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2012 is Y.O.T.P.D. (year of the pay day) for JerMike (2/$15)
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G3RMANATOR

Joined: 07 Oct 2010
Posts: 2215

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 2:15 am Post subject:

Kampman74 wrote:

G3RMANATOR wrote:

incognito_man wrote:

G3RMANATOR wrote:

incognito_man wrote:

Finley has a net positive impact on our offense, is a top 5 TE in the league and is worth his contract.

look at your posts, its like your trying to convince yourself rather than us.

you don't make any sense

Well when you've been proven wrong countless times and your still on that Finley hype.

So would you rather not have Finley? Don't you remember the 2009 season? Guy is one of the biggest mismatches in the league and the reason why guys like Jennings and Jordy have huge games. Do you remember the 2010 season opener against the Eagles, their gameplan was to stop Finley, not Jennings, they were targeting Finley. Finley brings a lot more than just what the stat sheet shows to the table.

I tell you what I'd rather have Larry Fitzgerald than him thats for sure lol. I get that Finley is a mismatch, totally agree, but does that seperate him from guys like Vernon Davis who have 4.3 speed to stretch the field? Or guys like Jimmy Graham who line up at receiver and are bigger than Finley? Or guys like Gronkowski who can get big yardage while being great at blocking? I mean come on, no one else pimps their tight ends as mismatches as much as Packer fans when their are plenty of other tight ends who both effect the game like that and are more productive than Finley.

P.S. So Finley is the reason Jennings has huge games? You do realize Jennings was an elite caliber receiver before Finley started a game and had his best season in which Finley missed most of that year. And yea Finley was our main target for the first 4 games of 2010, and subsequently was one of Aaron Rodgers worst 4 game stretches of his career lol, do you guys bother to think about this stuff or has Waldo already brainwashed you guys enough?
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blankman0021

Joined: 02 May 2007
Posts: 1426
Location: Eau Claire

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 3:20 am Post subject:

G3RMANATOR wrote:

Kampman74 wrote:

G3RMANATOR wrote:

incognito_man wrote:

G3RMANATOR wrote:

incognito_man wrote:

Finley has a net positive impact on our offense, is a top 5 TE in the league and is worth his contract.

look at your posts, its like your trying to convince yourself rather than us.

you don't make any sense

Well when you've been proven wrong countless times and your still on that Finley hype.

No need for that last comment IMO. Borderline trolling.

But I will concur with you, Graham, Gronk, and Davis are in a class right now above JMike. But remember it took Davis a few before he hit his stride and I think JMike is in the same mold. They were immature coming into the league, and needed some time to get their stuff together. JMike has all the potential to be a top 5 TE if it clicks. TT gave him a contract that will no doubt boost his ego and make him earn that money. If he doesn't earn it, I think there is a chance we could cut him Year 2 of the deal. Not sure what the guaranteed is on it though.
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Mattwaukee

Joined: 22 Jan 2009
Posts: 3272

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 3:41 am Post subject:

palmy50 wrote:

Hope so!

Still, I don't care how good he can be. I care about how good he is willing to be.

I honestly don't think it had anything to do with "willing". I think it had to do with a guy coming into a offense that was not used to having him; Having two good pre-seasons and being minimally involved in the first real season and then getting hurt in hie second season where he was really starting to come on, I pretty much look at it exactly like the Victor Cruz situation. Showed alot in first preseason, little to no playing time. Then Showed a lot in second pre season, Got hurt. Third season...............

even tho this is technically Finley's 4th season, His first was basically nothing except learning.
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palmy50

Joined: 26 Nov 2006
Posts: 12541

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 4:36 am Post subject:

I get that, but no player on this team gives up on more plays than Finley.....PERIOD!

I'm a fan! Not saying he is not great. Just think he could be much more if he was willing, in more ways than one!
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G3RMANATOR

Joined: 07 Oct 2010
Posts: 2215

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 5:21 am Post subject:

blankman0021 wrote:

G3RMANATOR wrote:

Kampman74 wrote:

G3RMANATOR wrote:

incognito_man wrote:

G3RMANATOR wrote:

incognito_man wrote:

Finley has a net positive impact on our offense, is a top 5 TE in the league and is worth his contract.

look at your posts, its like your trying to convince yourself rather than us.

you don't make any sense

Well when you've been proven wrong countless times and your still on that Finley hype.

Yea very possible, but the fact is right now he isn't an elite tight end and hasn't played like it by any measure. I just don't get how his mismatch is ability is so overblown around here when their are plenty of other tight ends who offer their own way of effecting the game gameplan wise.
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spilltray

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 8651
Location: Green Bay, WI

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 7:24 am Post subject:

palmy50 wrote:

That's what bothers me the most!

I get that he "wants" to be great. Everyone WANTS to be great. I get that he works hard, but his lack of effort in some areas says to me he only wants to be great at some things. He barely makes a token effort to block. He has huge lapses in focus and concentration both on the field and in interviews. He talks like he thinks he is already among the best "playmakers" in the league when he hasn't even been one of the top TEs yet. I just don't see the type of player that gives me faith "everything will click".

Finley THINKS he wants to be great, and maybe even tries to be great at some things, but he needs a major reality check and a shift in his priorities if he is actually going to become great instead of a tease. Unfortunately, I don't see that happening.
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Kampman74

Joined: 30 Apr 2007
Posts: 5576

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 9:23 am Post subject:

G3RMANATOR wrote:

Kampman74 wrote:

G3RMANATOR wrote:

incognito_man wrote:

G3RMANATOR wrote:

incognito_man wrote:

Finley has a net positive impact on our offense, is a top 5 TE in the league and is worth his contract.

look at your posts, its like your trying to convince yourself rather than us.

you don't make any sense

Well when you've been proven wrong countless times and your still on that Finley hype.

Man I was all for having a good debate but why take cheap shots? Rolling Eyes

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G3RMANATOR

Joined: 07 Oct 2010
Posts: 2215

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 10:02 am Post subject:

Kampman74 wrote:

G3RMANATOR wrote:

Kampman74 wrote:

G3RMANATOR wrote:

incognito_man wrote:

G3RMANATOR wrote:

incognito_man wrote:

Finley has a net positive impact on our offense, is a top 5 TE in the league and is worth his contract.

look at your posts, its like your trying to convince yourself rather than us.

you don't make any sense

Well when you've been proven wrong countless times and your still on that Finley hype.

Man I was all for having a good debate but why take cheap shots? Rolling Eyes

I apologize for that but man Waldo hyped Finley so dam much and it seemed to definitely rub off on the Packer forum hard to me.
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incognito_man

Joined: 11 Jan 2007
Posts: 26371
Location: Madison

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 10:37 am Post subject:

G3RMANATOR wrote:

I tell you what I'd rather have Larry Fitzgerald than him thats for sure lol.

Still on this huh? Still can't comprehend the actual argument put forth in that thread huh?

yawn.

grow-up.

you sound foolish everytime you bring this up because you misrepresent the point. A far better comparison would be would you rather have Finley + Jordy or Fitzgerald? That's essentially the initial question proposed.

G3RMANATOR

Joined: 07 Oct 2010
Posts: 2215

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 11:09 am Post subject:

incognito_man wrote:

G3RMANATOR wrote:

I tell you what I'd rather have Larry Fitzgerald than him thats for sure lol.

You say I need to grown up calling me a hater because I don't constantly gloat over Finley when I have backed up everything I have said with logic and reason yet you have nothing to back your stance up except name calling lol ok. But yea the bolded was definitely not the question asked, it was who would you rather have and a vast majority of Packer fans said Finley, while the vast majority of everyone else of course took Fitzgerald. I brought that poll up to show the true overhype of Finley over the past couple of years.
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incognito_man

Joined: 11 Jan 2007
Posts: 26371
Location: Madison

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 11:47 am Post subject:

G3RMANATOR wrote:

backed it up with logic and reason Laughing

and you still misunderstand the question in that thread. I encourage you to go back and read it.

MrBobGray

Joined: 08 Jan 2007
Posts: 1528

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 1:18 pm Post subject:

incognito_man wrote:

G3RMANATOR wrote:

backed it up with logic and reason Laughing

and you still misunderstand the question in that thread. I encourage you to go back and read it.

He's not misunderstanding the question, just the reasoning behind the answers given. The money thing was mentioned just in passing, as something additionally to consider:

http://www.footballsfuture.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=450893&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

And I have reread it. People who took Finley said he was a more dangerous player than Fitz, end of story. There was little said about money saved, or potential savings. They believed he was more dangerous because of his match-up problems, but that hasn't really been shown to be true.

Now, I agree it's a little disingenuous to use that poll as an example of Finley being unfairly overhyped, because there were legitimate reasons at the time to think he might blow up and be a superstar. That didn't happen, and now that post looks silly, but there's always a chance of that when you're talking about the future.

As far as Finley goes, he still has a bright future, although the chances of him living up to that potential are a bit iffier than they were IMO. Certainly, the cracks in his armor (Pro- Jeremy Lin fiasco dodge) have begun to show, and there is reason to be concerned about that. This was his first full year and it was a fairly big disappointment, no two ways about it. Still, he clearly has the tool-set to be a great player for the Packers at TE, so I think paying him was the right move. He's only 24, and if he gets his head right, he can have that Jimmy Graham/Rob Gronkowski level impact.

I do think that spilltray crushed the nail right in the skull though:

spilltray wrote:

Finley THINKS he wants to be great, and maybe even tries to be great at some things, but he needs a major reality check and a shift in his priorities if he is actually going to become great instead of a tease. Unfortunately, I don't see that happening.

This is the biggest issue I see for Finley to overcome. He thinks he's an all-world worker, the kind of guy who will tirelessly work on improving himself until he's the best he can be. The thing is, that kind of improvement requires you to be introspective enough to recognize what your faults are and then dedicated enough to improve them, and I don't see Finley as that kind of guy yet. Just working on being a great red-zone threat from the slot is not enough, and it never will be.

Mailman

Joined: 13 Jul 2007
Posts: 476
Location: United States

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 1:29 pm Post subject:

incognito_man wrote:

G3RMANATOR wrote:

I tell you what I'd rather have Larry Fitzgerald than him thats for sure lol.

I did a search and pulled some quotes from this Fitz vs Finley thread.

incognito_man wrote:

Finley is an incredible talent. He's going to blow up. He will. I could put the caveat 'if he stays healthy', but that can be added to every friggin' statement about any player looking forward. I would take Finley over Fitzgerald right now. Why? Because I think he helps an offense more.

http://www.footballsfuture.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=450893&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

I feel like such a Jon Stewart right now. lol.

incognito_man

Joined: 11 Jan 2007
Posts: 26371
Location: Madison

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 2:06 pm Post subject:

MrBobGray wrote:

...it's a reason imprinted right into the poll options "..scheming advantages, $, age..."

Here are some other quotes pulled from the thread:

me wrote:

If you think this thread is comparing the two, you've completely missed the spirit of this thread. It isn't to compare their pasts, it's to look at their futures, i.e. "Who would you rather have [going forward]".

Of which there are clear leans in Finley's direction, namely age and price. Which, when combined with other factors such as talent and likely future production, make for a good comparison for those with keen eyes.

original poster wrote:

You nailed it Incog.

...in response to my analysis of his interpretation outlined above

incognito_man

Joined: 11 Jan 2007
Posts: 26371
Location: Madison

Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 2:14 pm Post subject:

Mailman wrote:

I did a search and pulled some quotes from this Fitz vs Finley thread.

incognito_man wrote:

http://www.footballsfuture.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=450893&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

I feel like such a Jon Stewart right now. lol.

Quote:

...I think Fitzgerald is an overall more skilled player for sure

cut that part out, eh?

I pretty clearly defined the parameters in which the discussion made sense (and to which the OP presented the comparison initially) and it still holds true. Finley is still younger, still cheaper and still incredibly talented.

For the cost of 1 Fitzgerald ($16mil/yr), we're getting 1 Finley ($7mil), 1 Nelson ($3.5mil), and another $5.5 million in talent.

Is Fitzgerald worth a Nelson and Sitton more than Finley?

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