| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
goldfishwars 
Joined: 27 Mar 2011 Posts: 5424
|
Posted: Wed Dec 28, 2011 7:22 pm Post subject: The Goldfishwars Patriots Draft Guide |
|
|
|
Here's a few candidates I like in areas of needs for the team.
Defensive Tackle
With Kyle Love not being able to put four quarters together, Gerard Warren looking old and health concerns around Ron Brance we need help on our inside D-line. Because Vince is an all round threat, we need someone who can excel at either pass-rushing or to eat space so Vince doesn't see so many double-teams. With the Pats looking to mix around their sets next year, I'll be looking at guys who could play in either.
Candidates:
1st round:
Devon Still, Penn State - Can play 4-3 DT or five technique. He's massively powerful and has overwhelmed offensive lineman with a bull-rush, can stay low despite being 6'5 - team captain. Top of the tree.
Brandon Thompson, Clemson - He's a one-gap guy who won't bring a huge amount in terms of a pass-rush, however he'll eat up double-teams all day long and is a work-horse around the field.
Dontari Poe, Memphis - He's huge at 350 and 6'5, which has lead many to believe he's a NT in a 3-4 only - but he's hugely athletic for his frame. Not a pass-rusher, but excels at run stopping.
Marginal 1st Round/2nd Round
Jerel Worthy, Michigan State - This is a high-ceiling guy. He's a natural inside pass-rusher who has an array of moves at his disposal. He can take over games. Not a high-motor guy and has questions around conditioning - but massive potential. Excellent value in the 2nd.
Fletcher Cox*, Mississippi St. - Another versatile player who could play as a pass-rushing 4-3 DT or as a five technique. He has a nice burst and very active hands - he's excelled at getting into the backfield to be a disruptive force. Possibility he stays in school.
Kawann Short, Perdue - Again, another 4-3 or five technique. He's been dominant this year and impressed against rates Center Michael Brewster from Ohio. Not an explosive player, but can stay low and has strong and violent hands. Possibility he stays in school too.
3rd Round +
Kendall Reyes, Connecticut - He's a raw talent that could flourish in the Pats system. Ideally suited as a 4-3 DT or five technique - he's a high ceiling guy with fast hands and quickness. He's a high-motor guy who could be a steal in the 3rd. Wouldn't take him any earlier than that because he's a project.
Derek Wolfe, Cincinnati - He's a bit of a tweener, but could play in either set as a pass-rushing DT or someone who could develop into a 3-4 DE. Not a hugely impressive runs-stopper, but someone who could get after the QB with 7 sacks this year.
Kheeston Randall, Texas
Very strong, tough to move off the point. He's probably a 4-3 NT at this point, but one who could develop into a run stuffinf 3-4 End. He's not a pas-rusher and lacks a bit of quickness - but can control his man and make plays as a run-stopper.
Defensive End/3-4 OLB
We need someone who can compliment or replace Andre Carter and Mark Anderson, an edge-rusher who can switch between 4-3 DE and 3-4 OLB. There's a lot of undersized DE's (Ronnell Lewis, Bruce Irvin) in college these days. Guys playing there at 6'2 and 225-240 - they're not going to be playing 4-3 DE in the NFL anytime soon. There's also some excellent 4-3 Ends who aren't suited as 3-4 rushers - Quinton Coples for one, Melvin Ingram, Andre Branch and (probably) Whitney Mercilus falls into this category.
1st Round:
Nick Perry*, USC - Possibly stays on for another year, but if he were to declare would probably go 1st round. Would need to add a little bulk to play every down 4-3 DE - but would excel as a situational pass-rusher or as a 3-4 OLB from the off. Huge ceiling with this guy, hugely explosive and elite speed off the edge.
Marginal 1st Round/2nd Round
Brandon Jenkins*, FSU - Another underclassman. High motor guy and fluid, balanced athlete who uses spins moves, rather than quickness to rush the Quarterback. Not a great run-stopper - although could develop.
Vinny Curry, Marshall - Has posted back to back double-digit sack seasons. He has a great 1st step - and the size (6'5) which BB likes in his 3-4 outside linebackers. He's also a team captain.
3rd Round +
Cam Johnson, Virginia - Has experience as a 3-4 linebacker and a 4-3 DE after the defensive scheme was changed to 4-3 this year. Has a solid mix of speed/size as a rusher - has questions around his motor, but would see plenty of rotational work as a Pats defensive player anyway.
Frank Alexander, Oklahoma - The much vaunted Ronnell Lewis's opposite End, Alexander has 8.5 sacks and 18.5 tackles for a loss this year. With no truly outstanding attributes to speak of, he just seems to be a playmaker and in a deep class, this guy has draft day steal all over him.
Shea McClellin, Boise State - Again he's going to get lost and fall in the draft due to the number of end/linebacker rushers - but he's capable of playing 4-3 DE or 3-4 OLB and he's a clever, crafty rusher with an explosive step. He has a high motor which keeps going.
Safety
I don't susbscribe to the idea we look at FS only. Chung is banged up a lot of the time and he has experience of playing FS anyway. This is a BPA situation and we should look at a guy in the 2nd where the value seems to be.
Marginal 1st Round/2nd Round
Mark Barron, Alabama - He's a violent hitter who's improving his instincts. A bigger, built like a linebacker Safety who has comparisons to Adrian Wilson. Was beaten through the air a lot in 2010, but has turned his coverage problems around.
2nd Round
Robert Lester, Alabama - He might go back to school, but Lester would be a decent pick up in the 2nd. Overshadowed slightly by Barron's performances this year, he's a ball hawk who makes a lot of interceptions - although was down on last year's numbers.
Markelle Martin, Oklahoma State - Has huge upside athletically with fluid movements and good instincts in coverage. He's not a natural tackler however, which is something he'll need to work on.
Kenny Vaccaro, Texas - He's been rising up the boards of late because he's such a solid all-rounder. Has excellent size and bulk for the position and plays with decent instincts, good open-field tackler. Won't get buckets of interceptions - but will break up plays. Will contribute heavily on special teams.
3rd Round +
Harrison Smith, Notre Dame - He's thickly built, which makes him play a little tight. He's great at playing down field and is a good open field tackler having converted from linebacker. I can see his stock shooting up after a good showing at the combine.
Aaron Henry, Wisconsin - Solid all-rounder with natural coverage skills, he's good at re-routing receivers and is a fluid mover. He's a little raw and could play some special teams before developing into a starter.
Wide Receiver
I'd prefer a smaller, fast receiver here - someone who can get seperation easily and get deep - a natural replacement for an ageing Deion Branch.
1st Round
Kendall Wright, Baylor
He's had an amazing 2011 - with his breathtaking speed and open-field running. He's sill a little raw as a route runner, but we've all seen the impact Mike Wallce and the other speedsters have had in Pittsburgh and Wright fits that mould. He can play inside and outside in the NFL.
3rd Round +
Ryan Broyles, Oklahoma - He's probably an early 2nd round pick who will drop because of the ACL injury. He probably doesn't have huge straight line speed - but he's the kind of crafty, intelligent receiver BB likes. He has fantastic hands and is an elusive runner.
AJ Jenkins, Illinois - Will probably run in the late 4.3's/4.4s - has been very productive this year. He's been uncoverable at times this year and just gets open. He'd be very solid value in rounds 3 onwards.
Jarius Wright, Arkansas - Not the biggest, but will work the seams and is lightning quick. He's been playing on a pro-style offense in Arkansas and has very reliable hands. He's been very productve this year.
Jordan White, Western Michigan - The cat might be out of the bag with this guy - will have comparisons with another famous receiver from the same school, but he's a legitmate player in his own right. Makes a lot of yards after the catch and has excellent straight line speed.
SAM Linebacker
1st Round
Dont'a Hightower, Alabama - There isn't really a prospect I like more than Hightower. He's a large linebacker who could play SAM and ILB in a 4-3 or 3-4. He's another team captain who makes a lot of plays on the Alabama defense. He's an excellent run defender in the box and leads a very complex pro-style defense.
3rd Round
Audie Cole, North Carolina St. - He's played outside and inside linebacker for North Carolina. He's a versaitle player, who's tall and good in coverage - does lots of things well and has size (6'4) for the position that BB likes in his linebackers.
Cornerback
I'm going to ignore the corners who are probably out of reach - Morris Claiborne, Dre Kirkpatrick and Alfonzo Dennard.
1st Round Marginal/2nd Round
Chase Minnifield, Virginia - Does well in man and zone coverage. He's Dowling's former running mate at Virginia and the son of a former Browns player. He has a very specific skillset that's taylor made for the position and it's worth noting how much teams threw away from Chase this year.
2nd Round
Stephon Gilmore, South Carolina - He's a bigger corner who can get burnt a little, but makes a lot of plays. You can't teach a playmaker and he has it - if coverage can improve, he looks like a baller.
Casey Hayward, Vanderbilt - I think he'll go in the 2nd, some think later, but he's underrated. He's a smart and highly productive corner who makes a lot of plays. He's an intelligent guy off the field and that would appeal to BB.
3rd Round +
Coryell Judie, Texas A&M - He's a fluid mover with great straight-line speed. He's also a good wrap-up tackler He'll attack the ball and make turnovers - in a deep corner class he could drop and become excellent value.
Donnie Fletcher, Boston College - He's a solid all-rounder and with no outstanding attributes will drop because of the deep class - however he'll be a real steal in rounds 3 onwards. He has a good combination of size and speed and ball skills. _________________
Thanks Duron Harmon!
Last edited by goldfishwars on Mon Feb 06, 2012 11:18 am; edited 2 times in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
patsfan25
Joined: 07 Dec 2008 Posts: 2959 Location: CenCal
|
Posted: Wed Dec 28, 2011 7:50 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
Good stuff. I'm still interested in seeing your own mock of what the Patriots draft will be this offseason. If you want to reserve that for later, it's fine. Thanks for the thread. _________________
| Ring Worm Sherm wrote: | | You're an complete idiot |
Aite,
Peace. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
mcmurtry86
Joined: 02 Mar 2010 Posts: 16285
|
Posted: Wed Dec 28, 2011 9:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
I'm not really a fan of the DL crop this year. Cox and Reyes are mildly intriguing in the 2nd or 3rd round.
Thompson is a bad fit for the system, unless the Pats are running exclusively a 4-3. Still is just another Penn State DL - I like his skillset but not sold on his transition to 5-technique. Poe is intriguing, although seems a bit miscast in the Pats' scheme with Wilfork on board.
The edge-rusher class is pretty unappealing as well. Jenkins doesn't look like he's good enough against the run to be on the Pats radar. Curry is a favorite on this board but he struggles at times against really marginal offenses so I'm not sure what kind of impact he'll have (at least early on). Cam Johnson intrigues me but he's a real tweener - seems too stiff to play OLB and not really quick enough to play RE in a 4-3. He also has some sloppy technique and doesn't do a very good job with gap responsibility. He's a real project, albeit one with a high upside. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
trivium2009
Joined: 14 Dec 2009 Posts: 472
|
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 2:46 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
| Just wandering cuz I kinda got a draft crush on this guy, what is your opinion on Jared Crick DE Nebraska? |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
NinjaZX6R 
Joined: 05 Jun 2011 Posts: 6918 Location: Columbus, Ohio
|
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 2:56 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
| trivium2009 wrote: | | Just wandering cuz I kinda got a draft crush on this guy, what is your opinion on Jared Crick DE Nebraska? |
Wasn't good this year even before his shoulder injury.
Liked him last year. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
goldfishwars 
Joined: 27 Mar 2011 Posts: 5424
|
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 4:38 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
| trivium2009 wrote: | | Just wandering cuz I kinda got a draft crush on this guy, what is your opinion on Jared Crick DE Nebraska? |
I’m not that high on Jared Crick. He has a decent motor and is a good run defender – but he gets pushed around and doesn’t have much of a pass-rush. He’s a 3-4 DE only at the next level at this stage. _________________
Thanks Duron Harmon! |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
goldfishwars 
Joined: 27 Mar 2011 Posts: 5424
|
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 7:00 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
| patsfan25 wrote: | | Good stuff. I'm still interested in seeing your own mock of what the Patriots draft will be this offseason. If you want to reserve that for later, it's fine. Thanks for the thread. |
Firstly, I’m gonna look at our needs and see where the depth is of each class.
The depth for me is in DE/OLB class (a lot of 3-4 OLB only guys will go to 3-4 teams looking for rushers – Chargers, Jets, Bills etc). There’s no elite plug-in talent like a Von Miller from last year, but there’s a lot of middling guys who can be situational rushers in their 1st years like Aldon Smith at the 49ers. Corner is a very deep class this year, one elite looking talent in Claiborne and then a drop off to the rest. For the type of receiver I like as discussed – there’s some intriguing guys that can be taken in the 3rd round onwards.
The positions of need where the class doesn’t run deep is at Safety, SAM linebacker and interior D-line. I’ll give 2 scenarios – because a lot will depend on whether Dont’a Hightower falls to us in the 1st or not. I also think we take a close look at Kendall Wright if he's available - with his stock rocketing upwards, I think he's off the board by the time we pick. I'm also concerned about taking a 1 year guy with rough route running (albeit with a huge ceiling) that early.
1st Round (strategy):-
Scenario 1:
1. Dont’a Hightower slips, then we should snap him up here. He’s everything a Patriots linebacker should be – tall, athletic, smart – a leader.
2. Mark Barron – if his coverage abilities have improved in the way it looks on tape, then we should take a close look in the 1st. He’s by far the best Safety prospect in the class. Huge physical upside.
Scenario 2:
1. Hightower is off the board, we pick the best interior D-line guy available from Still, Thompson, Worthy, Poe – Cox if he declares and impresses in combine and workouts
2. Mark Barron (as above)
2nd Round (strategy):-
Scenario 1 (already picked LB, S):
1. We need to hit with the interior D-line as the class falls off. It’s possible Worthy falls because of motor concerns, Poe falls because he’s tall for a NT or Cox/Short because they’re juniors – Reyes possibly if he impresses in workouts/combine
2. With LB, S & DT covered – I’m gonna find the best DE/OLB or corner available. We’re not picking a starter here, so it could be someone with the highest ceiling. For the sake of argument, let’s say a corner like Casey Heyward (instincts) or Stephon Gilmore (size) falls here and we grab him.
Scenario 2 (already picked DT, S):
1. If Vontaze Burfict falls (I think someone takes a chance on him by now), then we should take a close look. If not – then I don’t have a 2nd round grade on any of other linebackers who could play SAM in the Patriots mould. Therefore I’m going to pick the best DE/OLB or Corner available. Let’s say Vinny Curry is available here and we take him.
2. I’m going to take the best corner on the board – there’s a fair chance a Gilmore or Heyward are available.
3rd Round (strategy):-
Scenario 1 (already picked LB, S, DT, CB)
1. It’s a straight choice between the best WR or DE/OLB available. I have a 3rd round grade on more WR’s than DE/OLB’s – so I’m going to assume one of those slips into the 4th and pick-up Frank Alexander here who is excellent value in the 3rd and won’t be too high on many lists.
Scenario 2 (already picked DT, S, DE/OLB, CB)
1. Audie Cole may well be available at this point. I think he’s an under the radar kind of guy who won’t be looked at by many 3-4 teams. He’s my pick here.
4th Round (strategy):-
Scenario 1 (already picked LB, S, DT, CB, DE/OLB)
1. It’s the best WR available. There’s a very good chance a Broyles, AJ Jenkins, Jarius Wright, Joe Adams or Jordan White is available here. Preference would go to Broyles if he falls here or the Arkansas receivers due to the pro-tyle offense and crisp route running.
Scenario 2 – As above.
So, the overall picks in Scenario 1 and 2 are:
Scenario 1
1. Dont’a Hightower, LB – Alabama
1. Mark Barron, S - Alabama
2. Jerel Worthy, DT – Michigan/Fletcher Cox, DT - Mississippi St./Kawann Short, DT - Perdue
2. Stephon Gilmore, CB – South Carolina/Casey Heward, CB - Vanderbilt
3. Frank Alexander, DE/OLB – Oklahoma/Cam Johnson, DE/OLB - Virginia
4. Ryan Broyles, WR – Oklahoma/Jarius Wright, WR – Arkansas/Joe Adams, WR – Arkansas
Scenario 2
1. Devon Still, DT – Penn State/Brandon Thompson, DT – Clemson/Dontari Poe, DT - Memphis
1. Mark Barron, S - Alabama
2. Vinny Curry – DE/OLB – Marshall
2. Stephon Gilmore, CB – South Carolina/Casey Heward, CB - Vanderbilt
3. Audie Cole, LB – North Carolina St.
4. Ryan Broyles, WR – Oklahoma/Jarius Wright, WR – Arkansas/Joe Adams, WR – Arkansas
I know there are risks around Barron being off the board in round 1 (I don’t think he will be when you factor the needs in of other teams) – but if he is, then I would advocate trading down and picking up something for next year. Kenny Vaccaro or Harrison Smith would be next Safeties to look at. Same goes for Vinny Curry and Audie Cole in rounds 2 and 3 of Scenario 2, if they're not there - then trade down and get some value. _________________
Thanks Duron Harmon! |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
mcmurtry86
Joined: 02 Mar 2010 Posts: 16285
|
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 11:36 am Post subject: |
|
|
|
| I don't understand where you're projecting Hightower to play. Are the Pats (in your scenario) dumping Spikes? |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
goldfishwars 
Joined: 27 Mar 2011 Posts: 5424
|
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 12:41 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| mcmurtry86 wrote: | | I don't understand where you're projecting Hightower to play. Are the Pats (in your scenario) dumping Spikes? |
Well - he'd be on a rotation, like everyone else in the Pats defense. But, he does everything Spikes does, with more speed - he plays with more instinct than Mayo and can play strong side or weak, 3-4 ILB, 4-3 OLB or ILB. _________________
Thanks Duron Harmon! |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
NinjaZX6R 
Joined: 05 Jun 2011 Posts: 6918 Location: Columbus, Ohio
|
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 12:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| goldfishwars wrote: | | mcmurtry86 wrote: | | I don't understand where you're projecting Hightower to play. Are the Pats (in your scenario) dumping Spikes? |
Well - he'd be on a rotation, like everyone else in the Pats defense. But, he does everything Spikes does, with more speed - he plays with more instinct than Mayo and can play strong side or weak, 3-4 ILB, 4-3 OLB or ILB. |
I don't think the Pats will be taking a rotational LB in the 1st round. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
goldfishwars 
Joined: 27 Mar 2011 Posts: 5424
|
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 1:18 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| NinjaZX6R wrote: | | goldfishwars wrote: | | mcmurtry86 wrote: | | I don't understand where you're projecting Hightower to play. Are the Pats (in your scenario) dumping Spikes? |
Well - he'd be on a rotation, like everyone else in the Pats defense. But, he does everything Spikes does, with more speed - he plays with more instinct than Mayo and can play strong side or weak, 3-4 ILB, 4-3 OLB or ILB. |
I don't think the Pats will be taking a rotational LB in the 1st round. |
Rotate as appear in several positions for different packages. He's an upgrade over Spikes as a ILB, but could also play SAM OLB over Ninkovich. _________________
Thanks Duron Harmon! |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
NinjaZX6R 
Joined: 05 Jun 2011 Posts: 6918 Location: Columbus, Ohio
|
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 2:37 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| goldfishwars wrote: | | NinjaZX6R wrote: | | goldfishwars wrote: | | mcmurtry86 wrote: | | I don't understand where you're projecting Hightower to play. Are the Pats (in your scenario) dumping Spikes? |
Well - he'd be on a rotation, like everyone else in the Pats defense. But, he does everything Spikes does, with more speed - he plays with more instinct than Mayo and can play strong side or weak, 3-4 ILB, 4-3 OLB or ILB. |
I don't think the Pats will be taking a rotational LB in the 1st round. |
Rotate as appear in several positions for different packages. He's an upgrade over Spikes as a ILB, but could also play SAM OLB over Ninkovich. |
And what spot does he play when we switch back to the 34? |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
mcmurtry86
Joined: 02 Mar 2010 Posts: 16285
|
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 2:50 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
I don't see the Pats taking another ILB. Spikes looks decent and they run so many sub packages that there isn't going to be a lot of playing time for a guy like Hightower.
I don't really see Hightower's 4-3 SAM ability as a big selling point. The Pats will be playing (again) a lot of sub and probably mixing in 3-4 fronts.
Don't get me wrong - I like him a lot as a prospect. But I don't see him as a fit in New England. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
goldfishwars 
Joined: 27 Mar 2011 Posts: 5424
|
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 3:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| mcmurtry86 wrote: | I don't see the Pats taking another ILB. Spikes looks decent and they run so many sub packages that there isn't going to be a lot of playing time for a guy like Hightower.
I don't really see Hightower's 4-3 SAM ability as a big selling point. The Pats will be playing (again) a lot of sub and probably mixing in 3-4 fronts.
Don't get me wrong - I like him a lot as a prospect. But I don't see him as a fit in New England. |
Don't diss my man crush! Personally I think he upgrades our linebacking core significantly. Would hate to see him on the Ravens or Steelers.
How would you mock Mcmurty? _________________
Thanks Duron Harmon! |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
mcmurtry86
Joined: 02 Mar 2010 Posts: 16285
|
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 3:47 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| goldfishwars wrote: |
Don't diss my man crush! Personally I think he upgrades our linebacking core significantly. Would hate to see him on the Ravens or Steelers.
|
He's a perfect fit for the Ravens and a definite need-filler for Pittsburgh. I have a feeling both teams will be in the mix on him - although I expect him to come off the board before the 25-32 range where these teams will be drafting. The Jets could take a long look at him and there's no shortage of 3-4 schemed teams who need ILB help.
| Quote: | | How would you mock Mcmurty? |
I'd probably call him names, insult his mother and whatnot.......  |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
|