and what's available.

But I don't see much difference between being the worst team and say the 5th worst team in football. Hell we lost to that TERRIBLE Carolina team in 2010.

Record isn't everything. Give me the first overall pick.
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stchamp98


Most Valuable Poster (3rd Ballot)

Joined: 11 Apr 2005
Posts: 53052
Location: Havre, Montana
PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JohnnyV wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
JohnnyV wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
JohnnyV wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
younggun1273 wrote:
I don't care if we go after a coach with a recognized name or not, I just want to see this team take that leap into a consistent legitimate playoff contender. When Greg Schiano, Mike Smith, and Joe Philbin were hired, no one expected much but they all hit the ground running and showed improvement. That's what I want to see. Look at the Colts. They switched their defensive scheme entirely and had a depleted roster yet are now 6-3.

We are also ranked 25th in penalties per game. So we aren't very disciplined either.


Bolded: Colts aren't a great example. For 1, their success is only made possible by finishing with one of the worst regular seasons in league history and acquiring Andrew Luck in the process. That's not skill, that is (no punt intended) pure luck. For 2, they've played a pretty child-like schedule. Jacksonville twice, Cleveland, Tennessee, Miami at home. Still have games against Buffalo, Tennessee and Kansas City and if things continue on as they have, a Houston team resting starters in week 17 (That game is in Indy too). They beat Green Bay and that's nice but all of their losses come against the only other good teams they've played. And 2 of those losses were 20+ point losses.

The Colts aren't what they appear to be.


They hit the lottery with TWO once in a franchise type quarterbacks.

Yet we haven't had one like ever.


Have to finish 1-15 to get there. I have no interest in that.


I'd rather go 1-15 than be stuck with double digit loses year after year after year which is what this franchise has been cursed with for the most part.


You go ahead, I'm not with ya on this one. Being happy for 1-15 isn't in my DNA.


The Falcons had a disaster season, got Matt Ryan. Up until this year, Carolina's bust year was well worth it for Cam.

I'm not claiming I'd be happy with 1-15, but it's common sense to know that you are perhaps getting a player that will benefit your franchise far longer than you are with say the 5th, 6th or 7th player overall.

Yes, it depends on the year and what's available.

But I don't see much difference between being the worst team and say the 5th worst team in football. Hell we lost to that TERRIBLE Carolina team in 2010.

Record isn't everything. Give me the first overall pick.


Bolded: LOL, stopped reading right there.
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JohnnyV


Joined: 04 Jan 2008
Posts: 2205
Location: Chicago, Illinois
PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stchamp98 wrote:
JohnnyV wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
JohnnyV wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
JohnnyV wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
younggun1273 wrote:
I don't care if we go after a coach with a recognized name or not, I just want to see this team take that leap into a consistent legitimate playoff contender. When Greg Schiano, Mike Smith, and Joe Philbin were hired, no one expected much but they all hit the ground running and showed improvement. That's what I want to see. Look at the Colts. They switched their defensive scheme entirely and had a depleted roster yet are now 6-3.

We are also ranked 25th in penalties per game. So we aren't very disciplined either.


Bolded: Colts aren't a great example. For 1, their success is only made possible by finishing with one of the worst regular seasons in league history and acquiring Andrew Luck in the process. That's not skill, that is (no punt intended) pure luck. For 2, they've played a pretty child-like schedule. Jacksonville twice, Cleveland, Tennessee, Miami at home. Still have games against Buffalo, Tennessee and Kansas City and if things continue on as they have, a Houston team resting starters in week 17 (That game is in Indy too). They beat Green Bay and that's nice but all of their losses come against the only other good teams they've played. And 2 of those losses were 20+ point losses.

The Colts aren't what they appear to be.


They hit the lottery with TWO once in a franchise type quarterbacks.

Yet we haven't had one like ever.


Have to finish 1-15 to get there. I have no interest in that.


I'd rather go 1-15 than be stuck with double digit loses year after year after year which is what this franchise has been cursed with for the most part.


You go ahead, I'm not with ya on this one. Being happy for 1-15 isn't in my DNA.


The Falcons had a disaster season, got Matt Ryan. Up until this year, Carolina's bust year was well worth it for Cam.

I'm not claiming I'd be happy with 1-15, but it's common sense to know that you are perhaps getting a player that will benefit your franchise far longer than you are with say the 5th, 6th or 7th player overall.

Yes, it depends on the year and what's available.

But I don't see much difference between being the worst team and say the 5th worst team in football. Hell we lost to that TERRIBLE Carolina team in 2010.

Record isn't everything. Give me the first overall pick.


Bolded: LOL, stopped reading right there.


Jury still not out. Guy had the greatest stastical season by a rookie ever.
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stchamp98


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 4:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If the jury's still out then you shouldn't try and use him to make your case.

More turnovers than touchdowns. Ron Rivera's hanging by a thread in large part to that. Marty Hurney's out. To say that picked saved the franchise is...kind of a joke.
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JohnnyV


Joined: 04 Jan 2008
Posts: 2205
Location: Chicago, Illinois
PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stchamp98 wrote:
If the jury's still out then you shouldn't try and use him to make your case.

More turnovers than touchdowns. Ron Rivera's hanging by a thread in large part to that. Marty Hurney's out. To say that picked saved the franchise is...kind of a joke.


He played well enough last year for them to be a .500 team but their defense was maybe the worst in the NFC.

He's taken a step back in year two but so did Matt Ryan. The imature background was always there but his play made up for it.

Now it's just more noticable.
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DJ_Fka


Joined: 13 Jan 2009
Posts: 5237
Location: Brisvegas, Land Down Under
PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 5:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

They have gone away from what made him successul in his rookie year.

They will bounce back, Cam has talent, too much talent to fail for too long.
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DirtyDez


Joined: 15 Oct 2010
Posts: 13214
Location: the Arizona desert
PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 5:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If we're legitimately in the Chip sweepstakes we need to be unbiased on our franchise compared to other potential HC openings...

Oakland - Poorly run franchise. Don't see Chip going there.
KC - Charles is the perfect RB for him. Talent on defense like us.
Philly - McCoy another excellent fit. Explosive weapons on offense.
Dallas - Nobody wants to be Jerry's puppet. Cowher and Fisher weren't even interested.
San Diego - Best QB if the bunch and on the west coast.
Jacksonville/Bills - Nothing really attractive there.

Where does the Cards job stack up?
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stchamp98


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 6:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DirtyDez wrote:
If we're legitimately in the Chip sweepstakes we need to be unbiased on our franchise compared to other potential HC openings...

Oakland - Poorly run franchise. Don't see Chip going there.
KC - Charles is the perfect RB for him. Talent on defense like us.
Philly - McCoy another excellent fit. Explosive weapons on offense.
Dallas - Nobody wants to be Jerry's puppet. Cowher and Fisher weren't even interested.
San Diego - Best QB if the bunch and on the west coast.
Jacksonville/Bills - Nothing really attractive there.


Bolded: If Jamaal Charles is the quote, "perfect RB for him", then there's a lot more then nothing to Buffalo. 2 letters, 1 word: CJ Spiller
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stchamp98


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 6:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JohnnyV wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
If the jury's still out then you shouldn't try and use him to make your case.

More turnovers than touchdowns. Ron Rivera's hanging by a thread in large part to that. Marty Hurney's out. To say that picked saved the franchise is...kind of a joke.


He played well enough last year for them to be a .500 team but their defense was maybe the worst in the NFC.

He's taken a step back in year two but so did Matt Ryan. The imature background was always there but his play made up for it.

Now it's just more noticable.


You'rer right, it's always more noticeable when you're terrible.
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DirtyDez


Joined: 15 Oct 2010
Posts: 13214
Location: the Arizona desert
PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 6:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stchamp98 wrote:
DirtyDez wrote:
If we're legitimately in the Chip sweepstakes we need to be unbiased on our franchise compared to other potential HC openings...

Oakland - Poorly run franchise. Don't see Chip going there.
KC - Charles is the perfect RB for him. Talent on defense like us.
Philly - McCoy another excellent fit. Explosive weapons on offense.
Dallas - Nobody wants to be Jerry's puppet. Cowher and Fisher weren't even interested.
San Diego - Best QB if the bunch and on the west coast.
Jacksonville/Bills - Nothing really attractive there.


Bolded: If Jamaal Charles is the quote, "perfect RB for him", then there's a lot more then nothing to Buffalo. 2 letters, 1 word: CJ Spiller


Geno and Jamal? Yeah KC vs BUF isn't really close in terms of better job IMO...
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stchamp98


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 6:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DirtyDez wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
DirtyDez wrote:
If we're legitimately in the Chip sweepstakes we need to be unbiased on our franchise compared to other potential HC openings...

Oakland - Poorly run franchise. Don't see Chip going there.
KC - Charles is the perfect RB for him. Talent on defense like us.
Philly - McCoy another excellent fit. Explosive weapons on offense.
Dallas - Nobody wants to be Jerry's puppet. Cowher and Fisher weren't even interested.
San Diego - Best QB if the bunch and on the west coast.
Jacksonville/Bills - Nothing really attractive there.


Bolded: If Jamaal Charles is the quote, "perfect RB for him", then there's a lot more then nothing to Buffalo. 2 letters, 1 word: CJ Spiller


Geno and Jamal? Yeah KC vs BUF isn't really close in terms of better job IMO...


I didn't realize KC had already drafted Geno Smith. Thanks for the heads up.

If we're putting him into play, that ups Jacksonville's allure.
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DirtyDez


Joined: 15 Oct 2010
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's still a better job. Chip isn't going to Buffalo...
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stchamp98


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 6:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DirtyDez wrote:
It's still a better job. Chip isn't going to Buffalo...


I guess I'll have to take your word for that beings as, you know, it's purely your opinion and not based on anything.

Who says we're even in a competition for Chip Kelly? Who says he wants to be here? Who says we want him here? Is there anything to suggest any of that? Not really. It's all just fan speculation. So while we're speculating let's not make it seem like a team like Buffalo, who has arguably the most explosive RB in this league and a lot of defensive talent doesn't have as good a chance as anyone else.
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DJ_Fka


Joined: 13 Jan 2009
Posts: 5237
Location: Brisvegas, Land Down Under
PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KC with Geno, Charles and Chip

They are clear 2nd in that AFC West, pushing Peyton and the Broncos

SD needs a change, otherwise they are 3rd in this scenario.
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Yibbyl


Joined: 21 Apr 2011
Posts: 2391
Location: Redding, CA
PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 10:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DirtyDez wrote:
It's still a better job. Chip isn't going to Buffalo...

Can't say one way or the other about the 2nd sentence, but I think the 1st is accurate. Not because of the players though, but because of the fact that Ralph Wilson is a couple of years older than ancient and there are some upcoming issues regarding the stadium. We're actually fighting a battle to keep the team in Buffalo and the likelihood of a new owner in the relatively near future is not out of the question. IMHO the turmoil those 2 things could cause is enough to compensate for KC's less-talented team, which does make Buffalo a less desirable job. Unfortunately.
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