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Why Jay Cutler Could Fall to Us...
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K_LO


Joined: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 987
PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 7:16 pm    Post subject: Why Jay Cutler Could Fall to Us... Reply with quote

I know, I know, as if we needed another post on Cutler. However, this is a different spin.

The general consensus is that if Cutler is drafted in Round 1 before the Dolphins get to him, it would be by the Raiders, Lions, Cardinals or Ravens. Here's my rationale on why he will fall to us, assuming no trades or anything too wacky happens to throw the draft order off.

Raiders

Oakland was 27th in the league in Total defense this year, and 25th against the rush. Their D-Line needs major help. On that note, their D-Line is rapidly getting older. Ted Washington is 37, Hamilton is 34 and Sapp is 33. What may even be scarier, is there 2nd string situation supporting some of the aforementioned. Their back-up NT along w/ both their DE's are UFA's. Meaning, their 1st team is old and ineffective and their 2nd string could all be gone.

I see the Raiders trying to land Mario Williams or Haloti Ngata here. Since the Raiders have drafted 3 CB's in round 1 since 2002, I doubt they look there for Jimmy Williams, but he could be a consideration.

Lions

The Lions just hired a guy who's been coaching the D-Line in Tampa for the past 10 years, so if anyone understands the value of a good D-Line and being able to defend one it's Marinelli. The Lions raned 26th in Rushing Offense this year. While Jones did have some down time at RB, the Rushing woes were the fault of his O-Line. While Jeff Backus may be their lone O-Line hope at LT, he becomes an UFA. At RT, they have Kelly Butler who's been less than stellar. His back-up also becomes an UFA. While the jury is still out on Harrington, I see him battling Orlovsky for the starting spot next season. I imagine Garcia is gone because he too becomes an UFA.

I see the Lions heavily leaning towards Eric Winston or Winston Justice here. I see Backus getting re-signed, but Butler needs to get replaced.

Cardinals

This team is as hard to predict as any. However, many Card fans see the team taking LenDale White or DeAngelo Williams if available. AZ was last in the league in Rushing Offense, so some may argue that landing White will solve things. Others, however, look at their O-Line and see a team of journeymen at best. I share that opinion. Outside of Leonard Davis, who hasn't played up to expectations, their O-Line consists of 4th-5th rounders. I see them going w/ the best OT available.

Rumor also has it that the Cards are working on a new contract for Warner. While it will most likely only be for 1 year, I see him being on board and challenging again for the starting spot next season. Bear in mind that this team finished 1st in the league for Passing Offense. Granted, much of this was due to their lack luster run game. However, they proved that they can still get a ton of yards through the air with their current QB's.

Ravens

Of all the teams drafting before us, this team actually worries me the most. While Boller came on in the end of the year, they may say enough is enough. I'm hoping that M. Huff or J. Williams fall here. While their 1st string CB's are solid, both back-ups are not what they used to be (Carter, Sanders). While Ed Reed is solid at SS, Either guy would be an upgarde over Demps at FS, who is becoming an UFA. OT is a possibility here too. Pace is 35 and Ogden 31. While they do have Adam Terry to fill either spot, who knows if he plays like a round 2 talent. RB could be a solid option too, depending on what they do w/ Lewis. There is a very good chance that DeAngelo Williams falls here. While Lewis is only 26, he's proven to be suspect as of late.

Summary

The teams drafting before us have bigger needs than a QB in my eyes. And, talent sits in the sposts where they need it. There could be 4 OT's taken within the first 15 picks (Ferguson, Winston, Justice, Scott). There are also studs on D like M. Williams, Kiwi, Hawk, Ngata.. that teams may covet. I honestly am okay if we don't get Cutler. I just think the signs are pointing in that direction.
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HebrewHammer


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 7:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great post K_LO. You might just be right, Cutler could fall to us. I wouldn't much mind if he didn't, however (In that case, I'd love to see us get Ko Simpson or Darnell Bing, whom I hope are still there)
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obxboarderphil


Joined: 16 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 7:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

that would be awsome finally gettin a new QB...we got sage as a solid backup so i do think if we could get him it would really help us...also if we got like TO or givens and then we randy and chambers he could do us some good. but we still need some D so i hope he won't be too much money cause i'd love to get hutchinson from seatlee but we wil see
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BrettWolfe


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 7:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

k_lo, I agree. Thats what I've been saying all along. The teams in front of us need other poisitons more than QB's.

Plus Raiders have Andrew Walter who will be a factor for the new head coach.

AS long as Billick is still coach, Kyle" should've been a bowler" boller will be the QB. They will bring in a vet. to compete w/ him.
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Backwoodsboy65


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 8:12 pm    Post subject: Re: Why Jay Cutler Could Fall to Us... Reply with quote

K_LO wrote:
Here's my rationale on why he will fall to us, assuming no trades or anything too wacky happens to throw the draft order off.


Great JOB! But, there is one scenario that I wouldn't be suprised with. It isn't a consensus view and not many people see it as even a possibility, but hey, I'll throw it out there. Most people think that Leinart will be the first QB off the board and it will leave the Tennessee Titans to select Vince Young. I'm not sold on the Titans taking Young right now. I really think that there is a fair chance that the Titans pass on Young and take Jay Cutler at #3. Yeah, I said it, Cutler could go 3rd in the draft, IFF Leinart is taken. But, if Leinart isn't then I would fully expect the Titans to take him.
To explain further, I think it is a likely possibility that Leinart could pull a J.Elway or E.Manning on the Saints. Let's face it, it isn't a good situation. Leinart is a cocky guy. He will look at what Eli and Elway have done and figure that he can do that also.
The Saints have already said that they will develop a QB. So, if you are the Saints, do you hold Leinart and trade him to a lower team that would want him? Then who do you get for your Franchise QB? What if Tennessee would take Young and want to hold onto him? Will someone give us the value that Leinart really possesses? There are too many chances with this. Peyton said he is ready to DEVELOP a QB. If I am the Saints, if Leinart pulls crap, I just take Young. That lets Leinart fall to the Titans. Chow won't let him fall any further, and Cutler could fall to us. But, IFF Leinart is fine with New Orleans, you may see Cutler go quicker than many anticipate.
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BrettWolfe


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 8:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I heard on PTI that Leinarts agent said Leinart is fine w/ being picked by NO. If McNair stays in Tenn. i fully expect Tenn. will take Young no doubt.
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gocanes817


Joined: 13 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One thing I read on the Baltimore Forum was a post regarding a comment made by Billick on radio.

Stated that he is concerned about his running game, didnt specify whether his need was another RB or OL, but I would think OL with them getting up in age.

Just thought I would put that out there knowing that we are a little worried about the Ravens drafting Cutler.

Have a great day!!!!!!
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K_LO


Joined: 20 Sep 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 10:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HebrewHammer wrote:
Great post K_LO. You might just be right, Cutler could fall to us. I wouldn't much mind if he didn't, however (In that case, I'd love to see us get Ko Simpson or Darnell Bing, whom I hope are still there)


Thanks!

Yeah, I wouldn't mind either of those guys playing in the Outfield for us. Either would a a great upgrade.
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K_LO


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 10:10 pm    Post subject: Re: Why Jay Cutler Could Fall to Us... Reply with quote

Backwoodsboy65 wrote:
K_LO wrote:
Here's my rationale on why he will fall to us, assuming no trades or anything too wacky happens to throw the draft order off.


Great JOB! But, there is one scenario that I wouldn't be suprised with. It isn't a consensus view and not many people see it as even a possibility, but hey, I'll throw it out there. Most people think that Leinart will be the first QB off the board and it will leave the Tennessee Titans to select Vince Young. I'm not sold on the Titans taking Young right now. I really think that there is a fair chance that the Titans pass on Young and take Jay Cutler at #3. Yeah, I said it, Cutler could go 3rd in the draft, IFF Leinart is taken. But, if Leinart isn't then I would fully expect the Titans to take him.
To explain further, I think it is a likely possibility that Leinart could pull a J.Elway or E.Manning on the Saints. Let's face it, it isn't a good situation. Leinart is a cocky guy. He will look at what Eli and Elway have done and figure that he can do that also.
The Saints have already said that they will develop a QB. So, if you are the Saints, do you hold Leinart and trade him to a lower team that would want him? Then who do you get for your Franchise QB? What if Tennessee would take Young and want to hold onto him? Will someone give us the value that Leinart really possesses? There are too many chances with this. Peyton said he is ready to DEVELOP a QB. If I am the Saints, if Leinart pulls crap, I just take Young. That lets Leinart fall to the Titans. Chow won't let him fall any further, and Cutler could fall to us. But, IFF Leinart is fine with New Orleans, you may see Cutler go quicker than many anticipate.


That could happen indeed. The operative word in my opening sentence was wacky. As we know, crazy things happen on draft day.
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phinsforlife


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 11:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vert well done i like your work
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Backwoodsboy65


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 12:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BrettWolfe wrote:
I heard on PTI that Leinarts agent said Leinart is fine w/ being picked by NO. If McNair stays in Tenn. i fully expect Tenn. will take Young no doubt.


No Doubt???

Here is a little insider I have...

A Quote from the Titans GM, Floyd Reese, about Jay Cutler:
Quote:
"I think before the workouts, he is probably projected about the third (QB) in the draft,'' Reese said of Cutler. "Now what happens after workouts is of course a different story. He is probably a pretty good blend between Young and Leinart. I think he will (climb)."


There is still a lot of rising and falling to do, and anyone, even Young or Leinart could fall come draft day.
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ovaw8lover


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 9:23 am    Post subject: Re: Why Jay Cutler Could Fall to Us... Reply with quote

K_LO wrote:
I know, I know, as if we needed another post on Cutler. However, this is a different spin.

The general consensus is that if Cutler is drafted in Round 1 before the Dolphins get to him, it would be by the Raiders, Lions, Cardinals or Ravens. Here's my rationale on why he will fall to us, assuming no trades or anything too wacky happens to throw the draft order off.

Raiders

Oakland was 27th in the league in Total defense this year, and 25th against the rush. Their D-Line needs major help. On that note, their D-Line is rapidly getting older. Ted Washington is 37, Hamilton is 34 and Sapp is 33. What may even be scarier, is there 2nd string situation supporting some of the aforementioned. Their back-up NT along w/ both their DE's are UFA's. Meaning, their 1st team is old and ineffective and their 2nd string could all be gone.

I see the Raiders trying to land Mario Williams or Haloti Ngata here. Since the Raiders have drafted 3 CB's in round 1 since 2002, I doubt they look there for Jimmy Williams, but he could be a consideration.

Lions

The Lions just hired a guy who's been coaching the D-Line in Tampa for the past 10 years, so if anyone understands the value of a good D-Line and being able to defend one it's Marinelli. The Lions raned 26th in Rushing Offense this year. While Jones did have some down time at RB, the Rushing woes were the fault of his O-Line. While Jeff Backus may be their lone O-Line hope at LT, he becomes an UFA. At RT, they have Kelly Butler who's been less than stellar. His back-up also becomes an UFA. While the jury is still out on Harrington, I see him battling Orlovsky for the starting spot next season. I imagine Garcia is gone because he too becomes an UFA.

I see the Lions heavily leaning towards Eric Winston or Winston Justice here. I see Backus getting re-signed, but Butler needs to get replaced.

Cardinals

This team is as hard to predict as any. However, many Card fans see the team taking LenDale White or DeAngelo Williams if available. AZ was last in the league in Rushing Offense, so some may argue that landing White will solve things. Others, however, look at their O-Line and see a team of journeymen at best. I share that opinion. Outside of Leonard Davis, who hasn't played up to expectations, their O-Line consists of 4th-5th rounders. I see them going w/ the best OT available.

Rumor also has it that the Cards are working on a new contract for Warner. While it will most likely only be for 1 year, I see him being on board and challenging again for the starting spot next season. Bear in mind that this team finished 1st in the league for Passing Offense. Granted, much of this was due to their lack luster run game. However, they proved that they can still get a ton of yards through the air with their current QB's.

Ravens

Of all the teams drafting before us, this team actually worries me the most. While Boller came on in the end of the year, they may say enough is enough. I'm hoping that M. Huff or J. Williams fall here. While their 1st string CB's are solid, both back-ups are not what they used to be (Carter, Sanders). While Ed Reed is solid at SS, Either guy would be an upgarde over Demps at FS, who is becoming an UFA. OT is a possibility here too. Pace is 35 and Ogden 31. While they do have Adam Terry to fill either spot, who knows if he plays like a round 2 talent. RB could be a solid option too, depending on what they do w/ Lewis. There is a very good chance that DeAngelo Williams falls here. While Lewis is only 26, he's proven to be suspect as of late.

Summary

The teams drafting before us have bigger needs than a QB in my eyes. And, talent sits in the sposts where they need it. There could be 4 OT's taken within the first 15 picks (Ferguson, Winston, Justice, Scott). There are also studs on D like M. Williams, Kiwi, Hawk, Ngata.. that teams may covet. I honestly am okay if we don't get Cutler. I just think the signs are pointing in that direction.


K_LO you are absolutely correct. Cutler will be there for the Dolphins to select but here is the question I have. Are we forcing ourselves to take Cutler at QB with our 16th pick because we have a need or does he warrant to be drafted that high? I do not think he is a top 16 pick and if the Dolphins draft based on "best available player" then I do not believe we should select him with this pick. I hope one of the aformentioned teams select Jay Cutler because that would allow us to select a real position of need: Lineman, possibly even a safety.
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Fishfan79


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 9:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

when is the combine and senior bowl next weekend?
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K_LO


Joined: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 987
PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 10:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fishfan79 wrote:
when is the combine and senior bowl next weekend?


The combine is February 22-28th I believe, and the Sr. Bowl is a week from tomorrow. Tomorrow is the East-West Shrine game follwed by the Hula Bowl.
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K_LO


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 10:37 am    Post subject: Re: Why Jay Cutler Could Fall to Us... Reply with quote

ovaw8lover wrote:
K_LO wrote:
I know, I know, as if we needed another post on Cutler. However, this is a different spin.

The general consensus is that if Cutler is drafted in Round 1 before the Dolphins get to him, it would be by the Raiders, Lions, Cardinals or Ravens. Here's my rationale on why he will fall to us, assuming no trades or anything too wacky happens to throw the draft order off.

Raiders

Oakland was 27th in the league in Total defense this year, and 25th against the rush. Their D-Line needs major help. On that note, their D-Line is rapidly getting older. Ted Washington is 37, Hamilton is 34 and Sapp is 33. What may even be scarier, is there 2nd string situation supporting some of the aforementioned. Their back-up NT along w/ both their DE's are UFA's. Meaning, their 1st team is old and ineffective and their 2nd string could all be gone.

I see the Raiders trying to land Mario Williams or Haloti Ngata here. Since the Raiders have drafted 3 CB's in round 1 since 2002, I doubt they look there for Jimmy Williams, but he could be a consideration.

Lions

The Lions just hired a guy who's been coaching the D-Line in Tampa for the past 10 years, so if anyone understands the value of a good D-Line and being able to defend one it's Marinelli. The Lions raned 26th in Rushing Offense this year. While Jones did have some down time at RB, the Rushing woes were the fault of his O-Line. While Jeff Backus may be their lone O-Line hope at LT, he becomes an UFA. At RT, they have Kelly Butler who's been less than stellar. His back-up also becomes an UFA. While the jury is still out on Harrington, I see him battling Orlovsky for the starting spot next season. I imagine Garcia is gone because he too becomes an UFA.

I see the Lions heavily leaning towards Eric Winston or Winston Justice here. I see Backus getting re-signed, but Butler needs to get replaced.

Cardinals

This team is as hard to predict as any. However, many Card fans see the team taking LenDale White or DeAngelo Williams if available. AZ was last in the league in Rushing Offense, so some may argue that landing White will solve things. Others, however, look at their O-Line and see a team of journeymen at best. I share that opinion. Outside of Leonard Davis, who hasn't played up to expectations, their O-Line consists of 4th-5th rounders. I see them going w/ the best OT available.

Rumor also has it that the Cards are working on a new contract for Warner. While it will most likely only be for 1 year, I see him being on board and challenging again for the starting spot next season. Bear in mind that this team finished 1st in the league for Passing Offense. Granted, much of this was due to their lack luster run game. However, they proved that they can still get a ton of yards through the air with their current QB's.

Ravens

Of all the teams drafting before us, this team actually worries me the most. While Boller came on in the end of the year, they may say enough is enough. I'm hoping that M. Huff or J. Williams fall here. While their 1st string CB's are solid, both back-ups are not what they used to be (Carter, Sanders). While Ed Reed is solid at SS, Either guy would be an upgarde over Demps at FS, who is becoming an UFA. OT is a possibility here too. Pace is 35 and Ogden 31. While they do have Adam Terry to fill either spot, who knows if he plays like a round 2 talent. RB could be a solid option too, depending on what they do w/ Lewis. There is a very good chance that DeAngelo Williams falls here. While Lewis is only 26, he's proven to be suspect as of late.

Summary

The teams drafting before us have bigger needs than a QB in my eyes. And, talent sits in the sposts where they need it. There could be 4 OT's taken within the first 15 picks (Ferguson, Winston, Justice, Scott). There are also studs on D like M. Williams, Kiwi, Hawk, Ngata.. that teams may covet. I honestly am okay if we don't get Cutler. I just think the signs are pointing in that direction.


K_LO you are absolutely correct. Cutler will be there for the Dolphins to select but here is the question I have. Are we forcing ourselves to take Cutler at QB with our 16th pick because we have a need or does he warrant to be drafted that high? I do not think he is a top 16 pick and if the Dolphins draft based on "best available player" then I do not believe we should select him with this pick. I hope one of the aformentioned teams select Jay Cutler because that would allow us to select a real position of need: Lineman, possibly even a safety.


To answer your question, yes and no on a couple of different fronts. If Cutler falls to us, I do think that we'd force ourselves to take him. Why? Because we haven't placed any credence on the QB position since we had Marino. The time has more than passed for us to do so. While opinions vary about Cutler, I have yet to read a recent article on him that doesn't list him as the 3rd best QB nor a 1st Round pick. So he is solid. While there are other good QB prospects, there is some drop-off after Cutler. Jacobs and Croyle both come with concerns...

Will Jay be the BPA at the 16th pick? Probably not. My guess is that an OT will be. And, there are huge risks in taking a QB in Round 1. I just read an article that talks about what busts Shuler, Mirer, Leaf, etc. were. For the most part, when you compare Round 1 O-Lineman vs. Round 1 QB's, OT's usually end up being more worth the pick. Furthermore, go back and look at the past Playoff and SuperBowl winners and scope at their O-Line. Most are compromised of high draft picks, not day 2 guys.

When it all shakes out, we could still get an OT in Round 2 like Whitworth or Trueblood. While neither are spectacular, either would be an upgrade. To be honest, I'm looking more at rounds 3-4 right now. To me, those are huge picks for us. Heck, I'm even looking at our 4 picks in Round 7. While Round 7 is usually a bust round, this draft is so deep that a gem could be found there.
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