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Suffering_Bills


Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 4223
Location: Rochester, N.Y.
PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 10:57 pm    Post subject: Draft question for fans of the Giants. Reply with quote

Greetings from New York State, guys. Very Happy

So, here's the hypothetical draft scenario:
#1. TB-Winston.
#2. TN-Mariota.
#3. JX-Fowler.
#4. OA-L. Williams.
#5. WA-Beasley.
#6. NJ-Cooper.
#7. CH-K. White.
#8. AT-Dupree.
#9. NG-????

So, who to select in this scenario? No trade-down, for the purpose of the question.
La'el Collins?
Brandon Scherff?
Ereck Flowers?
Andrus Peat?
Randy Gregory?
Shane Ray?
Other?
Feedback appreciated. Thanks.
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Suffering_Bills


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 10:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Help me out here, dudes. Some input, please?
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Kodaraw


Joined: 12 Feb 2013
Posts: 890
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 11:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is by far the worst scenario for us.
Danny Shelton, probably.
Or La'el Collins.

Gregory is out.

We will look for high character, blue-collar guys. Team captains, high football IQ.
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Suffering_Bills


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kodaraw wrote:
This is by far the worst scenario for us.
Danny Shelton, probably.
Or La'el Collins.

Gregory is out.

We will look for high character, blue-collar guys. Team captains, high football IQ.

I think Collins would be a very sensible pick for you guys.
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dkebones


Joined: 15 Mar 2007
Posts: 3855
Location: Giants fan in the Seahawk's backyard...
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 11:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Suffering_Bills wrote:
Kodaraw wrote:
This is by far the worst scenario for us.
Danny Shelton, probably.
Or La'el Collins.

Gregory is out.

We will look for high character, blue-collar guys. Team captains, high football IQ.

I think Collins would be a very sensible pick for you guys.


apparently so does the coaching staff that was working with him during his pro day workout.
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Kodaraw


Joined: 12 Feb 2013
Posts: 890
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Suffering_Bills wrote:
Kodaraw wrote:
This is by far the worst scenario for us.
Danny Shelton, probably.
Or La'el Collins.

Gregory is out.

We will look for high character, blue-collar guys. Team captains, high football IQ.

I think Collins would be a very sensible pick for you guys.


I think he is less than ideal. Our OL isn't near as bad as people think. We ideally need a LG and spending a first round pick on that, passing on DL or WR, is silly, IMO. But here, every sensible DL is gone except Shelton. Shelton + Hankins + Ellis makes a decent interior considering how often we were abused against the run.

Cooper would be my ideal pick.

An under-the-radar pick could be a CB. We haven't extended Prince or JPP yet. Of course, everyone is under the impression we will. But Prince, Eli, and JPP will be 3 massive signings. Not sure we can afford them all.
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Kodaraw


Joined: 12 Feb 2013
Posts: 890
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 11:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dkebones wrote:
Suffering_Bills wrote:
Kodaraw wrote:
This is by far the worst scenario for us.
Danny Shelton, probably.
Or La'el Collins.

Gregory is out.

We will look for high character, blue-collar guys. Team captains, high football IQ.

I think Collins would be a very sensible pick for you guys.


apparently so does the coaching staff that was working with him during his pro day workout.


We have a history of not really visiting or working out our first round pick.
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Suffering_Bills


Joined: 10 Apr 2006
Posts: 4223
Location: Rochester, N.Y.
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 11:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kodaraw wrote:
Suffering_Bills wrote:
Kodaraw wrote:
This is by far the worst scenario for us.
Danny Shelton, probably.
Or La'el Collins.

Gregory is out.

We will look for high character, blue-collar guys. Team captains, high football IQ.

I think Collins would be a very sensible pick for you guys.


I think he is less than ideal. Our OL isn't near as bad as people think. We ideally need a LG and spending a first round pick on that, passing on DL or WR, is silly, IMO. But here, every sensible DL is gone except Shelton. Shelton + Hankins + Ellis makes a decent interior considering how often we were abused against the run.

Cooper would be my ideal pick.

An under-the-radar pick could be a CB. We haven't extended Prince or JPP yet. Of course, everyone is under the impression we will. But Prince, Eli, and JPP will be 3 massive signings. Not sure we can afford them all.

You don't buy into the idea of Collins starting right away at RT, moving Pugh inside to guard, thereby strengthening two positions? Confused
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Kodaraw


Joined: 12 Feb 2013
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 11:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Suffering_Bills wrote:
Kodaraw wrote:
Suffering_Bills wrote:
Kodaraw wrote:
This is by far the worst scenario for us.
Danny Shelton, probably.
Or La'el Collins.

Gregory is out.

We will look for high character, blue-collar guys. Team captains, high football IQ.

I think Collins would be a very sensible pick for you guys.


I think he is less than ideal. Our OL isn't near as bad as people think. We ideally need a LG and spending a first round pick on that, passing on DL or WR, is silly, IMO. But here, every sensible DL is gone except Shelton. Shelton + Hankins + Ellis makes a decent interior considering how often we were abused against the run.

Cooper would be my ideal pick.

An under-the-radar pick could be a CB. We haven't extended Prince or JPP yet. Of course, everyone is under the impression we will. But Prince, Eli, and JPP will be 3 massive signings. Not sure we can afford them all.

You don't buy into the idea of Collins starting right away at RT, moving Pugh inside to guard, thereby strengthening two positions? Confused


I don't buy into the idea that Pugh moving to a position he has never played will strengthen our line, no. However, I think it is more likely we have a veteran next to Richburg than a rookie OL.
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Suffering_Bills


Joined: 10 Apr 2006
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Location: Rochester, N.Y.
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kodaraw wrote:
Suffering_Bills wrote:
Kodaraw wrote:
Suffering_Bills wrote:
Kodaraw wrote:
This is by far the worst scenario for us.
Danny Shelton, probably.
Or La'el Collins.

Gregory is out.

We will look for high character, blue-collar guys. Team captains, high football IQ.

I think Collins would be a very sensible pick for you guys.


I think he is less than ideal. Our OL isn't near as bad as people think. We ideally need a LG and spending a first round pick on that, passing on DL or WR, is silly, IMO. But here, every sensible DL is gone except Shelton. Shelton + Hankins + Ellis makes a decent interior considering how often we were abused against the run.

Cooper would be my ideal pick.

An under-the-radar pick could be a CB. We haven't extended Prince or JPP yet. Of course, everyone is under the impression we will. But Prince, Eli, and JPP will be 3 massive signings. Not sure we can afford them all.

You don't buy into the idea of Collins starting right away at RT, moving Pugh inside to guard, thereby strengthening two positions? Confused


I don't buy into the idea that Pugh moving to a position he has never played will strengthen our line, no. However, I think it is more likely we have a veteran next to Richburg than a rookie OL.

Respectfully disagree. I think Pugh would come in and do a competent job at LG, while Collins would be an upgrade at the RT position.
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NYGCRUZ80


Joined: 02 Jan 2014
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't believe La'El Collins is worth a top 10 pick. I'd like to trade back to like the Saints and I believe he will still be there, only OL worth top 10 IMO is Scheriff.
Shelton isn't a bad option but can he fit into a 4-3? Cause he's more of a 3-4 NT. I like Brown better at DT but no shot we take him at 9.
Landon Collins is also an option but yet again 9 is a reach for him

Only guy you listed that's worth a pick at 9 IMO is Scheriff, Shelton or Gregory. Maybe Shane Ray but I have doubts about him as a 4-3 DE
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Suffering_Bills


Joined: 10 Apr 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NYGCRUZ80 wrote:
I don't believe La'El Collins is worth a top 10 pick. I'd like to trade back to like the Saints and I believe he will still be there, only OL worth top 10 IMO is Scheriff.
Shelton isn't a bad option but can he fit into a 4-3? Cause he's more of a 3-4 NT. I like Brown better at DT but no shot we take him at 9.
Landon Collins is also an option but yet again 9 is a reach for him

Only guy you listed that's worth a pick at 9 IMO is Scheriff, Shelton or Gregory. Maybe Shane Ray but I have doubts about him as a 4-3 DE

I could easily see Scherff as the pick. Ray is a linebacker in the pros, BTW. Totally not a defensive end, in ANY scheme. You're right about Landon Collins, too; he's barely a top-TWENTY pick in this draft. Nowhere near worth the #9 slot.
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Last edited by Suffering_Bills on Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:15 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Kodaraw


Joined: 12 Feb 2013
Posts: 890
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Suffering_Bills wrote:
Kodaraw wrote:
Suffering_Bills wrote:
Kodaraw wrote:
Suffering_Bills wrote:
Kodaraw wrote:
This is by far the worst scenario for us.
Danny Shelton, probably.
Or La'el Collins.

Gregory is out.

We will look for high character, blue-collar guys. Team captains, high football IQ.

I think Collins would be a very sensible pick for you guys.


I think he is less than ideal. Our OL isn't near as bad as people think. We ideally need a LG and spending a first round pick on that, passing on DL or WR, is silly, IMO. But here, every sensible DL is gone except Shelton. Shelton + Hankins + Ellis makes a decent interior considering how often we were abused against the run.

Cooper would be my ideal pick.

An under-the-radar pick could be a CB. We haven't extended Prince or JPP yet. Of course, everyone is under the impression we will. But Prince, Eli, and JPP will be 3 massive signings. Not sure we can afford them all.

You don't buy into the idea of Collins starting right away at RT, moving Pugh inside to guard, thereby strengthening two positions? Confused


I don't buy into the idea that Pugh moving to a position he has never played will strengthen our line, no. However, I think it is more likely we have a veteran next to Richburg than a rookie OL.

Respectfully disagree. I think Pugh would come in and do a competent job at LG, while Collins would be an upgrade at the RT position.


Pugh does an above competent job at RT.
So, wouldn't it better to bring in a LG in the later rounds, like maybe AJ Cann in the second or Cedric Ogbuehi who could be a Chris Snee type player for us and keep Pugh at RT?

Edit: This is worded awkwardly.

Edit 2: Okay, so Pugh is solid at RT. If we move Pugh to LG, and he is competent, and draft a new RT at 9 who is solid, we spent the 9th overall pick for a competent player.
Now, assume we draft someone like Cann or Ogbuehi who are solid, or even competent, at 43 (I think thats right), then we spent the 43rd instead of the 9th pick for the same result. However, I still think TC would prefer a vet like Pugh next to Richburg than a rookie, but I've been surprised before.


Last edited by Kodaraw on Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:19 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Kodaraw


Joined: 12 Feb 2013
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NYGCRUZ80 wrote:
I don't believe La'El Collins is worth a top 10 pick. I'd like to trade back to like the Saints and I believe he will still be there, only OL worth top 10 IMO is Scheriff.
Shelton isn't a bad option but can he fit into a 4-3? Cause he's more of a 3-4 NT. I like Brown better at DT but no shot we take him at 9.
Landon Collins is also an option but yet again 9 is a reach for him

Only guy you listed that's worth a pick at 9 IMO is Scheriff, Shelton or Gregory. Maybe Shane Ray but I have doubts about him as a 4-3 DE


We got human centipeded by the run. I will take a 3-4 NT that will stonewall RB's. Thats why I want BJ Raji. Low-risk high-reward player than can stonewall the run and get after the QB.
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Suffering_Bills


Joined: 10 Apr 2006
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Location: Rochester, N.Y.
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kodaraw wrote:
Suffering_Bills wrote:
Kodaraw wrote:
Suffering_Bills wrote:
Kodaraw wrote:
Suffering_Bills wrote:
Kodaraw wrote:
This is by far the worst scenario for us.
Danny Shelton, probably.
Or La'el Collins.

Gregory is out.

We will look for high character, blue-collar guys. Team captains, high football IQ.

I think Collins would be a very sensible pick for you guys.


I think he is less than ideal. Our OL isn't near as bad as people think. We ideally need a LG and spending a first round pick on that, passing on DL or WR, is silly, IMO. But here, every sensible DL is gone except Shelton. Shelton + Hankins + Ellis makes a decent interior considering how often we were abused against the run.

Cooper would be my ideal pick.

An under-the-radar pick could be a CB. We haven't extended Prince or JPP yet. Of course, everyone is under the impression we will. But Prince, Eli, and JPP will be 3 massive signings. Not sure we can afford them all.

You don't buy into the idea of Collins starting right away at RT, moving Pugh inside to guard, thereby strengthening two positions? Confused


I don't buy into the idea that Pugh moving to a position he has never played will strengthen our line, no. However, I think it is more likely we have a veteran next to Richburg than a rookie OL.

Respectfully disagree. I think Pugh would come in and do a competent job at LG, while Collins would be an upgrade at the RT position.


Pugh does an above competent job at RT.
So, wouldn't it better to bring in a LG in the later rounds, like maybe AJ Cann in the second or Cedric Ogbuehi who could be a Chris Snee type player for us and keep Pugh at RT?

Hmmmm. Confused Ogbuehi is a left tackle coming off of ACL surgery. Moot point. A.J. Cann wouldn't be a bad way to go in the 2nd round, if you figure Pugh is THAT good at right tackle.
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