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PAtexansFAN99


Joined: 04 Jan 2007
Posts: 4381
PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 7:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

EliteTexan80 wrote:
Marco79 wrote:
kenney wrote:
Apparently folks around the league are expecting Houston to go QB in the 2nd to 4th rounds. Ugh.

This is a terrible QB draft and this FO ought to be ashamed that it didn't open up its QB search until the year AFTER the greatest QB draft since '83.

Who's psyched for the Mike Glennon, Ryan Nassib, or Zac Dysert-led Texans?!!?

EJ Manuel, please.


I'm on board with Manuel...

...but I highly doubt he's going in the 2nd round. He had the best Sr. Bowl of all the QBs at Mobile, and unless he goes and throws ducks and runs a Ryan Mallett-esque 5.37, his stock is only going to get higher. We all knew he was a very competent athlete and was primed to have a good combine, the questions lied with his on-field performances against other players - and with that game he had, those questions were answered quickly.

If he continues performing at this high of a rate in all post season workouts, he's the 3rd QB off the board and probably a mid 1st round pick. It might be a case where the 27th pick in the draft isn't enough; Guy is the fastest riser right now, and unless he massively slips, I don't see that changing.


I disagree. I don't think there's a QB that's a solid first round prospect in this year's class, and I don't think that teams will be willing to reach for these guys.

I think Texans may have their pick of any QB in the draft @ 27..

That being said, EJ Manuel is not a bad choice. I also think Tyler Bray is one of if not the best arm in the draft.
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EliteTexan80


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 7:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PAtexansFAN99 wrote:
I disagree. I don't think there's a QB that's a solid first round prospect in this year's class, and I don't think that teams will be willing to reach for these guys.

A lack of solid 1st round prospects don't necessarily stop QB needy teams from taking guys well before they SHOULD be taken. Nobody with a half right head felt as if either Jake Locker, Blaine Gabbert or Christian Ponder REALLY felt as if they had a first round pedigree - but there they were, three iffy selections at QB, taken with the first 15 picks of the draft (and all playing bridesmaid to the top QB selected, Cam Newton).

Given the state of the teams picking in the top 10 (only Detroit and MAYBE Tenn have locks at the QB spot) you will see guys coming off the board MUCH quicker than they should. Andy Reid will want to start his tenure with a rookie to soften the blow of any criticism from a slow building process in KC, and Geno Smith fits the bill of a strong armed, mobile QB who can run his offense; Jacksonville is probably snakebit from the Blaine Gabbert failure, so they could pass, but Matt Barkley at 2 could be a possible landing spot; Even if QBs don't go 1, 2...you have to think teams such as Oakland, Philly, Cleveland and Arizona are looking to upgrade at QB; Oakland COULD go with Terrelle Pryor, Philly COULD go with Nick Foles - but even if those don't play out, Buffalo and the Jets are in dire need for a QB.

The supply is low, but the demand is at an all time high at the top of the draft...so teams will be willing to risk, knowing they don't have to pay the mega contracts that teams had to pay prior to the rookie cap.

Quote:
I think Texans may have their pick of any QB in the draft @ 27...

Question is, do the Texans go QB in the first? Can this team justify such a move, with a very highly paid QB on roster, one who might be anywhere between the 12-15 best QB in the NFL?

Quote:
That being said, EJ Manuel is not a bad choice. I also think Tyler Bray is one of if not the best arm in the draft.

Eh. Bray is the next Ryan Leaf or Ryan Mallett. Has all the talent in the world, but is just TOO immature to handle the job of a starting, franchise QB in the NFL. For all of Manuel's physical gifts, he's a great student, team leader and humble kid. Teams pay a premium for that kind of person now.
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Wolf6151


Joined: 11 Feb 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 7:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kenney wrote:
Wolf6151 wrote:
I was asking about this move months ago, it only makes sense to move Reed inside after re-signing Barwin so that we can keep all your best LB's on the field at once. Barwin at SOLB, Cushing at SILB, Reed at WILB, and Mercilus at WOLB. Now the only hole in our front 7 is at NT and that can be filled with Kawann Short in the 1st round.

I think we'll look for some depth at both ILB and OLB in the 3rd - 5th rounds.

I love this move if it happens.


I have already had my row with mse about how substantial our need for a nose is, but, supposing we do go for a nose in the 1st: why are you all so set on Short? Poor pad level, questionable hand-placement and technique, not always an effort player...

I would much rather we look at:
- Sharrif Floyd, Florida
- Jesse Williams, Alabama
- Brandon Williams, Missouri Southern

... to name a few guys who are better prospects than Short.



*Floyd is either a 4-3 UT or 3-4 DE, he's not a 3-4 NT even in our 1 gap system.
*J. Williams, I like him alot as well and would have no problem with him in the 1st. I think he's stronger than Short and can handle the double teams better in a more traditional NT role but he's not near as agile or quick and his lateral movement leaves alot to be desired. He plays the run well but doesn't offer much in a pass rush.
*B. Williams, I like him as well if we wait til the 2nd or 3rd round. He's a project, I think he'll need to drop some weight and I know he had a good Senior Bowl week but I worry about the whole level of competition thing. I think he'll be really good but will take at least a year before we see it on the field.
*Short, is strong and can handle the double teams, he's got a great base (butt and legs) and anchors very well, plays the run very well, has good agility and lateral movement to pursue the play or in a pass rush. Short is a combo of Sylvester Williams and Jesse Williams, not as strong as Jesse and not as quick as Sylvester but very good at both. Pad level is very coachable, and I don't see effort issues so much as conditioning issues that most college players have. With Watt on one side of him, Antonio on the other, and Cushing behind him he'll have to give full effort, he'd be to afraid not to.

A better NT would lessen our needs at ILB, offer more of a pass rush without blitzing all the time, and free us up to play Earl Mitchell at DE occasionally thus showing a better variety of D-line formations. Short would also bring more size to a D-line that needs it on short yardage or goal line situations.
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amazingandre


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 8:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Im growing interest in Matt Scott, he is the COMPLETE opposite of Matt Schaub, he has a good arm especially on the run (which would make our boot leg deadly) and is VERY durable. He does need to work on under center snaps and being a bit more accurate from the pocket. Could be a nice one year project who COULD at the minimum push Schaub.
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kenney


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 9:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

lumberjackchris wrote:
kenney wrote:
Apparently folks around the league are expecting Houston to go QB in the 2nd to 4th rounds. Ugh.

This is a terrible QB draft and this FO ought to be ashamed that it didn't open up its QB search until the year AFTER the greatest QB draft since '83.

Who's psyched for the Mike Glennon, Ryan Nassib, or Zac Dysert-led Texans?!!?


Link?


It was only a bit that I caught right before going into work. Hub Arkush was interviewing with Seth Payne and Mike Meltzer (which is the best radio duo in Houston, bar none).

I will dig up a tweet to cite when I'm back on a computer.

EDIT:

Seth Payne wrote:
Hub Arkush from Pro Football Weekly says there's noise that Texans may draft a QB high


Also, I don't believe the Texans will look at EJ Manuel, and my biggest frustration is something Apollo has noted before: the Watt and Cushing drafts aside, the Texans are consistently a day late and a dollar short when it comes to adequately identifying needs and addressing them early.

We would be in much better shape with Russell Wilson than Brandon Brooks.
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Wolf6151


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2013 2:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kenney wrote:
lumberjackchris wrote:
kenney wrote:
Apparently folks around the league are expecting Houston to go QB in the 2nd to 4th rounds. Ugh.

This is a terrible QB draft and this FO ought to be ashamed that it didn't open up its QB search until the year AFTER the greatest QB draft since '83.

Who's psyched for the Mike Glennon, Ryan Nassib, or Zac Dysert-led Texans?!!?


Link?


It was only a bit that I caught right before going into work. Hub Arkush was interviewing with Seth Payne and Mike Meltzer (which is the best radio duo in Houston, bar none).

I will dig up a tweet to cite when I'm back on a computer.

EDIT:

Seth Payne wrote:
Hub Arkush from Pro Football Weekly says there's noise that Texans may draft a QB high


Also, I don't believe the Texans will look at EJ Manuel, and my biggest frustration is something Apollo has noted before: the Watt and Cushing drafts aside, the Texans are consistently a day late and a dollar short when it comes to adequately identifying needs and addressing them early.

We would be in much better shape with Russell Wilson than Brandon Brooks.


There's no arguing with the fact we'd be much better off with Russell Wilson than Brooks but Wilson was selected #75 in the draft so he was passed over 74 times. Even the Seahawks passed on him twice. Hindsite is 20/20 and foresite is damn near blind. It makes you wonder how 32 football teams full of talent scouting experts, GM's, coaches, etc. could all miss 74 times. Look at Tom Brady, it gets alot worse. How did so many teams full of talent evaluating experts miss so badly so many times? You also have to wonder would Russell Wilson have turned out the same here in Houston with Kubiak dictating things, as he has in Seattle. Second guessing selections will drive you crazy. Yes selecting Revis would have been much better than Okoye and it's aggravating when your team gets a pick wrong but no team gets them all right. I agree the Texans do seem to be late in identifying needs and filling them but I think the talent level of the team, or lack there of had alot to do with that for many years. The Texans were filling immediate needs and didn't have the talent level or depth on the team to look at future needs and fill them a year ahead of time. I think we're getting to that point though now. Mercilus was an insurance pick against Barwin leaving, and Harris/Carmichael were selected to provide the future depth at CB, which looks good now that Harris will probably be taking over for McCain at nickle. The same can be said for Brooks and Jones being the depth a yr. ahead of time when we're looking at losing Caldwell. I would assume the Texans to do the same this year picking an OG to replace W. Smith after the 2013 season.
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Wolf6151


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2013 2:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

amazingandre wrote:
Im growing interest in Matt Scott, he is the COMPLETE opposite of Matt Schaub, he has a good arm especially on the run (which would make our boot leg deadly) and is VERY durable. He does need to work on under center snaps and being a bit more accurate from the pocket. Could be a nice one year project who COULD at the minimum push Schaub.


Just as an FYI, I asked CWood21 about Scott on the NFL Draft board and he didn't have anything good to say about him. CW isn't perfect obviously but his talent evaluating skills seem to be better than most.


Jonathan Banks-CB from Miss. St. has moved down to a late 1st or early 2nd round pick. Is CB enough of a need that we might look at adding some high quality depth or future starter in this years draft?
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kenney


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2013 3:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wolf6151 wrote:
kenney wrote:
lumberjackchris wrote:
kenney wrote:
Apparently folks around the league are expecting Houston to go QB in the 2nd to 4th rounds. Ugh.

This is a terrible QB draft and this FO ought to be ashamed that it didn't open up its QB search until the year AFTER the greatest QB draft since '83.

Who's psyched for the Mike Glennon, Ryan Nassib, or Zac Dysert-led Texans?!!?


Link?


It was only a bit that I caught right before going into work. Hub Arkush was interviewing with Seth Payne and Mike Meltzer (which is the best radio duo in Houston, bar none).

I will dig up a tweet to cite when I'm back on a computer.

EDIT:

Seth Payne wrote:
Hub Arkush from Pro Football Weekly says there's noise that Texans may draft a QB high


Also, I don't believe the Texans will look at EJ Manuel, and my biggest frustration is something Apollo has noted before: the Watt and Cushing drafts aside, the Texans are consistently a day late and a dollar short when it comes to adequately identifying needs and addressing them early.

We would be in much better shape with Russell Wilson than Brandon Brooks.


There's no arguing with the fact we'd be much better off with Russell Wilson than Brooks but Wilson was selected #75 in the draft so he was passed over 74 times. Even the Seahawks passed on him twice. Hindsite is 20/20 and foresite is damn near blind. It makes you wonder how 32 football teams full of talent scouting experts, GM's, coaches, etc. could all miss 74 times. Look at Tom Brady, it gets alot worse. How did so many teams full of talent evaluating experts miss so badly so many times? You also have to wonder would Russell Wilson have turned out the same here in Houston with Kubiak dictating things, as he has in Seattle. Second guessing selections will drive you crazy. Yes selecting Revis would have been much better than Okoye and it's aggravating when your team gets a pick wrong but no team gets them all right. I agree the Texans do seem to be late in identifying needs and filling them but I think the talent level of the team, or lack there of had alot to do with that for many years. The Texans were filling immediate needs and didn't have the talent level or depth on the team to look at future needs and fill them a year ahead of time. I think we're getting to that point though now. Mercilus was an insurance pick against Barwin leaving, and Harris/Carmichael were selected to provide the future depth at CB, which looks good now that Harris will probably be taking over for McCain at nickle. The same can be said for Brooks and Jones being the depth a yr. ahead of time when we're looking at losing Caldwell. I would assume the Texans to do the same this year picking an OG to replace W. Smith after the 2013 season.


While I agree that judging drafts by hindsight is a pretty dumb criterion on its own, Wilson was a highly-regarded prospect who'd have been a first rounder if he was two inches taller.

However, what I was really lamenting was the fact that it does seem like our FO late to the party so often in identifying needs in general. It shouldn't have taken 2010 for Smith to figure out that we needed help int he secondary. It shouldn't have taken this year for Smith to start planning for Schaub's successor. We should have never been in a position to have to start Tim Dobbins, Mister Alexander, Daryl Sharpton, or Barrett Ruud. This is my real frustration.

Seven rookie QBs started in the NFL last year, and we had a shot at three of them. Now we're faced with taking a QB in a draft in which NONE of these players would go ahead of the seven guys from last year's class. That's unacceptable.
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kenney


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2013 2:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quick mock:

1: DeAndre Hopkins, WR, Clemson
2: Dion Sims, TE, Michigan State
3: Kyle Long, OL, Oregon
3: Chris Harper, WR, Kansas State
4: Akeem Spence, DT, Illinois
5: Kevin Reddick, LB, North Carolina
6: Robert Lester, S, Alabama
6: Micah Hyde, DB, Iowa
6: Joe Kruger, DE, Utah
6: Rex Burkhead, RB, Nebraska
7: John Boyett, S, Oregon
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jch1911


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 12:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting reads

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Whos-been-doing-the-best-job-of-drafting.html

Texans in middle of the pack re: draft success (according to this site's metrics)


Also, cost per draft pick (2012)

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Cost-Per-Snap-A-New-Approach-for-the-NFL-Draft.html
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Wolf6151


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 1:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kenney wrote:
Quick mock:

1: DeAndre Hopkins, WR, Clemson
2: Dion Sims, TE, Michigan State
3: Kyle Long, OL, Oregon
3: Chris Harper, WR, Kansas State
4: Akeem Spence, DT, Illinois
5: Kevin Reddick, LB, North Carolina
6: Robert Lester, S, Alabama
6: Micah Hyde, DB, Iowa
6: Joe Kruger, DE, Utah
6: Rex Burkhead, RB, Nebraska
7: John Boyett, S, Oregon


I love the Hopkins pick. Long is good but I think we can do better at OG than him. I like the Reddick pick, good athleticism but has alot to learn. I have doubts that Lester falls that far, great pick if he is available. Hyde is a CB but he plays CB like a future SS, he'll be changing positions. Burkhead is a good pick but only if we trade away Tate.
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kenney


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 2:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wolf6151 wrote:
kenney wrote:
Quick mock:

1: DeAndre Hopkins, WR, Clemson
2: Dion Sims, TE, Michigan State
3: Kyle Long, OL, Oregon
3: Chris Harper, WR, Kansas State
4: Akeem Spence, DT, Illinois
5: Kevin Reddick, LB, North Carolina
6: Robert Lester, S, Alabama
6: Micah Hyde, DB, Iowa
6: Joe Kruger, DE, Utah
6: Rex Burkhead, RB, Nebraska
7: John Boyett, S, Oregon


I love the Hopkins pick. Long is good but I think we can do better at OG than him. I like the Reddick pick, good athleticism but has alot to learn. I have doubts that Lester falls that far, great pick if he is available. Hyde is a CB but he plays CB like a future SS, he'll be changing positions. Burkhead is a good pick but only if we trade away Tate.


I think Long is a similar eval to Duane Brown coming out: off the charts tools but unbelievably raw. Give him time and coaching to learn in this system and I think you end up with a guy who can be elite at 4 positions on the line. Ultimately, though, I think I'm dreaming here as I believe Long winds up as a 1st-rounder.

This ILB draft is beyond terrible, but I think Reddick is a good project player with enough talent to certainly be more valuable as depth to Reed and Cushing than Sharpton, Ruud, etc.

Lester is a tough call because I've only watched his stock decline, but I think he compares favorably to Bernard Pollard. Hyde is a quasi-DB who I think offers us a ton of positional versatility on the back end. His skillset is not dissimilar to Glover Quin's.

I've been saying for a while that I think Burkhead is the next Kevin Faulk - a really cerebral do-everything third down back, but Burkhead has a little more power.

Boyett is my favorite stash-and-develop/recover prospect since Jack Ikegwuonu.

I think if the team can add the playmaking options of Hopkins, Sims, Harper, and Burkhead, Matt Schaub goes into next season with a group of young players who all possess skill sets that make them immediate impact contributors.

The defensive selections bolster weak depth and special teams and provide solid developmental guys, as well.
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kenney


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 2:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

And, well, Tate or no Tate, RB just shot up the board in terms of priority Sad

Arian Foster to undergo heart surgery.
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mse326


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 12:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kenney wrote:
And, well, Tate or no Tate, RB just shot up the board in terms of priority Sad

Arian Foster to undergo heart surgery.


If anything it might lessen the need. It is for the issue that he's had almost his whole life, and from what I've read it is relatively minor (at least as heart surgeries go). Given that he's performed well his whole life with the condition I can't imagine they would do this now unless 1) There is little risk of it affecting his play or 2) the condition suddenly got much worse. Given we haven't heard anything I'd imagine it's number 1.
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amazingandre


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kenney wrote:
And, well, Tate or no Tate, RB just shot up the board in terms of priority Sad

Arian Foster to undergo heart surgery.


If anything it hampered him this year, once fixed he should be ok.

This is from a DR on another site


Cardiac ablation is a very common procedure performed for many types of arrhythmia such as atrial fibrillation, SVT (supraventricular tachycardia), WPW (Wolf-Parkinson-White), etc. These conditions occur due to an abnormal trigger tissue in the heart trying to take over the normal anatomical heart tissue trigger (the sinoatrial node [SA node]) that lies in the atrium of the heart. When these conditions are present, the pumping of the heart is not in sych, and therefore does not distribute the blood and oxygen to the brain and all parts of the body efficiently. Symptoms produced can include dizziness, weakness, fatigue, shortness of breath, and in general a lack of feeling of well being. Many of these entities may be controlled with medication. Most of the time, ablation is performed if medications for these entities do not control effectively, or produce side effects that are intolerable. Most of these conditions will be successfully resolved effectively after ablation.

It seems that reporting on Arian is stuck on "shortness of breath" as possibly being a life-threatening condition, where in truth, with any of these entities untreated, there can be an element of intermittent shortness of breath that may be bothersome but very seldom life-threatening. If Arian was suffering from an arrhythmia that was life-threatening such as ventricular tachycardia (VT)........or arrhythmia not essentially controlled by meds.....he would have been restricted from playing football until well controlled. Since it seems that he was on medications that he tended to skip on game day, it makes me think that he was on a beta-blocker for atrial fibrillation with fast response heart rate. If anyone has ever taken a beta-blocker (such as Inderal), you know that it slows down the heart rate, can make you extremely sluggish, dizzy and fatigued, and can in itself give you shortness of breath as it is a broncho constrictor (constrictor of airway). These side effects would be why he would want to stop taking it on the day of a game. When doing so, the interruption can lead to a temporary breakthrough of the arrhythmia.........which is what I believe Arian experienced in practices and in that one game..........times where stressors upon the heart are maximal.......and where effects of either the arrhythmia (without the beta blocker to fully control) or the effects of the beta blocker are most likely to be felt.
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