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J. Tucker Must NOT Die?
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diamondbull424


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 3:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

STrid wrote:
I've got to go with SnA right here. Sure, there is nothing wrong with some competition at the spot, but the guy has done nothing so far that warrants this kind of optimism. He kicked a 55 yarder? Last year, or the year before that, we were all raving about how well Cundiff was doing in practice, but as we all know it's a lot easier to hit FG's when there is no pressure on. Until the guy actually makes a meaningful kick I'm very much going to doubt him.

No one is saying that Tucker is a prodigy at the kicking spot, a talent unseen. Heck, I didn't even call him competent. There is no such thing as being optimistic in my OP.

Simply put, Tucker is our only hope. Sure Cundff can win te kicking competition, but it won't matter. He's a guy that when he wasn't being pushed for his job he failed to perform in 2012 like he did in 2012. He's a guy that when down by 3 and marching down the field he didn't think to start practicing his kicking motion to be ready for the kick. He's a guy that missed a chip shot. Sure he was rushed but under similar circumstances I remember Steven Hauschka (?) almost making a kick from about 48 yards with time expiring against the Vikings a few years back, he didn't miss wide left. I have zero confidence in Cundiff as a performer, a competitor, and a clutch asset.

So again, Tucker might not be the answer to our kicking situation, but he's a potential solution.. While Cundiff has already proven to me that he's not an answer... And the faster we're saved from his incompetence, the sooner we can look towards a more competent option... If Tucker doesn't prove to handle the position.
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drd23


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 3:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've got to agree with SnA on this one too.

I think dbs jumped the gun on this one. Making a 55 yarder in practice and being better than Cundiff from outside 50yds in college (which doesnt mean much given how poor Cundiff is from distance) doesn't mean he deserves this sort of hype.

He is an UDFA kicker for crying out loud. They dont need their own threads Laughing Razz

If any UDFA deserves their own thread, it should be mini-Ray, Bobby Rainey, or Ishmaa'ily Kitchen (because he has an awesome name and a legitimate chance of making the final roster)
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ravens5520


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 4:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've always been one to not dwell on the past.. "it's not what you have done, but what you are doing now". I'm all or allowing Billy to come back. He is a guy who probably spent all season feeling like crap, hopefully using that as fuel to fire his passion to change that misfortune around. Many things happened in that game prior to the Cundiff kick that should have went the other way and none of us would even be considering this walk on... "just another camp body" would be this title.

So I agree with what someone else said. I would also just like to see the Ravens keep the best performing kicker
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diamondbull424


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 5:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd really like anyone to find me these quotes that provide this "hype" that I'm hearing. This is about Cundiff being back. I could care less if Cundiff wins the job over Tucker... It'd mean nothing, in fact, knowing Harbaugh... I expect Cundiff to win.

But I still can't forgive myself for being on the Alex Henery bandwagon for so long only to jump off after Cundiff's 2010 season. He fooled me once, I'm not foolish enough to allow him to do it twice. He's a fraud and will never be a franchise kicker. We had one, I want one, and whether Tucker becomes one or not is inconsequential, Cundiff isn't one. And to keep Harbaugh'S loyalty from causing us to lose more games down the road, Tucker is our only hope at this point.

And FWIW I created this thread because Tucker does indeed have an awesome name. He's named nearly after a corny movies main protagonist. Plus Tucker winning the competition would impact this team more than any other UDFA names in this thread... He'd be a starter.
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RAVINGMADD


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 7:14 am    Post subject: Re: J. Tucker Must NOT Die? Reply with quote

diamondbull424 wrote:
This guy clearly needs to impress and win the kicking job. He, simply put, is our only hope.

Rewind. For those of you who are thinking "WTFreak" about the topic title, you've likely never heard of the movie "John Tucker Must Die" OR you likely haven't been properly introduced to the Ravens UDFA Rookie Kicker... Justin Tucker. His claim to fame? Booting a 55 yard field goal in practice earning "oooohs" and "aaaahs" from his fellow rookie campriots (new word: think compatriots).

I've been on record multiple times saying there was no "sure thing" kicker in this class like I saw from Alex Henery last year... but Justin Tucker was a guy that wasn't exactly on my radar. And I have to say his stats were impressive enough.

In 2011, he completed 81.1% of his kicks. In 2010 he completed 85.2% of his kicks.

The thing that I liked to look at with kickers is to make sure they are accurate up close. From 20-29 range, Tucker has never missed... which is good, because those are freebies and he SHOULD be making them. I'm a little dissapointed that from 30-39 range, Tucker only converted on 77% of his career kicks. I want consistenct in those kicks more than anything else IMO. Missing a kick in that range is a momentum killer. Tucker had about 82% kicking accuracy from 40-50 range... that's where I'd want it. Obsiously no kicker is perfect and if we get that kind of production from that range, we're good. With 50+ kicks, Tucker has connected 50% of the time with a long of 52 yards.

I'm not sure if Tucker has a weapon of a leg, but what we need most is someone that has the inner conficence to get the job done when we can count on them. I don't trust Cundiff and he's proven he can't do it. Justin Tucker is an incredibly interesting option... and I hope he can find more and more ways to live throughout this competition. Justin Tucker is our only hope... he must live, and prevail!

EDIT: And for those of you who are still, deep down, depressed about our final game against the Patriots and you would like to experience delusions of grandeur, imagine that we have a time machine and are traveling back to that fateful game against the Patriots. It's January 22, 2012. Lee Evans gets the ball knocked out- CRAP! Billy Cundiff is no longer on the team. In his stead? Justin Tucker... doing this. Overtime, Ed Reed interception, laterall to Lardarius Webb... he runs it to the 43 yard line. Flacco lobs a deep ball pass to Torrey Smith deep for a touchdown on the first play from us in the overtime period. We're going to the Super Bowl! We WON! WE WON!!!! Crying or Very sad

I really hope he wins the job from Cundiff. I'd much rather have an unknown as our kicker going into the season over Cundiff. A kicker's psyche is so fragile that it's probably better to have a young fresh leg in there as opposed to a veteran who has struggled. I seriously doubt that Cundiff could come through for us if we need him in another clutch situation. That kick is going to go through his head every time he's in a clutch situation and he's going to over think it. A young guy gets to come in fresh without any damage to his psyche and just kick. Once a kicker becomes damaged goods like Cundiff, I would be inclined to get rid of him no matter how good he was. Vanderjagt is a prime example of what a miss like this could do to a kicker. Vanderjagt's miss wasn't even as bad as Cundiff's and he came into make that kick as the MOST ACCURATE KICKER IN HISTORY, which Cundiff has never been. Vanderjagt was never the same after that and I see no reason why Cundiff would do much better.

I definitely like the kick he made in the Texas A&M game. At least he's shown to make clutch kicks in college (and right down the middle). I just hope that if he does something like that for the Ravens, they don't try to tackle him like his players at Texas did. I can just see him getting tackled by Suggs like that and breaking his leg or something. Gotta be careful with the kickers, it isn't just their psyche that's fragile. Laughing
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gooselovechild


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 10:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
gooselovechild wrote:
SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
STrid wrote:
I've got to go with SnA right here. Sure, there is nothing wrong with some competition at the spot, but the guy has done nothing so far that warrants this kind of optimism. He kicked a 55 yarder? Last year, or the year before that, we were all raving about how well Cundiff was doing in practice, but as we all know it's a lot easier to hit FG's when there is no pressure on. Until the guy actually makes a meaningful kick I'm very much going to doubt him.


Exactly.

If this guy comes in to camp and just blows everyone away with his accuracy and leg and actually beats out Cundiff then yeah this kind of optimism is warranted..

Making ONE 55 yard kick during Rookie mini camp? Please.


One might say the same about one punt return against the Redskins' rookie free agents late in a preseason game, but you felt that was enough to make Laquan Williams the primary punt/kick returner.

I'm not feeling the consistency.


The difference was that after that kick return, which happened in a GAME, he never even got another chance...That was the last we saw of LaQuan returning punts for us, and even when we had injuries and were putting Zbikowski and Ed Reed back there, LaQuan was sitting on the sidelines...

There's a difference between what I'm saying here and what I was trying to say with LaQuan Williams returning punts for us.


You realize that for bottom of the roster guys, practice has more to do with who makes the team and what roles they fill than games, right?
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SnA ExclusiVe


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 12:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

diamondbull424 wrote:
I'd really like anyone to find me these quotes that provide this "hype" that I'm hearing. This is about Cundiff being back. I could care less if Cundiff wins the job over Tucker... It'd mean nothing, in fact, knowing Harbaugh... I expect Cundiff to win.

But I still can't forgive myself for being on the Alex Henery bandwagon for so long only to jump off after Cundiff's 2010 season. He fooled me once, I'm not foolish enough to allow him to do it twice. He's a fraud and will never be a franchise kicker. We had one, I want one, and whether Tucker becomes one or not is inconsequential, Cundiff isn't one. And to keep Harbaugh'S loyalty from causing us to lose more games down the road, Tucker is our only hope at this point.

And FWIW I created this thread because Tucker does indeed have an awesome name. He's named nearly after a corny movies main protagonist. Plus Tucker winning the competition would impact this team more than any other UDFA names in this thread... He'd be a starter.


- This whole thread is the hype we are talking about. And not only that, but your ENTIRE first post is creating hype. Giving his stats, highlights, etc. hyping him up...

- Your second paragraph I agree with ENTIRELY. Cundiff isn't a franchise kicker at all; I thought he was going to be a stop-gap after Hauschka so we could draft Henery or a franchise Kicker, but after his 2010 season, I guess Harbs and everyone thought Cundiff was going to be the franchise guy.

- As for your thoughts on JTMD, that movie was awesome Wink
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SnA ExclusiVe


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 12:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gooselovechild wrote:
SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
gooselovechild wrote:
SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
STrid wrote:
I've got to go with SnA right here. Sure, there is nothing wrong with some competition at the spot, but the guy has done nothing so far that warrants this kind of optimism. He kicked a 55 yarder? Last year, or the year before that, we were all raving about how well Cundiff was doing in practice, but as we all know it's a lot easier to hit FG's when there is no pressure on. Until the guy actually makes a meaningful kick I'm very much going to doubt him.


Exactly.

If this guy comes in to camp and just blows everyone away with his accuracy and leg and actually beats out Cundiff then yeah this kind of optimism is warranted..

Making ONE 55 yard kick during Rookie mini camp? Please.


One might say the same about one punt return against the Redskins' rookie free agents late in a preseason game, but you felt that was enough to make Laquan Williams the primary punt/kick returner.

I'm not feeling the consistency.


The difference was that after that kick return, which happened in a GAME, he never even got another chance...That was the last we saw of LaQuan returning punts for us, and even when we had injuries and were putting Zbikowski and Ed Reed back there, LaQuan was sitting on the sidelines...

There's a difference between what I'm saying here and what I was trying to say with LaQuan Williams returning punts for us.


You realize that for bottom of the roster guys, practice has more to do with who makes the team and what roles they fill than games, right?


Yes, I realize that. I play college baseball and I know how it works. Doesn't change the fact that when LaQuan got his chance to return IN A GAME he made his chance count, and then the coaching staff rewarded that with never giving him another chance again.

Now it could've been that after that one time in a game he just started sucking at practice, but we'll never know, and I seriously doubt that that was the case.
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diamondbull424


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 3:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
diamondbull424 wrote:
I'd really like anyone to find me these quotes that provide this "hype" that I'm hearing. This is about Cundiff being back. I could care less if Cundiff wins the job over Tucker... It'd mean nothing, in fact, knowing Harbaugh... I expect Cundiff to win.

But I still can't forgive myself for being on the Alex Henery bandwagon for so long only to jump off after Cundiff's 2010 season. He fooled me once, I'm not foolish enough to allow him to do it twice. He's a fraud and will never be a franchise kicker. We had one, I want one, and whether Tucker becomes one or not is inconsequential, Cundiff isn't one. And to keep Harbaugh'S loyalty from causing us to lose more games down the road, Tucker is our only hope at this point.

And FWIW I created this thread because Tucker does indeed have an awesome name. He's named nearly after a corny movies main protagonist. Plus Tucker winning the competition would impact this team more than any other UDFA names in this thread... He'd be a starter.


- This whole thread is the hype we are talking about. And not only that, but your ENTIRE first post is creating hype. Giving his stats, highlights, etc. hyping him up...

- Your second paragraph I agree with ENTIRELY. Cundiff isn't a franchise kicker at all; I thought he was going to be a stop-gap after Hauschka so we could draft Henery or a franchise Kicker, but after his 2010 season, I guess Harbs and everyone thought Cundiff was going to be the franchise guy.

- As for your thoughts on JTMD, that movie was awesome Wink

1. Actually this entire thread isn't hyping him. This thread, like any other is for information. Name me more then three guys from our draft class that likely has more impact on our team than a starting kicker. Outside of our first two picks of Courtney Upshaw and K.O. along with Gino Gradkowski, none of our picks are in competition for a starting position. And the accuracy and leg of a kicker plays an important role in both winning the field position battle as well as capitalizing on certain field position with 3 points. That's an incredible amount of impact. Should I wait until Tucker has already been eliminated from the kicking competition or wins it to announce his credentials for the competition?

The key fact here is that I'd wager 95% of this forum.. Including myself had no idea who Justin Tucker was... In terms of his stat-line and notable college performances.. Before now. This is an introduction for a guy that COULD become a key asset to this team moving forward... Hype would have been if I made this thread before it was announced that he was even competing for the kicking job and/or talked about how awesome Tucker is and how he's going to wipe the floor with Cundiff. Hype? The closest part to hyping Tucker in this thread is my "edit" where I delude myself into believing that Cundiff is no longer our kicker and in his place we have a guy make that kick against the Patriots that gives us the chance to win that game. Tucker made a clutch kick and he looked calm while doing it. He mentions clutch situations being a strength. This is all valuable information regarding his credentials.

I've hyped college prospects before, Cordy Glenn, Kevin Zeitler, Alshon Jeffery... Of recent note. Justin Tucker is a no name player in competition for a starting spot on this team. One can delude themself into believing that he's on a level playing field with our other UDFAs but simply put, he's not. There's a history behind UDFA kickers winning starting jobs and being successful throughout their careers. Not all great kickers are drafted, the draft importance is lowlighted unless you have a relative sure thing or Al Davis was making your selections. Can other UDFAs end up starting and makin a huge impact? Sure. It's possible. But the chances aren't in their favor, with Tucker... He's got a legitimate shot.

2. Agreed.

3. JTMD = I enjoyed the corny/cheesiness of it, it was hilarious. I can't speak for everyone though. Honestly of that movie doesn't exist, this thread probably never gets maid. That movie using the word "die" in the title for a rom-com was awesome in and of itself. How could one not want to see a movie with that title? It's like what the frack?..
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Flaccomania


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 4:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
Yes, I realize that. I play college baseball and I know how it works. Doesn't change the fact that when LaQuan got his chance to return IN A GAME he made his chance count, and then the coaching staff rewarded that with never giving him another chance again.

Now it could've been that after that one time in a game he just started sucking at practice, but we'll never know, and I seriously doubt that that was the case.


So what if LaQuan wasn't doing great in practices but they gave him a shot anyway, did great in the game, and then in practice again was bad? What if he started fumbling the ball constantly in practice?

Like you said yourself, you'll never know. But your conspiracy theory that the coaches just decided "oh, sure, he did that in a game but we're just not going to use him for no reason whatsoever" is far fetched. There was obviously something there that we don't know about.
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drd23


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PostPosted: Fri May 25, 2012 8:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Aaron Wilson ‏@RavensInsider

Rookie kicker Justin Tucker hasn't been signed to the roster following minicamp tryout. So, Billy Cundiff is the only kicker on the roster

All this hype building for nothing? Razz
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HokieRaven5


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PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2012 11:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

drd23 wrote:
Quote:
Aaron Wilson ‏@RavensInsider

Rookie kicker Justin Tucker hasn't been signed to the roster following minicamp tryout. So, Billy Cundiff is the only kicker on the roster

All this hype building for nothing? Razz


Justin Tucker never dies!

http://blogs.baltimoreravens.com/2012/05/29/ravens-officially-sign-kicker-justin-tucker/
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diamondbull424


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PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2012 2:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HokieRaven5 wrote:
drd23 wrote:
Quote:
Aaron Wilson ‏@RavensInsider

Rookie kicker Justin Tucker hasn't been signed to the roster following minicamp tryout. So, Billy Cundiff is the only kicker on the roster

All this hype building for nothing? Razz


Justin Tucker never dies!

http://blogs.baltimoreravens.com/2012/05/29/ravens-officially-sign-kicker-justin-tucker/

Dude! This is just like the movie. You think hey, he's a goner, but then shamwow he's like- still there! Panties and all. Tucker is the most awesomest kicker and as his official hype man (yeeeeaaaaahhhh boooyyyyy) I'm telling you he's got a golden foot, the next Matt Stover. He's going to blow the league up!

Don't mind me... I'm bored. But yeah, I definitely expected them to sign Tucker. I'm glad you beat me to linking this... I wouldn't want people to think I'm really, myself, Justin Tucker... sort of like for a few weeks back in 07' where I actually wondered if convenient truth might be Joe Flacco undercover..
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SnA ExclusiVe


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PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2012 2:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm glad we signed him to give Cundiff some competition. Now we can truly see who deserves the kicking spot instead of just giving it to Cundiff like we did mid-season last year when Graham clearly deserved it more.
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PostPosted: Tue May 29, 2012 4:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SnA ExclusiVe wrote:
I'm glad we signed him to give Cundiff some competition. Now we can truly see who deserves the kicking spot instead of just giving it to Cundiff like we did mid-season last year when Graham clearly deserved it more.


Huh? Graham wasn't even on the roster until Cundiff got hurt late in the season. Even then Graham didn't really do anything to prove he deserved it.

As for Tucker, meh. I don't expect the team to cut Cundiff so soon after giving him a pretty big contract for a kicker - especially for an undrafted rookie that wasn't signed until a month after the draft. I guess I just don't think Tucker is a guy that will really push Cundiff.
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