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Klomp
Joined: 11 Aug 2011
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 Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 12:20 pm Post subject: |
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| vikingsrule wrote: | | If Welker was so highly valued, how come he wasnt ever rewarded with a substantial contract back in 08 or 09 when he was pulling in 120 catches. |
The "New England Way" of doing business
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vikingsrule
Joined: 15 Nov 2005
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 12:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Klomp wrote: | | vikingsrule wrote: | | If Welker was so highly valued, how come he wasnt ever rewarded with a substantial contract back in 08 or 09 when he was pulling in 120 catches. |
The "New England Way" of doing business |
Possibly, then again they rewarded there top 2 TEs with substantial contracts, contracts in which I dont even think Welker saw as a Patriot. |
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CriminalMind
Joined: 25 Aug 2011
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Location: Toronto, CA
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 12:24 pm Post subject: |
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| vikingsrule wrote: | | Klomp wrote: | | vikingsrule wrote: | | Just look at Wes Welker he is a good comparison. Harvin is more explosive than Welker, but Welker has struggled to get a top 5 WR like contract simply because he has really been nothing more than just an underneath/yac receiver. |
No, Welker's not getting that contract because he's 31. Percy is 24. |
If Welker was so highly valued, how come he wasnt ever rewarded with a substantial contract back in 08 or 09 when he was pulling in 120 catches. Its a similar situation to Harvin, Welker was never the type to score lots of TDs or have a high YPC. He was largely that 10 yds/catch type receiver, which Harvin has developed into this year. Its not bad for an offense to have a player like that, I just dont think teams see a lot of value in that type of player in terms of conract. I think Harvin has more potential than Welker and he is obviously younger, but I think there situations are somewhat comparable in terms of use within an offense. The Pats offense was always most prolific when they have a down field threat to pair with Welker (Moss/Gronk). |
I can see the comparison to Welker to a point.
But when we factor in:
a) younger then Welker
b) better then Welker
c) we're not the Pats, we're the Min Vikings.
I could see Percy getting a better previous contract then Welker.
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vike daddy
Joined: 12 Mar 2005
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 12:51 pm Post subject: |
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Harvin's had quite the 180-degree turnaround from June, when he skipped a mandatory minicamp workout, said he was unhappy and asked for a trade. That melodrama is a distant memory now.
Frazier: "The way he practices, he practices hard and he doesn't ask to get out of reps. He's great in the meetings. He's been a very good teammate. We need that. When you've got so many young guys who are learning how to play in our league, to have a star player like him stepping up and being attentive and taking notes and showing guys the way. And then going on the field and playing the way he's playing, it's big for our entire team."
Ponder: "I'd be happy if I was getting the ball as much as he is."
http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/171435121.html?refer=y
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vikingsrule
Joined: 15 Nov 2005
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 12:54 pm Post subject: |
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| CriminalMind wrote: | | vikingsrule wrote: | | Klomp wrote: | | vikingsrule wrote: | | Just look at Wes Welker he is a good comparison. Harvin is more explosive than Welker, but Welker has struggled to get a top 5 WR like contract simply because he has really been nothing more than just an underneath/yac receiver. |
No, Welker's not getting that contract because he's 31. Percy is 24. |
If Welker was so highly valued, how come he wasnt ever rewarded with a substantial contract back in 08 or 09 when he was pulling in 120 catches. Its a similar situation to Harvin, Welker was never the type to score lots of TDs or have a high YPC. He was largely that 10 yds/catch type receiver, which Harvin has developed into this year. Its not bad for an offense to have a player like that, I just dont think teams see a lot of value in that type of player in terms of conract. I think Harvin has more potential than Welker and he is obviously younger, but I think there situations are somewhat comparable in terms of use within an offense. The Pats offense was always most prolific when they have a down field threat to pair with Welker (Moss/Gronk). |
I can see the comparison to Welker to a point.
But when we factor in:
a) younger then Welker
b) better then Welker
c) we're not the Pats, we're the Min Vikings.
I could see Percy getting a better previous contract then Welker. |
Oh i agree, that is why I think that 5 yrs/$40M type deal is a pretty decent starting point. I dont think Harvin is quite deserving of what Vincent Jackson got on the open market in comparison. |
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Klomp
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 9:33 pm Post subject: |
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Welker contributes 0 in special teams.
Speaking of, Priefer said in his weekly presser that Harvin basically has the green light to go, except in special situations. One such situation is with 4:00 left and the lead, we'd rather give the ball to the offense at the 20. Also, if its a high hang time and 9 yards deep, probably will take a knee.
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HighHopes
Joined: 01 Jun 2008
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 10:03 pm Post subject: |
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| Klomp wrote: | Welker contributes 0 in special teams.
Speaking of, Priefer said in his weekly presser that Harvin basically has the green light to go, except in special situations. One such situation is with 4:00 left and the lead, we'd rather give the ball to the offense at the 20. Also, if its a high hang time and 9 yards deep, probably will take a knee. |
I'm pretty sure I've seen Welker out on Punt Returns.
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vikingsrule
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| Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 10:07 pm Post subject: |
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| HighHopes wrote: | | Klomp wrote: | Welker contributes 0 in special teams.
Speaking of, Priefer said in his weekly presser that Harvin basically has the green light to go, except in special situations. One such situation is with 4:00 left and the lead, we'd rather give the ball to the offense at the 20. Also, if its a high hang time and 9 yards deep, probably will take a knee. |
I'm pretty sure I've seen Welker out on Punt Returns. |
Yep, Welker was the primary PR in New England until 2009. Obviously at Welker's age, they probably wanted to limit his touches and get him off returns. Welker also returned kicks AND punts when he was in Miami. |
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Klomp
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| Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2012 2:52 am Post subject: |
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Oops
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Yfz01
Joined: 18 Jul 2008
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| Posted: Sat Sep 29, 2012 1:47 pm Post subject: |
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| vikingsrule wrote: | | Klomp wrote: | | vikingsrule wrote: | | If Welker was so highly valued, how come he wasnt ever rewarded with a substantial contract back in 08 or 09 when he was pulling in 120 catches. |
The "New England Way" of doing business |
Possibly, then again they rewarded there top 2 TEs with substantial contracts, contracts in which I dont even think Welker saw as a Patriot. |
Have you seen those two TE's? Just incredible mismatches. Welker still makes that offense, and it's noticeably more prolific with him in than when on the bench. If Hernandez didn't get injured, I was fully expecting them to go the Randy Moss/Richard Seymour route, and trade him.
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vike daddy
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vikingsrule
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| Posted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 12:07 pm Post subject: |
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here is clarification to Harvin's issue in June:
http://www.twincities.com/sports/ci_21674111/vikings-percy-harvin-june-beef-was-about-position?source=rss
| Quote: | Harvin clarified the situation somewhat Monday, Oct. 1, saying he was frustrated with not knowing which position he'd play each week. He said he wasn't the only player with those feelings at the time and praised offensive coordinator Bill Musgrave for clarifying his role.
"I think it was just the identity of our offense, just not only me, just guys knowing exactly what the coaches are asking of them on a week-to-week basis," said Harvin, who has lined up at receiver and running back, besides returning kickoffs. "(It was) not playing one position one week, and (coming) in and not totally having a grasp on what they're asking for the next week.
"I think Coach Musgrave has done a great job -- I said it all offseason -- of putting (tight end) Kyle Rudolph in great situations. We got a package for (wide receiver) Jerome Simpson, which you've seen, where we'll take shots downfield. So everybody, I think, knows their role, knows what the coaches expect them to do. Now you can just sit back and try to do it at the highest level you can." |
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JDBrocks
Joined: 11 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 12:23 pm Post subject: |
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This is the second week that I've heard the announcers say that there isn't an offensive player in the league that they would take ahead of Harvin. I think it was the same crew, but I don't know how you can say that about a guy without an offensive TD. Top 5 or Top 10? maybe.
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vikingsrule
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| Posted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 12:30 pm Post subject: |
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| JDBrocks wrote: | | This is the second week that I've heard the announcers say that there isn't an offensive player in the league that they would take ahead of Harvin. I think it was the same crew, but I don't know how you can say that about a guy without an offensive TD. Top 5 or Top 10? maybe. |
I agree, Harvin isnt getting in the endzone so i am not sure why there has been so much hype. We know Harvin as an elite underneath receiver, but until he can make dynamic plays downfield and put the ball in the endzone, he should never be mentioned with the top 5 WRs of the league. I was baffled by that comment by the commentator in last weeks game. No way i woudl take Harvin over Calvin Johnson or Larry Fitzgerald. If you recall, the commentator said he would take Harvin over all offensive players outside a QB. |
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CriminalMind
Joined: 25 Aug 2011
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Location: Toronto, CA
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| Posted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 1:11 pm Post subject: |
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Harvin is not necessarily a redzone threat. If your within the 20, it could be a lil difficult to get Harvin the ball. More defenders at the point of attack, and his speed is less of a factor, and the jump ball to him is not really there.
Outside of the redzone, I think he is the most dangerous offensive weapon overall.
If I was picking offensive players after a QB, he would be in the top 5
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