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Harper41


Joined: 29 Aug 2009
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 30, 2014 8:08 pm    Post subject: Something to ponder... Reply with quote

Is CB really a huge need? I think Corey White performed much better than we've given him credit for... His coverage statistics were as follows.

343 snaps, 57 targets, 32 receptions, 335 yards, 4 TDs and 1 INT.

He was thrust into a starting role after Greers injury but I think people are far too focused on the few big plays he allowed and not how well he performed overall. I think another CB would certainly help but I think Corey White is going to develop into a very nice #2 CB.
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Harper41


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 30, 2014 8:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also, Malcolm Jenkins sucked...Again.
457 snaps, 48 targets, 36 receptions, 486 yards allowed, 2 TDs allowed, 2 INTs
All while having 14 missed tackles...In comparison, Harper and Vaccaro had 5 misses tackles combined...
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Saint-Anger_13


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 30, 2014 8:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, given that Greer maybe done after his injury. White has shown he is a good 2nd corner at best. Jenkins, well he is off and on. I won't say he's horrible, but with the game on the line I wouldn't trust him to deliver. CB can be argued to be the 2nd need on this team, if not WR.
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Harper41


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 30, 2014 8:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Saint-Anger_13 wrote:
Yes, given that Greer maybe done after his injury. White has shown he is a good 2nd corner at best. Jenkins, well he is off and on. I won't say he's horrible, but with the game on the line I wouldn't trust him to deliver. CB can be argued to be the 2nd need on this team, if not WR.

I wouldn't say he's horrible, but I'd say he's average at best.
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Harper41


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 30, 2014 8:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rafael Bush in 600 snaps...
Thrown at 12 times, allowed 6 catches, 50% completion percentage, 0 TDs allowed... While only missing 1 tackle.

I think Bush needs to be given a chance to start next year.
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Spartica4Real


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 30, 2014 8:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Harper41 wrote:
Rafael Bush in 600 snaps...
Thrown at 12 times, allowed 6 catches, 50% completion percentage, 0 TDs allowed... While only missing 1 tackle.

I think Bush needs to be given a chance to start next year.


If your somebody who listens to PFF, he was by far our best graded defender last season, as well as this season.

While I don't really trust PFF to give accurate assessments a lot of the time, I do agree with that. I just notice it while watching him. He definitely needs to start alongside Vaccaro next season. Not sure who our other starter will be though, considering we run 3 safety sets.

Also, on White, I think he could be our #2 corner but he was very inconsistent this season IMO. Like in the Atlanta game he just got completely picked on, by an UDFA rookie at that. Though there were games where he was shutdown as well, like the Panthers games.
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Saint-Anger_13


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 30, 2014 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Harper41 wrote:
Rafael Bush in 600 snaps...
Thrown at 12 times, allowed 6 catches, 50% completion percentage, 0 TDs allowed... While only missing 1 tackle.

I think Bush needs to be given a chance to start next year.


I would agree, Bush did his job and didn't mess up too much.
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Raves


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 30, 2014 11:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry if I missed it during the season but how did Bush get so many more snaps than Jenkins and also didn't Jenkins typically get put onto the WRs and TEs compared to just playing deep which means he would be targeted more often and likely give up more plays, especially the underneath routes?
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Harper41


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 30, 2014 11:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Raves wrote:
Sorry if I missed it during the season but how did Bush get so many more snaps than Jenkins and also didn't Jenkins typically get put onto the WRs and TEs compared to just playing deep which means he would be targeted more often and likely give up more plays, especially the underneath routes?

Regardless of where Jenkins lined up, he gave up lots of catches and was horrific in run defense. He needs to go. Especially with Bush out performing him by a good margin.
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FLOODx


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 30, 2014 11:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think RT is our biggest need, but I can't see us drafting one in round 1. CB is the biggest possibility because of the transformation of the NFL and P Rob/Greer situation. Look what the Seahawks are able to do with 3 corners that can man up on nearly any receiving core. With a trio of corners: Lewis, White, 1st round pick and the pass rush of Galette, Jordan, and Butler our defense could be even better than it was this season. If we don't go CB or DB in general in round 1 then I want a beastly WR or ILB.
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whodatworm23


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 30, 2014 11:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As far as corner, I do feel it's our biggest need... at this moment but that could all change. I feel it's a big need now for a few reasons...

1. Rob Ryan's dependency on solid play at the position.
2. The health and future status of Jabari Greer & Patrick Robinson.
3. The uncertain future development of Corey White.

Keenan Lewis is a stud and has one starting spot on lock down but in todays NFL your 3rd and even 4th corners play almost as much as some of you linebackers. Yes Ryan utilizes a 3 safety look but that could change moving forward. Rafael Bush is clearly the better player over Jenkins and Harper and Vaccaro is a future star. I do see White (if no FA is signed) entering the season as the starting #2 corner but I'd LOVE to see a guy like TCU's Jason Verrett thrown into the mix.

As far as BPA in this upcoming draft... the offensive tackle position is beginning to stand out to me in the latter part of round one. With top prospects like Auburn's Greg Robinson, A&M's Jake Matthews and ND's Zack Martin likely to all go in the top 15 picks... other prospects such as Michigan's Taylor Lewan, Alabama's Cyrus Koundjio, Tennessee's Antonio Richardson and Virginia's Morgan Moses are likely to be very tempting at 27.

Yes, Terron Armstead looked very good but if a OT is indeed the best player on the board at 27 I have no doubt that Loomis would pull the trigger. It's true that lately the Saints have opted for developing later round prospects at the position but they aren't afforded that luxury any more and might need someone to come in and start immediately on the right side if Streif is not retained.

It's also not like Loomis is steadfast against a 1st round offensive lineman, he did draft Jamal Brown 14th overall a few years ago.
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Harper41


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 1:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe our former GM Randy Mueller drafted Jamal Brown, not Loomis. Could be wrong though.
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whodatworm23


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 8:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Harper41 wrote:
I believe our former GM Randy Mueller drafted Jamal Brown, not Loomis. Could be wrong though.


What???

Brown was drafted 13th overall in the 2005 NFL draft, Muller was fired by Benson after the 2001 season and promoted Loomis to GM beginning of the 2002 season.

Loomis inherited Jim Haslett from the Muller regime and had to deal with him and his power struggle when it came to the roster until the famed 2003 NFL draft where the Saints traded two 1st round picks to move up and draft bust Jonathan Sullivan. This was the last move Haslett was to make with total control of the roster and during the 2003 season after it became clear that the Saints made a big mistake, Haslett began to lose favor in New Orleans and Benson shifted power of the roster to Loomis heading into the offseason.

In 2004, Loomis had veto power on the roster but by the 2005 NFL draft Loomis had a complete and total control of the roster as Haslett was looked at as a lame duck coach and would eventually be replaced sooner or later. Haslett entered the 2005 season with a bleak future in the Big Easy but Hurricane Katrina basically sealed his fate as the team dealt through many obstacles. Haslett's time in New Orleans began a downward spiral after the firing of Muller and his quest for control over the roster. He became a malcontent behind the scenes and a cancer in the organization as the writing on the wall became clear that Mickey Loomis was the guy that Benson was going to lean on to build the team.

Make no mistake... Jamal Brown was the 1st true draft selection of the Loomis era and he was actually a pretty good one for a good while. In 2006 Loomis fired Haslett and hired Payton and the rest is history. I love Sean Payton but I have always felt that Mickey Loomis is the true architect of this organization and a guy who truly does not get the credit he deserves.
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SWATcha


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 12:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Something to ponder... Reply with quote

Harper41 wrote:
Is CB really a huge need? I think Corey White performed much better than we've given him credit for... His coverage statistics were as follows.


I'm not sure I trust White as the #2. He was really starting to shine as the nickel corner before Greer went down. Personally, I would rather bring in a veteran corner (Verner?), move White back to nickel and draft a guy like Pryor. That has the makings of one hell of a secondary.

Lewis
Verner
White
Vaccaro
Bush
Pryor
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Fray32


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 1:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Harper41 wrote:
Rafael Bush in 600 snaps...
Thrown at 12 times, allowed 6 catches, 50% completion percentage, 0 TDs allowed... While only missing 1 tackle.

I think Bush needs to be given a chance to start next year.
Bush and Vaccaro, I've been preaching this for time (just not on ff)

Bush brings a certain physical presence to this team that is sorely lacking and non existent in years past. When he rocked Edelam and Harvin I got hype as ****, imagine how pumped everyone else on the defense got when that happens.
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