Discuss football with over 60,000 fans. Free Membership. Join now!

 FAQFAQ  RegisterRegister   ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

FootballsFuture.com Forum Index
FootballsFuture.com Home

Are we being to hard on Freeman?
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    FootballsFuture.com Forum Index -> Tampa Bay Buccaneers
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Posts: 7568
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 11:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

^^^^ Although I try not to weigh in on the "USC QBs in the past have Failed" or "No QB from this school has had success" blah blah, Matt Barkely just doesn't jump out at me. He's solid, but he doesn't warrent a top 20 grade IMO. Arm strength is questionable, can be very inaccurate, and has great playmakers in Lee and Woods. He's a risky one.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
RoeKG


Joined: 10 Apr 2007
Posts: 4204
Location: PA
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 11:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
^^^^ Although I try not to weigh in on the "USC QBs in the past have Failed" or "No QB from this school has had success" blah blah, Matt Barkely just doesn't jump out at me. He's solid, but he doesn't warrent a top 20 grade IMO. Arm strength is questionable, can be very inaccurate, and has great playmakers in Lee and Woods. He's a risky one.


I'm not pro-Barkley or Anti-Barkley, just if you're going to criticize him you should do it with real points like you just did. Not saying he'll fail because he went to USC.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Posts: 7568
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 11:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RoeKG wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
^^^^ Although I try not to weigh in on the "USC QBs in the past have Failed" or "No QB from this school has had success" blah blah, Matt Barkely just doesn't jump out at me. He's solid, but he doesn't warrent a top 20 grade IMO. Arm strength is questionable, can be very inaccurate, and has great playmakers in Lee and Woods. He's a risky one.


I'm not pro-Barkley or Anti-Barkley, just if you're going to criticize him you should do it with real points like you just did. Not saying he'll fail because he went to USC.


Yeah, agree. I think the best one was the "Tedford" Qbs. David Carr, Kyle Boller, Joey Harrington, all busted. Then Aaron Rodgers suffered a fall because of that. Look who missed out on a future HOF (Gruden LULZ)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bucsEST96


Joined: 22 Sep 2009
Posts: 2216
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 12:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RoeKG wrote:
bucsEST96 wrote:
RoeKG wrote:
bucsEST96 wrote:
YoungBucs15 wrote:
I just don't see Schiano drafted an athletic QB. A pocket QB is what it looks like he prefers, i'm fine with us taking Barkley. I know people around here aren't big on him but the kid is one of the best to come out of USC, thrown a few 6 td games, the most 5 td games in USC history and i believe several 4 td games. Only thing is he can't beat Stanford, but hey Manning couldn't beat Florida so i'm not worried about that. Plus it doesn't hurt i'm a huge USC fan.


Quote:
On Sunday Countdown, ESPN's Chris Mortensen stated that "It's been mistakenly assumed (Matt Barkley) would be the lock No. 1 quarterback for the 2013 draft."
Mortensen likely means in the public's eye, since Barkley has been mentioned in the same breath as last year's top two quarterbacks prior to the 2011 Draft. We feel the same since we have considered Arkansas senior Tyler Wilson a better prospect and now have moved West Virginia's Geno Smith ahead. And that is only considering the seniors. Barkley is in total command of USC's offense, but aside from his placement and touch he does not offer any outstanding traits. Sep. 30 - 11:41 am et


You done? How many USC qb's must fail in order for u USC fans to stop? Like its never happened.


Like all USC Quarterbacks are the same.


Mark Sanchez, Carson Palmer, Matt Leinart, Sean Salisbury, Rodney Peete, Pat Haden, Matt Cassel, Bill Nelsen, Pete Beathard, Vince Evans, Paul McDonald, Todd Marinovich, Rob Johnson AND John David Booty.

Hmmm 14 USC qb's, 1pro bowler, 1(backup) SB title........... You done?


So do all stigmas about positions and schools from the 60s apply?

Of that list you have 3 1st rounders, with one being elite and the other 2 pretty much being busts. Sounds about right for 1st round QBs. You're comparing guys who went undrafted and late round picks to a sure fire 1st round pick. Barkley is also the only QB out yet to come out under Lane Kiffin which should mean something.

By the way, compile any list of any position from any school and you'll see similar success, so.... you done?


Actually none of what u said is true. It's common knowledge/known facts USC qb's don't hack it in the nfl. But there's always someone like you who begs to differ and get disappointed. Which you will again
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
RoeKG


Joined: 10 Apr 2007
Posts: 4204
Location: PA
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 12:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bucsEST96 wrote:
RoeKG wrote:
bucsEST96 wrote:
RoeKG wrote:
bucsEST96 wrote:
YoungBucs15 wrote:
I just don't see Schiano drafted an athletic QB. A pocket QB is what it looks like he prefers, i'm fine with us taking Barkley. I know people around here aren't big on him but the kid is one of the best to come out of USC, thrown a few 6 td games, the most 5 td games in USC history and i believe several 4 td games. Only thing is he can't beat Stanford, but hey Manning couldn't beat Florida so i'm not worried about that. Plus it doesn't hurt i'm a huge USC fan.


Quote:
On Sunday Countdown, ESPN's Chris Mortensen stated that "It's been mistakenly assumed (Matt Barkley) would be the lock No. 1 quarterback for the 2013 draft."
Mortensen likely means in the public's eye, since Barkley has been mentioned in the same breath as last year's top two quarterbacks prior to the 2011 Draft. We feel the same since we have considered Arkansas senior Tyler Wilson a better prospect and now have moved West Virginia's Geno Smith ahead. And that is only considering the seniors. Barkley is in total command of USC's offense, but aside from his placement and touch he does not offer any outstanding traits. Sep. 30 - 11:41 am et


You done? How many USC qb's must fail in order for u USC fans to stop? Like its never happened.


Like all USC Quarterbacks are the same.


Mark Sanchez, Carson Palmer, Matt Leinart, Sean Salisbury, Rodney Peete, Pat Haden, Matt Cassel, Bill Nelsen, Pete Beathard, Vince Evans, Paul McDonald, Todd Marinovich, Rob Johnson AND John David Booty.

Hmmm 14 USC qb's, 1pro bowler, 1(backup) SB title........... You done?


So do all stigmas about positions and schools from the 60s apply?

Of that list you have 3 1st rounders, with one being elite and the other 2 pretty much being busts. Sounds about right for 1st round QBs. You're comparing guys who went undrafted and late round picks to a sure fire 1st round pick. Barkley is also the only QB out yet to come out under Lane Kiffin which should mean something.

By the way, compile any list of any position from any school and you'll see similar success, so.... you done?


Actually none of what u said is true. It's common knowledge/known facts USC qb's don't hack it in the nfl. But there's always someone like you who begs to differ and get disappointed. Which you will again


What are you even talking about? I never even said I liked Barkley, just that your argument is bad. Because it is.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bucsEST96


Joined: 22 Sep 2009
Posts: 2216
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 12:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
RoeKG wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
^^^^ Although I try not to weigh in on the "USC QBs in the past have Failed" or "No QB from this school has had success" blah blah, Matt Barkely just doesn't jump out at me. He's solid, but he doesn't warrent a top 20 grade IMO. Arm strength is questionable, can be very inaccurate, and has great playmakers in Lee and Woods. He's a risky one.


I'm not pro-Barkley or Anti-Barkley, just if you're going to criticize him you should do it with real points like you just did. Not saying he'll fail because he went to USC.


Yeah, agree. I think the best one was the "Tedford" Qbs. David Carr, Kyle Boller, Joey Harrington, all busted. Then Aaron Rodgers suffered a fall because of that. Look who missed out on a future HOF (Gruden LULZ)


You forgetting the GB coaches even said Rodgers was a "project" they "rebuilt" him into a QB. So that hold no water. Example, I been a Michigan fan since 1990. Tom Brady was a BONAFIDE scrub to the point he went to the NFL combine to prove his athleticism to MLB scouts because baseball is was #1 sport and why he was recruited to Michigan. Sat the bench behind damn Dree freaking Henson. Barely drafted but ended up in the right system.


Point being Barkley will stink like all the rest the USC qb's
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
YoungBucs15


Joined: 14 Jan 2009
Posts: 3782
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 12:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RoeKG wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
^^^^ Although I try not to weigh in on the "USC QBs in the past have Failed" or "No QB from this school has had success" blah blah, Matt Barkely just doesn't jump out at me. He's solid, but he doesn't warrent a top 20 grade IMO. Arm strength is questionable, can be very inaccurate, and has great playmakers in Lee and Woods. He's a risky one.


I'm not pro-Barkley or Anti-Barkley, just if you're going to criticize him you should do it with real points like you just did. Not saying he'll fail because he went to USC.


That's what i don't get, there is always going to be players that buck the system. If you are weary of WR's from the Georgia Tech because of the spread, do you pass on Calvin Johnson. Im not saying Barkley is on that level as far as talent is concerned as Calvin is a once a decade WR. To me you know exactly what you are getting from Barkley, he may not be elite but I believe you are getting a very solid above average QB.

As far as accuracy, only time he threw for under 60% was his true freshman year, since then he has improved to almost 70% last year. Freeman couldn't even get 60% in his last year.

Im also not sure how we can knock him on having elite WR's in Woods and Lee. He still has to get the ball to them, go back and watch some of the throws he gets them. Biggest reason he is struggling the last few games is that the starting center is out and they have absolutely no depth due to the sanctions. Im just not sure people can look down at him because Geno is doing so good. Kid is looked at as one of the best for the last 2 years and because Geno is having a phenomenal year Barkley must have regressed because he's not doing what Geno is. Not to take anything away from what Geno is accomplishing, don't get me wrong I would love to have him on the roster as well.

My only real concern at this point is what defense has Geno really faced as LSU is really the only great defense he faced and he didn't do to well. Last year he had good stats but my understanding is that it was mainly in garbage time at the end. Same could be said about Barkley but i think he plays higher level defenses throughout the Pac 12 than Smith faces in the Big East.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
tml_gogo


Joined: 02 Feb 2007
Posts: 13617
Location: Montréal
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 10:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Barkley kinda reminds me of Jimmy Clausen. Very hyped coming into college, questionable arm strength, good accuracy, with lots of playmakers around him. I'm not pro or anti Barkley, don't really know yet, but overall as a potential top 5 prospect he seems pretty underwhelming.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Posts: 7568
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 1:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's something to ponder: Matt Ryan is in his 5th year and new offensive scheme.

Christian ponder is in his 2nd year and new offensive scheme.

So what's the excuse for freeman again?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
5nick5


Joined: 25 Jan 2011
Posts: 1258
Location: Florida
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="YoungBucs15"][quote="RoeKG"]
REDandPEWTER wrote:
Same could be said about Barkley but i think he plays higher level defenses throughout the Pac 12 than Smith faces in the Big East.


WVU's in the Big 12 now. While they aren't the best defensive conference either, they're better than the Pac-12. Either way, 20TDs 0INT 1728yds. and an 83.4% completion percentage through the first month of the season is nothing short of spectacular. This weekend against Texas will be a game I'm tuning into. That Texas defense has a lot of high NFL Draft prospects on it, so it'll be interesting to see what Geno can put up against them. It looks like Geno will be this year's RG3. A good arm, great accuracy, and running ability.
_________________


Thanks to BGG on the sig.

Adopt a Buc: Alterraun Verner
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
YoungBucs15


Joined: 14 Jan 2009
Posts: 3782
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 4:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="5nick5"][quote="YoungBucs15"]
RoeKG wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
Same could be said about Barkley but i think he plays higher level defenses throughout the Pac 12 than Smith faces in the Big East.


WVU's in the Big 12 now. While they aren't the best defensive conference either, they're better than the Pac-12. Either way, 20TDs 0INT 1728yds. and an 83.4% completion percentage through the first month of the season is nothing short of spectacular. This weekend against Texas will be a game I'm tuning into. That Texas defense has a lot of high NFL Draft prospects on it, so it'll be interesting to see what Geno can put up against them. It looks like Geno will be this year's RG3. A good arm, great accuracy, and running ability.


I know, i'm just basing this off who he's already played. The next 6 weeks is what i'm curious to see.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
DaRealdeal


Moderator
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 9060
Location: Jamison. on the sig
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 1:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://twitter.com/HolderStephen/status/253862026978398208

Quote:
Among the questions I've heard of late is whether Greg Schiano is fully committed to Josh Freeman as his QB going forward. We know the answer, for the time being, is yes; there are no other options right now. But what about in the long term?

My perception, observation, etc from my time at One Buc Place is that Schiano means what he says when he talks about his belief in Freeman. We can debate how they use him and those kinds of issues, but it's becoming clear to me that Schiano thinks he has a gem in Freeman and that the Bucs will continue to take more advantage of his strengths as time goes on. The fact that Freeman is saying the staff has plans to continue throwing deep tells you the coaches understand what he does well and are going to give him a chance to do more of those things.

Finally, Schiano is a smart guy, and he knows starting over at QB in the NFL can take years. People are not patient in this business, so if you've got a quarterback who seems talented, the better option is to make it work and build around him. That's what I foresee happening here.

Good to hear. It will be interesting to see how this offense evolves as the season goes on. Freeman's 2nd half performance against the Redskins was very encouraging. He was deadly throwing it deep. Hopefully that momentum continues after our bye week.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bucsfan333


Joined: 15 Jun 2007
Posts: 27524
Location: the mitten
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 1:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DaRealdeal wrote:
https://twitter.com/HolderStephen/status/253862026978398208

Quote:
Among the questions I've heard of late is whether Greg Schiano is fully committed to Josh Freeman as his QB going forward. We know the answer, for the time being, is yes; there are no other options right now. But what about in the long term?

My perception, observation, etc from my time at One Buc Place is that Schiano means what he says when he talks about his belief in Freeman. We can debate how they use him and those kinds of issues, but it's becoming clear to me that Schiano thinks he has a gem in Freeman and that the Bucs will continue to take more advantage of his strengths as time goes on. The fact that Freeman is saying the staff has plans to continue throwing deep tells you the coaches understand what he does well and are going to give him a chance to do more of those things.

Finally, Schiano is a smart guy, and he knows starting over at QB in the NFL can take years. People are not patient in this business, so if you've got a quarterback who seems talented, the better option is to make it work and build around him. That's what I foresee happening here.

Good to hear. It will be interesting to see how this offense evolves as the season goes on. Freeman's 2nd half performance against the Redskins was very encouraging. He was deadly throwing it deep. Hopefully that momentum continues after our bye week.

Jackson and Williams both average over 19 yards per catch.

I like the vertical offense we've flashed a little bit this year. We need to do more of it. That plays best to what Free excels at. He's much more effective using the cannon he's got attached to his shoulder. And if the safeties have to play deep that should help open up the running game.
_________________
Adopt-a-Buc Lavonte David Tackles | Sacks | INTs | FFs | FRs
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
DaRealdeal


Moderator
Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 9060
Location: Jamison. on the sig
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 1:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bucsfan333 wrote:
DaRealdeal wrote:
https://twitter.com/HolderStephen/status/253862026978398208

Quote:
Among the questions I've heard of late is whether Greg Schiano is fully committed to Josh Freeman as his QB going forward. We know the answer, for the time being, is yes; there are no other options right now. But what about in the long term?

My perception, observation, etc from my time at One Buc Place is that Schiano means what he says when he talks about his belief in Freeman. We can debate how they use him and those kinds of issues, but it's becoming clear to me that Schiano thinks he has a gem in Freeman and that the Bucs will continue to take more advantage of his strengths as time goes on. The fact that Freeman is saying the staff has plans to continue throwing deep tells you the coaches understand what he does well and are going to give him a chance to do more of those things.

Finally, Schiano is a smart guy, and he knows starting over at QB in the NFL can take years. People are not patient in this business, so if you've got a quarterback who seems talented, the better option is to make it work and build around him. That's what I foresee happening here.

Good to hear. It will be interesting to see how this offense evolves as the season goes on. Freeman's 2nd half performance against the Redskins was very encouraging. He was deadly throwing it deep. Hopefully that momentum continues after our bye week.

Jackson and Williams both average over 19 yards per catch.

I like the vertical offense we've flashed a little bit this year. We need to do more of it. That plays best to what Free excels at. He's much more effective using the cannon he's got attached to his shoulder. And if the safeties have to play deep that should help open up the running game.

Yup, you kind of saw it in the Washington game. Once Freeman connected on some deep shots the safeties played deeper and Freeman was able to hit some seam routes with Underwood. I'm sure if we weren't playing from behind the running game would have been more effective then too.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Caaddy24


Joined: 23 Jan 2007
Posts: 5520
Location: Houston
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 2:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DaRealdeal wrote:
https://twitter.com/HolderStephen/status/253862026978398208

Quote:
Among the questions I've heard of late is whether Greg Schiano is fully committed to Josh Freeman as his QB going forward. We know the answer, for the time being, is yes; there are no other options right now. But what about in the long term?

My perception, observation, etc from my time at One Buc Place is that Schiano means what he says when he talks about his belief in Freeman. We can debate how they use him and those kinds of issues, but it's becoming clear to me that Schiano thinks he has a gem in Freeman and that the Bucs will continue to take more advantage of his strengths as time goes on. The fact that Freeman is saying the staff has plans to continue throwing deep tells you the coaches understand what he does well and are going to give him a chance to do more of those things.

Finally, Schiano is a smart guy, and he knows starting over at QB in the NFL can take years. People are not patient in this business, so if you've got a quarterback who seems talented, the better option is to make it work and build around him. That's what I foresee happening here.

Good to hear. It will be interesting to see how this offense evolves as the season goes on. Freeman's 2nd half performance against the Redskins was very encouraging. He was deadly throwing it deep. Hopefully that momentum continues after our bye week.


Pretty much exactly what I was saying here and how I feel
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   

Post new topic   Reply to topic    FootballsFuture.com Forum Index -> Tampa Bay Buccaneers All times are GMT - 4 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8  Next
Page 7 of 8

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum




Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group