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Could we give up 79+ sacks in 2012?
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stchamp98


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 21, 2012 4:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Line did a heckuva job today, couple of plays not withstanding. Sacks will be the focus but we ran for 4.8 a carry and we didn't need a bunch of Kolb scrambles to get to that number either. Line did it's job. QB and run defense let us down today.
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Boise&cards Fan


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 21, 2012 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

They did give up 7 sacks on the day. Not all of them could have been on Skelton?
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stchamp98


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 21, 2012 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Boise&cards Fan wrote:
They did give up 7 sacks on the day. Not all of them could have been on Skelton?


3 on the OL by my count. 2 on Skelton, 1 was a designed bootleg run for no gain that the scorers scored as a sack. Can't remember the 7th one.

The OL definitely did it's job today. For 90% of the day, Skelton had ample time to throw the football and our RBs didn't lack for holes to run through. They really did well today. At least for their talent pool, anyway.
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apollo14000


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 21, 2012 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stchamp98 wrote:
Boise&cards Fan wrote:
They did give up 7 sacks on the day. Not all of them could have been on Skelton?


3 on the OL by my count. 2 on Skelton, 1 was a designed bootleg run for no gain that the scorers scored as a sack. Can't remember the 7th one.

The OL definitely did it's job today. For 90% of the day, Skelton had ample time to throw the football and our RBs didn't lack for holes to run through. They really did well today. At least for their talent pool, anyway.


I agree but Massie and Batiste still looked like fools on a couple of plays though.

This game is on Skelton though. Both turnovers were his fault for lack of awareness. He had plenty of time on both plays.
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stchamp98


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 21, 2012 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

apollo14000 wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
Boise&cards Fan wrote:
They did give up 7 sacks on the day. Not all of them could have been on Skelton?


3 on the OL by my count. 2 on Skelton, 1 was a designed bootleg run for no gain that the scorers scored as a sack. Can't remember the 7th one.

The OL definitely did it's job today. For 90% of the day, Skelton had ample time to throw the football and our RBs didn't lack for holes to run through. They really did well today. At least for their talent pool, anyway.


I agree but Massie and Batiste still looked like fools on a couple of plays though.

This game is on Skelton though. Both turnovers were his fault for lack of awareness. He had plenty of time on both plays.


I don't remember Batiste doing anything too awful. Remember Massie got schooled on the one spin move.

Massie's been pretty bad the last 3 weeks. Steep decline from the first 3.
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AZCardinalsFan


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 21, 2012 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stchamp98 wrote:
apollo14000 wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
Boise&cards Fan wrote:
They did give up 7 sacks on the day. Not all of them could have been on Skelton?


3 on the OL by my count. 2 on Skelton, 1 was a designed bootleg run for no gain that the scorers scored as a sack. Can't remember the 7th one.

The OL definitely did it's job today. For 90% of the day, Skelton had ample time to throw the football and our RBs didn't lack for holes to run through. They really did well today. At least for their talent pool, anyway.


I agree but Massie and Batiste still looked like fools on a couple of plays though.

This game is on Skelton though. Both turnovers were his fault for lack of awareness. He had plenty of time on both plays.


I don't remember Batiste doing anything too awful. Remember Massie got schooled on the one spin move.

Massie's been pretty bad the last 3 weeks. Steep decline from the first 3.


I thought Batiste did decent against Jared Allen today.
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stchamp98


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 21, 2012 4:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AZCardinalsFan wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
apollo14000 wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
Boise&cards Fan wrote:
They did give up 7 sacks on the day. Not all of them could have been on Skelton?


3 on the OL by my count. 2 on Skelton, 1 was a designed bootleg run for no gain that the scorers scored as a sack. Can't remember the 7th one.

The OL definitely did it's job today. For 90% of the day, Skelton had ample time to throw the football and our RBs didn't lack for holes to run through. They really did well today. At least for their talent pool, anyway.


I agree but Massie and Batiste still looked like fools on a couple of plays though.

This game is on Skelton though. Both turnovers were his fault for lack of awareness. He had plenty of time on both plays.


I don't remember Batiste doing anything too awful. Remember Massie got schooled on the one spin move.

Massie's been pretty bad the last 3 weeks. Steep decline from the first 3.


I thought Batiste did decent against Jared Allen today.


The 1 Allen sack was actually a move he put on the TE too, even though Batiste was there and didn't get get in front of him well enough.

Can't remember who the TE was though, if it was King or Housler.
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apollo14000


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 21, 2012 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stchamp98 wrote:
apollo14000 wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
Boise&cards Fan wrote:
They did give up 7 sacks on the day. Not all of them could have been on Skelton?


3 on the OL by my count. 2 on Skelton, 1 was a designed bootleg run for no gain that the scorers scored as a sack. Can't remember the 7th one.

The OL definitely did it's job today. For 90% of the day, Skelton had ample time to throw the football and our RBs didn't lack for holes to run through. They really did well today. At least for their talent pool, anyway.


I agree but Massie and Batiste still looked like fools on a couple of plays though.

This game is on Skelton though. Both turnovers were his fault for lack of awareness. He had plenty of time on both plays.


I don't remember Batiste doing anything too awful. Remember Massie got schooled on the one spin move.

Massie's been pretty bad the last 3 weeks. Steep decline from the first 3.


Allen got him good quite a few times.
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stchamp98


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 21, 2012 5:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ya he had some moments but overall it was nothing that really affected our offensive capabilities.

At the end of the day, Batiste vs. Allen, we came out better than I would have thought pre-game.
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JohnnyV


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 10:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Four more sacks from last night takes our total for the season up to 39.

Actually thought we'd give up more than we did.

On pace for 78.
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stchamp98


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 10:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Figured thiw would get brought up. Fact is, the pass protection had nothing to do with yesterday's loss. Run blocking maybe but not the protection. 3 of those sacks came in obvious passing situations with the 49ers leading by 24. They had no bearing on the game.
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JohnnyV


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 10:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

stchamp98 wrote:
Figured thiw would get brought up. Fact is, the pass protection had nothing to do with yesterday's loss. Run blocking maybe but not the protection. 3 of those sacks came in obvious passing situations with the 49ers leading by 24. They had no bearing on the game.


Agreed. The run blocking was terrible. Pass protection was pretty good, then again they only rushed 4 most of the night (which we've also had problems with).

We used quick screens and some mis-direction in the first half to try to shake things up.
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stchamp98


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 10:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

49ers have rushed 4 for most of the year. We saw their base defense tonight. Tonight offensively was the offensive line getting murdered in the run game and John Skelton not being able to hit water if he were in a boat.

I counted 11 passes that he missed to a decently open receiver. 11. And that's not including 3-4 air mail balls that I honestly couldn't tell where they were going.
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JohnnyV


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 10:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bigger need right now is QB. Agreed.
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JohnnyV


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2012 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ESPN Insider article from the people at PFF...

The Arizona Cardinals haven't just had poor pass protection this season; they have had historically disastrous protection. And they've already had two quarterbacks taken out of games due to injuries.



Things aren't likely to get any better for the Cardinals as they host the San Francisco 49ers and one of the league's best defenses on Monday night.



Although the 49ers haven't been getting to the quarterback as frequently as they did in 2011, the Cardinals' coaches and John Skelton have to be worried about what San Francisco will do to a pass-protection unit that has been hemorrhaging pressure against every team it has faced.



Pro Football Focus has been grading every player on every play in the NFL season since 2008, and this Arizona offensive line is allowing pressure at a greater rate than any other team in that time span -- and by a good margin. On 300 passing plays this season, the Cardinals have already allowed an astounding 134 total QB disruptions (sacks, knockdowns and hurries), and Kevin Kolb and Skelton have felt heat on 43 percent of all passing plays.




In the previous four seasons, the Cardinals' offensive line has allowed the most pressure of any line in the league twice, but last year's New York Giants hold the high-water mark in terms of pressure allowed. That offensive line surrendered 221 total pressures, 12 more than any other team. This year's Cardinals are on pace to allow a staggering 306 total pressures (39 percent more than the worst mark over the past four seasons) and could pass the 2011 Giants by late November.



The offensive line alone is averaging a ridiculous 19 total pressures per game, ensuring that whoever plays at quarterback is going to be dealing with a steady stream of defenders in his face. Every starting member of the line has allowed at least one sack and a knockdown.



The only good news for Arizona is that the damage is limited to the offensive line. Jeff King is the only player among the tight ends and running backs to allow a sack in pass protection, despite the other positions combining for 156 additional snaps of pass blocking.



The problems



The consistent inability of Arizona to find viable offensive linemen is genuinely impressive. Russ Grimm is a well-respected offensive line coach and has been coaching the unit since 2007, but over that time span the Cardinals' mistakes in personnel have been massive.



Arizona selected Levi Brown with the fifth pick overall of the 2007 draft and he was supposed to go a long way toward reviving the line. But he has been consistently among the worst tackles in the league, allowing nine or more sacks in each of his past four seasons. Somehow, though, the Cardinals have managed to get much worse after losing Brown from the lineup due to injury.



They are now starting the pair of D'Anthony Batiste and Bobby Massie at tackle, each of whom have already allowed 10 or more sacks through the first seven games of the season, putting them on pace to allow more than double Brown's average. Batiste and Massie rank as the worst two tackles in PFF's grading on the season with grades of minus-36.2 and minus-25.2, respectively, more than 10 points worse than the next player on the list (Philadelphia's Demetress Bell at minus-14.4). The 12.0 sacks allowed by Massie is twice as bad as the next highest number allowed by any tackle not playing in Arizona, and as if the pressure itself wasn't bad enough, the pair also has combined for 10 penalties.



The tackles are not the only problem on the offensive line, though, as Adam Snyder currently ranks as our worst-rated guard in the NFL. Snyder has allowed 20 total pressures, which pales in significance next to the tally of the offensive tackles, but is two more than any other guard this season. Snyder represents a damning failure of the Cardinals' scouting department because he has ranked in the bottom five among guards in both of the recent years he got significant time as a starter (2008 and 2011). Center Lyle Sendlein has allowed a pair of sacks and 10 total pressures this season, which is third worst among centers.



The only bright spot in the entire unit is left guard Daryn Colledge. Unlike his teammates, Colledge has surrendered just a single sack, and only 10 total pressures through seven games. Though not exactly elite, that ranks in the top 20 in PFF's pass blocking efficiency metric with a score of 97.4, 34 spots ahead of his teammate Snyder on the right side.



The bottom line



The Cardinals are surrendering pressure at an alarming and historic rate, and they're going up against a team in the 49ers that can bring pressure from several different places. Outside linebacker Aldon Smith has responded to his new full-time role with 24 total pressures, good for fourth at his position in the NFL, and Justin Smith at defensive end has 11 of his own. Those two alone will likely be the source of destruction to the left side of the Arizona line, but Ahmad Brooks on the other side of the formation will likely give right tackle Massie more than he can handle. It seems very likely that Skelton will be in for another long day under center.

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