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Quinton Coples vs. Chandler Jones
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jetsfan4life51


Joined: 12 Jan 2006
Posts: 32692
Location: lawn guy land
PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 11:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rickyt31 wrote:
I doubt we will start trading back. We finally had a full draft in the last, cut 2 players before the season started, and threw 2 talented players on the practice squad. With Tanny & Rex, I just don't see the purpose of trading back multiple times in a draft.

As far as dealing with picks, I like what Tanny did in the last draft. Didn't trade to many away, and didn't only come out with 3 players. But who he selected is a different story.


We have a lot of guys hitting FA, and a few older guys who will most likely be cap casualties. Could see a lot of turnover and we would have room for the rookie.
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rickyt31


Joined: 29 Dec 2008
Posts: 7324
Location: HEATlanta , GA
PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jetsfan4life51 wrote:
rickyt31 wrote:
I doubt we will start trading back. We finally had a full draft in the last, cut 2 players before the season started, and threw 2 talented players on the practice squad. With Tanny & Rex, I just don't see the purpose of trading back multiple times in a draft.

As far as dealing with picks, I like what Tanny did in the last draft. Didn't trade to many away, and didn't only come out with 3 players. But who he selected is a different story.


We have a lot of guys hitting FA, and a few older guys who will most likely be cap casualties. Could see a lot of turnover and we would have room for the rookie.


I hope so. There are a lot of good options in the late 1st I wouldn't mind trading back for and the extra 2nd or 3rd pick would be huge.
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tonyto3690


Joined: 29 Jan 2010
Posts: 5506
PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 10:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rockice_8 wrote:
ekill08x wrote:
I have been begging for this team to attempt to trade down several times like the Pats always do and collect 2nd and 3rd round picks. If we have a good draft in April and a smart FA, this team could be on the right track going into 2014. 2013 is going to be a tough year, and I honestly think we should select one of Landry Jones, Tyler Bray/Wilson, or Mike Glennon on day two or three, draft a RB earlier and move forward with the run first attitude and ball control on offense. Say we go like 7-9 or 8-8 (which would be progress after a bit of a rebuild) and have another strong draft, 2014 could be the year we get back to being a 10-6+ team. Unfortunately we dont have the right people in the FO to make this happen, or an owner who has any idea of what to do.


I understand the logic but what about the Pats drafting history makes you want to draft like them. They have been terrible drafters since doing this trade back thing. Way more misses than hits. They're at their best when they just stand pat and draft.

I'm not against trading down if there is a guy we like/need back a few picks.


They have?

DROY/All Pro Mayo
runner up DROY McCourty
DROY Chandler
Top 10-15 ILB Spikes
HOF bound Gronkowski
fringe All Pro Hernandez
All Pro Vollmer
Decent role player Cunningham
Fringe elite RB Ridley
Good RB Vereen
Decent role player Love
Decent role player Pryor


How many quality picks have the Jets had the past 3 years? The Patriots have had misses, but that comes with consistently picking in the 28-31 range. If the Patriots picked consistently in the top 5-15 like the Jets they'd likely have even more/higher quality hits.

Trading back got us Gronkowski who is better than anyone on the Jets roster besides arguably Revis. Trading back also directly got us the resources to grab Chandler, Mayo and Hightower
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JetFanSince85


Joined: 27 Dec 2011
Posts: 603
PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Answer me this,

If the Patriots have been so successful as a drafting team why do they have nothing but re-treads playing in the seconday?

Not to mention Devin McCorty could not cover a bed with a blanket. He was the worst CB last year with a passer rating against of like 106.

Now I think Grownkowski is a great player but the to put him in the HOF after one big season is a joke. Revis has been the best CB in football for almost 4 years and argubaly the best defensive player in Football.

To futhter the point, THE NO TE is in the discussion as the best TE in football with Vernon Davis, Jason Witten in the Conversation.

With Revis it's him and him alone. come on 2009-11 Revis Dominated.

Mayo is overrated in my opinion.
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rdelaney89


Joined: 22 Jan 2009
Posts: 1632
PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The patriots have build probably their most dangerous team since the 07-08 year. That being said having one of the best QBs of all time doesn't hurt your chances year in and year out haha but again they drafted Brady too so props.
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Rockice_8


Joined: 05 Oct 2010
Posts: 2364
Location: Unknown
PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tonyto3690 wrote:
Rockice_8 wrote:
ekill08x wrote:
I have been begging for this team to attempt to trade down several times like the Pats always do and collect 2nd and 3rd round picks. If we have a good draft in April and a smart FA, this team could be on the right track going into 2014. 2013 is going to be a tough year, and I honestly think we should select one of Landry Jones, Tyler Bray/Wilson, or Mike Glennon on day two or three, draft a RB earlier and move forward with the run first attitude and ball control on offense. Say we go like 7-9 or 8-8 (which would be progress after a bit of a rebuild) and have another strong draft, 2014 could be the year we get back to being a 10-6+ team. Unfortunately we dont have the right people in the FO to make this happen, or an owner who has any idea of what to do.


I understand the logic but what about the Pats drafting history makes you want to draft like them. They have been terrible drafters since doing this trade back thing. Way more misses than hits. They're at their best when they just stand pat and draft.

I'm not against trading down if there is a guy we like/need back a few picks.


They have?

DROY/All Pro Mayo
runner up DROY McCourty
DROY Chandler
Top 10-15 ILB Spikes
HOF bound Gronkowski
fringe All Pro Hernandez
All Pro Vollmer
Decent role player Cunningham
Fringe elite RB Ridley
Good RB Vereen
Decent role player Love
Decent role player Pryor


How many quality picks have the Jets had the past 3 years? The Patriots have had misses, but that comes with consistently picking in the 28-31 range. If the Patriots picked consistently in the top 5-15 like the Jets they'd likely have even more/higher quality hits.

Trading back got us Gronkowski who is better than anyone on the Jets roster besides arguably Revis. Trading back also directly got us the resources to grab Chandler, Mayo and Hightower


Really we've been drafting in the 5-15 range every year, that's news to me. We actually haven't had a pick in the range since 2009.

Your list of players and their accomplishments are way off base.
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ekill08x


Joined: 05 Oct 2005
Posts: 8666
Location: Patchogue, New York
PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 3:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tonyto3690 wrote:
Rockice_8 wrote:
ekill08x wrote:
I have been begging for this team to attempt to trade down several times like the Pats always do and collect 2nd and 3rd round picks. If we have a good draft in April and a smart FA, this team could be on the right track going into 2014. 2013 is going to be a tough year, and I honestly think we should select one of Landry Jones, Tyler Bray/Wilson, or Mike Glennon on day two or three, draft a RB earlier and move forward with the run first attitude and ball control on offense. Say we go like 7-9 or 8-8 (which would be progress after a bit of a rebuild) and have another strong draft, 2014 could be the year we get back to being a 10-6+ team. Unfortunately we dont have the right people in the FO to make this happen, or an owner who has any idea of what to do.


I understand the logic but what about the Pats drafting history makes you want to draft like them. They have been terrible drafters since doing this trade back thing. Way more misses than hits. They're at their best when they just stand pat and draft.

I'm not against trading down if there is a guy we like/need back a few picks.


They have?

DROY/All Pro Mayo
runner up DROY McCourty
DROY Chandler
Top 10-15 ILB Spikes
HOF bound Gronkowski
fringe All Pro Hernandez
All Pro Vollmer
Decent role player Cunningham
Fringe elite RB Ridley
Good RB Vereen
Decent role player Love
Decent role player Pryor


How many quality picks have the Jets had the past 3 years? The Patriots have had misses, but that comes with consistently picking in the 28-31 range. If the Patriots picked consistently in the top 5-15 like the Jets they'd likely have even more/higher quality hits.

Trading back got us Gronkowski who is better than anyone on the Jets roster besides arguably Revis. Trading back also directly got us the resources to grab Chandler, Mayo and Hightower


I would just like to tell you that your the stupidest poster on FF. Your the biggest homer as well. Stay in your forum. I welcome any Pats fan BUT you for the fact that you spew complete nonsense.

CHandler, Mayo, Hightower, McCourty, Spikes, Wilfork. All studs huh? Then how come your defense still BLOWS? Explain that Brohan.
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Rich51


Joined: 16 Jan 2012
Posts: 1085
Location: WPB Fl via Jc NJ
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2012 8:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like a number of this years drafted and undrafted rookies. What I don't understand is why they are not getting more playing time.

Surely we are not going to bring Scott back next year, so why is he taking time away from Davis and Dowtin.

We have no wr so why isn't Jordan White playing. You would think after over 100 receptions, he could be counted on to hold onto the ball.

Coples has played well but loses time to Devito, a decent player but Coples could be special.

And why is Smith still on the team taking time away from Allen and Bush.

I would have also liked to see more of Harrison at Nt and Fletcher at CB

We're at best an average team this year and imo should be developing the players that have futures. I think the problem is that Rex and the FO still think we can make the POs.
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Jamison.


Joined: 08 Mar 2011
Posts: 7413
Location: no
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2012 10:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ekill08x wrote:
tonyto3690 wrote:
Rockice_8 wrote:
ekill08x wrote:
I have been begging for this team to attempt to trade down several times like the Pats always do and collect 2nd and 3rd round picks. If we have a good draft in April and a smart FA, this team could be on the right track going into 2014. 2013 is going to be a tough year, and I honestly think we should select one of Landry Jones, Tyler Bray/Wilson, or Mike Glennon on day two or three, draft a RB earlier and move forward with the run first attitude and ball control on offense. Say we go like 7-9 or 8-8 (which would be progress after a bit of a rebuild) and have another strong draft, 2014 could be the year we get back to being a 10-6+ team. Unfortunately we dont have the right people in the FO to make this happen, or an owner who has any idea of what to do.


I understand the logic but what about the Pats drafting history makes you want to draft like them. They have been terrible drafters since doing this trade back thing. Way more misses than hits. They're at their best when they just stand pat and draft.

I'm not against trading down if there is a guy we like/need back a few picks.


They have?

DROY/All Pro Mayo
runner up DROY McCourty
DROY Chandler
Top 10-15 ILB Spikes
HOF bound Gronkowski
fringe All Pro Hernandez
All Pro Vollmer
Decent role player Cunningham
Fringe elite RB Ridley
Good RB Vereen
Decent role player Love
Decent role player Pryor


How many quality picks have the Jets had the past 3 years? The Patriots have had misses, but that comes with consistently picking in the 28-31 range. If the Patriots picked consistently in the top 5-15 like the Jets they'd likely have even more/higher quality hits.

Trading back got us Gronkowski who is better than anyone on the Jets roster besides arguably Revis. Trading back also directly got us the resources to grab Chandler, Mayo and Hightower


I would just like to tell you that your the stupidest poster on FF. Your the biggest homer as well. Stay in your forum. I welcome any Pats fan BUT you for the fact that you spew complete nonsense.

CHandler, Mayo, Hightower, McCourty, Spikes, Wilfork. All studs huh? Then how come your defense still BLOWS? Explain that Brohan.
The only stud I would consider is Vince Wilfork. He's truly the only guy who has been elite on that defense.

Chandler is a rookie that I think will develop into a really good player, but let's wait before we crown him.

Mayo is solid, not a great player. He has poor hand work and has trouble shedding blocks. Not the best tackler.

Hightower is a rookie as well. He has 35 tackles this year. Not the greatest impact. Hasn't started every game. He's been in and out of the starting lineup. Over pursues a lot. He's horrible in man coverage(HB coming out of the backfield)

McCourty was god awful last year at CB. He is now playing safety and he's an above average safety. However, he's not the Darrelle Revis Patriot fans thought they had after his rookie year.

Brandon Spikes is a just a thumper. Like Hightower, he struggles covering the HB coming out of the backfield. Very slow, and can kill a team with a dumb penalty here and there.
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xenajets


Joined: 31 Mar 2012
Posts: 1203
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2012 11:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tonyto3690 wrote:
Rockice_8 wrote:
ekill08x wrote:
I have been begging for this team to attempt to trade down several times like the Pats always do and collect 2nd and 3rd round picks. If we have a good draft in April and a smart FA, this team could be on the right track going into 2014. 2013 is going to be a tough year, and I honestly think we should select one of Landry Jones, Tyler Bray/Wilson, or Mike Glennon on day two or three, draft a RB earlier and move forward with the run first attitude and ball control on offense. Say we go like 7-9 or 8-8 (which would be progress after a bit of a rebuild) and have another strong draft, 2014 could be the year we get back to being a 10-6+ team. Unfortunately we dont have the right people in the FO to make this happen, or an owner who has any idea of what to do.


I understand the logic but what about the Pats drafting history makes you want to draft like them. They have been terrible drafters since doing this trade back thing. Way more misses than hits. They're at their best when they just stand pat and draft.

I'm not against trading down if there is a guy we like/need back a few picks.


They have?

DROY/All Pro Mayo-Solid player but nothing more imo!
runner up DROY McCourty-Thought he was good as a rookie but regressed ever since
DROY Chandler-I like Jones to be fair has so much potential
Top 10-15 ILB Spikes-He's clearly not!!!
HOF bound Gronkowski-Way to early to say HOF
fringe All Pro Hernandez-How is he an all-pro player?! He's 7-10 tight end
All Pro Vollmer-Dont think he is all pro
Decent role player Cunningham-Not great for a 2nd rounder
Fringe elite RB Ridley- Hes not elite..yet
Good RB Vereen- So,so
Decent role player Love-Not bad role player
Decent role player Pryor- " " "


How many quality picks have the Jets had the past 3 years? The Patriots have had misses, but that comes with consistently picking in the 28-31 range. If the Patriots picked consistently in the top 5-15 like the Jets they'd likely have even more/higher quality hits.

Trading back got us Gronkowski who is better than anyone on the Jets roster besides arguably Revis. Trading back also directly got us the resources to grab Chandler, Mayo and Hightower

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Jet Life


Joined: 10 Oct 2012
Posts: 110
PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 11:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

Coples:

Games Played: 15
Tackles: 28
Sacks: 5.5
Forced Fumbles: 0
Passes Defended: 2
Stuffs: 5
Snaps: 556 total snaps, 483 defensive snaps, 73 special teams snaps


Jones:

Games Played: 13
Tackles: 38
Sacks: 6
Forced Fumbles: 3
Passes Defended: 3
Stuffs: 3
Snaps: 737 total snaps, 683 defensive snaps, 54 special teams snaps

http://www.ganggreennation.com/2012/12/28/3812848/battle-of-the-first-rounders-quinton-coples-vs-chandler-jones
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rdelaney89


Joined: 22 Jan 2009
Posts: 1632
PostPosted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 12:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jet Life wrote:
Quote:

Coples:

Games Played: 15
Tackles: 28
Sacks: 5.5
Forced Fumbles: 0
Passes Defended: 2
Stuffs: 5
Snaps: 556 total snaps, 483 defensive snaps, 73 special teams snaps


Jones:

Games Played: 13
Tackles: 38
Sacks: 6
Forced Fumbles: 3
Passes Defended: 3
Stuffs: 3
Snaps: 737 total snaps, 683 defensive snaps, 54 special teams snaps

http://www.ganggreennation.com/2012/12/28/3812848/battle-of-the-first-rounders-quinton-coples-vs-chandler-jones


To clarify a forced fumble is only when the defense recovers correct? not just knocking the ball out. It seems like these two worked out nicely for both teams. Jones got about 180 more plays under his belt but I can't say from these stats that I'm upset with our selection.
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teamorange


Joined: 15 Nov 2010
Posts: 13413
PostPosted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rdelaney89 wrote:
Jet Life wrote:
Quote:

Coples:

Games Played: 15
Tackles: 28
Sacks: 5.5
Forced Fumbles: 0
Passes Defended: 2
Stuffs: 5
Snaps: 556 total snaps, 483 defensive snaps, 73 special teams snaps


Jones:

Games Played: 13
Tackles: 38
Sacks: 6
Forced Fumbles: 3
Passes Defended: 3
Stuffs: 3
Snaps: 737 total snaps, 683 defensive snaps, 54 special teams snaps

http://www.ganggreennation.com/2012/12/28/3812848/battle-of-the-first-rounders-quinton-coples-vs-chandler-jones


To clarify a forced fumble is only when the defense recovers correct? not just knocking the ball out. It seems like these two worked out nicely for both teams. Jones got about 180 more plays under his belt but I can't say from these stats that I'm upset with our selection.


I don't think so. You still get a FF when you just strip the ball loose even if the ball is recovered by the offense or rolls out of bounds.
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quietjetsket wrote:
skrILL wrote:

Care to offer some sort of insight instead of just being obnoxious? Rolling Eyes
I don't.

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moham-17


Joined: 26 Mar 2009
Posts: 3950
Location: The Boro
PostPosted: Sun May 12, 2013 4:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This from Mike Reiss, the Pats blogger on ESPN, pertaining to a comparison between Coples and Jones.

Reiss writes:
" When Jets coach Rex Ryan publicly called out 2012 first-round draft choice Quinton Coples for slacking off in the weight room (Ryan claimed it was for just one day, which some found hard to believe), the first thing I thought of was the link between Coples and Patriots 2012 first-round draft choice Chandler Jones. The Jets selected Coples (16) over Jones (21) last year, and both essentially play the same position (defensive end/outside linebacker type). Jones thought he was going to the Jets, which is something he repeated earlier this month in an interview with Patriots reporters. Through one year, the partial tale of the tape: Coples with 16 games played and 5.5 sacks; Jones with 14 games played and 6 sacks. "

Now, claiming that they play essentially the same position is, from what I know about Jones' position and role vs. Coples' position and his role, a grossly weak comparison.

I'm not sure but didn't Jones pretty much line up on the outside the whole season? Correct me if I'm wrong.

Whereas Coples played all over the line, not to mention standing up every now and then.

And additionally, I wonder what the tally was on snaps played, I know I've seen the numbers around here before, can anybody bring them up again?

They both look like they're going to be very good, but I just got the feeling Reiss was trying to take a small swipe at the Jets decision to take Coples over Jones. I think it's way too early to say personally, but then again it's never too early to rip on the Jets. Given we make it easy, but it follows that people should find bigger and better fish to fry, I would be embarrassed to constantly make jokes about any institution or person that has been as clueless as the Jets franchise has been these last few years. It shows a lack of ability to write about or discover issues that actually have substance.

EDIT: Never mind my question about snaps played etc. It's further up the page for all to see.
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rampantjet


Joined: 25 Apr 2012
Posts: 2159
PostPosted: Sun May 12, 2013 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jones had a few hundred more snaps. I'll take Coples all day. I hated Jones coming out of the draft and saw him as not only overrated but an injury prone guy.
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