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Raiders need draft Geno Smith, Bray, Or Matt Barkley next.
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Rolni


Joined: 08 Jun 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 7:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

oakdb36 wrote:
Rolni wrote:

DVD also made too much money and on a team with this cap space situation it's important.


No, he didn't. He was on a 3rd round pick rookie contract which is cheap.

It's realtive...He was making more then a 2nd year FA pick up and wasn't playing well...
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Rolni


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 7:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

By the way to write something to the title of this topic:

I felt that a guy like Barkley would be able to run this O well, even in his rookie year. He is made for this WCO and if our run blocking gets together for next year he could do it.

I'm not saying lets draft him...I still wanna see BPA, but if he is the pick he could be our answer at QB IMO...
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oakdb36


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 8:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rolni wrote:
oakdb36 wrote:
Rolni wrote:

DVD also made too much money and on a team with this cap space situation it's important.


No, he didn't. He was on a 3rd round pick rookie contract which is cheap.

It's realtive...He was making more then a 2nd year FA pick up and wasn't playing well...


The difference, if any, is minimal so i really don't think it was money related. The staff just didn't feel he had a future on their team.
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JTagg7754


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 8:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

oakdb36 wrote:
Rolni wrote:
oakdb36 wrote:
Rolni wrote:

DVD also made too much money and on a team with this cap space situation it's important.


No, he didn't. He was on a 3rd round pick rookie contract which is cheap.

It's realtive...He was making more then a 2nd year FA pick up and wasn't playing well...


The difference, if any, is minimal so i really don't think it was money related. The staff just didn't feel he had a future on their team.


I also would agree w/ this.
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Silver&Black88


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 8:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rolni wrote:
By the way to write something to the title of this topic:

I felt that a guy like Barkley would be able to run this O well, even in his rookie year. He is made for this WCO and if our run blocking gets together for next year he could do it.

I'm not saying lets draft him...I still wanna see BPA, but if he is the pick he could be our answer at QB IMO...


I'm not completely sold, but he could be what we're looking for. Don't get it twisted, I love the guy (Trojan fan) but there are a few things he needs improvement on and other knocks that are somewhat concerning. He could stand to add some muscle, he isn't that mobile (kind of important given the scheme it seems we're adamant on), he's had top notch talent to work with, and his deep balls aren't that great, nor is his arm the strongest.

But when I look at those areas I think:

Muscle: easy to fix

Mobility: Palmer isn't that mobile either and he's running the show damn near perfectly

How he'd fare with less than elite talent surrounding him: Most teams looking to draft him have the same problem anyway

Deep balls: Dmoe is great at making adjustments, so is Criner (yes, he's still on the team lol) and Ford and Streater have flashed the ability too.

Arm strength: We run a WCO. Most of his passes are going to be short - intermediate. If he can play like Brees or Dalton I think we're ok. I've addressed the deep ball already.

I'd be alright with picking him 4-7. Maybe higher depending on who is available. I'd prefer Jarvis Jones right now, but depending how Curry looks LB might not be a need. I like that Star DT kid too though.
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ZoomWaffle


Joined: 25 Apr 2010
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 9:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Silver&Black88 wrote:
Rolni wrote:
By the way to write something to the title of this topic:

I felt that a guy like Barkley would be able to run this O well, even in his rookie year. He is made for this WCO and if our run blocking gets together for next year he could do it.

I'm not saying lets draft him...I still wanna see BPA, but if he is the pick he could be our answer at QB IMO...


I'm not completely sold, but he could be what we're looking for. Don't get it twisted, I love the guy (Trojan fan) but there are a few things he needs improvement on and other knocks that are somewhat concerning. He could stand to add some muscle, he isn't that mobile (kind of important given the scheme it seems we're adamant on), he's had top notch talent to work with, and his deep balls aren't that great, nor is his arm the strongest.

But when I look at those areas I think:

Muscle: easy to fix

Mobility: Palmer isn't that mobile either and he's running the show damn near perfectly

How he'd fare with less than elite talent surrounding him: Most teams looking to draft him have the same problem anyway

Deep balls: Dmoe is great at making adjustments, so is Criner (yes, he's still on the team lol) and Ford and Streater have flashed the ability too.

Arm strength: We run a WCO. Most of his passes are going to be short - intermediate. If he can play like Brees or Dalton I think we're ok. I've addressed the deep ball already.

I'd be alright with picking him 4-7. Maybe higher depending on who is available. I'd prefer Jarvis Jones right now, but depending how Curry looks LB might not be a need. I like that Star DT kid too though.


+1

I dont see why so many people are concerned by arm strength. Do they remember who our last WCO QB was??? He took us to a Super Bowl, showed us some of the greatest QB play we've ever seen in silver and black, and did not have a strong arm whatsoever. Its one thing if he cant put enough zip on a 15 yard pass to get it in a window, but I really dont care if he cant throw it 50 yards down field- its pretty evident that our OC will never call a play that would require him to.

Accurate, efficient QB + short/intermediate passes + well-executed ZBS = Great success!

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RunDmc23


Joined: 25 Dec 2010
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 9:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Palmer is a top 15 qb he puts up big yards he has little to none receiver help Minus D.Moore he has an Ok tight end and a banged up Oline.. Mcfadden needs to do better but how can he with a weak Oline like that.. We need to strike Gold in Free Agency and fix the right side and a few other spots on this Oline and get some kind of cornerback help... OUr Defense is Horrible other than the Dline. Greg Knapp is Horrible play caller against the Falcons he should have did one of those Mcfadden screens or something but no. Truth is we need a hole new coaching stuff either bring back chucky or Hue, Draft Either Geno or Barkley let pryor play the last 8 games see what he can do If he can't make some sort of improvement by game 16 draft a real franchise QB and switch him to the next Jimmy Graham Tight end Smile
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Rolni


Joined: 08 Jun 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 9:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JTagg7754 wrote:
oakdb36 wrote:
Rolni wrote:
oakdb36 wrote:
Rolni wrote:

DVD also made too much money and on a team with this cap space situation it's important.


No, he didn't. He was on a 3rd round pick rookie contract which is cheap.

It's realtive...He was making more then a 2nd year FA pick up and wasn't playing well...


The difference, if any, is minimal so i really don't think it was money related. The staff just didn't feel he had a future on their team.


I also would agree w/ this.

Ok I'm convinced
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Chali21


Joined: 07 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 10:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RunDmc23 wrote:
Palmer is a top 15 qb he puts up big yards he has little to none receiver help Minus D.Moore he has an Ok tight end and a banged up Oline.. Mcfadden needs to do better but how can he with a weak Oline like that.. We need to strike Gold in Free Agency and fix the right side and a few other spots on this Oline and get some kind of cornerback help... OUr Defense is Horrible other than the Dline. Greg Knapp is Horrible play caller against the Falcons he should have did one of those Mcfadden screens or something but no. Truth is we need a hole new coaching stuff either bring back chucky or Hue, Draft Either Geno or Barkley let pryor play the last 8 games see what he can do If he can't make some sort of improvement by game 16 draft a real franchise QB and switch him to the next Jimmy Graham Tight end Smile


First of all...no to the second half of your post. Bringing Chucky or Hue back would be idiotic. I would state reasons but I have stated them before and I don't think there's any need to now. Next why draft Geno or Barkley if Palmer is balling out? Also there is no way where Pryor makes a conversion to TE and plays as good Graham, I doubt he'll be as good as Asberry.

Also you can't just fire someone after a year of hiring them. It takes time to implement your system. Just look at the texans, falcons, giants, or even the niners. Yes I know harbaugh when to the NFC championship his first year but that team had been building awhile. I'd rather fly under the radar than take a ton aid free agents, be called elite, and then get whupped on.
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NCOUGHMAN


Joined: 25 Mar 2008
Posts: 15257
Location: Stockton via East Palo Alto
PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 12:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ZoomWaffle wrote:
Silver&Black88 wrote:
Rolni wrote:
By the way to write something to the title of this topic:

I felt that a guy like Barkley would be able to run this O well, even in his rookie year. He is made for this WCO and if our run blocking gets together for next year he could do it.

I'm not saying lets draft him...I still wanna see BPA, but if he is the pick he could be our answer at QB IMO...


I'm not completely sold, but he could be what we're looking for. Don't get it twisted, I love the guy (Trojan fan) but there are a few things he needs improvement on and other knocks that are somewhat concerning. He could stand to add some muscle, he isn't that mobile (kind of important given the scheme it seems we're adamant on), he's had top notch talent to work with, and his deep balls aren't that great, nor is his arm the strongest.

But when I look at those areas I think:

Muscle: easy to fix

Mobility: Palmer isn't that mobile either and he's running the show damn near perfectly

How he'd fare with less than elite talent surrounding him: Most teams looking to draft him have the same problem anyway

Deep balls: Dmoe is great at making adjustments, so is Criner (yes, he's still on the team lol) and Ford and Streater have flashed the ability too.

Arm strength: We run a WCO. Most of his passes are going to be short - intermediate. If he can play like Brees or Dalton I think we're ok. I've addressed the deep ball already.

I'd be alright with picking him 4-7. Maybe higher depending on who is available. I'd prefer Jarvis Jones right now, but depending how Curry looks LB might not be a need. I like that Star DT kid too though.


+1

I dont see why so many people are concerned by arm strength. Do they remember who our last WCO QB was??? He took us to a Super Bowl, showed us some of the greatest QB play we've ever seen in silver and black, and did not have a strong arm whatsoever. Its one thing if he cant put enough zip on a 15 yard pass to get it in a window, but I really dont care if he cant throw it 50 yards down field- its pretty evident that our OC will never call a play that would require him to.

Accurate, efficient QB + short/intermediate passes + well-executed ZBS = Great success!


gannon was also once of the best scrambling and bootleg qb's ive ever seen.
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bitty


Joined: 19 Jan 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 3:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chali21 wrote:
RunDmc23 wrote:
Palmer is a top 15 qb he puts up big yards he has little to none receiver help Minus D.Moore he has an Ok tight end and a banged up Oline.. Mcfadden needs to do better but how can he with a weak Oline like that.. We need to strike Gold in Free Agency and fix the right side and a few other spots on this Oline and get some kind of cornerback help... OUr Defense is Horrible other than the Dline. Greg Knapp is Horrible play caller against the Falcons he should have did one of those Mcfadden screens or something but no. Truth is we need a hole new coaching stuff either bring back chucky or Hue, Draft Either Geno or Barkley let pryor play the last 8 games see what he can do If he can't make some sort of improvement by game 16 draft a real franchise QB and switch him to the next Jimmy Graham Tight end Smile


First of all...no to the second half of your post. Bringing Chucky or Hue back would be idiotic. I would state reasons but I have stated them before and I don't think there's any need to now. Next why draft Geno or Barkley if Palmer is balling out? Also there is no way where Pryor makes a conversion to TE and plays as good Graham, I doubt he'll be as good as Asberry.

Also you can't just fire someone after a year of hiring them. It takes time to implement your system. Just look at the texans, falcons, giants, or even the niners. Yes I know harbaugh when to the NFC championship his first year but that team had been building awhile. I'd rather fly under the radar than take a ton aid free agents, be called elite, and then get whupped on.


Yeah why you want to hire the youngest coach to win the Super Bowl. The man had three losing seasons out of 11but the Raiders would not want him.
It's pretty obvious that the GM wants a puppet for a coach.
The reason he wants to model the Raiders after the Texans is because no one got fire in Texas after years mediocrity.
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ZoomWaffle


Joined: 25 Apr 2010
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2012 3:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NCOUGHMAN wrote:
ZoomWaffle wrote:
Silver&Black88 wrote:
Rolni wrote:
By the way to write something to the title of this topic:

I felt that a guy like Barkley would be able to run this O well, even in his rookie year. He is made for this WCO and if our run blocking gets together for next year he could do it.

I'm not saying lets draft him...I still wanna see BPA, but if he is the pick he could be our answer at QB IMO...


I'm not completely sold, but he could be what we're looking for. Don't get it twisted, I love the guy (Trojan fan) but there are a few things he needs improvement on and other knocks that are somewhat concerning. He could stand to add some muscle, he isn't that mobile (kind of important given the scheme it seems we're adamant on), he's had top notch talent to work with, and his deep balls aren't that great, nor is his arm the strongest.

But when I look at those areas I think:

Muscle: easy to fix

Mobility: Palmer isn't that mobile either and he's running the show damn near perfectly

How he'd fare with less than elite talent surrounding him: Most teams looking to draft him have the same problem anyway

Deep balls: Dmoe is great at making adjustments, so is Criner (yes, he's still on the team lol) and Ford and Streater have flashed the ability too.

Arm strength: We run a WCO. Most of his passes are going to be short - intermediate. If he can play like Brees or Dalton I think we're ok. I've addressed the deep ball already.

I'd be alright with picking him 4-7. Maybe higher depending on who is available. I'd prefer Jarvis Jones right now, but depending how Curry looks LB might not be a need. I like that Star DT kid too though.


+1

I dont see why so many people are concerned by arm strength. Do they remember who our last WCO QB was??? He took us to a Super Bowl, showed us some of the greatest QB play we've ever seen in silver and black, and did not have a strong arm whatsoever. Its one thing if he cant put enough zip on a 15 yard pass to get it in a window, but I really dont care if he cant throw it 50 yards down field- its pretty evident that our OC will never call a play that would require him to.

Accurate, efficient QB + short/intermediate passes + well-executed ZBS = Great success!


gannon was also once of the best scrambling and bootleg qb's ive ever seen.


Yea, he was in the top-3 in QB rushing yards a couple seasons with us, behind McNabb and Culpepper I think.
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RaidersAreOne


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 12:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I love me some Jarvis Jones, but I just learnt something about him yesterday that really scares me off. He has that degenerate disease that made Marcus McNeil retire at age 28 apparently. Not sure if its 100% true but I read posters in the draft forum speaking about it. Major risk.
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RaiderX


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 5:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RaidersAreOne wrote:
I love me some Jarvis Jones, but I just learnt something about him yesterday that really scares me off. He has that degenerate disease that made Marcus McNeil retire at age 28 apparently. Not sure if its 100% true but I read posters in the draft forum speaking about it. Major risk.


McNeill retired because he suffered a bad neck injury last season.
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RaidersAreOne


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RaiderX wrote:
RaidersAreOne wrote:
I love me some Jarvis Jones, but I just learnt something about him yesterday that really scares me off. He has that degenerate disease that made Marcus McNeil retire at age 28 apparently. Not sure if its 100% true but I read posters in the draft forum speaking about it. Major risk.


McNeill retired because he suffered a bad neck injury last season.


Still doesnt cover the fact he apparently has spinal stenosis.
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