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Are we being to hard on Freeman?
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Buccaneer4life


Joined: 27 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 8:51 am    Post subject: Are we being to hard on Freeman? Reply with quote

I was very upset with how Freeman played last week like we all Im sure were. He did absolutely NOTHING to help us win and he looked like he had no clue how to read a defense. But are we being to hard on him? Look at Alex Smith. I remember the 49ers and there fans were ready to give up on him before they turned it around last year. But he had alot of changes around him and he had to adjust to it. Now that he has a steady coaching staff and a great mentor in his HC John Harbaugh he is playing very well. I think the same thing could happen with Freeman. So lets not give up on him yet.
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bucsfan333


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Probably, but that's the nature of the position.

He looked promising his rookie year. He had probably the best season a Bucs' QB has ever had. He struggled last year with no OTAs and probably the worst coaching staff in the league. He's struggling this year with a new coaching staff, new system, and new weapons.

It's not all his fault, but he seems to be struggling in areas a fourth year QB shouldn't be having trouble with.
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DaRealdeal


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 11:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think that most of us realize that our offensive struggles aren't all on him, but he is the QB and he needs to be better. No harm in voicing that opinion.
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YoungBucs15


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thought this was a good article to read. I don't know if anyone on here bought the replay package from NFL that lets you see the 22 view.

http://www.bucsnation.com/2012/9/27/3414886/after-further-review-a-look-at-the-all-22-game-film-of-the-bucs-loss

Quote:
As we went through the All-22 gamefilm, a few things jumped out at us.

I'm not sure the players fully understand what's going on on offense. Either that or the Bucs have some terrible routes in their game plan. There were several times when receivers drifted into other receivers lanes, cluttering the area with traffic. There was one play in the first half were three receivers were literally within 3 yards of each other - it was as if they were converging for a tackle. I don't want to think that's the way the play was drawn up. Other plays the quarterback expected the receiver to one thing and they did another. It's obvious these players are still struggling to learn the offense.

You can complain about quarterback play and conservative offensive play calling all you want, but sometimes you have to credit the guys on the other side. On the majority of Freeman's pass attempts, the Bucs' wideouts were blanketed by the Dallas secondary. There were no open receivers. Freeman would hold, hold and hold waiting for someone (ANYONE) to get open and for the majority of the day, no one did. He'd either force a pass into tight coverage, throw it away or get sacked. That, more than anything, contributed to Freeman's low completion percentage.

Schiano said in a post game press conference that Freeman has the option to audible "on certain plays". On film, I didn't see Freeman audible once the entire game. There were times when the Cowboys brought nine guys into the box to stop the run - but Freeman either didn't or couldn't audible out of a running play. If the coaching staff is mandating a play is run no matter what the front - it's not a good situation, folks.

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bucsfan333


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 11:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I remember at least one play where Free took the snap and turned to his right to hand to Martin, but Martin ran to the left.

Our guys are still learning.

And if there really is a "don't audible" mentality from the coaching staff that's garbage. I understand scrypting the first dozen or so plays to try and set things up for later in the game, but to refuse to allow Free to check to a quick slant or something when it's obvious the other team is playing the run is ridiculous.

One thing most of us are overlooking is that this is a learning year. This team is so different from last year, top to bottom. Nobody had expectations of winning the division. We're gonna take our lumps. We're not gonna play amazing football. YET. Once we iron out a few wrinkles, we'll see that we have a competitive team. We'll steal a game or two. We'll win when we've got a double digit lead in the first half. We're just not there yet.
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YoungBucs15


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think it's so much that Freeman isn't allowed to change WR routes, I believe Mwill said that Freeman changed his to a 9 route in that 2 min drive. But I think the main concern would be that Freeman isn't allowed to shift from a run to a pass if they are showing 9 in the box.
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REDandPEWTER


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 12:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most know my opinion on freeman so ill hold off. I will say this yes our offense is installing a brand new scheme and there is going to be a few if not many bumps in the road. However if there's 9 in the box I honestly do not believe with the experience Sullivan has from gilbride and coughlin and schiano being a student from bellichik that he doesn't give freeman the option to call out of the play. I mean when Freeman's helmet communicator went out in the 3rd and 9 call he didn't call a timeout or audible to a pass and he best he comes up wit is a run? Come on. I agree that our play calling grts conservative but I think our coaches learn that will bite them.

My problem with freeman has nothing to do with play calling or schemes and ill leave it at that.
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tml_gogo


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That would be absolutely beyond stupid if he wasn't allowed to audible out of our obvious 1st down dive play if they have 9 in the box.
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YoungBucs15


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 12:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
Most know my opinion on freeman so ill hold off. I will say this yes our offense is installing a brand new scheme and there is going to be a few if not many bumps in the road. However if there's 9 in the box I honestly do not believe with the experience Sullivan has from gilbride and coughlin and schiano being a student from bellichik that he doesn't give freeman the option to call out of the play. I mean when Freeman's helmet communicator went out in the 3rd and 9 call he didn't call a timeout or audible to a pass and he best he comes up wit is a run? Come on. I agree that our play calling grts conservative but I think our coaches learn that will bite them.

My problem with freeman has nothing to do with play calling or schemes and ill leave it at that.


Thought this part was interesting in that article, in regards to that scenario.

Quote:
Josh Freeman claimed that the now infamous third-and-9 run call just before the two minute warning in the fourth quarter was due to malfunction in the headset. In watching the tape, you can see Freeman put his hands on the ear holes of his helmet in an attempt to hear better. However, when he came over to the sideline to talk with Sullivan, Freeman didn't seem to complain about the headset in the helmet and it didn't look like Sully or Schiano was upset about a mechanical malfunction.

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REDandPEWTER


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 1:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://potg2.blogspot.com/2012/09/quick-all-22-post_25.html?m=1

This actually hits on a lot of aspects. Lories inability as a lead blocker is interesting.

But Steve white points it out flat. Freeman isn't doing a good job in his reads before the snap and getting the ball out when it should. He's missing opportunities over and over again.
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SappDaddyDance


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
http://potg2.blogspot.com/2012/09/quick-all-22-post_25.html?m=1

This actually hits on a lot of aspects. Lories inability as a lead blocker is interesting.

But Steve white points it out flat. Freeman isn't doing a good job in his reads before the snap and getting the ball out when it should. He's missing opportunities over and over again.


I agree with you completely. Also it seems like the case of the entire offense trying to understand to play (for example the missed blocking assignments on the Benn Screen). But One of the more discouraging plays was on the Williams slant that led to the Demarcus Ware sack. Now in looking at the two screen shots it looks as though he had not finished his drop and by the time he was going to step into the pass Ware had already taken him down

The route Williams would run as you can see he (Freeman) had not finished the drop


When the route was avaliable to be thrown he is already being hit by Ware


I respect Steve White's view on the game more than anybody and he has pointed out areas of concern that we all have with Freeman. One thing that he needs to do which he did in the past is to shorten his strides in his 3 and 5 step drop. But trying to get too deep into those drops he is sacrificing open plays like the aforementioned Williams slant route. I hope these are areas that are addressed in the Bye week.
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REDandPEWTER


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That ball sappdaddy , should have been out. He's looking right at Williams what's he doing?

I also agree with whites view on lorig I like his work ethic but he's a de turned fb. Not a true lead blocker. Something I think we should have addressed.
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SappDaddyDance


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
That ball sappdaddy , should have been out. He's looking right at Williams what's he doing?

I also agree with whites view on lorig I like his work ethic but he's a de turned fb. Not a true lead blocker. Something I think we should have addressed.


Yeah I agree it should have which is why i point out that he goes "too deep" into the drop on that "attempt". If he would have just stepped into the pass it would have at least netted a 6 to 7 yard gain (5 yards plus the additional two yard coverage was giving Williams). In looking at the screen shots it looked like he was waiting it out to see if he could get more out of the play, but the corner had already closed out when he was ready to throw the ball (when he was sacked by Ware). Steve White makes a point in noting that in the last screen shot (I advise everyone to read this article) that Freeman tries to fit the ball into Stocker who looks double covered in the screen shot, with Williams wide open cutting across the middle. In looking at Freeman's feet he is already locked in on throwing to Stocker and has not shifted his eyes to his next progression (which would be Williams)


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indifference


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
http://potg2.blogspot.com/2012/09/quick-all-22-post_25.html?m=1

This actually hits on a lot of aspects. Lories inability as a lead blocker is interesting.

But Steve white points it out flat. Freeman isn't doing a good job in his reads before the snap and getting the ball out when it should. He's missing opportunities over and over again.
Thought Lorig had a good first game of the season but damn, he is a good reason to why we can't pop 4-5 yards a carry.
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REDandPEWTER


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SappDaddyDance wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
That ball sappdaddy , should have been out. He's looking right at Williams what's he doing?

I also agree with whites view on lorig I like his work ethic but he's a de turned fb. Not a true lead blocker. Something I think we should have addressed.


Yeah I agree it should have which is why i point out that he goes "too deep" into the drop on that "attempt". If he would have just stepped into the pass it would have at least netted a 6 to 7 yard gain (5 yards plus the additional two yard coverage was giving Williams). In looking at the screen shots it looked like he was waiting it out to see if he could get more out of the play, but the corner had already closed out when he was ready to throw the ball (when he was sacked by Ware). Steve White makes a point in noting that in the last screen shot (I advise everyone to read this article) that Freeman tries to fit the ball into Stocker who looks double covered in the screen shot, with Williams wide open cutting across the middle. In looking at Freeman's feet he is already locked in on throwing to Stocker and has not shifted his eyes to his next progression (which would be Williams)



Yeah. If he sees Williams and throws an accurate ball on that one he's pretty much gone b.c there is no one covering deep there. But again "IF".
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