Discuss football with over 60,000 fans. Free Membership. Join now!

 FAQFAQ  RegisterRegister   ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

FootballsFuture.com Forum Index
FootballsFuture.com Home

Nick Perry fined $15,000 for hit on Andrew Luck
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    FootballsFuture.com Forum Index -> NFL News
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
MNPackfan32


Joined: 22 Sep 2010
Posts: 7800
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 11:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCDUQo9Qum8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlbHhqeyLnQ

Are these hits really that much different? You can see Dumervil's helmet ducks then lifts, the same as Perry's. There is just no consistancy with the NFL. Neither of these should be penalties IMO, then you go down to Houston the next week, JJ Watt rips the helmet off of Aaron Rodgers and, nothing. Of course Rolling Eyes
_________________



Duff Man wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
Josh Sitton, Mike Daniels

Average at best
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mse326


Moderator
Joined: 19 Jan 2008
Posts: 15888
Location: mike23md on the sig
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 11:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MNPackfan32 wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCDUQo9Qum8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlbHhqeyLnQ

Are these hits really that much different? You can see Dumervil's helmet ducks then lifts, the same as Perry's. There is just no consistancy with the NFL. Neither of these should be penalties IMO, then you go down to Houston the next week, JJ Watt rips the helmet off of Aaron Rodgers and, nothing. Of course Rolling Eyes


Perry hit with the hairline/crow
Dumervil hit with the facemask

That is the difference

As for the JJ Watt play show me in the rules where what he did was illegal?
_________________

#JDI
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Packerraymond


Moderator
Joined: 31 Mar 2005
Posts: 13999
Location: UW Oshkosh
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 11:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mse326 wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCDUQo9Qum8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlbHhqeyLnQ

Are these hits really that much different? You can see Dumervil's helmet ducks then lifts, the same as Perry's. There is just no consistancy with the NFL. Neither of these should be penalties IMO, then you go down to Houston the next week, JJ Watt rips the helmet off of Aaron Rodgers and, nothing. Of course Rolling Eyes


Perry hit with the hairline/crow
Dumervil hit with the facemask

That is the difference

As for the JJ Watt play show me in the rules where what he did was illegal?


Why do you think his helmet popped off? He hit him right at the bottom of the facemask, which is part of the helmet, thus helmet-to-helmet contact. It was an easy call that was missed.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
MNPackfan32


Joined: 22 Sep 2010
Posts: 7800
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 11:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mse326 wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCDUQo9Qum8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlbHhqeyLnQ

Are these hits really that much different? You can see Dumervil's helmet ducks then lifts, the same as Perry's. There is just no consistancy with the NFL. Neither of these should be penalties IMO, then you go down to Houston the next week, JJ Watt rips the helmet off of Aaron Rodgers and, nothing. Of course Rolling Eyes


Perry hit with the hairline/crow
Dumervil hit with the facemask

That is the difference

As for the JJ Watt play show me in the rules where what he did was illegal?
Hahaha, just because thats what the announcer said, makes it true? Watch Dumervil's helmet, leads with the crown and when he makes contact he lifts it, just like Perry. And IIRC there is a rule about forcible blows to the QB's head. Ripping the helmet off is about as forcible as you can get.
_________________



Duff Man wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
Josh Sitton, Mike Daniels

Average at best
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mse326


Moderator
Joined: 19 Jan 2008
Posts: 15888
Location: mike23md on the sig
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 11:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Packerraymond wrote:
mse326 wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCDUQo9Qum8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlbHhqeyLnQ

Are these hits really that much different? You can see Dumervil's helmet ducks then lifts, the same as Perry's. There is just no consistancy with the NFL. Neither of these should be penalties IMO, then you go down to Houston the next week, JJ Watt rips the helmet off of Aaron Rodgers and, nothing. Of course Rolling Eyes


Perry hit with the hairline/crow
Dumervil hit with the facemask

That is the difference

As for the JJ Watt play show me in the rules where what he did was illegal?


Why do you think his helmet popped off? He hit him right at the bottom of the facemask, which is part of the helmet, thus helmet-to-helmet contact. It was an easy call that was missed.


They change the rule for QB's in the pocket but not throwing two years ago. There needs to be forcible contact. It came off not because of the force but the angle as Rodgers dipped and Watt had his arm wrapped on the helmet (not grabbing the facemask) and pulling. There is no rule against that.
_________________

#JDI
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mse326


Moderator
Joined: 19 Jan 2008
Posts: 15888
Location: mike23md on the sig
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 11:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MNPackfan32 wrote:
mse326 wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCDUQo9Qum8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlbHhqeyLnQ

Are these hits really that much different? You can see Dumervil's helmet ducks then lifts, the same as Perry's. There is just no consistancy with the NFL. Neither of these should be penalties IMO, then you go down to Houston the next week, JJ Watt rips the helmet off of Aaron Rodgers and, nothing. Of course Rolling Eyes


Perry hit with the hairline/crow
Dumervil hit with the facemask

That is the difference

As for the JJ Watt play show me in the rules where what he did was illegal?
Hahaha, just because thats what the announcer said, makes it true? Watch Dumervil's helmet, leads with the crown and when he makes contact he lifts it, just like Perry. And IIRC there is a rule about forcible blows to the QB's head. Ripping the helmet off is about as forcible as you can get.


I'm capable of seeing it with my eyes. He lifted before he hit. There was slight contact with the hairline but that is the incidental contact that is not illegal per the note to the rule.

Perry hit him flush with the hairline then lifted.

And no ripping is not forcible. That is just pulling. Has nothing to do with the force of the hit.
_________________

#JDI
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
MNPackfan32


Joined: 22 Sep 2010
Posts: 7800
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 12:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mse326 wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
mse326 wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCDUQo9Qum8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlbHhqeyLnQ

Are these hits really that much different? You can see Dumervil's helmet ducks then lifts, the same as Perry's. There is just no consistancy with the NFL. Neither of these should be penalties IMO, then you go down to Houston the next week, JJ Watt rips the helmet off of Aaron Rodgers and, nothing. Of course Rolling Eyes


Perry hit with the hairline/crow
Dumervil hit with the facemask

That is the difference

As for the JJ Watt play show me in the rules where what he did was illegal?
Hahaha, just because thats what the announcer said, makes it true? Watch Dumervil's helmet, leads with the crown and when he makes contact he lifts it, just like Perry. And IIRC there is a rule about forcible blows to the QB's head. Ripping the helmet off is about as forcible as you can get.


I'm capable of seeing it with my eyes. He lifted before he hit. There was slight contact with the hairline but that is the incidental contact that is not illegal per the note to the rule.

Perry hit him flush with the hairline then lifted.

And no ripping is not forcible. That is just pulling. Has nothing to do with the force of the hit.
You can see his helmet is down as he is hitting Brady. Seriously, look. The crown of his helmet hits Brady's arm and when he lifts his helmet up, Tom's arm stays on top of the crown of the helmet. Its clear you are just mad because I called out JJ Watt's hit, I'm just sayin, they protect Luck for a pretty clean hit, then Aaron dang near gets his head ripped off and nothing. I am not sure how you could argue that Perry's hit is more dangerous or harmful than either Dumervil or Watt's hit. I am sick of QB's getting protected so much, I am fine with the Dumervil hit and the Perry hit, but if you are going to flag and fine Perry, Watt should have too IMO.
_________________



Duff Man wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
Josh Sitton, Mike Daniels

Average at best
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mse326


Moderator
Joined: 19 Jan 2008
Posts: 15888
Location: mike23md on the sig
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 12:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MNPackfan32 wrote:
mse326 wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
mse326 wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCDUQo9Qum8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlbHhqeyLnQ

Are these hits really that much different? You can see Dumervil's helmet ducks then lifts, the same as Perry's. There is just no consistancy with the NFL. Neither of these should be penalties IMO, then you go down to Houston the next week, JJ Watt rips the helmet off of Aaron Rodgers and, nothing. Of course Rolling Eyes


Perry hit with the hairline/crow
Dumervil hit with the facemask

That is the difference

As for the JJ Watt play show me in the rules where what he did was illegal?
Hahaha, just because thats what the announcer said, makes it true? Watch Dumervil's helmet, leads with the crown and when he makes contact he lifts it, just like Perry. And IIRC there is a rule about forcible blows to the QB's head. Ripping the helmet off is about as forcible as you can get.


I'm capable of seeing it with my eyes. He lifted before he hit. There was slight contact with the hairline but that is the incidental contact that is not illegal per the note to the rule.

Perry hit him flush with the hairline then lifted.

And no ripping is not forcible. That is just pulling. Has nothing to do with the force of the hit.
You can see his helmet is down as he is hitting Brady. Seriously, look. The crown of his helmet hits Brady's arm and when he lifts his helmet up, Tom's arm stays on top of the crown of the helmet. Its clear you are just mad because I called out JJ Watt's hit, I'm just sayin, they protect Luck for a pretty clean hit, then Aaron dang near gets his head ripped off and nothing. I am not sure how you could argue that Perry's hit is more dangerous or harmful than either Dumervil or Watt's hit. I am sick of QB's getting protected so much, I am fine with the Dumervil hit and the Perry hit, but if you are going to flag and fine Perry, Watt should have too IMO.


1. I said there was slight hairline contact on the Dumervil hit. But that is the incidental contact that the Note to the rule says isn't illegal
2. I'm not mad. It wasn't called because it isn't a penalty. And I was arguing about the Perry hit since last week, so not sure how you draw your conclusion.
3. I never once argued one was more dangerous. I couldn't care less whether it is or isn't because I'm capable of applying the rules as written without my own bias of whether I think it should be. I'm arguing based on what the rules say. You are free to disagree with the rule. But in this debate that is absolutely irrelevant.
_________________

#JDI
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
aj hawk #50


Joined: 02 Jan 2007
Posts: 9600
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 12:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MNPackfan32 wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCDUQo9Qum8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlbHhqeyLnQ

Are these hits really that much different? You can see Dumervil's helmet ducks then lifts, the same as Perry's. There is just no consistancy with the NFL. Neither of these should be penalties IMO, then you go down to Houston the next week, JJ Watt rips the helmet off of Aaron Rodgers and, nothing. Of course Rolling Eyes
I honestly don't see any difference at all between those two hits. Both lead with the facemask and also hit with a bit of the crown, but both should result in no flag, IMO.
However, Packer fans need to stop complaining about the JJ Watt play. That was clean. It looked really bad because Rodgers helmet came off, but after watching the replays Sunday night, he did nothing illegal.
_________________

GeneralTso wrote:
When my team grows up, I want them to be the Green Bay Packers!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
biggio7


Joined: 18 Feb 2007
Posts: 9799
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 12:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

aj hawk #50 wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCDUQo9Qum8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlbHhqeyLnQ

Are these hits really that much different? You can see Dumervil's helmet ducks then lifts, the same as Perry's. There is just no consistancy with the NFL. Neither of these should be penalties IMO, then you go down to Houston the next week, JJ Watt rips the helmet off of Aaron Rodgers and, nothing. Of course Rolling Eyes
I honestly don't see any difference at all between those two hits. Both lead with the facemask and also hit with a bit of the crown, but both should result in no flag, IMO.
However, Packer fans need to stop complaining about the JJ Watt play. That was clean. It looked really bad because Rodgers helmet came off, but after watching the replays Sunday night, he did nothing illegal.


Maybe if Rodgers didn't try to duck under the tackle, his helmet wouldn't have come off. If Rodgers is standing, Watt hits him around the waist. I didn't see Rodgers complain about the hit.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
MNPackfan32


Joined: 22 Sep 2010
Posts: 7800
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mse326 wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
mse326 wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
mse326 wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCDUQo9Qum8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlbHhqeyLnQ

Are these hits really that much different? You can see Dumervil's helmet ducks then lifts, the same as Perry's. There is just no consistancy with the NFL. Neither of these should be penalties IMO, then you go down to Houston the next week, JJ Watt rips the helmet off of Aaron Rodgers and, nothing. Of course Rolling Eyes


Perry hit with the hairline/crow
Dumervil hit with the facemask

That is the difference

As for the JJ Watt play show me in the rules where what he did was illegal?
Hahaha, just because thats what the announcer said, makes it true? Watch Dumervil's helmet, leads with the crown and when he makes contact he lifts it, just like Perry. And IIRC there is a rule about forcible blows to the QB's head. Ripping the helmet off is about as forcible as you can get.


I'm capable of seeing it with my eyes. He lifted before he hit. There was slight contact with the hairline but that is the incidental contact that is not illegal per the note to the rule.

Perry hit him flush with the hairline then lifted.

And no ripping is not forcible. That is just pulling. Has nothing to do with the force of the hit.
You can see his helmet is down as he is hitting Brady. Seriously, look. The crown of his helmet hits Brady's arm and when he lifts his helmet up, Tom's arm stays on top of the crown of the helmet. Its clear you are just mad because I called out JJ Watt's hit, I'm just sayin, they protect Luck for a pretty clean hit, then Aaron dang near gets his head ripped off and nothing. I am not sure how you could argue that Perry's hit is more dangerous or harmful than either Dumervil or Watt's hit. I am sick of QB's getting protected so much, I am fine with the Dumervil hit and the Perry hit, but if you are going to flag and fine Perry, Watt should have too IMO.


1. I said there was slight hairline contact on the Dumervil hit. But that is the incidental contact that the Note to the rule says isn't illegal.
This makes no sense. Its pretty black and white IMO. Either you lead with your crown or you didn't. I bet if you ask Nick Perry if his was incidental he would say yes. You cant kinda sorta hit somebody with the crown, either your head is up or down. Dumervil did the same thing and nothing happend and rightfully so IMO. And my point with the Watt hit is, if you are going to protect a QB from a hit like Perry put on Luck, they should do it for a player who gets his helmet ripped off. Me personally I would rather have neither of them be a penalty but if they are banging the table to protect the QB's, then do it and do it on a consistant basis.
_________________



Duff Man wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
Josh Sitton, Mike Daniels

Average at best
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Packerraymond


Moderator
Joined: 31 Mar 2005
Posts: 13999
Location: UW Oshkosh
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 12:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mse326 wrote:
Packerraymond wrote:
mse326 wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCDUQo9Qum8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlbHhqeyLnQ

Are these hits really that much different? You can see Dumervil's helmet ducks then lifts, the same as Perry's. There is just no consistancy with the NFL. Neither of these should be penalties IMO, then you go down to Houston the next week, JJ Watt rips the helmet off of Aaron Rodgers and, nothing. Of course Rolling Eyes


Perry hit with the hairline/crow
Dumervil hit with the facemask

That is the difference

As for the JJ Watt play show me in the rules where what he did was illegal?


Why do you think his helmet popped off? He hit him right at the bottom of the facemask, which is part of the helmet, thus helmet-to-helmet contact. It was an easy call that was missed.


They change the rule for QB's in the pocket but not throwing two years ago. There needs to be forcible contact. It came off not because of the force but the angle as Rodgers dipped and Watt had his arm wrapped on the helmet (not grabbing the facemask) and pulling. There is no rule against that.



His helmet hit Rodgers helmet, thats why it fell off, simple as that.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mse326


Moderator
Joined: 19 Jan 2008
Posts: 15888
Location: mike23md on the sig
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 12:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Packerraymond wrote:
mse326 wrote:
Packerraymond wrote:
mse326 wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCDUQo9Qum8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlbHhqeyLnQ

Are these hits really that much different? You can see Dumervil's helmet ducks then lifts, the same as Perry's. There is just no consistancy with the NFL. Neither of these should be penalties IMO, then you go down to Houston the next week, JJ Watt rips the helmet off of Aaron Rodgers and, nothing. Of course Rolling Eyes


Perry hit with the hairline/crow
Dumervil hit with the facemask

That is the difference

As for the JJ Watt play show me in the rules where what he did was illegal?


Why do you think his helmet popped off? He hit him right at the bottom of the facemask, which is part of the helmet, thus helmet-to-helmet contact. It was an easy call that was missed.


They change the rule for QB's in the pocket but not throwing two years ago. There needs to be forcible contact. It came off not because of the force but the angle as Rodgers dipped and Watt had his arm wrapped on the helmet (not grabbing the facemask) and pulling. There is no rule against that.



His helmet hit Rodgers helmet, thats why it fell off, simple as that.


Do you have a link to the play? One of us is remembering incorrectly and I think it's you (obviously if I thought it was me I would change my stance).

IIRC it was Watt's arm. Rodgers ducked as Watt came in. Watt's arm wrapped around his helmet at the elbow and his momentum took him passed Rodgers pulling the helmet off.
_________________

#JDI
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mse326


Moderator
Joined: 19 Jan 2008
Posts: 15888
Location: mike23md on the sig
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 1:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MNPackfan32 wrote:
mse326 wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
mse326 wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
mse326 wrote:
MNPackfan32 wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCDUQo9Qum8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlbHhqeyLnQ

Are these hits really that much different? You can see Dumervil's helmet ducks then lifts, the same as Perry's. There is just no consistancy with the NFL. Neither of these should be penalties IMO, then you go down to Houston the next week, JJ Watt rips the helmet off of Aaron Rodgers and, nothing. Of course Rolling Eyes


Perry hit with the hairline/crow
Dumervil hit with the facemask

That is the difference

As for the JJ Watt play show me in the rules where what he did was illegal?
Hahaha, just because thats what the announcer said, makes it true? Watch Dumervil's helmet, leads with the crown and when he makes contact he lifts it, just like Perry. And IIRC there is a rule about forcible blows to the QB's head. Ripping the helmet off is about as forcible as you can get.


I'm capable of seeing it with my eyes. He lifted before he hit. There was slight contact with the hairline but that is the incidental contact that is not illegal per the note to the rule.

Perry hit him flush with the hairline then lifted.

And no ripping is not forcible. That is just pulling. Has nothing to do with the force of the hit.
You can see his helmet is down as he is hitting Brady. Seriously, look. The crown of his helmet hits Brady's arm and when he lifts his helmet up, Tom's arm stays on top of the crown of the helmet. Its clear you are just mad because I called out JJ Watt's hit, I'm just sayin, they protect Luck for a pretty clean hit, then Aaron dang near gets his head ripped off and nothing. I am not sure how you could argue that Perry's hit is more dangerous or harmful than either Dumervil or Watt's hit. I am sick of QB's getting protected so much, I am fine with the Dumervil hit and the Perry hit, but if you are going to flag and fine Perry, Watt should have too IMO.


1. I said there was slight hairline contact on the Dumervil hit. But that is the incidental contact that the Note to the rule says isn't illegal.
This makes no sense. Its pretty black and white IMO. Either you lead with your crown or you didn't. I bet if you ask Nick Perry if his was incidental he would say yes. You cant kinda sorta hit somebody with the crown, either your head is up or down. Dumervil did the same thing and nothing happend and rightfully so IMO. And my point with the Watt hit is, if you are going to protect a QB from a hit like Perry put on Luck, they should do it for a player who gets his helmet ripped off. Me personally I would rather have neither of them be a penalty but if they are banging the table to protect the QB's, then do it and do it on a consistant basis.


Incidental =/= unintentional.

You can say it doesn't make sense, but the fact that the rules specifically talk about incidental contact means that it does exist.

As I see the play Perry's head was down at contact. Dumervil's was basically up. At least as much as you can expect from someone bending at the waist. It obviously wasn't perpendicular to the ground but that isn't realistic. He hit him almost solely with the facemask. There was slight contact.

The rule says "forcible" contact with the hairline or crown. I believe that the hairline didn't hit forcibly in Dumervil's case. The facemask was where the force was. Perry's hit was forcibly with the hairline.
_________________

#JDI
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
_Iverson38


Joined: 06 Oct 2011
Posts: 336
Location: GV
PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 1:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That was a beautiful tackle. The penalty was a joke. The fine is an embarrassment.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   

Post new topic   Reply to topic    FootballsFuture.com Forum Index -> NFL News All times are GMT - 4 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Page 3 of 4

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum




Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group