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With the 32nd pick the Bears select? [Mock Added Pg 4]
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dabears32


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 12:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anybody from 'Bama.
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Madmike90


Joined: 25 Jan 2009
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 6:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

AZBearsFan wrote:
Madmike90 wrote:
bearsaddict wrote:
Madmike90 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
Madmike90 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
Right now I would say our needs are

1. OL
2. LB
3. CB
4. TE

All those positions usually have value picks in the late 1st.


I would say…

1. LB
2. OL
3. CB
4. DL
5. TE

I have Dline ahead of TE depending on Idonije’s status…if he isn’t resigned we lose a versatile part of our Dline…this season has proven that if we can get pass rush we can be dominate on the defensive side of the ball…we have to keep the talent and depth levels up at that spot…

As for the TE position we have to decide what we want at the position and stick to it…we aren’t going to find a TE like Gronk who can do it all…we have to decide if we are going to have a TE who is a great blocker but is lacking in the passing game or if we want an undersized receiving TE…until we decide on that direction I don’t see any real point in pouring resources into the position…altho one guy who is really growing on me is Nick Kasa out of Colorado…former DE who plays the TE spot with that kind of mentality…but has also averaged over 18 YPC this season…he is very very raw but the size at 6-6” 260lbs with his mentality and physical ability could see him being this years Taylor Thompson who went in the 4th this year.


I think TE is a weapon that we simply do not have.

Right now on our offence I can argue, that outside of Carimi who needs time, that TE is the worst position on our offence.

If I can get a real weapon like Graham I make the move.

Gronk is 1 in a million.


I don't think there is anyone close to even Graham...the best TE in the draft is Eifert and he is just another Greg Olsen IMO...

I think we are getting too wrapped up in wanting a big time pass catcher at TE...offences like The Pats and Saints don't have an elite WR on the outside so there TEs have to be the focal point of their passing attack…and at times they suffer for only being able to do certain things with those TEs...we have Marshall on the outside...a TE in this offence won't catch as many balls as one will in NE or NO so our TE's skill set has to be different because it’s getting harder and harder to find great all round TEs from the college ranks...to me you almost have to choose if you want a pass catcher or a blocker…for me this offence might even be better with a truly great blocking TE…especially if Alshon lives up to his potential.
This just doesn't make sense. You are correct in that a solid TE would not get as many touches as in NE, but it is silly to say our tight end's skill set has to be different because of that. A solid pass catching TE would really screw defenses by not allowing them to really try to lock up Marshall and Jeffery. You said it yourself that NE can really be hurt by the fact that they don't have elite WRs, well, imagine how much it opens everything up when you DO have elite WRs. I will also say this, Eifert is NOT just another Greg Olsen. He has better hands AND he is a better blocker.


But the difference is NE don’t just have “solid” pass catching TEs…they have the elite TE in the NFL and one of the very best pass catching TEs…if we could get a guy who was as good as those two then scheme wouldn’t matter but IMO no one in the upcoming draft is close to Gronk or has the versatility of Hernandez…a solid pass catching TE would be great in this offence…but because he wouldn’t see the ball a ton with the talents not only on the outside but coming out of the backfield he would have to be able to block just as well as he catches because he won’t be the featured target like Gronk or Hernandez are…with the rise of the spread offence in the college game it is getting harder and harder to find great all round TEs…which means you have to balance out getting a quality receiving TE if you want to feature them a lot in the passing game…or get a TE who can catch some balls over the middle but who’s main role is to help in the blocking game…

Like everyone else I would love an elite weapon at TE but I just don’t think there is enough balls to go around to warrant taking one in the 1st round…especially not for a guy like Eifert who like I said IMO is another Greg Olsen…in fact Eifert is very similar to Coby Fleener from last year IMO.

Do you think that Greg Olsen wouldn't be a great weapon in our offense right now with Marshall and Alshon in the mix? I would LOVE to bring a Greg Olsen type in right now to be a complimentary player.


But would you use a 1st round pick to do it? Because that is the real question…as I said I would love to have a big time weapon at TE but if that weapon isn’t going to be the 1st, 2nd or even 3rd look on many passing plays are we really going to invest a 1st round pick in that kind of TE? Especially if they don’t offer much in the blocking phase of the game?
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Madmike90


Joined: 25 Jan 2009
Posts: 23233
Location: Scotland
PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 6:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

pigsooie5 wrote:
Madmike90 wrote:
bearsaddict wrote:
Madmike90 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
Madmike90 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
Right now I would say our needs are

1. OL
2. LB
3. CB
4. TE

All those positions usually have value picks in the late 1st.


I would say…

1. LB
2. OL
3. CB
4. DL
5. TE

I have Dline ahead of TE depending on Idonije’s status…if he isn’t resigned we lose a versatile part of our Dline…this season has proven that if we can get pass rush we can be dominate on the defensive side of the ball…we have to keep the talent and depth levels up at that spot…

As for the TE position we have to decide what we want at the position and stick to it…we aren’t going to find a TE like Gronk who can do it all…we have to decide if we are going to have a TE who is a great blocker but is lacking in the passing game or if we want an undersized receiving TE…until we decide on that direction I don’t see any real point in pouring resources into the position…altho one guy who is really growing on me is Nick Kasa out of Colorado…former DE who plays the TE spot with that kind of mentality…but has also averaged over 18 YPC this season…he is very very raw but the size at 6-6” 260lbs with his mentality and physical ability could see him being this years Taylor Thompson who went in the 4th this year.


I think TE is a weapon that we simply do not have.

Right now on our offence I can argue, that outside of Carimi who needs time, that TE is the worst position on our offence.

If I can get a real weapon like Graham I make the move.

Gronk is 1 in a million.


I don't think there is anyone close to even Graham...the best TE in the draft is Eifert and he is just another Greg Olsen IMO...

I think we are getting too wrapped up in wanting a big time pass catcher at TE...offences like The Pats and Saints don't have an elite WR on the outside so there TEs have to be the focal point of their passing attack…and at times they suffer for only being able to do certain things with those TEs...we have Marshall on the outside...a TE in this offence won't catch as many balls as one will in NE or NO so our TE's skill set has to be different because it’s getting harder and harder to find great all round TEs from the college ranks...to me you almost have to choose if you want a pass catcher or a blocker…for me this offence might even be better with a truly great blocking TE…especially if Alshon lives up to his potential.
This just doesn't make sense. You are correct in that a solid TE would not get as many touches as in NE, but it is silly to say our tight end's skill set has to be different because of that. A solid pass catching TE would really screw defenses by not allowing them to really try to lock up Marshall and Jeffery. You said it yourself that NE can really be hurt by the fact that they don't have elite WRs, well, imagine how much it opens everything up when you DO have elite WRs. I will also say this, Eifert is NOT just another Greg Olsen. He has better hands AND he is a better blocker.


But the difference is NE don’t just have “solid” pass catching TEs…they have the elite TE in the NFL and one of the very best pass catching TEs…if we could get a guy who was as good as those two then scheme wouldn’t matter but IMO no one in the upcoming draft is close to Gronk or has the versatility of Hernandez…a solid pass catching TE would be great in this offence…but because he wouldn’t see the ball a ton with the talents not only on the outside but coming out of the backfield he would have to be able to block just as well as he catches because he won’t be the featured target like Gronk or Hernandez are…with the rise of the spread offence in the college game it is getting harder and harder to find great all round TEs…which means you have to balance out getting a quality receiving TE if you want to feature them a lot in the passing game…or get a TE who can catch some balls over the middle but who’s main role is to help in the blocking game…

Like everyone else I would love an elite weapon at TE but I just don’t think there is enough balls to go around to warrant taking one in the 1st round…especially not for a guy like Eifert who like I said IMO is another Greg Olsen…in fact Eifert is very similar to Coby Fleener from last year IMO.

You make it sound like it's an elite TE or none... That can't be the mindset. There is a huge gap between Kellen Davis and an elite TE, we need to find somebody inbetween... How many young QB's have there TE as there major safety blanket? Cutler NEEDS one, not Kellen Davis, and just because theres no "elite" TE shouldn't deter us from looking that direction.


The question wasn’t if we could use a new starting TE…of course we could since Davis is shown zero consistency…the question was who would you select with the 32nd overall pick…IMO if you are going to take a TE in the 1st round these days they have to have the potential to be elite…I don’t see that in any TE in this draft.
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WindyCity


Joined: 26 Jun 2009
Posts: 10322
PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 10:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Madmike90 wrote:
pigsooie5 wrote:
Madmike90 wrote:
bearsaddict wrote:
Madmike90 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
Madmike90 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
Right now I would say our needs are

1. OL
2. LB
3. CB
4. TE

All those positions usually have value picks in the late 1st.


I would say…

1. LB
2. OL
3. CB
4. DL
5. TE

I have Dline ahead of TE depending on Idonije’s status…if he isn’t resigned we lose a versatile part of our Dline…this season has proven that if we can get pass rush we can be dominate on the defensive side of the ball…we have to keep the talent and depth levels up at that spot…

As for the TE position we have to decide what we want at the position and stick to it…we aren’t going to find a TE like Gronk who can do it all…we have to decide if we are going to have a TE who is a great blocker but is lacking in the passing game or if we want an undersized receiving TE…until we decide on that direction I don’t see any real point in pouring resources into the position…altho one guy who is really growing on me is Nick Kasa out of Colorado…former DE who plays the TE spot with that kind of mentality…but has also averaged over 18 YPC this season…he is very very raw but the size at 6-6” 260lbs with his mentality and physical ability could see him being this years Taylor Thompson who went in the 4th this year.


I think TE is a weapon that we simply do not have.

Right now on our offence I can argue, that outside of Carimi who needs time, that TE is the worst position on our offence.

If I can get a real weapon like Graham I make the move.

Gronk is 1 in a million.


I don't think there is anyone close to even Graham...the best TE in the draft is Eifert and he is just another Greg Olsen IMO...

I think we are getting too wrapped up in wanting a big time pass catcher at TE...offences like The Pats and Saints don't have an elite WR on the outside so there TEs have to be the focal point of their passing attack…and at times they suffer for only being able to do certain things with those TEs...we have Marshall on the outside...a TE in this offence won't catch as many balls as one will in NE or NO so our TE's skill set has to be different because it’s getting harder and harder to find great all round TEs from the college ranks...to me you almost have to choose if you want a pass catcher or a blocker…for me this offence might even be better with a truly great blocking TE…especially if Alshon lives up to his potential.
This just doesn't make sense. You are correct in that a solid TE would not get as many touches as in NE, but it is silly to say our tight end's skill set has to be different because of that. A solid pass catching TE would really screw defenses by not allowing them to really try to lock up Marshall and Jeffery. You said it yourself that NE can really be hurt by the fact that they don't have elite WRs, well, imagine how much it opens everything up when you DO have elite WRs. I will also say this, Eifert is NOT just another Greg Olsen. He has better hands AND he is a better blocker.


But the difference is NE don’t just have “solid” pass catching TEs…they have the elite TE in the NFL and one of the very best pass catching TEs…if we could get a guy who was as good as those two then scheme wouldn’t matter but IMO no one in the upcoming draft is close to Gronk or has the versatility of Hernandez…a solid pass catching TE would be great in this offence…but because he wouldn’t see the ball a ton with the talents not only on the outside but coming out of the backfield he would have to be able to block just as well as he catches because he won’t be the featured target like Gronk or Hernandez are…with the rise of the spread offence in the college game it is getting harder and harder to find great all round TEs…which means you have to balance out getting a quality receiving TE if you want to feature them a lot in the passing game…or get a TE who can catch some balls over the middle but who’s main role is to help in the blocking game…

Like everyone else I would love an elite weapon at TE but I just don’t think there is enough balls to go around to warrant taking one in the 1st round…especially not for a guy like Eifert who like I said IMO is another Greg Olsen…in fact Eifert is very similar to Coby Fleener from last year IMO.

You make it sound like it's an elite TE or none... That can't be the mindset. There is a huge gap between Kellen Davis and an elite TE, we need to find somebody inbetween... How many young QB's have there TE as there major safety blanket? Cutler NEEDS one, not Kellen Davis, and just because theres no "elite" TE shouldn't deter us from looking that direction.


The question wasn’t if we could use a new starting TE…of course we could since Davis is shown zero consistency…the question was who would you select with the 32nd overall pick…IMO if you are going to take a TE in the 1st round these days they have to have the potential to be elite…I don’t see that in any TE in this draft.


I think when you are dealing with a late 1st round talent that demanding they have elite potential is a little unrealistic.

We took Gabe Carimi at 28 and I don't think any draft pundits really thought he would be an elite talent.

Do I want Greg Olsen 2.0, NO, but I would like someone who can come in and be a big weapon in the middle of the field. I think out offence would be mug better with Greg Olsen let alone a guy like Tyler Eifert.

With late 1st round picks I am looking for players who can be starter and really good players.

If you look at the last 4 picks from last year I don't think any of them have elite potential.

S Harrison Smith
WR Harrison Smith
RB Doug Martin
RB David Wilson

3 of those players play less valuable positions like TE, S and RB, and none is going to be confused with AP, Ed Reed or Mike Wallace.
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Madmike90


Joined: 25 Jan 2009
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Location: Scotland
PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 11:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

WindyCity wrote:
Madmike90 wrote:
The question wasn’t if we could use a new starting TE…of course we could since Davis is shown zero consistency…the question was who would you select with the 32nd overall pick…IMO if you are going to take a TE in the 1st round these days they have to have the potential to be elite…I don’t see that in any TE in this draft.


I think when you are dealing with a late 1st round talent that demanding they have elite potential is a little unrealistic.

We took Gabe Carimi at 28 and I don't think any draft pundits really thought he would be an elite talent.

Do I want Greg Olsen 2.0, NO, but I would like someone who can come in and be a big weapon in the middle of the field. I think out offence would be mug better with Greg Olsen let alone a guy like Tyler Eifert.

With late 1st round picks I am looking for players who can be starter and really good players.

If you look at the last 4 picks from last year I don't think any of them have elite potential.

S Harrison Smith
WR Harrison Smith
RB Doug Martin
RB David Wilson

3 of those players play less valuable positions like TE, S and RB, and none is going to be confused with AP, Ed Reed or Mike Wallace.


There where positional value becomes a factor…in the last 5 drafts there have only been 3 TEs taken in the 1st round…in the 2 drafts there hasn’t been a single TE selected in the 1st round…that’s why I’m saying if you’re going to spend a 1st round pick on a TE he better have a ton of potential because recent history suggests that if he doesn’t he more than likely isn’t worth a 1st round pick which obviously doesn’t apply to every position.
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IronMike84


Joined: 17 Jun 2009
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 1:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

WindyCity wrote:
I think TE is a weapon that we simply do not have.

WAIT A MINUTE, what happened to all of this talk during the offseason that Kellen Davis was going to be this super-productive tight end?

Davis is 9/132/1 on the season and some of you guys were insisting he had big time breakout potential, to the point where TE was deemed a non-need on draft day by nearly everybody on this forum.

NOW, all of a sudden, TE is deemed a major need. Hmm...
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TytybearsFan21


Joined: 31 Mar 2011
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IronMike84 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
I think TE is a weapon that we simply do not have.

WAIT A MINUTE, what happened to all of this talk during the offseason that Kellen Davis was going to be this super-productive tight end?

Davis is 9/132/1 on the season and some of you guys were insisting he had big time breakout potential, to the point where TE was deemed a non-need on draft day by nearly everybody on this forum.

NOW, all of a sudden, TE is deemed a major need. Hmm...


I've always been a TE guy, broseph.
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DaMike


Joined: 21 Nov 2010
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't forget about Evan Rodriguez. He can be a good receiving option for us. He needs a shot.
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TytybearsFan21


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 1:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DaMike wrote:
Don't forget about Evan Rodriguez. He can be a good receiving option for us. He needs a shot.


Keepin my fingers crossed that I'm wrong about him but I dont think he'll be any better than Davis.
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pigsooie5


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 2:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dabears32 wrote:
Anybody from 'Bama.

Im getting so sick of hearing this.
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IronMike84


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 3:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pigsooie5 wrote:
dabears32 wrote:
Anybody from 'Bama.

Im getting so sick of hearing this.

That's because you're an Arkansas fan. Laughing
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pigsooie5


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 3:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alec Ogletree. He is perfect for what we do on Defense, the only questions I had on the guy were his leadership/off the field issues..
Today so far against Florida, he is playing with more emotion than anybody on that Georgia Defense hands down. Im sold on the guy, he looks like a special, special player. I think his off the field issues are a concern although I truly believe Chicago is the best place for a player like that. "Transformations" happen, let him learn from our vets in the locker room. To me, his upside is clearly higher than any ILB in this draftclass, especially for Lovies D.
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pigsooie5


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 3:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IronMike84 wrote:
pigsooie5 wrote:
dabears32 wrote:
Anybody from 'Bama.

Im getting so sick of hearing this.

That's because you're an Arkansas fan. Laughing

C'mon Mike, no ones supposed to know. Laughing

But really, some people should do some research, theres more prospects than what Saban's team has to offer.
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IronMike84


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 3:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pigsooie5 wrote:
IronMike84 wrote:
pigsooie5 wrote:
dabears32 wrote:
Anybody from 'Bama.

Im getting so sick of hearing this.

That's because you're an Arkansas fan. Laughing

C'mon Mike, no ones supposed to know. Laughing

But really, some people should do some research, theres more prospects than what Saban's team has to offer.

At the same time though, Saban comes from the Bill Belichick system of player evaluation. It's easy to put a lot of stock in his school's prospects, and we've seen GMs from Belichick's linage (Newsome, Piolo, Dimitroff, even Belichick himself) go that route as well.
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TytybearsFan21


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 27, 2012 4:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IronMike84 wrote:
pigsooie5 wrote:
dabears32 wrote:
Anybody from 'Bama.

Im getting so sick of hearing this.

That's because you're an Arkansas fan. Laughing


IT'S PRONOUNCED ARKANSAW NOT ARKANSAS LOL
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