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Best Rookie Kicker?
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Best Rookie Kicker
Justin Tucker
33%
 33%  [ 56 ]
Blair Walsh
35%
 35%  [ 60 ]
Greg Zuerlein
30%
 30%  [ 51 ]
Total Votes : 167

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jrry32


Joined: 04 Jan 2011
Posts: 47787
PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JonnyQuest wrote:
Right now it is Blair Walsh by a good margin IMO.

Talent/leg wise these guys obviously are similar, but kickers' careers are made/revived/die based solely on clutch kicks. Walsh, in his first game as a rookie, converted two extremely clutch kicks. He gets the cake.


What you're saying doesn't make sense. The fact that they're all 6/6 means that none has missed a kick yet.

So how can Walsh be better by a good margin because he's had an opportunity the others haven't?

And FYI, Zuerlein took and made a clutch kick against Detroit. He made a FG with under 2 minutes left in the game to put the Rams ahead.

But getting back to the point, you can't logically penalize Tucker and Zuerlein because they haven't had that opportunity yet.

diamondbull424 wrote:
jrry32 wrote:
vikingsrule wrote:
Walsh is 7/11 on TBs.

Tucker is 9/15 on TBs.

Zurlein is 7/13 on TBs.

Walsh has the best %.


Did you happen to account for when the team asked the kicker to intentionally not kick a touchback?

Yeah, this is a good point. Plus there are yardage points that are better than TBs. And then you have to account for returner stupidity. I remember the game we had against the Bengals where Brandon Tate was like.. 3 inches away from the back of the endzone and the ball had plenty of hangtime to get it there... and the idiot decided to return it... and he did something similar on multiple occasions that game. He returned both kicks and was flattened at the 11 (with a holding penalty that pushed it to the 6 IIRC) on one return and well within the 20 on the other.

And truth be told, if I'm coaching the special teams I tell my kicker to get the ball as much hang time as possible and to land it at the back of the endzone... but not kick it out of bounds. Because if you land it in bounds in such a situation, you a) get a touchback anyway or b) get a return that gets obliterated early.

In terms of the kick averages, I think that's also somewhat overrated to this point. It's only been two games. Tucker really hasn't had many kicks inside the 40 to really lower his average to this point. And I'm sure the other two guys will have more opportunities to really zoom it in the future.

All I know is that Justin Tucker is the best Ravens kicker we've had since Matt Stover... and the guy also would consistently finish with double figure special teams tackles when at UT and already has a key tackle on kickoffs from this season. And while I don't want my kicker putting himself in harms way... Tucker is an athlete, he could probably play backup safety... can any of these other kickers kick a 60 yarder and then play backup safety (at an extremely poor level, I might add)... hmm? Hmm...

stealthtuckerpimpagecompleted.org Wink


Exactly.

vikingsrule wrote:
jrry32 wrote:
vikingsrule wrote:
Walsh is 7/11 on TBs.

Tucker is 9/15 on TBs.

Zurlein is 7/13 on TBs.

Walsh has the best %.


Did you happen to account for when the team asked the kicker to intentionally not kick a touchback?


How can we possibly know this without actually being on the sideline talking with the ST coach.

Im posting raw data, you can interpret it and skew it however you want Smile

Walsh has given up 4 returns, the furthest a team has started is the 23 yard line. All other returns were within the 20 yard line.


Well, when the kicker kicks a squib or a pooch kick, you can normally tell.
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JonnyQuest


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 5:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

^Good point.

I'll still take Walsh since he has proven he can hit clutch kicks. Maybe my opinion will change once the others hit game winners.
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vikingsrule


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 8:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jrry32 wrote:
Well, when the kicker kicks a squib or a pooch kick, you can normally tell.


Right. However, what if a pooch or squib kick was simply the kicker completely whiffing on a kick. Even in that circumstance, its not always certain that a squib or pooch was intentional. Walsh hasnt had this situation yet and I cant comment on the other kickers if they have.

Of Walsh's eleven kickoffs, four kickoffs were returned. Three returners made it within the 20 yard line and one returner made it to the 23. If Zurlein or Tucker purposely had a squib or pooch kick, factor it in but Walsh hasnt.

Nevertheless, having a strong % of TBs, being perfect for FGs and kicking two clutch FGs to win or tie a game, Walsh has a very strong argument.
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WhackyPlague


Joined: 25 May 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 8:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GaTechRavens wrote:
diamondbull424 wrote:
Oh and guess what guy that said all last year (2011 season), "The Ravens waited too long to grab a kicker. Henery was a franchise kicker. And this year there, it's a really weak kicker class."

... Yeah. I think my credibility in grading kickers takes at least 10 pinata merciless beatdowns.

(though I did say Mychal Kendricks a beast well before the combine back when he was only a lowly 5th round prospect in most drafts/rated by nfldraftscout. Said he had 1st round talent, but wouldn't see pub because of his size.) mychalkendricksstealthpimping.com


I don't care how bad Henery apparently is. You were right, dammit Crying or Very sad


Henery isn't bad, but Tucker certainly looks better.
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jrry32


Joined: 04 Jan 2011
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 11:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vikingsrule wrote:
jrry32 wrote:
Well, when the kicker kicks a squib or a pooch kick, you can normally tell.


Right. However, what if a pooch or squib kick was simply the kicker completely whiffing on a kick. Even in that circumstance, its not always certain that a squib or pooch was intentional. Walsh hasnt had this situation yet and I cant comment on the other kickers if they have.

Of Walsh's eleven kickoffs, four kickoffs were returned. Three returners made it within the 20 yard line and one returner made it to the 23. If Zurlein or Tucker purposely had a squib or pooch kick, factor it in but Walsh hasnt.

Nevertheless, having a strong % of TBs, being perfect for FGs and kicking two clutch FGs to win or tie a game, Walsh has a very strong argument.


And Zuerlein has a strong argument because he's just plain better. Laughing
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diamondbull424


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

WhackyPlague wrote:
GaTechRavens wrote:
diamondbull424 wrote:
Oh and guess what guy that said all last year (2011 season), "The Ravens waited too long to grab a kicker. Henery was a franchise kicker. And this year there, it's a really weak kicker class."

... Yeah. I think my credibility in grading kickers takes at least 10 pinata merciless beatdowns.

(though I did say Mychal Kendricks a beast well before the combine back when he was only a lowly 5th round prospect in most drafts/rated by nfldraftscout. Said he had 1st round talent, but wouldn't see pub because of his size.) mychalkendricksstealthpimping.com


I don't care how bad Henery apparently is. You were right, dammit Crying or Very sad


Henery isn't bad, but Tucker certainly looks better.

At the moment. I'm still a Henery fan... and it makes two years in a row that the Eagles took one of "my guys": first Henery then Kendricks... I'm hesitant to even do any draft research this year because of those darn Eagles just waiting in the wings to steal my most wanted prospects every year... you guys suck! Evil or Very Mad

But yeah, still not sure who is better at this point. Tucker has only played in two regular season games. Sure he's 6/6, but that could easily become 87% by the end of the season... which is around where Henery was (88% IIRC). So at the end of the day, I like both kickers a lot... but Tucker does have the much cooler name, so I think it puts him over the top. Razz
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diamondbull424


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jrry32 wrote:
vikingsrule wrote:
jrry32 wrote:
Well, when the kicker kicks a squib or a pooch kick, you can normally tell.


Right. However, what if a pooch or squib kick was simply the kicker completely whiffing on a kick. Even in that circumstance, its not always certain that a squib or pooch was intentional. Walsh hasnt had this situation yet and I cant comment on the other kickers if they have.

Of Walsh's eleven kickoffs, four kickoffs were returned. Three returners made it within the 20 yard line and one returner made it to the 23. If Zurlein or Tucker purposely had a squib or pooch kick, factor it in but Walsh hasnt.

Nevertheless, having a strong % of TBs, being perfect for FGs and kicking two clutch FGs to win or tie a game, Walsh has a very strong argument.


And Zuerlein has a strong argument because he's just plain better. Laughing

And Tucker has a strong argument because he's gonna Tuck. Only two things in life are certain: Haters gonna hate and Tucker's gonna tuck. Wink
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Jonezy


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Young GZ
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jrry32


Joined: 04 Jan 2011
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

diamondbull424 wrote:
jrry32 wrote:
vikingsrule wrote:
jrry32 wrote:
Well, when the kicker kicks a squib or a pooch kick, you can normally tell.


Right. However, what if a pooch or squib kick was simply the kicker completely whiffing on a kick. Even in that circumstance, its not always certain that a squib or pooch was intentional. Walsh hasnt had this situation yet and I cant comment on the other kickers if they have.

Of Walsh's eleven kickoffs, four kickoffs were returned. Three returners made it within the 20 yard line and one returner made it to the 23. If Zurlein or Tucker purposely had a squib or pooch kick, factor it in but Walsh hasnt.

Nevertheless, having a strong % of TBs, being perfect for FGs and kicking two clutch FGs to win or tie a game, Walsh has a very strong argument.


And Zuerlein has a strong argument because he's just plain better. Laughing

And Tucker has a strong argument because he's gonna Tuck. Only two things in life are certain: Haters gonna hate and Tucker's gonna tuck. Wink


Lame. Should have a cooler nickname like Young GZ or Greg the Leg.
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Harper41 wrote:
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But would he do it in a Sharknado?
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24isthelaw


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sounds like these guys are the 2003 Big Ben/Philip Rivers/Eli Manning of the kicking game.
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24isthelaw


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JaguarCrazy2832 wrote:
Tucker's average length is what gives him the edge


Really now Shocked
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 2:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I love me some Das Boooooooooot!

Laughing Laughing
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Flaccomania


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jrry32 wrote:
diamondbull424 wrote:
jrry32 wrote:
vikingsrule wrote:
jrry32 wrote:
Well, when the kicker kicks a squib or a pooch kick, you can normally tell.


Right. However, what if a pooch or squib kick was simply the kicker completely whiffing on a kick. Even in that circumstance, its not always certain that a squib or pooch was intentional. Walsh hasnt had this situation yet and I cant comment on the other kickers if they have.

Of Walsh's eleven kickoffs, four kickoffs were returned. Three returners made it within the 20 yard line and one returner made it to the 23. If Zurlein or Tucker purposely had a squib or pooch kick, factor it in but Walsh hasnt.

Nevertheless, having a strong % of TBs, being perfect for FGs and kicking two clutch FGs to win or tie a game, Walsh has a very strong argument.


And Zuerlein has a strong argument because he's just plain better. Laughing

And Tucker has a strong argument because he's gonna Tuck. Only two things in life are certain: Haters gonna hate and Tucker's gonna tuck. Wink


Lame. Should have a cooler nickname like Young GZ or Greg the Leg.


Justin Tucker Must NOT Die

Tuck Yeah

Tuck-9

(I'm not very creative Sad But props to db24 on the first one, he called for Tucker months ago when he was first signed).
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vikingsrule


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 10:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

24isthelaw wrote:
Sounds like these guys are the 2003 Big Ben/Philip Rivers/Eli Manning of the kicking game.


I think that was 2004 your referring too.

This might turn out to be the greatest kicker draft of all time Laughing
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diamondbull424


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 3:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Flaccomania wrote:
jrry32 wrote:
diamondbull424 wrote:
jrry32 wrote:
vikingsrule wrote:
jrry32 wrote:
Well, when the kicker kicks a squib or a pooch kick, you can normally tell.


Right. However, what if a pooch or squib kick was simply the kicker completely whiffing on a kick. Even in that circumstance, its not always certain that a squib or pooch was intentional. Walsh hasnt had this situation yet and I cant comment on the other kickers if they have.

Of Walsh's eleven kickoffs, four kickoffs were returned. Three returners made it within the 20 yard line and one returner made it to the 23. If Zurlein or Tucker purposely had a squib or pooch kick, factor it in but Walsh hasnt.

Nevertheless, having a strong % of TBs, being perfect for FGs and kicking two clutch FGs to win or tie a game, Walsh has a very strong argument.


And Zuerlein has a strong argument because he's just plain better. Laughing

And Tucker has a strong argument because he's gonna Tuck. Only two things in life are certain: Haters gonna hate and Tucker's gonna tuck. Wink


2. Lame. Should have a cooler nickname like Young GZ or Greg the Leg.


Justin Tucker Must NOT Die

Tuck Yeah

Tuck-9

(I'm not very creative Sad 1. But props to db24 on the first one, he called for Tucker months ago when he was first signed).

1. Well to be fair he was IMO our only hope at that point... and he hasn't disappointed. Billy Cundiff was a fraud and we needed to move on. Tucker had the track record that looked like he could be a solution and I'm glad that in the end, we made the best choice.

2. In terms of nicknames... Young GZ and Greg the Leg = corny... Tucker is above corny nicknames. Tucker transcends mere names... Tucker will launch himself into the realm of verbs... you know, action words... as in Young GZ hit a game winner, Greg the Leg hit a game winner, but Ravens win by a game winning FG... congratulations, you've just been Tuck'd.

And if Tucker was to have a corny nickname, it'd be the most awesome corny nickname in placekicker history, he'd be nicknamed "King Tuck- The Destroyer". No team has ever lived to see his leg and survive... except the Eagles... because they can fly... and Sir Tucksalot is a fan of flying creatures everywhere, so he chooses not to harm them... the ladies love this about him. Hence the following:

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