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With the 4th pick, MINN Selects - Matt Kalil [LT] USC
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SteelKing728


Joined: 23 Aug 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 3:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frank Costello wrote:
Hey VR, still think Blackmon is average? Or did we all forget about the WR learning curve?


I'll wait for you to still call him average and short. Laughing


did Blackmon suddenly become 6'5 after one great game?

because he's still short, and average at this point.

I'll admit, I was shocked that he had that kind of day against Houston, or at all for that matter.
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Frank Costello


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Considering who is throwing to this guy, to have expected much more by him by now would be asking a lot. Most WRs take 2-3 years to hit a 100 yard game, he just hit a 200+ yard game his rookie season. He has the NCAA record for the most back to back 200+ yard games.


Take it for what its worth. It would have been nice to have him and Matt.
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Frank Costello


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 5:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

disaacs wrote:
Frank Costello wrote:
Hey VR, still think Blackmon is average? Or did we all forget about the WR learning curve?


I'll wait for you to still call him average and short. Laughing


1 great day doesn't make him an All-Pro.


Certainly, but its also farrrrrrrrr from a fluke. If thats where youre going with that my friend.
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disaacs


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 6:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frank Costello wrote:
disaacs wrote:
Frank Costello wrote:
Hey VR, still think Blackmon is average? Or did we all forget about the WR learning curve?


I'll wait for you to still call him average and short. Laughing


1 great day doesn't make him an All-Pro.


Certainly, but its also farrrrrrrrr from a fluke. If thats where youre going with that my friend.


Qadry Ismail (former Viking) had 258 yds receiving as a Raven vs. the Steelers in '99.

It could still be a fluke. You can't jump to the conclusion that he's some otherworldly receiver after he finally shows up in the 11th week.
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rpmwr19


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 6:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frank Costello wrote:
Considering who is throwing to this guy, to have expected much more by him by now would be asking a lot. Most WRs take 2-3 years to hit a 100 yard game, he just hit a 200+ yard game his rookie season. He has the NCAA record for the most back to back 200+ yard games.


Not really true.

Torrey Smith had two 150+ yard games his rookie year
Denarius Moore had three 100+ yard games his rookie year
TY Hilton has had three 100+ yard games this season
Mike Williams and an 100 yard game and two 95+ yard games his rookie season
AJ Green had four 100+ yard games his rookie year
Julio Jones had five 100+ yard games his rookie year

I could go on and these are all recent players...

Only Jones and Green were drafted as highly as Blackmon. Blackmon is behind the eight ball when it comes to QB play, but elite WR's should produce regardless. Blackmon has struggled with getting separation at this level.

He also never had back to back 200 yard games in college... he got close, (190 against Louisiana Lafayette, and 207 against Texas Tech) so now you're just making stuff up Wink

http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/justin-blackmon-1/gamelog/

http://oklahomastate.rivals.com/cviewplayer.asp?Player=406619
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ArcticNorseman


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 7:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frank . . . C'mon man, this thread's about Kalil, not the lack of choosing Blackmon. Wink

Yes, Blackmon had an impressive game last week. Let's see how things shake out the rest of the season for him.

For the record -- Kalil IS the better choice of the two. I mean, really, look at the pro-bowl voting numbers. Plus, think how awesome and threatening this offense would be with Someone at LT while Blackmon's lined up out wide . . . lmao.

Percy Harvin's rookie numbers exceed what Blackmon's are, and he didn't get a tarnished reputation from stupidity between the draft and the start of the season. I'll give Blackmon a pass in that he has 5 more games to prove he's better than he's appeared -- i.e. 1 game (out of 10) produced 1/3 of his stats.
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vikingsrule


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 7:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If Matt Kalil wasnt starting, that would mean Charlie Johnson would be the LT. Shocked We know how that went last year.

There wasnt a mid round prospect who would have been likely to step in at LT.

Bobbie Massie was a popular prospect, he has been horrible this year, as a RT.
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Frank Costello


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I dont think im bashing Kalil, not sure why people think I am.

The general rule of thumb for a WR is 2-3 years. 110% true as we went through it with Rice. Just because certain guys produce early, you dont throw that way of thinking out the window.


My point in all of this is, if Blackmon if was selected,he could have done nice things for us. We hashed out why he wasnt picked, and some of you have ragged on him all season long up until last Sunday. But to reiterate, I am happy with the Kalil pick.
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Frank Costello


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rpmwr19 wrote:
Frank Costello wrote:
Considering who is throwing to this guy, to have expected much more by him by now would be asking a lot. Most WRs take 2-3 years to hit a 100 yard game, he just hit a 200+ yard game his rookie season. He has the NCAA record for the most back to back 200+ yard games.


Not really true.

Torrey Smith had two 150+ yard games his rookie year
Denarius Moore had three 100+ yard games his rookie year
TY Hilton has had three 100+ yard games this season
Mike Williams and an 100 yard game and two 95+ yard games his rookie season
AJ Green had four 100+ yard games his rookie year
Julio Jones had five 100+ yard games his rookie year

I could go on and these are all recent players...

Only Jones and Green were drafted as highly as Blackmon. Blackmon is behind the eight ball when it comes to QB play, but elite WR's should produce regardless. Blackmon has struggled with getting separation at this level.

He also never had back to back 200 yard games in college... he got close, (190 against Louisiana Lafayette, and 207 against Texas Tech) so now you're just making stuff up Wink

http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/justin-blackmon-1/gamelog/

http://oklahomastate.rivals.com/cviewplayer.asp?Player=406619



I worded it wrong, my fault. But you listed 6 WRs out of 354667 that have been drafted. If anything your point helps to prove my point even further.


Show me a list of every first round WRs production in year one. Then ill be impressed.
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Last edited by Frank Costello on Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:06 pm; edited 1 time in total
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vikingsrule


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frank Costello wrote:
I dont think im bashing Kalil, not sure why people think I am.

The general rule of thumb for a WR is 2-3 years. 110% true as we went through it with Rice. Just because certain guys produce early, you dont throw that way of thinking out the window.


My point in all of this is, if Blackmon if was selected,he could have done nice things for us. We hashed out why he wasnt picked, and some of you have ragged on him all season long up until last Sunday. But to reiterate, I am happy with the Kalil pick.


There was a reason why people have been ragging on him until last sunday. He was severely underproducing for a top 5 pick, and one big game doesnt really change much of that.

The way I saw, the Vikes needed an immediate impact player with there top pick. Kalil seemed to be a prospect who would be more ready to contribute in a big way from day one.

WR is still a holdover need, but we would be saying the same thing about LT if they took Blackmon.
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wcblack34


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frank Costello wrote:
Hey VR, still think Blackmon is average? Or did we all forget about the WR learning curve?


I'll wait for you to still call him average and short. Laughing


Kalil has transformed the entire offensive line. Peterson is arguably having his best season as a pro, Ponder is taking far fewer hits, and our TE's actually get to run routes. Up until Sunday, Cecil Shorts was (and still may be) the best receiver on the Jaguars' roster.

Flipper Anderson had 336 receiving yards in a single game...where's his Hall of Fame Bust? Blackmon has a looooooong way to go before he proves that he was a better pick than Kalil.
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Frank Costello


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vikingsrule wrote:
Frank Costello wrote:
I dont think im bashing Kalil, not sure why people think I am.

The general rule of thumb for a WR is 2-3 years. 110% true as we went through it with Rice. Just because certain guys produce early, you dont throw that way of thinking out the window.


My point in all of this is, if Blackmon if was selected,he could have done nice things for us. We hashed out why he wasnt picked, and some of you have ragged on him all season long up until last Sunday. But to reiterate, I am happy with the Kalil pick.


There was a reason why people have been ragging on him until last sunday. He was severely underproducing for a top 5 pick, and one big game doesnt really change much of that.

The way I saw, the Vikes needed an immediate impact player with there top pick. Kalil seemed to be a prospect who would be more ready to contribute in a big way from day one.

WR is still a holdover need, but we would be saying the same thing about LT if they took Blackmon.



That whole offense struggled, why would you expect anything different from a rookie? Who has had not one but two different starting QBs already.

Jags offense has life now, and Blackmon is playing better every week, not just last. So i dont get why he has to come in and put up Randy Moss numbers to earn his draft pick status.
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vikingsrule


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frank Costello wrote:
Hey VR, still think Blackmon is average? Or did we all forget about the WR learning curve?


I'll wait for you to still call him average and short. Laughing


He had one great game in his 10 game career, I guess that we can start anointing him. Where were you in all his 5 catches for 30 yards efforts?
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Frank Costello


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vikingsrule wrote:
Frank Costello wrote:
Hey VR, still think Blackmon is average? Or did we all forget about the WR learning curve?


I'll wait for you to still call him average and short. Laughing


He had one great game in his 10 game career, I guess that we can start anointing him. Where were you in all his 5 catches for 30 yards efforts?


Im more patient with WRs, thats my whole point. While I have been waiting for him to explode out of his shell, you've voiced displeasure with him.
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rpmwr19


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frank Costello wrote:
rpmwr19 wrote:
Frank Costello wrote:
Considering who is throwing to this guy, to have expected much more by him by now would be asking a lot. Most WRs take 2-3 years to hit a 100 yard game, he just hit a 200+ yard game his rookie season. He has the NCAA record for the most back to back 200+ yard games.


Not really true.

Torrey Smith had two 150+ yard games his rookie year
Denarius Moore had three 100+ yard games his rookie year
TY Hilton has had three 100+ yard games this season
Mike Williams and an 100 yard game and two 95+ yard games his rookie season
AJ Green had four 100+ yard games his rookie year
Julio Jones had five 100+ yard games his rookie year

I could go on and these are all recent players...

Only Jones and Green were drafted as highly as Blackmon. Blackmon is behind the eight ball when it comes to QB play, but elite WR's should produce regardless. Blackmon has struggled with getting separation at this level.

He also never had back to back 200 yard games in college... he got close, (190 against Louisiana Lafayette, and 207 against Texas Tech) so now you're just making stuff up Wink

http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/players/justin-blackmon-1/gamelog/

http://oklahomastate.rivals.com/cviewplayer.asp?Player=406619



I worded it wrong, my fault. But you listed 6 WRs out of 354667 that have been drafted. If anything your point helps to prove my point even further.


Show me a list of every first round WRs production in year one. Then ill be impressed.

How specifically did you word that wrong? And I was specifically trying to avoid first round receivers (aside from AJ Green and Julio Jones because they were drafted in a similar slot to Blackmon) to show that it's not really such a fantastic thing in today's NFL when a rookie receiver goes for 100+ yards in a game in his rookie season. There are 2nd, 4th, and 5th round picks on that list who have had multiple 100+ yard games as rookies.

I stopped simply because I had no wish to do more research after typing in rookie receivers from past years and seeing all of them have 100+ yard games. I'll compile a list for you of first round receivers over the last five years or so that have had 100+ yard games as a rookie.
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