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Team has a lot of holes...
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Calibucsfan


Joined: 05 Sep 2011
Posts: 3104
Location: Los Angeles CA
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 10:36 am    Post subject: Team has a lot of holes... Reply with quote

Just a vent thread on where I feel we got holes
I will start with Josh Freeman. Yesterday we were all calling for his head up until the half, even the announcers kept saying how he is making inaccurate throws. There were times where he had all day to throw...
Freeman really reminds me of AJ Smith and Norv Turner...and yes I am talking about the Chargers GM and Head Coach. Reason is, I talk to a lot of SD fans and they all want those 2 gone, they suck at drafting and hardly ever bring anyone in Free Agency..but they do just enough to stick around, Chargers always barely sneak into playoffs only go get beat in the first round or they will make a 2nd half of the season comeback to get to .500 or slighly over...most Charger fans hate the two and want them gone..what does this have to do with Freeman? Because just like AJ Smith and Norv Turner, Freeman always does just enough to stick around. He will suck for 3 games and have 2 good ones that will get him just enough to not get the boot or loose the starting job. Yesterday, he sucked hard in the first half, and 2nd half got nothing but praises from the announcers. He is extremely inconsistent, has bad vision and sometimes just looks scared to me. He needs to go. Even if we do somehow manage to end the year at .500, if its performances like today, he really needs to go. However, since Freeman does "just enough" that might take about 2 seasons...hopefully not.

Our O-line is a not that good IMO. Donald Penn, Carl Nicks, and Davin Joseph should be the only 3 guys left starting next season from this season. Zuttah is trash, the dude was barely good enough to be average at guard , so who on earth decided he was going to be a stud center? He gets blown up a lot, he is better than Faine but that's not saying much. We need a real center. Besides that, I am glad Trueblood is not starting anymore, but Dotson is average. I feel like this spot can use a major upgrade. Unless Datson just keeps improving, he is nothing more than a great backup.

Wide Receiver core, this one is complicated. We saw Mike Williams multiple times this season catch deep balls...but that only happens in the 4th quarter when we are down...where is that performance the rest of the game? All the offensive woes cannot be put on Freeman, at times he has all day to throw but no one to throw it to. Our guys get constantly jammed at the line or stay covered...only one who makes an effort the rest of the 3 quarters if Vincent Jackson. I think we need to go out and get another WR to fill the #2 spot, and demote Mike Williams to a #3...

And Tight Ends? We got an old Dallas Clark and an unproven Stocker....need I say more?

On defense our D-line is always a nightmare. So far we invest a #1 and a #2 back to back years on a DT and a DE...and we still cant seem to find one. Clayborne and Bowers are done and Price is not even on the team anymore...I am pulling for McCoy to stay healthy all year but I am not sold on him until I see him play a whole season. As of right now our only good and non injury prone D-lineman is Micheal Bennet...who was a diamond in the rough.


Secondary is a joke. Mainly our CB's and mainly Talib. The dude has regressed hard. He is not the same anymore. His ball skills are TERRIBLE. He always get caught on, and Wright is not much better. Our secondary in general sucks and lets anyone pass on them.Barber plays good but he might not be here in the next year or 2. Barron misses plays here and there but he is getting better and is a rookie so gets a pass.



Based on that list, I say we got huge holes in a lot of places. Our needs for next season in order should be
1)QB
2)CB(yes I want Talib replaced)
3)FS
4)WR
5)C
6)TE
7)T
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Posts: 6817
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 10:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

All good points Cali. However the problem with Wrs not consistantly producing is Freeman's innabilty to see the field and go trough progressions. There's many times you see guys open but he locks onto the first read.
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Buccaneer4life


Joined: 27 Jan 2007
Posts: 3509
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 10:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree that QB is our biggest need right now, but I dont wana reach on a QB just for the sake of drafting a QB. If were drafting say in the 10-15 range I dont wana reach for a guy like EJ Manuel, Tyler Wilson, or Landry Jones. If we cant get Geno Smith or Matt Barkley, we just have to live another year with Freeman. Ive always been the biggest supporter of Freeman's, but yesterdays 1st half paired with the entire Cowboys game, idk how much longer I can live with that. I think we need to keep building our defense.
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Posts: 6817
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 10:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Buccaneer4life wrote:
I agree that QB is our biggest need right now, but I dont wana reach on a QB just for the sake of drafting a QB. If were drafting say in the 10-15 range I dont wana reach for a guy like EJ Manuel, Tyler Wilson, or Landry Jones. If we cant get Geno Smith or Matt Barkley, we just have to live another year with Freeman. Ive always been the biggest supporter of Freeman's, but yesterdays 1st half paired with the entire Cowboys game, idk how much longer I can live with that. I think we need to keep building our defense.


Watch Aaron Murray. You will come away impressed.
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BBando


Joined: 18 Feb 2011
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Location: Tampa Bay
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 11:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Am I the only one who comes away after watching him. That Manuel is a 4th-5th round prospect. Him and Landry Jones. They are both overrated because of the schools they play for. I know we have some FSU fans that are Buc fans. So don't come and berate me. Everyone has an opinion.
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REDandPEWTER


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 12:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BBando wrote:
Am I the only one who comes away after watching him. That Manuel is a 4th-5th round prospect. Him and Landry Jones. They are both overrated because of the schools they play for. I know we have some FSU fans that are Buc fans. So don't come and berate me. Everyone has an opinion.


Agreed. Landry Jones just seems lost this year and regressed from his sophomore season. Manuel isn't an nfl qb at all. Good athlete for the college game but doesn't transition well.
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indifference


Joined: 08 Nov 2010
Posts: 1794
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 1:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The tackling was bad yesterday. We need to keep adding pieces to the defense. Quincy Black should not be back next year. He always gets beat in coverage and is nowhere to be found. Foster and David are always making the plays. With that said, we need to add some depth next year on defense along the defensive line. George Johnson isn't anything to write home about and our CB's have played average all year long. We might need to draft Aqib Talib's replacement this year b/c he hasn't done nothing worth keeping around.

Offensively, we could use an upgrade at center. I wouldn't mind drafting a guard early to replace Joseph. Dotson got beat by Kerrigan badly yesterday but I'll give him more time. A huge TE that is a receiving threat in the mold of Gronk, Graham, etc...would be nice but our passing game is strictly designed for the WR's. Our offensive line has to play better for us to run the ball and throw.
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bucstopshere


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 3:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

we all need to step back and think about this team. Last year we were embarrased week in and week out for the last 10 games of the season. We werent competetive, couldnt move the ball effectively and couldnt stop a nose bleed.


a mere 4 games into the season with totally new schemes on both sides of the ball and we look like a different team. Sure we can sit here and put blame on Sullivan for play calling, Freeman for his struggles, corners for getting beat on an island, but why?

We have been in every game, and quite easily could be 4-0 right now. Did anyone think we would be able to do that? I know I had us losing @NYG and @DAL....

Step back and think about how far this team has actually come in a short year. Let Sullivan continue to work with Freeman and let him develop.

In the second half of that game Freeman looked outstanding. I dont care if they were the worst secondary in the league. Look at the ball placement he had, especially to that throw to Mike Williams.

Let's all take a deep breath, realize that we only won 4 games last year, and have 12 games left....
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bucsfan333


Joined: 15 Jun 2007
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Location: the mitten
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 3:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bucstopshere wrote:
we all need to step back and think about this team. Last year we were embarrased week in and week out for the last 10 games of the season. We werent competetive, couldnt move the ball effectively and couldnt stop a nose bleed.


a mere 4 games into the season with totally new schemes on both sides of the ball and we look like a different team. Sure we can sit here and put blame on Sullivan for play calling, Freeman for his struggles, corners for getting beat on an island, but why?

We have been in every game, and quite easily could be 4-0 right now. Did anyone think we would be able to do that? I know I had us losing @NYG and @DAL....

Step back and think about how far this team has actually come in a short year. Let Sullivan continue to work with Freeman and let him develop.

In the second half of that game Freeman looked outstanding. I dont care if they were the worst secondary in the league. Look at the ball placement he had, especially to that throw to Mike Williams.

Let's all take a deep breath, realize that we only won 4 games last year, and have 12 games left....

But, but... Freeman. Laughing

You're absolutely right. We've fielded a competitive team all four weeks this year. We can't say that about last years team.

Three losses by a combined 15 points? We're three big plays away from 4-0. Nobody likes losing. But we're much closer to turning things around than we have been in a while.
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5nick5


Joined: 25 Jan 2011
Posts: 1222
Location: Florida
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think Freeman could be a solid NFL QB, at least a really good backup, but we don't want that in Tampa Bay. Freeman doesn't fit the scheme and I think even if he ends up having a decent year, Dominik should look in a different direction.

This year the only QB that wows me is Geno Smith and we won't suck enough to get him. I agree with B4L that if we are gonna draft a QB, we need to draft the safest pick. Aaron Murray and Tyler Bray are impressive, but I think they should wait a year before they declare for the draft, so if we stick with Freeman through his contract, we could end up in a good situation.

I think the very top need however is CB. Talib has been getting torched this year, Wright has been better than I expected, but he can still get burned a few times. I like Biggers as a nickel-back or dime-back, but the starting positions might need to be worked on. My two favorite prospects at CB are Johnthan Banks and Dee Milliner. Odds are we have to settle with just one, but that's fine, Rome wasn't built in a day. As far as Safety, am I the only one impressed with Ahmad Black so far? I think he's been playing pretty darn well when called upon. Maybe I'm just too high on him to notice his flaws.

I think our receiving core is underrated by a lot of us Bucs fans. You can blame the receivers for Freeman's struggles, but Jackson and Williams have played some good games so far this season. Freeman should be calling out more audibles and changing routes so they can keep the defense guessing. I wouldn't be opposed to another receiver, because you can never have enough receiving threats, but I wouldn't consider it a need.

The O-Line, I'm not sure about Dotson, but Zuttah definitely needs to go. 6 sacks already is simply unacceptable for somebody at his position. Barrett Jones is an intriguing prospect. The guy is really versatile and in my opinion is the best Offensive Lineman in the draft. Khaled Holmes is also a decent option.

While this offense doesn't call for a game breaking TE, it's always good to have one. Gronk, Graham, Gonzalez, etc. are all game changers and can really come up big and be a nice safety option for the QB, especially a guy like Freeman who really liked throwing to his TEs. I like Tyler Eifert a lot but it'd also be nice to see Dominik work out a deal with the Pats for Aaron Hernandez. He often gets overshadowed by Gronkowski, but he is a star in his own right. He's also very versatile.

I agree we have a lot of holes, but despite those this team is giving 100% effort week-in and week-out and are showing a lot of promise. I'm having more fun watching this team than any team since 2005. While they may leave us with heavy hearts after 3 nail-biting losses, you guys can't doubt the improvements that have been made.
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bucstopshere


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The truth of the matter is unless we can get Geno Smith were we are drafting there is absolutely no point in wasting a pick on a QB.

Let's please even stop this talk til the end of the year.

We need another CB bad, and I hope we go back to the Alabama well and are able to land Millner. He is a stud. Great technique, great size, very good speed. He is who I want on this team.

Honestly the O-line is doing just fine. Having Joesph back next year will help with Zuttah.

Tight end is a need. Stocker is no more than a number 2 guy. Clark is washed up. He can't block, and tries to catch things with one hand WAYYY too much
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bucstopshere wrote:
The truth of the matter is unless we can get Geno Smith were we are drafting there is absolutely no point in wasting a pick on a QB.

Let's please even stop this talk til the end of the year.

We need another CB bad, and I hope we go back to the Alabama well and are able to land Millner. He is a stud. Great technique, great size, very good speed. He is who I want on this team.

Honestly the O-line is doing just fine. Having Joesph back next year will help with Zuttah.

Tight end is a need. Stocker is no more than a number 2 guy. Clark is washed up. He can't block, and tries to catch things with one hand WAYYY too much


Actually there is a qb that is pretty darn good behind Geno Smith. I'll reveal it later this week. Watched a lot of film on him and will say greatly impressive.
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 5:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think so many put so much heat on Schiano I've been seeing. Remember, Mike SUllivan and Bill Sheridan were not his first choice. If I remember correctly, we were denied by our 2 top options each OC and DC candidates before Sullivan or Sheridan were hired.

However, I think Sheridan has done a nice job. Yes, the Gaints game was suspect and he had some off calls, bc he's too aggressive.

Mike Sullivan is learning. I thought it was a good hire, but he's opened the offense up.

Also, before anyone disects this, yes the offensive play-calling has been inconsistant, but that has nothing to do with Josh Freeman's inability. His flaws are out side of the scheme, comfortability or not.
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indifference


Joined: 08 Nov 2010
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 5:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
bucstopshere wrote:
The truth of the matter is unless we can get Geno Smith were we are drafting there is absolutely no point in wasting a pick on a QB.

Let's please even stop this talk til the end of the year.

We need another CB bad, and I hope we go back to the Alabama well and are able to land Millner. He is a stud. Great technique, great size, very good speed. He is who I want on this team.

Honestly the O-line is doing just fine. Having Joesph back next year will help with Zuttah.

Tight end is a need. Stocker is no more than a number 2 guy. Clark is washed up. He can't block, and tries to catch things with one hand WAYYY too much


Actually there is a qb that is pretty darn good behind Geno Smith. I'll reveal it later this week. Watched a lot of film on him and will say greatly impressive.
Aaron Murray is a good prospect. I wouldn't mind taking him next year and we bring Freeman back.
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scottonatable


Joined: 24 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 8:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i say in the draft we continue to build with the defense and in the later rounds grab a TE AND QB...
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