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Jason Smith and Eugene Monroe: Not Top 10 Picks?
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RashaanSalaami


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 7:28 pm    Post subject: Jason Smith and Eugene Monroe: Not Top 10 Picks? Reply with quote

Here's a post I found interesting from the NFL Draft forum. Read through it then I'll explain a little more.

Big Cat wrote:
I wanted to post this video clip http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d80f0e6e2 from the NFL Network, where Charles Davis and Charley Casserly discuss Jason Smith (OT, Baylor). Contrary to popular opinion, Casserly had some complaints about Smith's work out and his overall potential.

"Jason Smith and Eugene Monroe (are) really not true top 10 offensive tackles" - Charlie Casserly

It's not an opinion I've read or heard anywhere else since the combine. Casserly has his critics, but he is credited with drafting five eventual pro-bowlers in Houston and was known to have played a crucial part in the decision to draft Mario Williams instead of Reggie Bush. It would be a huge surprise if Smith and Monroe weren't taken in the top ten, but here's something to consider. If you could have either, or instead choose Ryan Clady - who would you go for? Clady was drafted 12th overall by Denver in 2008. Another thing, to all you mockers, please stop giving the Lions Jason Smith at #1.


Now what I found most interesting about that post is in those last few sentences.

If you had the option between Jason Smith or Eugene Monroe this season or Ryan Clady last season (knowing only what you knew as of last April), which would you take?

For me, it would be hands down Ryan Clady. That also goes to show the strength of last year's class compared to this year.
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packfan4


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 7:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ryan Clady, NO DOUBT ABOUT IT. Jason Smith reminds me of Clady some but Clady is more polished and better in the Run Game. The top of this Draft class is just very, very, weak. The only guy in this Draft who I think would go Top 10 in every Draft is Aaron Curry.
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IrishGreen


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 7:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would take Jason Smith. His athletiscism is through the roof for a tackle and I don't even think he's fully scratched the surface of his potential. He's got great size and I've heard his overall character and work ethic is very good. This is why he is number one on my big board for the Packers at 9.
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ugLymayNe


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 7:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

They are top 10 picks in this draft.

But I would take Clady before them for sure.


I would rank them:

Clady
Monroe
Williams
Albert
J. Smith
A. Smith
Otah
Oher
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IrishGreen


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 7:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ugLymayNe wrote:
They are top 10 picks in this draft.

But I would take Clady before them for sure.


I would rank them:

Clady
Monroe
Williams
Albert
J. Smith
A. Smith
Otah
Oher



Didn't Brandon Albert have a pretty below-average to average year last year? I know that he was a rookie LT, but when you watch Joe Thomas and Jake Long have the success they did, it's hard to justify Albert not showing more than what he did. He never impressed me much as a prospect. I would put him below Oher on your list.
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ugLymayNe


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 8:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joe Thomas and Jake Long were top five picks, and I didn't include Long for that reason.

Maybe you should read Rashaan's first post....................


Quote:
If you had the option between Jason Smith or Eugene Monroe this season or Ryan Clady last season (knowing only what you knew as of last April), which would you take?



He played as a rookie. He had his ups and downs like most rookies do. Its not like KC is a good team or anything. Laughing
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IrishGreen


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 8:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ugLymayNe wrote:
Joe Thomas and Jake Long were top five picks, and I didn't include Long for that reason.

Maybe you should read Rashaan's first post....................


Quote:
If you had the option between Jason Smith or Eugene Monroe this season or Ryan Clady last season (knowing only what you knew as of last April), which would you take?



He played as a rookie. He had his ups and downs like most rookies do. Its not like KC is a good team or anything. Laughing



My point was that he didn't make an impact of all, and I don't really care if you're a top 5 pick or not. If you're a first round pick, you should be able to make a good impact (the exception maybe being QB). I mean even Otah is looking like one of the game's best RT's right now. Obviously RT is a little easier than LT, but take it for what it's worth. I mean we're kind of going off topic here, but I really don't like Albert as an NFL prospect in the future. I think he may end up playing guard in the NFL.
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palmy50


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 8:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

First of all I had a higher grade on Clady than Long last year and I'm sure I was not the only one. I would have been more than OK with Clady at #1 last year and I bet more than a few GM's would have taken him there.

In short, Clady was a better prospect than both Smith and Monroe but most years Clady sure as hell would not have made it out of the top five.

You can look at that thing two ways, Williams went two picks after Clady and I have a much higher grade on Monroe than I had on Williams. One could make a very strong case for Smith falling because he is VERY raw and I have said from day one that Big Andre is still over him on my board.
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palmy50


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RashaanSalaami, How many LT's in the past ten years did you have over Monroe's grade? It's a very small group for me (Samuels, McKinnie, Gross, Thomas, & Clady) and if you take away the college injuries he very well could be at the top (not over McKinnie's Draft grade). VERY SMOOTH big men are hard to find and you just can't teach those feet!
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packerbacker87


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 10:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

palmy50 wrote:
One could make a very strong case for Smith falling because he is VERY raw and I have said from day one that Big Andre is still over him on my board.


Palmy, I would really like to see "your board". Seriously. What does your top ten look like. I bet its different than many others on here. Also, what do you take into most consideration when having a player high on a board. Workouts, Comine, or just overall production? If it is a secret I will understand Razz
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RashaanSalaami


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 10:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

palmy50 wrote:
RashaanSalaami, How many LT's in the past ten years did you have over Monroe's grade? It's a very small group for me (Samuels, McKinnie, Gross, Thomas, & Clady) and if you take away the college injuries he very well could be at the top (not over McKinnie's Draft grade). VERY SMOOTH big men are hard to find and you just can't teach those feet!


Of all responses, I was curious as to what you had to say about the issue, but I had completely forgotten that you were incredibly high on Ryan Clady.

I wish I could say I've been following the draft religiously for ten years, but I can't. I've only been in it for like 5 years or so, so there's still a ton that I'm learning about the process. I feel like I'm getting significantly better each and every year. Over those 5 years, I would say the prospects I would have ranked better than Monroe are:

Marcus McNeill, Joe Thomas, Jake Long, and Ryan Clady. I'd also put him on the level of D'Brick. Not to take the cop out route, but I still haven't seen as much of Eugene Monroe as I have the others. The knees are really a big concerns with me, but you're dead right in that his feet are something that don't come around more than a couple times a decade. I saw him a couple times early in the year and he was really a little inconsistent to me. I had Clady in the 6-10 range last year, a tad behind Long, so I think this year's draft class is a little worse at the top than last year's.

Most of all, he's reppin Jersey!!! Very Happy
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RashaanSalaami


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 10:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

packerbacker87 wrote:
palmy50 wrote:
One could make a very strong case for Smith falling because he is VERY raw and I have said from day one that Big Andre is still over him on my board.


Palmy, I would really like to see "your board". Seriously. What does your top ten look like. I bet its different than many others on here. Also, what do you take into most consideration when having a player high on a board. Workouts, Comine, or just overall production? If it is a secret I will understand Razz


It has to be overall production. Not necessarily just production, but their resume on the field. This includes potential and flashes which may not directly translate to collegiate production. All of these workouts are nice and they give teams a good chance to sit down with the players, talk with them, and get more familiar with their personalities, but only in rare instances should incredible workouts really influence your board. If I know palmy well enough, I'd say it's something along those lines.

I love the Combine but the most important numbers are the ones that are overlooked: height, weight, arm length. For most positions, these are the best numbers you can produce in Indianapolis. The 40 dash is clearly the most fun to observe and compare though. Smile
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palmy50


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 10:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

packerbacker87 wrote:
palmy50 wrote:
One could make a very strong case for Smith falling because he is VERY raw and I have said from day one that Big Andre is still over him on my board.


Palmy, I would really like to see "your board". Seriously. What does your top ten look like. I bet its different than many others on here. Also, what do you take into most consideration when having a player high on a board. Workouts, Comine, or just overall production? If it is a secret I will understand Razz


Packers big board: (also the only players I'm OK with at #9 for us)

1. Monroe
2. Curry
3. J smith (I have him over Big Andre for us because I don't see Andre as a pass blocking = with DC)
4. Raji
5. Maybin
6. Big Andre (DC makes that pick a push for me but Andre is a stud)
7. Brown
8. Jackson
9. Cushing
10. Orakpo (love him at DE)
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palmy50


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 10:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RashaanSalaami wrote:
packerbacker87 wrote:
palmy50 wrote:
One could make a very strong case for Smith falling because he is VERY raw and I have said from day one that Big Andre is still over him on my board.


Palmy, I would really like to see "your board". Seriously. What does your top ten look like. I bet its different than many others on here. Also, what do you take into most consideration when having a player high on a board. Workouts, Comine, or just overall production? If it is a secret I will understand Razz


It has to be overall production. Not necessarily just production, but their resume on the field. This includes potential and flashes which may not directly translate to collegiate production. All of these workouts are nice and they give teams a good chance to sit down with the players, talk with them, and get more familiar with their personalities, but only in rare instances should incredible workouts really influence your board. If I know palmy well enough, I'd say it's something along those lines.

I love the Combine but the most important numbers are the ones that are overlooked: height, weight, arm length. For most positions, these are the best numbers you can produce in Indianapolis. The 40 dash is clearly the most fun to observe and compare though. Smile


YEP YEP!
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palmy50


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 10:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

palmy50 wrote:
packerbacker87 wrote:
palmy50 wrote:
One could make a very strong case for Smith falling because he is VERY raw and I have said from day one that Big Andre is still over him on my board.


Palmy, I would really like to see "your board". Seriously. What does your top ten look like. I bet its different than many others on here. Also, what do you take into most consideration when having a player high on a board. Workouts, Comine, or just overall production? If it is a secret I will understand Razz


Packers big board: (also the only players I'm OK with at #9 for us)

1. Monroe
2. Curry
3. J smith (I have him over Big Andre for us because I don't see Andre as a pass blocking = with DC)
4. Raji
5. Maybin
6. Big Andre (DC makes that pick a push for me but Andre is a stud)
7. Brown
8. Jackson
9. Cushing
10. Orakpo (love him at DE)


I would have a small issue with the last three and I do have Big Andre over J Smith on my general board.

General Board:

1. Monroe
2. Curry
3. Orakpo (4-3 DE)
4. Big Andre
5. Raji
6. Crabtree
7. J Smith
8. Stafford (would be OK with him at #1 if team had a need)
9. Maybin
10. Maclin (push with him and Jenkins at safety)
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