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TheOsprey
Joined: 27 Aug 2009
Posts: 6552
Location: In a van, down by the river.
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 Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 1:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Tatupu_64 wrote: | | TheOsprey wrote: | | Tatupu_64 wrote: | | TheOsprey wrote: | Until we get an every down DT, who can cosistently scare the living crap out of opposing QB's, that will always be one of my answers.  |
We don't need one with Watt. He'll create pressure from end and assuming we'll be in a nickel package 50% of our snaps, he's essentially a UT for us. |
Yes, we do need one. Watt would command a double team, but what good is that when we have no DT's who can get pressure? I want pressure from the ends and the interior. We got pressure from both ends with Brock and Clemons, but opposing QB's were still able to step deep into the pocket and burn us. I want a DT there to smash him when he does.
Peterson is the one that I don't understand. He's not much better than what we have now. I don't see him as a significant upgrade at all.  |
How often do we have 3 cornerbacks on the field?
And in what situations was Brock in? Pass rushing situations. So that would mean Irvin was in. Which would mean Watt would be at DT... |
In what context are we using this? I'm assuming we're using the 4-3 Under scheme where Watt and Clemons are DE's and Mebane and Suh are at NT and UT. If we were to acquire Watt and Suh, you'd better believe, we'd be showing much different looks than we currently show. If we had the defensive line I would want, we would be able to play pure man to man coverage and take advantage of our physical starting CB's, because we'd get much more pressure on the QB on every play. In my scheme, Irvin wouldn't be on the field. Instead I would take this time to have him sit and learn the SLB position and when he was ready, I'd install him there on pass rush situations. |
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bill21792
Joined: 01 Jan 2008
Posts: 314
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| Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 2:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Chandler Jones. Honestly don't even need a 2nd player to make this the GOAT defense with him in there |
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bill21792
Joined: 01 Jan 2008
Posts: 314
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| Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 2:56 pm Post subject: |
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| On a serious note though, I'm not sure. I want JJ Watt, because he's basically Red Bryant with a pass rush. I'm not sure what I'd want more for the 2nd spot. A 3-tech like Suh who can rush the passer. Or someone like Von Miller at SLB and slide KJ over to weak side. That would be a beastly set of LB's or a beastly D-Line |
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SaveourSonics
Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 45445
Location: Sleepless in Seattle
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| Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 3:31 pm Post subject: |
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| TheOsprey wrote: | | SaveourSonics wrote: | | TheOsprey wrote: | | Ndamukong Suh and J.J. Watt. QB's would just flop to the ground, to keep from getting injured. |
I'll take Geno Atkins over Suh. |
I love Atkins, but you're insane! |
Atkins is by far the most dominating DT in the league right now. Atkins has twice as many sacks as Suh (which is the whole point of what you want) and twice as many tackles. And it's not like this is just this year. Last year Atkins was half a sack away from doubling Suh's sack output, had more tackles, and more stuffs.
I can't see a single reason to want Suh over Atkins unless you just want the publicity of Suh....
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Richard D!ck Sherman 4 Prez |
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TheOsprey
Joined: 27 Aug 2009
Posts: 6552
Location: In a van, down by the river.
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| Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 5:54 pm Post subject: |
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| SaveourSonics wrote: | | TheOsprey wrote: | | SaveourSonics wrote: | | TheOsprey wrote: | | Ndamukong Suh and J.J. Watt. QB's would just flop to the ground, to keep from getting injured. |
I'll take Geno Atkins over Suh. |
I love Atkins, but you're insane! |
Atkins is by far the most dominating DT in the league right now. Atkins has twice as many sacks as Suh (which is the whole point of what you want) and twice as many tackles. And it's not like this is just this year. Last year Atkins was half a sack away from doubling Suh's sack output, had more tackles, and more stuffs.
I can't see a single reason to want Suh over Atkins unless you just want the publicity of Suh.... |
Suh is better against the run. He is just more balanced. I live just outside Cincy and see all the Bengals games. I love Atkins, but he is in pass rush mode all the time and tends to overrun ball carriers allowing them to slip by him. It happens quite a bit. Maybe he would be better against the run if he had a real MLB helping out, but until the Bengals get one (possibly Manti Teo'), then we'll never know. Right now, I'd give up a few sacks to have that balance, because either way you look at it, both are dominant pass rushers. |
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SaveourSonics
Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 45445
Location: Sleepless in Seattle
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| Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 6:28 pm Post subject: |
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Yea, that's not true at all. I love how you use stats like the gospel until they go against your viewpoint, then it turns into the eye test as the trump card. Duh is week against the run, you can ask any Detroit fan that. His bread and butter is rushing the passer, and he's not as good as Atkins in that area. We already have supreme run defenders in Mebane and Red, so I'll take the extra sacks over a slight upgrade in run defense (which isn't even true).
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Richard D!ck Sherman 4 Prez |
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Plush
Joined: 24 Sep 2012
Posts: 811
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| Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 10:38 pm Post subject: |
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Calais Cambell and JJ Watt
The opponent wouldn't complete any passes outside the hashmarks lol |
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Tatupu_64
Joined: 05 Apr 2007
Posts: 17275
Location: Hello. My name is Inigo Montoya. You killed my father. Prepare to die.
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| Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 10:40 pm Post subject: |
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| bill21792 wrote: | | On a serious note though, I'm not sure. I want JJ Watt, because he's basically Red Bryant with a pass rush. |
So he's completely different than Red Bryant...  
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Props to the Ramster
Seattle's Original Bruce Irvin Supporter
ET and Mebane's Biggest Supporter
FFMD2 13 GM |
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TheOsprey
Joined: 27 Aug 2009
Posts: 6552
Location: In a van, down by the river.
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| Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 10:47 pm Post subject: |
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| SaveourSonics wrote: | | Yea, that's not true at all. I love how you use stats like the gospel until they go against your viewpoint, then it turns into the eye test as the trump card. Duh is week against the run, you can ask any Detroit fan that. His bread and butter is rushing the passer, and he's not as good as Atkins in that area. We already have supreme run defenders in Mebane and Red, so I'll take the extra sacks over a slight upgrade in run defense (which isn't even true). |
I thought we were debating Suh and Atkins? Who is Duh? |
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SaveourSonics
Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 45445
Location: Sleepless in Seattle
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| Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 10:49 pm Post subject: |
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| TheOsprey wrote: | | SaveourSonics wrote: | | Yea, that's not true at all. I love how you use stats like the gospel until they go against your viewpoint, then it turns into the eye test as the trump card. Duh is week against the run, you can ask any Detroit fan that. His bread and butter is rushing the passer, and he's not as good as Atkins in that area. We already have supreme run defenders in Mebane and Red, so I'll take the extra sacks over a slight upgrade in run defense (which isn't even true). |
I thought we were debating Suh and Atkins? Who is Duh? |
I'll take this as your admittance of being wrong
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Richard D!ck Sherman 4 Prez |
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TheOsprey
Joined: 27 Aug 2009
Posts: 6552
Location: In a van, down by the river.
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| Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 10:57 pm Post subject: |
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| SaveourSonics wrote: | | TheOsprey wrote: | | SaveourSonics wrote: | | Yea, that's not true at all. I love how you use stats like the gospel until they go against your viewpoint, then it turns into the eye test as the trump card. Duh is week against the run, you can ask any Detroit fan that. His bread and butter is rushing the passer, and he's not as good as Atkins in that area. We already have supreme run defenders in Mebane and Red, so I'll take the extra sacks over a slight upgrade in run defense (which isn't even true). |
I thought we were debating Suh and Atkins? Who is Duh? |
I'll take this as your admittance of being wrong |
Not at all. I see Atkins each week. I realize he is a great pass rusher, that was never in question, but he just isn't very good against the run at all. Granted I've only seen one Lions game this year, but there is no way that Suh is a bad agains the run as Atkins is. You'll never convince me of that. |
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SaveourSonics
Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 45445
Location: Sleepless in Seattle
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| Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 11:00 pm Post subject: |
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| TheOsprey wrote: | | SaveourSonics wrote: | | TheOsprey wrote: | | SaveourSonics wrote: | | Yea, that's not true at all. I love how you use stats like the gospel until they go against your viewpoint, then it turns into the eye test as the trump card. Duh is week against the run, you can ask any Detroit fan that. His bread and butter is rushing the passer, and he's not as good as Atkins in that area. We already have supreme run defenders in Mebane and Red, so I'll take the extra sacks over a slight upgrade in run defense (which isn't even true). |
I thought we were debating Suh and Atkins? Who is Duh? |
I'll take this as your admittance of being wrong |
Not at all. I see Atkins each week. I realize he is a great pass rusher, that was never in question, but he just isn't very good against the run at all. Granted I've only seen one Lions game this year, but there is no way that Suh is a bad agains the run as Atkins is. You'll never convince me of that. |
That is because you are ungodly arrogant You would never allow someone to slant your viewpoint, even when given all of the necessary information to show that you're point-blank wrong. What a silly, silly notion that Suh is even a somewhat good run defender.
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Richard D!ck Sherman 4 Prez |
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Tooki
Joined: 28 Apr 2009
Posts: 9694
Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
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| Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 11:06 pm Post subject: |
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Suh isn't a good run stopper, neither is Atkins
Suh is a good pass rusher, Atkins is better
I pick Atkins. Next topic boys.
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| sp6488 wrote: | | If the Chiefs finish ahead of the Ravens in the standings I will eat a printed copy of the standings. |
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sirensong
Joined: 13 Mar 2007
Posts: 716
Location: Vancouver BC
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| Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 11:13 pm Post subject: |
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Atkins and Matthews.
Move Wright to WLB and play Clay at SLB.
In picking them I'm trying not to push any of our leaders or stars out. Getting Watt would take Bryant off the field and I think were better with Red and Clay than Hill and Watt.
Wright Wagner Matthews
Clem Mebane Atkins Bryant
Really like the mix of pass rush and run defense, thats by far the most balanced and elite front 7 in football.
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L.O.B.- D!CK, BOOM BOOM, ET, BB. |
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SaveourSonics
Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 45445
Location: Sleepless in Seattle
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| Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2012 11:20 pm Post subject: |
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While Red is a good player and good for the scheme, Watt would be elite in this scheme and would completely change the dynamic of this defense. With Red this is a team that rarely generates a pass rush when he's on the field. With Watt, you would still get consistent pressure even when in your jumbo package.
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Richard D!ck Sherman 4 Prez |
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