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Dean Pees = Greg Mattison?
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MilleniumD2000


Joined: 20 Jan 2009
Posts: 485
Location: Baltimore
PostPosted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

diamondbull424 wrote:
MilleniumD2000 wrote:
diamondbull424 wrote:
MilleniumD2000 wrote:
What I'm trying to figure out is why Clarence Brooks keeps getting passed over for the d-coordinator job. He is the longest tenured defensive coach and the d-line is always one of our strongest units. I have wanted him to take over the defense ever since Rex left. I'm hoping he gets a shot after Pees leaves or retires because you know Harbaugh isn't going to fire him (see Cam Cameron).

Well he wasn't a better candidate than Chuck Pagano- who I was a big fan of. And ATM, our DL is underachieving to its talent level IMO. It's likely a scheme thing from Peas, but I think some of that responsibility also has to fall onto Brooks. He could stand to do a better job.

Also I personally prefer DB coaches at the defensive coordinator position because they're the ones who most understand how what types of blitzes you call affect your coverages. Like the blitzes that Peas calls seems to work pretty darn well, but all of those blown coverages where we saw Brent Celek wide open... I have to believe that we don't see something like that under Pagano. And this being and becoming more and more of a passing league, I want a DC that specializes in shutting down the pass with awesome coverages that pair with the blitzes.

But as it stands, no coach is more qualified than Brooks. Though I'd suspect Teryl Austin to be in strong consideration for a coordinating position as well... I just want to see him clean up our secondary weaknesses before I'd agree that he's the right man for the job.

To be fair, Ngata is pretty much our only lineman that is good. Everyone else on our dline is above average or average. Losing your second best lineman from last year (Corey Redding) is hurting us more then we thought it would. Also, I'm 100% positive that Brooks has no say in rushing 3 lineman on obvious passing downs.

The main reason I believe Brooks would be a great candidate is because he has been around alot of great defensive minds. Take a little bit of Ryan's scheme and sprinkle a dash of Paganos scheme in there and bam! Organized chaos part 2 is back in business. I agree that Pagano was the best candidate. He should have been hired after Rex then Brooks should have been hired after Pagano took a hc job.

I'd still expect this unit to be more disciplined. Either way whether they're only playing to their talent level or not, they definitely aren't over-achieving and I think that's something we consistently saw with Pagano. His units were always overachievers. And thats something I want out of our defensive coordinator. A guy who can have his unit over-achieve. Either Brooks isn't properly motivating his guys or he doesn't possess the technical prowess. Being around great defensive minds doesn't always mean one inherits those great traits.

I'm not saying Brooks can't be a good DC, I just have no reason to believe that he's going to be anything more than solid if he can't get a Ngata, Cody, McPhee talent to thrive. And I can't give him much credit for McPhee last year because the lockout kept him from impacting McPhee's development and McPhee came out balling from the get-go. I just see no reason that this unit shouldn't be doing better than it is.

Fair enough, I still believe that Brooks would be better then pees and any other defensive coach we have on our staff. I'm telling you now, if I see a three man rush on third and long against the pats, I will personally get out of my seat walk down to the field and ring Deans neck. Another thing I don't want to see ever again is that soft zone with a three man rush. That has to be fundamentally the worst defense you can call. Webb better be on Welker the whole game also.
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diamondbull424


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2012 4:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

^^^ At this point I might be willing to concede that it's "possible" that Brooks could be better than Peas (I'll give him a little more of a sample size) and perhaps the rest of our staff... we do have some young defensive coaches (in coaching years anyway).

Terryl Austin isn't off to a strong start as the only DBs/secondary coach this season. On one hand our safety play is exceptional, but on the other, the overall play of our corners appears to me to be under-performing to its talent level. That said, Austin has a lot of potential and is still pretty young. I've also made it known that I tend to prefer secondary coaches when promoting for DC... just like I tend to prefer former QBs/QBs coaches as OCs. This is a passing league and I'd rather a person drawing up the schemes be the coach most tasked in training his guys to prevent the most explosive pass options.

I also like Ted Monachino, he's young, has done a nice job developing our young OLBs and improving upon what we had there before he arrived. I like to look for overachievers and Kruger is an example of that. He seemed to flame out some, but Monachino was somehow able to get Kruger back on the track to being a nice pass rusher. Kindle has improved leaps and bounds of last season. Upshaw is looking better. So I'd have to imagine that he's certainly had a sizable impact in helping his players to get better and reach their potential. That's the type of thing I look for in DC prospects. He's still young in coaching years (45) and I think given the fact that Peas will likely get at least another year... a couple years from now Chino looks like he might be our best option.

I also think that young Stanford grad/defensive quality control coach- Matt Weiss- is a name worth keeping an eye out for. He seems to be the ultimate in-house developmental coach and has been a part of some really successful teams and defenses from Stanford with Jim Harbaugh to the Ravens throughout John's tenure in Baltimore. He seems like he could be the type to be one of those "rising star coaches" in that Josh McDaniel type mold from a few years ago. He's only 29 years old, so that's still incredibly young for a coach.
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Integrity


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2012 10:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

God I hate what has become of this defense.
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SnA ExclusiVe


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 12:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Integrity wrote:
God I hate what has become of this defense.


Ditto. I can't stand it. I miss organized chaos so much right now it hurts.

However, the way our defense ended this game was absolutely freaking heroic, and I don't even care that Kruger can't tackle a stationary target.
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I'd say he's [Dennis Pitta] the fourth best TE in the division... Cameron > Miller > Gresham > Eiffert = Pitta
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MilleniumD2000


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 4:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
Integrity wrote:
God I hate what has become of this defense.


Ditto. I can't stand it. I miss organized chaos so much right now it hurts.

However, the way our defense ended this game was absolutely freaking heroic, and I don't even care that Kruger can't tackle a stationary target.

Speaking of that series, Mattison I mean Pees actually blitzed and it was the main reason we got the ball back. You would think that he would realize that blitzing instead of rushing three is 100 times more effective. Last night and the Eagles game it was the same thing. Brady and Vick folded when we would blitz, flourished when we rushed 3 and played zone.
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BaltimoreTerp


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 5:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MilleniumD2000 wrote:
Brady and Vick folded when we would blitz, flourished when we rushed 3 and played zone.
Don't know if I would put it that formulaically. For much of the game up to the final 2 series, the problem wasn't just that we weren't sending guys, it was also that the Pats weren't having much trouble negating our blitz packages. For example, Pees seems to love the corner blitz and especially loves sending Webb from the slot but the Pats were completely prepared for it and Brady was surgical with the quick hot routes. I think it was coordinator who put it best, that the bigger problem wasn't as much that Pees didn't want to blitz and more that even when he did blitz for the most part those blitz packages were seemingly easy for the Pats to deal with. We definitely saw a bit of variety... Cary and Webb both coming on corner blitzes, Ray Lewis coming off the edge, Ellerbe trying to burst through the middle, and Pollard (who is probably our most affective blitzer) also being sent from time to time... it wasn't always that we stuck with 3 man rushes, though we certainly saw a bit of that, it was also just that the blitzes we tried never did much.

The fact that we got pressure on Brady at the end of the game was a combination of certain plays where we finally seemed to dial up the right blitz packages but also simple instances of player execution being better: Ngata and Kruger, for example, finally burst through their blockers and got in Brady's face after being stonewalled all night in the pass rush.

While the pass rush is still a big concern, I'm hopeful that at least for the medium term a game like yesterday's could prove to be one of the worst-case-scenario type of games. New England, after all, has one of the best quarterbacks in the league and one of the best offenses in general, Tom Brady is as good as anyone in the league at getting the ball out quickly and playing the short game, and they had a better understanding of Pees dating from his days as New England's DC on top of all of that. There were times when it seemed basically impossible to stop them because we couldn't get any pressure with a 3 man rush and Brady had all day to look for an open man but any time we sent someone on a blitz Brady was instantly able to recognize it and get the ball in the exact area of the field where there was less traffic. That says to me that Pees needs to do a better job of disguising his blitzes and creating more indecision for the quarterback but I think it also has to be acknowledged that it's much harder to fool a HOF quarterback.

Our next 3 games (CLE, @KC, DAL) are against 3 teams who are more vulnerable at either the QB position or on the offensive line, and I think they'll tell us a little bit more about just where our defense stands. Because as bad as we looked at times last night, the sad reality is that, especially with Suggs out, it was always going to be a difficult matchup going against the Patriots regardless of who the DC was, and furthermore, to the credit of our defense, they still dug in, forced New England to settle for field goals when touchdowns would have put the game away and then got us the ball back when we needed it most. Against a team like the Pats, a bend-but-don't-break defense might be the most we can ask for.

The next couple of weeks will also tell us a little more about an area where I think we've seen a shift in the way we play the cornerbacks, though I also see some of the reasoning behind it and am hopeful that it was more tactically oriented towards the opponents we had. Pagano loved to press with our corners and it worked well last year in tandem with a more reliable pass rush. So far this season we've seen our outside corners giving up far bigger cushions, but I'm wondering if that wasn't necessitated by the gameplans and personnel we specifically faced in the first 3 weeks. Against Cincinnati it was clear as day our only priority was avoiding letting AJ Green beat us deep: We were willing to let our offense eventually force Cincinnati's hand. Philadelphia's receivers were too small and fast to risk consistently pressing with our tall outside corners. And it seems we always play New England this way, with the big cushion, trying basically to let Brady move the ball with the short stuff and then tighten up in the red zone. So against comparatively weaker offenses, I'm hoping we can get some of the aggressiveness back in our corner play.
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BareYourTeeth


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 9:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is no way Jimmy Smith is as bad as Cary is right now. Our coaches seriously need to reward players when they're outplaying the starters for example Dannell Ellerbe, who I expect to see him starting next week and they should to demote players when they're playing as bad as Cary is right now, especially when you have someone like a Jimmy Smith available.
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coordinator0


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 10:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BaltimoreTerp wrote:
While the pass rush is still a big concern, I'm hopeful that at least for the medium term a game like yesterday's could prove to be one of the worst-case-scenario type of games. New England, after all, has one of the best quarterbacks in the league and one of the best offenses in general, Tom Brady is as good as anyone in the league at getting the ball out quickly and playing the short game, and they had a better understanding of Pees dating from his days as New England's DC on top of all of that. There were times when it seemed basically impossible to stop them because we couldn't get any pressure with a 3 man rush and Brady had all day to look for an open man but any time we sent someone on a blitz Brady was instantly able to recognize it and get the ball in the exact area of the field where there was less traffic. That says to me that Pees needs to do a better job of disguising his blitzes and creating more indecision for the quarterback but I think it also has to be acknowledged that it's much harder to fool a HOF quarterback.


That's a good point too. Against lesser QBs we probably wouldn't see them them getting rid of the ball as quickly as Brady did so some of those blitzes where the DB(s) rushed the QB might have worked.

Regardless I haven't been impressed at all with the scheme Pees has used so far. We heard the players saying it was complex during training camp but that hasn't been the case so far from what I can tell. I'm not just talking about the blitz schemes either, the types of coverages and run-defense packages are lacking in my opinion as well. Could that be a result of not having Suggs and Johnson on the field/team? Sure, but I wouldn't bet that they would be a great unit with them on the team and Pees calling the defense either.
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wackywabbit


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 11:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I liked what I saw from Ellerbe yesterday. He was our best defender in that game.

I did not like how much we blitzed Webb. We did it on about half the plays in the game. He's good at it, and our pass rush wasn't working, but everyone is expecting it now, and you are taking our best cover man out of coverage.

There is still enough talent on all levels of our defense that we should still be fielding one of the better defenses in the league, so I hope the coaching staff gets it all together. Not that I think giving up 24 points to the Eagles and 30 to the Pats is cause for panic.
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Flaccomania


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 6:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BareYourTeeth wrote:
There is no way Jimmy Smith is as bad as Cary is right now. Our coaches seriously need to reward players when they're outplaying the starters for example Dannell Ellerbe, who I expect to see him starting next week and they should to demote players when they're playing as bad as Cary is right now, especially when you have someone like a Jimmy Smith available.


Jimmy played much of the night, though. Jimmy was on Branch, Webb on Welker and Cary on Lloyd -- Brady just picked on Cary.
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diamondbull424


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 10:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Flaccomania wrote:
BareYourTeeth wrote:
There is no way Jimmy Smith is as bad as Cary is right now. Our coaches seriously need to reward players when they're outplaying the starters for example Dannell Ellerbe, who I expect to see him starting next week and they should to demote players when they're playing as bad as Cary is right now, especially when you have someone like a Jimmy Smith available.


Jimmy played much of the night, though. Jimmy was on Branch, Webb on Welker and Cary on Lloyd -- Brady just picked on Cary.

Well in the first half he was also mostly on Edelman tbf... Not that you were taking anything away from Jimmy, it's just that Edelman is a tougher cover than Branch... yet Brady just still abused Cary. Like he literally didn't even look at any other receiver on half the passes. It was pathetic. There comes a point as a corner when you just have to know that the QB is targeting you and you have to get aggressive, watch his eyes, anticipate and either make an attempt to intercept the ball or destroy the receiver just as he catches it(like what Jimmy did to.. Branch?) You can't let the QB just keep bullying you like that and not try and make a play. It was truly pathetic. Any hope that Cary Williams has any kind of ball skills... or has the ability to develop some, should have been thoroughly crushed and abandoned after his performance Sunday. I mean, we've had much worse corners... (Corey Ivy anyone), but they were usually hilariously out of position... they just flat out couldn't hang. But Williams has everything you look for in a lockdown corner... except above the neck. It's just so frustrating that a guy can be so close to plays... yet never make them. Not talking

And with Smith, he did have one bad play. The defensive holding penalty as he was falling, I just wish he'd get over his balance issue. He tends to fall down too much in coverage... it reminds me of that year before Foxworth got injured. He was falling a lot in coverage at the beginning before he seemed to right that issue later on and improve his cover abilities.
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BaltimoreTerp


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 10:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The question isn't Jimmy Smith vs. Cary Williams. As it's already been said, both saw were pretty much on the field at the same time because New England operated with a base 3 wideout set. And in the 2nd half if my eyes weren't playing tricks on me I think Pees even did move Smith on to Lloyd on some plays, and Brady just went and looked for Cary anyways, now covering Branch.

The question would be Cary vs. Corey Graham. I don't know anything about Corey Graham as a corner so it's hard to say whether he would be an upgrade. But I hope the coaching staff is at least asking that question and trying to determine whether we might be better off with Webb/Smith/Graham out there.
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diamondbull424


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 10:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BaltimoreTerp wrote:
The question isn't Jimmy Smith vs. Cary Williams. As it's already been said, both saw were pretty much on the field at the same time because New England operated with a base 3 wideout set. And in the 2nd half if my eyes weren't playing tricks on me I think Pees even did move Smith on to Lloyd on some plays, and Brady just went and looked for Cary anyways, now covering Branch.

The question would be Cary vs. Corey Graham. I don't know anything about Corey Graham as a corner so it's hard to say whether he would be an upgrade. But I hope the coaching staff is at least asking that question and trying to determine whether we might be better off with Webb/Smith/Graham out there.

Yes, Smith did indeed get I'd say... 5 plays against Lloyd (I'd have to rewind the game to be exactly sure) and was targeted once... which is when he lost his balance when opening his hips to turn to run with Lloyd. He had a slight hold of Lloyd to regain his balance and was called for it... but hey, I'll take 5 yards over and no other targets over Cary being abused.

But yes, I agree that has to be the question the coaching staff has to be asking themselves. Honestly, I think we should give it another week. If Cary can't "look good" against the Browns and their "rookie" QB, then I think we have to move on. Corey Graham has similar size to Cary Williams and I think we should experiment with how he does. Because we know what we're getting from Cary at this point. We need to see if another player might be able to upgrade the unit, the season is still young, we're still figuring out who this team is and so I think if we can get another guy in there, he could end up having a Bernard Pollard 11' impact where he upgrades the guy ahead of him by enough to really elevate the play of the defense. And if we make a switch now, the unit still has time to jell over the rest of the season.
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SnA ExclusiVe


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As BaltimoreTerp just mentioned; WHERE IS COREY GRAHAM? All camp long we heard about how he was getting INT's and playing great and came here because he felt Chicago never gave him a fair shot at playing defense, and now we are doing the same damn thing when it's OBVIOUS we need a 3rd CB not named Webb or Smith.

Cary Williams is as good as benched for me after these last two games. I don't think he's broken up a single pass that's been thrown his way the past 2 games, actually. I don't know if it's the off-coverage that has him screwed up or if its just him being a garbage player, but whatever it is we NEED to shake things up and give either Graham or Asa some playing time because Cary is just giving up catch after catch after catch over there.
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I'd say he's [Dennis Pitta] the fourth best TE in the division... Cameron > Miller > Gresham > Eiffert = Pitta
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coordinator0


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would like to see if Graham can be a decent 3rd CB not only because Williams is struggling right now but also so the team doesn't have to make bringing back Williams a priority this coming off-season. Graham would be a cheap option for next season and I think they will need all the cap room they can find. It's hard to say whether or not he will be able to be a guy you can depend on but something needs to change. They can't keep letting Williams get abused and it wasn't just in the game against the Patriots either. The catches he's giving up are usually for a good chunk of yardage or a first down and that's killing the defense. With the limited number of guys in the DL rotation (you could probably count Upsahw and Kruger too since they're out there most of the time now it seems) it's extremely important to keep them fresh and the long drives that opposing offenses are going on hurts. It's not all Williams fault but he's surely a part of it.
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