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Darbsk


Joined: 21 Oct 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 25, 2014 11:31 am    Post subject: Rookie Review Reply with quote

It's coming up that time that cuts have to be made and the rookies have 1 more pre-season chance to impress and push for those final roster spots.

Some guys have established themselves, others are still on the bubble I think we've seen enough so far to make some predictions and assesments over whether or not this class of rookies will be the ones to kick-start the Raiders revival.

Here are my initial thoughts after the draft process (in italics) and revised thoughts after 3 pre-season games and training camp:

Khalil Mack: He will be fast enough and what he lacks in outright speed he'll make up with power, he's not the 'Von Miller' clone some people are hoping for but he could be a more rounded playmaker I feel who contributes not so much in sacks but more in pass defence and run support.

Started slowly but he's coming along nicely and looks a very good all round player. I think we've been keeping him back a little in the exhibition games and he will see more action going after the passer in the regular season. Looking good for the future at this point.

Derek Carr: If he gets at least 12 months learning and not forced into action I think he has the possibility to be a decent starting QB for us, I don't think he'll ever be a top 10 QB though, standing tall and making the correct throws under pressure will be his achilles heel.

He's better than I expected and if he gets a smooth transition into the team next year could be the guy moving forward. Great arm, competitor and is working to iron out the creases. Has handled the pressure admirably so far and hasn't made too mnay rash decisions which you normally see in a rookie.

Gabe Jackson: This guy will be great! Has suprising technique and close quarter movement for such a big guy and with good coaching and experience around him will be in the Pro Bowl in a couple years.

I still think he'll be great.........has a few mental mistakes to clean up but looks like he will be a rock in our OL for the next decade.

Justin Ellis: Reggie views him as the heir apparent to Pat Sims, the more I see of him the better he seems and I have the feeling he will handle his weight and anchor our D for the next 10 years doing a solid if unspectacular job and allowing our 'stars' to get the attention.

Impressed with his limited game time and is more athletic and better and getting pressure than I thought he would be. Could get a lot of playing time this year, maintaing his weight will be key for his long term success.

Keith McGill: I can see him sticking with us as he grows and giving us a few good years of #2 CB play (I'm thinking Chris Johnson), don't think he's savvy enough to be a turnover machine but in limited man coverage he'll be solid.

Not impressed thus far, his tackling and run D can be good but he looks stiff in the hips and is a work in progress at CB. He has potential though so I think he could sneak into the 53 on special teams.

Travis Carrie: Returns guy who is cut by the start of the season IMHO.

The big suprise of TC and pre-season. I couldn't have been more wrong Embarassed and after doing a decent job against Nelson and Rodgers he's passed the sternest test for me. A lock to make the team and arguably the best CB so far this year!

Shelby Harris: He'll hang around for a couple years then get cut. I think this was a long shot based on measurables and potential.

Another big suprise and while he looks very raw in certain situations, he seems to have the knack of getting pressure. He's learned and set the edge better last going off, will definately make the team and will contribute in a rotational capacity.

Jonathan Dowling: I think we'll be seeing a lot more of this young man in the future as he learns from CWood, very interesting prospect who will be groomed to take over from CWood. Boom rather than Bust who'll make big plays and be a ball hawk.

At this moment in time he looks like too much work to put right. You can't inject guts into a guy and his tackling is that of a intimidated player. He hasn't shown the coverage skills either and will be cut shortly......man, was I wrong on that one!

What do you guys think of the rookies so far in relation to your initial draft opinions.......is there anyone who's suprised and a player that's dissappointed? Who's going to miss the cut?
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Dat Raider


Joined: 20 Oct 2008
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Location: London aka LDN
PostPosted: Mon Aug 25, 2014 1:20 pm    Post subject: Re: Rookie Review Reply with quote

Darbsk wrote:
It's coming up that time that cuts have to be made and the rookies have 1 more pre-season chance to impress and push for those final roster spots.

Some guys have established themselves, others are still on the bubble I think we've seen enough so far to make some predictions and assesments over whether or not this class of rookies will be the ones to kick-start the Raiders revival.

Here are my initial thoughts after the draft process (in italics) and revised thoughts after 3 pre-season games and training camp:

Khalil Mack: He will be fast enough and what he lacks in outright speed he'll make up with power, he's not the 'Von Miller' clone some people are hoping for but he could be a more rounded playmaker I feel who contributes not so much in sacks but more in pass defence and run support.

Started slowly but he's coming along nicely and looks a very good all round player. I think we've been keeping him back a little in the exhibition games and he will see more action going after the passer in the regular season. Looking good for the future at this point.

Derek Carr: If he gets at least 12 months learning and not forced into action I think he has the possibility to be a decent starting QB for us, I don't think he'll ever be a top 10 QB though, standing tall and making the correct throws under pressure will be his achilles heel.

He's better than I expected and if he gets a smooth transition into the team next year could be the guy moving forward. Great arm, competitor and is working to iron out the creases. Has handled the pressure admirably so far and hasn't made too mnay rash decisions which you normally see in a rookie.

Gabe Jackson: This guy will be great! Has suprising technique and close quarter movement for such a big guy and with good coaching and experience around him will be in the Pro Bowl in a couple years.

I still think he'll be great.........has a few mental mistakes to clean up but looks like he will be a rock in our OL for the next decade.

Justin Ellis: Reggie views him as the heir apparent to Pat Sims, the more I see of him the better he seems and I have the feeling he will handle his weight and anchor our D for the next 10 years doing a solid if unspectacular job and allowing our 'stars' to get the attention.

Impressed with his limited game time and is more athletic and better and getting pressure than I thought he would be. Could get a lot of playing time this year, maintaing his weight will be key for his long term success.

Keith McGill: I can see him sticking with us as he grows and giving us a few good years of #2 CB play (I'm thinking Chris Johnson), don't think he's savvy enough to be a turnover machine but in limited man coverage he'll be solid.

Not impressed thus far, his tackling and run D can be good but he looks stiff in the hips and is a work in progress at CB. He has potential though so I think he could sneak into the 53 on special teams.

Travis Carrie: Returns guy who is cut by the start of the season IMHO.

The big suprise of TC and pre-season. I couldn't have been more wrong Embarassed and after doing a decent job against Nelson and Rodgers he's passed the sternest test for me. A lock to make the team and arguably the best CB so far this year!


Shelby Harris: He'll hang around for a couple years then get cut. I think this was a long shot based on measurables and potential.

Another big suprise and while he looks very raw in certain situations, he seems to have the knack of getting pressure. He's learned and set the edge better last going off, will definately make the team and will contribute in a rotational capacity.

Jonathan Dowling: I think we'll be seeing a lot more of this young man in the future as he learns from CWood, very interesting prospect who will be groomed to take over from CWood. Boom rather than Bust who'll make big plays and be a ball hawk.

At this moment in time he looks like too much work to put right. You can't inject guts into a guy and his tackling is that of a intimidated player. He hasn't shown the coverage skills either and will be cut shortly......man, was I wrong on that one!

What do you guys think of the rookies so far in relation to your initial draft opinions.......is there anyone who's suprised and a player that's dissappointed? Who's going to miss the cut?


WHAT? So we cut him based on him being the best CB? Mistake I'm sure.
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CaliforniaKid7


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 25, 2014 1:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

^^^ OP said the italics are what he said PRE DRAFT.
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Dessie


Joined: 02 Feb 2006
Posts: 4587
PostPosted: Mon Aug 25, 2014 1:36 pm    Post subject: Re: Rookie Review Reply with quote

Dat Raider wrote:
Darbsk wrote:
It's coming up that time that cuts have to be made and the rookies have 1 more pre-season chance to impress and push for those final roster spots.

Some guys have established themselves, others are still on the bubble I think we've seen enough so far to make some predictions and assesments over whether or not this class of rookies will be the ones to kick-start the Raiders revival.

Here are my initial thoughts after the draft process (in italics) and revised thoughts after 3 pre-season games and training camp:

Khalil Mack: He will be fast enough and what he lacks in outright speed he'll make up with power, he's not the 'Von Miller' clone some people are hoping for but he could be a more rounded playmaker I feel who contributes not so much in sacks but more in pass defence and run support.

Started slowly but he's coming along nicely and looks a very good all round player. I think we've been keeping him back a little in the exhibition games and he will see more action going after the passer in the regular season. Looking good for the future at this point.

Derek Carr: If he gets at least 12 months learning and not forced into action I think he has the possibility to be a decent starting QB for us, I don't think he'll ever be a top 10 QB though, standing tall and making the correct throws under pressure will be his achilles heel.

He's better than I expected and if he gets a smooth transition into the team next year could be the guy moving forward. Great arm, competitor and is working to iron out the creases. Has handled the pressure admirably so far and hasn't made too mnay rash decisions which you normally see in a rookie.

Gabe Jackson: This guy will be great! Has suprising technique and close quarter movement for such a big guy and with good coaching and experience around him will be in the Pro Bowl in a couple years.

I still think he'll be great.........has a few mental mistakes to clean up but looks like he will be a rock in our OL for the next decade.

Justin Ellis: Reggie views him as the heir apparent to Pat Sims, the more I see of him the better he seems and I have the feeling he will handle his weight and anchor our D for the next 10 years doing a solid if unspectacular job and allowing our 'stars' to get the attention.

Impressed with his limited game time and is more athletic and better and getting pressure than I thought he would be. Could get a lot of playing time this year, maintaing his weight will be key for his long term success.

Keith McGill: I can see him sticking with us as he grows and giving us a few good years of #2 CB play (I'm thinking Chris Johnson), don't think he's savvy enough to be a turnover machine but in limited man coverage he'll be solid.

Not impressed thus far, his tackling and run D can be good but he looks stiff in the hips and is a work in progress at CB. He has potential though so I think he could sneak into the 53 on special teams.

Travis Carrie: Returns guy who is cut by the start of the season IMHO.

The big suprise of TC and pre-season. I couldn't have been more wrong Embarassed and after doing a decent job against Nelson and Rodgers he's passed the sternest test for me. A lock to make the team and arguably the best CB so far this year!


Shelby Harris: He'll hang around for a couple years then get cut. I think this was a long shot based on measurables and potential.

Another big suprise and while he looks very raw in certain situations, he seems to have the knack of getting pressure. He's learned and set the edge better last going off, will definately make the team and will contribute in a rotational capacity.

Jonathan Dowling: I think we'll be seeing a lot more of this young man in the future as he learns from CWood, very interesting prospect who will be groomed to take over from CWood. Boom rather than Bust who'll make big plays and be a ball hawk.

At this moment in time he looks like too much work to put right. You can't inject guts into a guy and his tackling is that of a intimidated player. He hasn't shown the coverage skills either and will be cut shortly......man, was I wrong on that one!

What do you guys think of the rookies so far in relation to your initial draft opinions.......is there anyone who's suprised and a player that's dissappointed? Who's going to miss the cut?


WHAT? So we cut him based on him being the best CB? Mistake I'm sure.


Yup the mistake is yours.

Quote:
Here are my initial thoughts after the draft process (in italics

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Professor Oak


Joined: 12 Apr 2011
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 25, 2014 1:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pretty much agree with your assessments. Even though it's just preseason, I like what I've seen so far.


Khalil Mack -- He will be fine. Eager to see the different ways Tarver utilizes him in the reg season. Looked dominant at times vs GB.

Derek Carr -- Looked poised and calm in the pocket. Easily the best arm on the team. Unfortunately, the Carr era might have a shorter grooming process than I had initially hoped for. I feel confident he can handle it though, if need be.

Gabe Jackson -- Why he isn't a starter yet is beyond me. He has looked way better than Khalif Barnes. No penalties, no hurries, no QB hits, and no sacks allowed. A few missed assignments but still solid.

Justin Ellis -- Limited action due to the concussion, but he looks solid from the little we've seen of him. Moves well for his size.

Keith McGill -- A little raw but that's expected. He will need more time to develop. TJ Carrie is ahead of him.

TJ Carrie -- I like his confidence but he needs more time to develop. He's being thrown to the wolves with DJ Hayden out. Expect a lot of rookie mistakes. Most useful on special teams.

Shelby Harris -- Biggest surprise to me so far. I thought he would be camp fodder but he's making impact plays in both pass rushing & run defense. I could easily see him in the rotation this year.

Jonathan Dowling -- Don't see him making the 53 but could see him placed on the practice squad. Poor in coverage and even worse in the tackling department (5 missed tackles). Needs to bulk up & learn how to wrap up.
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Rolni


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 25, 2014 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree man big time. Carrie and Shelby are big positive suprises for me and Dowling is the only negativer one so far...
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Dat Raider


Joined: 20 Oct 2008
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Location: London aka LDN
PostPosted: Mon Aug 25, 2014 3:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Rookie Review Reply with quote

Dessie wrote:
Dat Raider wrote:
Darbsk wrote:
It's coming up that time that cuts have to be made and the rookies have 1 more pre-season chance to impress and push for those final roster spots.

Some guys have established themselves, others are still on the bubble I think we've seen enough so far to make some predictions and assesments over whether or not this class of rookies will be the ones to kick-start the Raiders revival.

Here are my initial thoughts after the draft process (in italics) and revised thoughts after 3 pre-season games and training camp:

Khalil Mack: He will be fast enough and what he lacks in outright speed he'll make up with power, he's not the 'Von Miller' clone some people are hoping for but he could be a more rounded playmaker I feel who contributes not so much in sacks but more in pass defence and run support.

Started slowly but he's coming along nicely and looks a very good all round player. I think we've been keeping him back a little in the exhibition games and he will see more action going after the passer in the regular season. Looking good for the future at this point.

Derek Carr: If he gets at least 12 months learning and not forced into action I think he has the possibility to be a decent starting QB for us, I don't think he'll ever be a top 10 QB though, standing tall and making the correct throws under pressure will be his achilles heel.

He's better than I expected and if he gets a smooth transition into the team next year could be the guy moving forward. Great arm, competitor and is working to iron out the creases. Has handled the pressure admirably so far and hasn't made too mnay rash decisions which you normally see in a rookie.

Gabe Jackson: This guy will be great! Has suprising technique and close quarter movement for such a big guy and with good coaching and experience around him will be in the Pro Bowl in a couple years.

I still think he'll be great.........has a few mental mistakes to clean up but looks like he will be a rock in our OL for the next decade.

Justin Ellis: Reggie views him as the heir apparent to Pat Sims, the more I see of him the better he seems and I have the feeling he will handle his weight and anchor our D for the next 10 years doing a solid if unspectacular job and allowing our 'stars' to get the attention.

Impressed with his limited game time and is more athletic and better and getting pressure than I thought he would be. Could get a lot of playing time this year, maintaing his weight will be key for his long term success.

Keith McGill: I can see him sticking with us as he grows and giving us a few good years of #2 CB play (I'm thinking Chris Johnson), don't think he's savvy enough to be a turnover machine but in limited man coverage he'll be solid.

Not impressed thus far, his tackling and run D can be good but he looks stiff in the hips and is a work in progress at CB. He has potential though so I think he could sneak into the 53 on special teams.

Travis Carrie: Returns guy who is cut by the start of the season IMHO.

The big suprise of TC and pre-season. I couldn't have been more wrong Embarassed and after doing a decent job against Nelson and Rodgers he's passed the sternest test for me. A lock to make the team and arguably the best CB so far this year!


Shelby Harris: He'll hang around for a couple years then get cut. I think this was a long shot based on measurables and potential.

Another big suprise and while he looks very raw in certain situations, he seems to have the knack of getting pressure. He's learned and set the edge better last going off, will definately make the team and will contribute in a rotational capacity.

Jonathan Dowling: I think we'll be seeing a lot more of this young man in the future as he learns from CWood, very interesting prospect who will be groomed to take over from CWood. Boom rather than Bust who'll make big plays and be a ball hawk.

At this moment in time he looks like too much work to put right. You can't inject guts into a guy and his tackling is that of a intimidated player. He hasn't shown the coverage skills either and will be cut shortly......man, was I wrong on that one!

What do you guys think of the rookies so far in relation to your initial draft opinions.......is there anyone who's suprised and a player that's dissappointed? Who's going to miss the cut?


WHAT? So we cut him based on him being the best CB? Mistake I'm sure.


Yup the mistake is yours.

Quote:
Here are my initial thoughts after the draft process (in italics


Indeed it is. Indeed it is.
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Darbsk


Joined: 21 Oct 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2014 3:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Professor Oak wrote:
Pretty much agree with your assessments. Even though it's just preseason, I like what I've seen so far.


Khalil Mack -- He will be fine. Eager to see the different ways Tarver utilizes him in the reg season. Looked dominant at times vs GB.

Derek Carr -- Looked poised and calm in the pocket. Easily the best arm on the team. Unfortunately, the Carr era might have a shorter grooming process than I had initially hoped for. I feel confident he can handle it though, if need be.

Gabe Jackson -- Why he isn't a starter yet is beyond me. He has looked way better than Khalif Barnes. No penalties, no hurries, no QB hits, and no sacks allowed. A few missed assignments but still solid.

Justin Ellis -- Limited action due to the concussion, but he looks solid from the little we've seen of him. Moves well for his size.

Keith McGill -- A little raw but that's expected. He will need more time to develop. TJ Carrie is ahead of him.

TJ Carrie -- I like his confidence but he needs more time to develop. He's being thrown to the wolves with DJ Hayden out. Expect a lot of rookie mistakes. Most useful on special teams.

Shelby Harris -- Biggest surprise to me so far. I thought he would be camp fodder but he's making impact plays in both pass rushing & run defense. I could easily see him in the rotation this year.

Jonathan Dowling -- Don't see him making the 53 but could see him placed on the practice squad. Poor in coverage and even worse in the tackling department (5 missed tackles). Needs to bulk up & learn how to wrap up.


It's still early but this draft is looking very promising, with 4 potential starters and 2 probable rotational guys it looks like it could be our best draft in years. Of course if Carr does become our franchise QB then it will be the best draft for a decade or more!
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Mr Raider


Joined: 25 Jun 2014
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2014 6:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Khalil Mack - Started off slow, but no reason to panic. This guy is going to be a good one. Everything we expected on draft day. Will he ever be a 15 sack type guy? No, but thats not how were going to use him either. He can stuff the run, get after the QB, cover a TE down the seem, and has very good hands for a LB. He's the type of guy that is going to be a corner stone on defense and make the unit go. I have very few worries about this young stud, even after a slow start to the preseason.

Derek Carr - Imo, its your time to shine kid. Thus far, he has looked like what he is. A young QB, with loads of physical talent and potential, but rough around the edges. However the Derek Carr era might be coming a lot sooner then any of us would have thought. I just dont see how Allen can justify trotting Schaub out there (at his current level of play) more then a couple weeks into the season. Carr looks to have the ability to be our QBOTF but growing pains are to be expected. Jury is still out, but I would much rather roll the dice on a young, exciting talent as opposed to a washed up guy with very little left. Simply put, if Carr makes mistakes, you hope he learns from them and gets better. If Scahub makes mistakes there is no upside at all.

Gabe Jackson - I have watched big Gabe very closely, and all I can say is... START THE MAN. He is a beast of a man. He blocks hard, finishes plays, has surprisingly quick feet for such a big man, and hasnt been responsible for many pressures and zero sacks I believe. He should be a starter day one imo. Some rookie mistakes will be made, but again like Carr if hes making mistakes your hoping he learns from them and betters himself for it. Nothing good is going to come from Khalif Barnes making mistakes long term. Looks like an incredible value thus far.

Keith McGill - Havent loved what I have seen, and has dealt with some injuries. CB is no easy transition in the NFL, but he is an older prospect so I was hoping to see a bit better transition. Still he has some long term potential, just probably not suited for a large role early on, too bad that may not be an option.

TJ Carrie - How can you not root for this kid? Young guy that most didnt know anything about and/or expect anything from. Since day one he has shown he has a place on this team.. Looks like a very good return man, and his coverage skills are pretty solid. Needs more time to adjust like all rookies, but our CB depth is so bad he may have to be thrown out there in a sink or swim situation. To this point he looks capable of holding his own. Good value, even if he can become a great return guy and nothing more.

Shelby Harris - I literally knew nothing about this guy coming out, but man can he provide some pass rush. He isnt ready yet, but he deserves a spot on the roster imo and in a couple of years could be a really solid role player/pass rush specialist.

Jonathan Dowling - Just been awful imo, no other way to put it. Hasnt shown the ability to cover and probably has trouble hitting the sled. Maybe a PS stash player? But even then i am not sure we cant find someone better to use the practice squad spot on.
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Darbsk


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 28, 2014 5:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mr Raider wrote:

TJ Carrie - How can you not root for this kid? Young guy that most didnt know anything about and/or expect anything from. Since day one he has shown he has a place on this team.. Looks like a very good return man, and his coverage skills are pretty solid. Needs more time to adjust like all rookies, but our CB depth is so bad he may have to be thrown out there in a sink or swim situation. To this point he looks capable of holding his own. Good value, even if he can become a great return guy and nothing more.



I just hope that after he's thrown in early and makes the inevitable rookie mistakes that fans don't get on his back to much and appreciate the huge jump he's taken from pre-draft and the potential he has to be a very solid CB.

As you rightly say, he's a young man who deserves our support.
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