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Marco79


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 07, 2012 10:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Mohamed Sanu, T.Y. Hilton, Chris Givens, Joe Adams, Jarius Wright, Nick Toon, Greg Childs, Danny Coale, Marvin Jones, Juron Criner, Marvin McNutt, Tommy Streeter

It's so frustrating especially considering all of those players are pro bowlers and Posey is a bust.
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jch1911


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 12:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Marco79 wrote:
Quote:
Mohamed Sanu, T.Y. Hilton, Chris Givens, Joe Adams, Jarius Wright, Nick Toon, Greg Childs, Danny Coale, Marvin Jones, Juron Criner, Marvin McNutt, Tommy Streeter

It's so frustrating especially considering all of those players are pro bowlers and Posey is a bust.


Marco.... why don't you read the whole thing.... the thing about Posey is the red flags galore .... but good luck with the sarcasm thing Rolling Eyes
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Wolf6151


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 1:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jch1911 wrote:
Apollo Stallion wrote:
If I were to interpret these comments using the same multiplier on where the truth really lies as last year, it just continues to support everything I'm hearing that they are considerably underwhelmed with Posey thus far (Kubiak was flat po'ed at him again yesterday) .... I'm not going to shocked if Posey gets hawaiian shirted to the Texans IR resort this year before this is said and done.


Mohamed Sanu, T.Y. Hilton, Chris Givens, Joe Adams, Jarius Wright, Nick Toon, Greg Childs, Danny Coale, Marvin Jones, Juron Criner, Marvin McNutt, Tommy Streeter

Just SOME of the receivers that were still on the table when we took Koobs' pet project (Posey). I will be especially pi$$ed if Sanu, Givens, Wright, Toon, Childs (despite the injuries, still my favorite), Criner, or Streeter has a really good first (and second... and third... etc) year because they all made more sense than Posey did.

Just my way of saying Posey needs to show me something or I will chalk this up to a long list of top 3-round skill position draft failures.



I completely agree. I think Kubiaks interpretation of our WR needs prior to the 2012 draft was vastly different than everyone elses. I think he underthought the situation and went into the draft looking only to replace Jacoby at #3 WR and was only looking for a slot WR instead of looking for a new #2, with possibilities of being a future #1, and improving the WR corp as a whole. So we wound up with a 6th round talent in the 3rd round and passed on alot of WR talent in one of the deepest WR drafts in recent memory. I think we'll look back on this as an opportunity that we completely missed on, like the deep CB class a few years ago. I just hope that Kubiak doesn't hang onto Posey for 4-5 yrs., like Jacoby, trying to turn him into a capable WR. I'm tired of the 3rd round projects like Jacoby and Molden that we pick and hang onto far too long.


I think anyone who's not afraid of our WR situation is fooling themselves.
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Marco79


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jch1911 wrote:
Marco79 wrote:
Quote:
Mohamed Sanu, T.Y. Hilton, Chris Givens, Joe Adams, Jarius Wright, Nick Toon, Greg Childs, Danny Coale, Marvin Jones, Juron Criner, Marvin McNutt, Tommy Streeter

It's so frustrating especially considering all of those players are pro bowlers and Posey is a bust.


Marco.... why don't you read the whole thing.... the thing about Posey is the red flags galore .... but good luck with the sarcasm thing Rolling Eyes

A rookie struggling in OTAs is not red flags galore.

I am not saying Posey is gonna be the greatest WR, I'm not saying he is gonna bust, I am not saying anything right now because its 3 weeks into OTAs and none of us have any idea how his career is going to go and none of us know how those other players are going to do either. I just find it hilarious you're already considering him a bust basically and would rather have those players when NO ONE has even played a preseason game yet, yet alone a regular season game.
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EliteTexan80


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Marco79 wrote:
jch1911 wrote:
Marco79 wrote:
Quote:
Mohamed Sanu, T.Y. Hilton, Chris Givens, Joe Adams, Jarius Wright, Nick Toon, Greg Childs, Danny Coale, Marvin Jones, Juron Criner, Marvin McNutt, Tommy Streeter

It's so frustrating especially considering all of those players are pro bowlers and Posey is a bust.


Marco.... why don't you read the whole thing.... the thing about Posey is the red flags galore .... but good luck with the sarcasm thing Rolling Eyes

A rookie struggling in OTAs is not red flags galore.


...no, the "getting suspended for 10 games for taking free goods and selling merchandise while at OSU" are the red flags we are referencing to.

I don't care what the REASON was, he's hardly the first NCAA athlete who came from a poor background and had a mother who was on the edge of eviction. He took money and goods that he wasn't supposed to take, he got pinched for it and had to sit out. That is a red flag.
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Marco79


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

EliteTexan80 wrote:
Marco79 wrote:
jch1911 wrote:
Marco79 wrote:
Quote:
Mohamed Sanu, T.Y. Hilton, Chris Givens, Joe Adams, Jarius Wright, Nick Toon, Greg Childs, Danny Coale, Marvin Jones, Juron Criner, Marvin McNutt, Tommy Streeter

It's so frustrating especially considering all of those players are pro bowlers and Posey is a bust.


Marco.... why don't you read the whole thing.... the thing about Posey is the red flags galore .... but good luck with the sarcasm thing Rolling Eyes

A rookie struggling in OTAs is not red flags galore.


...no, the "getting suspended for 10 games for taking free goods and selling merchandise while at OSU" are the red flags we are referencing to.

I don't care what the REASON was, he's hardly the first NCAA athlete who came from a poor background and had a mother who was on the edge of eviction. He took money and goods that he wasn't supposed to take, he got pinched for it and had to sit out. That is a red flag.


So because of that, that means he is gonna be worse than every single player just listed?
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EliteTexan80


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Marco79 wrote:
EliteTexan80 wrote:
Marco79 wrote:
jch1911 wrote:
Marco79 wrote:
Quote:
Mohamed Sanu, T.Y. Hilton, Chris Givens, Joe Adams, Jarius Wright, Nick Toon, Greg Childs, Danny Coale, Marvin Jones, Juron Criner, Marvin McNutt, Tommy Streeter

It's so frustrating especially considering all of those players are pro bowlers and Posey is a bust.


Marco.... why don't you read the whole thing.... the thing about Posey is the red flags galore .... but good luck with the sarcasm thing Rolling Eyes

A rookie struggling in OTAs is not red flags galore.


...no, the "getting suspended for 10 games for taking free goods and selling merchandise while at OSU" are the red flags we are referencing to.

I don't care what the REASON was, he's hardly the first NCAA athlete who came from a poor background and had a mother who was on the edge of eviction. He took money and goods that he wasn't supposed to take, he got pinched for it and had to sit out. That is a red flag.


So because of that, that means he is gonna be worse than every single player just listed?


Means that he's behind the 8 ball in comparison to those players. Tell me any player who had to sit out for close to a year in college, and then come back and perform at a high level in the NFL, where there is already a huge gap in the speed and football IQ of your opponents?

The ONLY name that comes to mind is Sam Bradford his rookie season, and even THAT was a very sub-par year when in comparison to usual NFL QBs. He was a decent rookie QB, not exactly a Cam Newton (or even an Andy Dalton for that matter) but not even a slightly below NFL starter that year...and you see firsthand his dropoff from Y1 to Y2, so one can make a solid assumption that the year off (for MEDICAL reasons, not for being a dummy) took a toll on the guy.

Remind me how Mike Williams did in the NFL after having to sit out his Jr. year? How about Maurice Clarett after his exile from football?
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EliteTexan80


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

EliteTexan80 wrote:
...from looking at the Pats, it seems as if the pickings will come down to 85, Jermey Ebert, Matthew Slater, Donte Stallworth or Britt Davis. Not exactly a great choice of names out there...


...and Ocho is the odd man out.

At first I said that I would vomit at the thought of Ocho Cinco...but the more I think about it, the less inclined to riot I become. IF it could be a cap friendly deal that we can part ways with quickly and with no major cap issues...and IF he could refrain from being a distraction (which I think he CAN do; It's not as if he's a "give me the damn ball you idiot QB!" distraction that can break up a locker room, he's just a goofy guy who races horses and plays soccer in his spare time) then I wouldn't freak out TOO much.

Ocho would immediately be an upgrade over Jacoby Jones, and would probably give Kevin Walter some challenges for snaps. KW does all the little things...but last I checked, Ocho does them as well.

I'm not 100% on board with this move, but I wouldn't freak out either.
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Apollo Stallion


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 11:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

EliteTexan80 wrote:
EliteTexan80 wrote:
...from looking at the Pats, it seems as if the pickings will come down to 85, Jermey Ebert, Matthew Slater, Donte Stallworth or Britt Davis. Not exactly a great choice of names out there...


...and Ocho is the odd man out.

At first I said that I would vomit at the thought of Ocho Cinco...but the more I think about it, the less inclined to riot I become. IF it could be a cap friendly deal that we can part ways with quickly and with no major cap issues...and IF he could refrain from being a distraction (which I think he CAN do; It's not as if he's a "give me the damn ball you idiot QB!" distraction that can break up a locker room, he's just a goofy guy who races horses and plays soccer in his spare time) then I wouldn't freak out TOO much.

Ocho would immediately be an upgrade over Jacoby Jones, and would probably give Kevin Walter some challenges for snaps. KW does all the little things...but last I checked, Ocho does them as well.

I'm not 100% on board with this move, but I wouldn't freak out either.


No. In this case I'll take the devil(s) we don't know over the devil we know. At the very least our gaggle of slow unspectacular receivers are at least still hungry and fighting for something. Ocho has cared more about being a celebrity than being a football player for 5 years now. He had a great 6 year run, but it's been over for quite some time now even if having another "me, first" running mate in TO revived him for a season in there. He's not the type of guy I envision waking up one day and realizing that he actually has to work to be a good football player again.
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Grasspike


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 12:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apollo Stallion wrote:
EliteTexan80 wrote:
EliteTexan80 wrote:
...from looking at the Pats, it seems as if the pickings will come down to 85, Jermey Ebert, Matthew Slater, Donte Stallworth or Britt Davis. Not exactly a great choice of names out there...


...and Ocho is the odd man out.

At first I said that I would vomit at the thought of Ocho Cinco...but the more I think about it, the less inclined to riot I become. IF it could be a cap friendly deal that we can part ways with quickly and with no major cap issues...and IF he could refrain from being a distraction (which I think he CAN do; It's not as if he's a "give me the damn ball you idiot QB!" distraction that can break up a locker room, he's just a goofy guy who races horses and plays soccer in his spare time) then I wouldn't freak out TOO much.

Ocho would immediately be an upgrade over Jacoby Jones, and would probably give Kevin Walter some challenges for snaps. KW does all the little things...but last I checked, Ocho does them as well.

I'm not 100% on board with this move, but I wouldn't freak out either.


No. In this case I'll take the devil(s) we don't know over the devil we know. At the very least our gaggle of slow unspectacular receivers are at least still hungry and fighting for something. Ocho has cared more about being a celebrity than being a football player for 5 years now. He had a great 6 year run, but it's been over for quite some time now even if having another "me, first" running mate in TO revived him for a season in there. He's not the type of guy I envision waking up one day and realizing that he actually has to work to be a good football player again.


Apollo, you don't become an 11-year NFL veteran by being lazy. He has some gifts (he's the example college coaches use for footwork, YouTube "Chad Johnson footwork" to see what I mean) but he works hard to maintain them. Being involved in tons of celebrity endeavors and being a diva does not necessarily equate with lazy.

However, I wouldn't particularly care to have him on the team. His antics got old and stale a long time ago, and I don't know if he has the mental acuity to grasp our offense enough to contribute in the 1-2 year time span we need him for. I don't think he'd be a significant upgrade over anyone that will play a significant role this year, especially considering his weak blocking, so I'd prefer that we stay away. I'd rather pick up some journeyman willing to do the yeoman work in the preseason.
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amazingandre


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 12:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeez, the hate Posey receives by some here is just unreal. The kid sold some gear and got some cash, whoop-di-doo.....He practiced all year, helped his team and did this all while knowing he had no shot at playing. That tales dedication and love for the game. He is a hard worker and will get better, even if it means a Hawaiian trip to IR resort.


I would not mind bringing in Ocho, see what he brings to the table. Unlike New England, we call plays and routes for him to run, from what I understand, the Pats allow the wideout to come to the line and then decide what to run, and Brady has to agree without speaking and know what the wideout will do. We run NOTHING like that and if he runs what is called, then what is the big deal??? He was pretty quiet the last year and seemed to work hard. Give him a call for camp
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 12:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

amazingandre wrote:
Jeez, the hate Posey receives by some here is just unreal. The kid sold some gear and got some cash, whoop-di-doo.....He practiced all year, helped his team and did this all while knowing he had no shot at playing. That tales dedication and love for the game. He is a hard worker and will get better, even if it means a Hawaiian trip to IR resort.


That's fine, but it doesn't discount that he will be rusty, and it doesn't chance the fact that our current WR unit needs a #3 in a bad way.

I'm not too interested in talking about Posey's overall career arc - we've seen plenty of WRs amount to nothing their first few years, and then explode onto the scene and take their place as one of the best. Very well COULD be the case. However, this team has the chance to win NOW, and finding someone who can slot into the #2/#3 role at times needed. Posey isn't that guy, and it behooves us to find that guy.
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amazingandre


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 12:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

EliteTexan80 wrote:
amazingandre wrote:
Jeez, the hate Posey receives by some here is just unreal. The kid sold some gear and got some cash, whoop-di-doo.....He practiced all year, helped his team and did this all while knowing he had no shot at playing. That tales dedication and love for the game. He is a hard worker and will get better, even if it means a Hawaiian trip to IR resort.


That's fine, but it doesn't discount that he will be rusty, and it doesn't chance the fact that our current WR unit needs a #3 in a bad way.

I'm not too interested in talking about Posey's overall career arc - we've seen plenty of WRs amount to nothing their first few years, and then explode onto the scene and take their place as one of the best. Very well COULD be the case. However, this team has the chance to win NOW, and finding someone who can slot into the #2/#3 role at times needed. Posey isn't that guy, and it behooves us to find that guy.


i agree, but I think we need to make a trade for a legit guy, anyone with any ideas on who is out there? Don't forget we COULD trade Ben Tate....

Maybe a team like the Packers would make the trade, Tate for Jones or someone?
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lumberjackchris


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 1:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

amazingandre wrote:
EliteTexan80 wrote:
amazingandre wrote:
Jeez, the hate Posey receives by some here is just unreal. The kid sold some gear and got some cash, whoop-di-doo.....He practiced all year, helped his team and did this all while knowing he had no shot at playing. That tales dedication and love for the game. He is a hard worker and will get better, even if it means a Hawaiian trip to IR resort.


That's fine, but it doesn't discount that he will be rusty, and it doesn't chance the fact that our current WR unit needs a #3 in a bad way.

I'm not too interested in talking about Posey's overall career arc - we've seen plenty of WRs amount to nothing their first few years, and then explode onto the scene and take their place as one of the best. Very well COULD be the case. However, this team has the chance to win NOW, and finding someone who can slot into the #2/#3 role at times needed. Posey isn't that guy, and it behooves us to find that guy.


i agree, but I think we need to make a trade for a legit guy, anyone with any ideas on who is out there? Don't forget we COULD trade Ben Tate....

Maybe a team like the Packers would make the trade, Tate for Jones or someone?


Mike Thomas from Jville? not for Tate though for a 6th maybe 5th
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Grasspike


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

amazingandre wrote:
Jeez, the hate Posey receives by some here is just unreal. The kid sold some gear and got some cash, whoop-di-doo.....He practiced all year, helped his team and did this all while knowing he had no shot at playing. That tales dedication and love for the game. He is a hard worker and will get better, even if it means a Hawaiian trip to IR resort.


I would not mind bringing in Ocho, see what he brings to the table. Unlike New England, we call plays and routes for him to run, from what I understand, the Pats allow the wideout to come to the line and then decide what to run, and Brady has to agree without speaking and know what the wideout will do. We run NOTHING like that and if he runs what is called, then what is the big deal??? He was pretty quiet the last year and seemed to work hard. Give him a call for camp


ax2, have you even read the non-jargin comments about Posey? It's not about selling gear for cash. It's about doing it knowing that you could jeopardize an NFL career for a few hundred bucks, getting tangled up in a federal investigation in the process. That's a big red flag.

And it's not like he practiced with no chance of playing last year. He was initially only suspended 5 games, got caught taking more illegal benefits, which led to double the suspension, and then still had a chance to play in the last few games. So he practiced the entire season because he would start 2 games at the end and then had a chance at an NFL career. It's not like getting drafted came out of nowhere, like he was some unknown player that burst onto the scene. Any man worth even a tiny little bit of his salt would practice the whole season in this scenario. It's the equivalent redshirting a year to be a four-year starter. It proves absolutely nothing about his love for the game, only that he is not a complete and total idiot like Dwight Jones.

Second, no NFL teams run a playground offense where you read minds and communicate telepathically to make up the play. It's ludicrous that you would even suggest that. The Pats probably have one of the more complicated offenses in the NFL, but it's not like the Texans run a triple option with 4 plays. NFL offenses are complex, and he had the luxury of spending 10 years as the bigshot in the same system with mostly the same personnel, which made it easier to hide the fact that his ability to read coverages and understand offensive strategies was not the strongest, and it absolutely needs to be if you expect to be a contributing role player in an NFL offense, rather than the main man who the OC designs the offense around.
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