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forty six & 2


Joined: 02 Mar 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 12:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

UtBDan wrote:
JDBrocks wrote:
El Raymundo wrote:
JDBrocks wrote:
El Raymundo wrote:
What a Super Bowl. 18-1 and it's a failed season.

Having been through 1998, I know EXACTLY how the fans of the Pats feel right now.


My jaw dropped when Belijerk refused to let them finish the game. He had to steal the spotlight... Evil or Very Mad He is the single most classless arrogant individual in the NFL...

Great game though! Honestly this is the best Superbowl I've ever seen and the biggest upset in Superbowl history.


Huh? Did I miss something? He ran out onto the field when the clock showed 00:00, as did everyone else, then he jogged into the tunnel when they put one second back on the clock. It wasn't just Belichek who was confused...everyone was confused. And the Pats did go out and run the last play.


You must have missed Mike Carrey the ref telling him that they had to go back to the sidelines, telling him that by the NFL rules they had to run one more play and he pushed through anyway and ran into the tunnel and didn't come back out.

His players had to come back out and he refused. No class at all.


to boot, the clock was never at :00, it was at :03 when he started running off and they stopped it at :01. It never hit :00 till Eli put his arms in the air for celebration after taking the knee.

I watched it tick from :02, :01, :00 after the incomplete pass on fourth down so I don't know what you're talking about. The clock operator never stopped it. Both sidelines emptied as did a few rows of the fans, the broadcast camera was just zoomed on Belichick. He met Coughlin and exchanged a handshake and some words.

The guy just can't win no matter what he does. Everyone nitpicks every little thing he does and tries to analyze it as if it's part of an evil plot. He's a football coach, not Darth Vader, give him a break, he was on the field congratulating Coughlin surrounded by a throng of media, fans, and players. He doesn't have the power to put everyone in the stadium where they were prior to the clock operator's error. Jeez, even when he loses he's public enemy number one, I just don't get it.
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JDBrocks


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 1:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

forty six & 2 wrote:

I watched it tick from :02, :01, :00 after the incomplete pass on fourth down so I don't know what you're talking about. The clock operator never stopped it. Both sidelines emptied as did a few rows of the fans, the broadcast camera was just zoomed on Belichick. He met Coughlin and exchanged a handshake and some words.

The guy just can't win no matter what he does. Everyone nitpicks every little thing he does and tries to analyze it as if it's part of an evil plot. He's a football coach, not Darth Vader, give him a break, he was on the field congratulating Coughlin surrounded by a throng of media, fans, and players. He doesn't have the power to put everyone in the stadium where they were prior to the clock operator's error. Jeez, even when he loses he's public enemy number one, I just don't get it.


Sorry, If a guy is that arrogant all year and refuses to answer questions, gets caught cheating and won't own up to it, and leaves the field early because he lost, he doesn't get a break.

The clock had run out and had time put back on it before either side ran on to the field. Mike Carey and the rest of the officiating crew was trying to get both sides off of the field so they could finish the game.

The guy disowned his team by leaving them out there to finish the game so he could go pout in the locker room. Bill Belichick is a terrible sport and couldn't stomach the spotlight not being on him and his team.

He's a bad loser and a bad winner.
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vike daddy


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JDBrocks wrote:
The guy disowned his team by leaving them out there to finish the game so he could go pout in the locker room. Bill Belichick is a terrible sport and couldn't stomach the spotlight not being on him and his team. He's a bad loser and a bad winner.

i agree with forty six & 2's view of Belichick and what happened on the field. i don't idolize the guy, but i think he's being scrutinized for everything (my god, some people complain about his sweathshirt!) and the basis for the dislike seems to be rooted in something else than just him.

hey, have at your views, i'll defend your right to voice them, but they just seem... spiteful.
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Vhawk413


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 1:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vike daddy wrote:
JDBrocks wrote:
The guy disowned his team by leaving them out there to finish the game so he could go pout in the locker room. Bill Belichick is a terrible sport and couldn't stomach the spotlight not being on him and his team. He's a bad loser and a bad winner.

i agree with forty six & 2's view of Belichick and what happened on the field. i don't idolize the guy, but i think he's being scrutinized for everything (my god, some people complain about his sweathshirt!) and the basis for the dislike seems to be rooted in something else than just him.

hey, have at your views, i'll defend your right to voice them, but they just seem... spiteful.


Every hates the perennial winners, like the New York Yankees. They do not need a reason to hate them besides the fact they win all the time. Fact is, he gets his teams prepared better than almost any coach ever has before, his teams handle all of the media better than anyone before, and he turned a 6th round QB into one of the greatest QB's of all time. The guy wins, he changes players all the time, look at his WR core, all 3 new guys, and he still wins, takes old vets other teams don't want and turn them into pro bowlers, Vrabel. He is a great coach, but just like Joe Torre, he will get scrutinized for every little mistake. Not saying I like what he did at the end of the game, that was bad, but he is not the only person on his team that has left the field early now, Randy Moss.
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vike daddy


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 1:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Gnat wrote:
People made a huge deal out of it when Moss ran off the field that one Vikings game against the Redskins with a few seconds left, this is done on a much bigger stage with a much more important person then Moss.

to be fair in the comparison...

when Moss left the field, his team had the ball and he was criticized for the tiny chance that they could have recovered an onside kick, scored, and won the game. (am i remembering this right...?)

when the Pats didn't complete on 4th down, nothing conceivable could have happened on the ensuing play to give them a chance to tie the score or win. gosh, think if they had kicked a field goal and tied it. you think the outcome was exciting last night, that would have stretched it even further!

the feeling that there was one second on the clock and a play had to be run (a kneel down) is totally accurate. but to do so really deflated the enormous accomplishment of the Giants, and actually both teams agreeing the game was over and thousands of people rushing the field would have been a fine and appropriate outcome too.

any group of people will always disagree on the finer points of this and always have their strong senses of right and wrong. i just find it generally sad that there is so much hate and vitriol expressed over the occurrences of this year's NFL season.

please understand i am not pointing a finger at anyone here in this forum, but my gawd, the things we had to delete last night site-wide. hoo boy...

peace.
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this providence


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 2:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vike daddy wrote:
The Gnat wrote:
People made a huge deal out of it when Moss ran off the field that one Vikings game against the Redskins with a few seconds left, this is done on a much bigger stage with a much more important person then Moss.

to be fair in the comparison...

when Moss left the field, his team had the ball and he was criticized for the tiny chance that they could have recovered an onside kick, scored, and won the game. (am i remembering this right...?)

when the Pats didn't complete on 4th down, nothing conceivable could have happened on the ensuing play to give them a chance to tie the score or win. gosh, think if they had kicked a field goal and tied it. you think the outcome was exciting last night, that would have stretched it even further!

the feeling that there was one second on the clock and a play had to be run (a kneel down) is totally accurate. but to do so really deflated the enormous accomplishment of the Giants, and actually both teams agreeing the game was over and thousands of people rushing the field would have been a fine and appropriate outcome too.

any group of people will always disagree on the finer points of this and always have their strong senses of right and wrong. i just find it generally sad that there is so much hate and vitriol expressed over the occurrences of this year's NFL season.

please understand i am not pointing a finger at anyone here in this forum, but my gawd, the things we had to delete last night site-wide. hoo boy...

peace.


I agree with this assessment.

Last night was riddled with outlandish post that in no way reflected this site. It was truely a disgrace and personally, I had to log off because there was no sense in reading some of that garbage.

I had no real problem with most all of Belichick NONcoaching actions. We have seen this from him his entire career, why is everyone so up in arms when it happens this time? Just like the Moss incident, it really wasn't that big of a deal.

The only thing that I do have a problem with from Belichick (other than the refusal to max-protect while their O-line was getting eaten alive. Wink) is when he shoved the ref in haste to get off the field. And that really wasn't that big of a deal. I was just not envious of the officials and stadium personnel to try and get everyone in line to finish off the game because of a technicality. Not talking
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disaacs


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 3:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What Belichick did is consistent with his character. He was just Belichick being Belichick.
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JDBrocks


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 3:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vike daddy wrote:

i agree with forty six & 2's view of Belichick and what happened on the field. i don't idolize the guy, but i think he's being scrutinized for everything (my god, some people complain about his sweathshirt!) and the basis for the dislike seems to be rooted in something else than just him.

hey, have at your views, i'll defend your right to voice them, but they just seem... spiteful.


My dislike for Belichick is rooted in the fact that he treats people as though he is above them. The guy cheats and won't own up. He treats coaches terribly. The way he treats Mangini and the whole Colts team is disgraceful. Just because he wins doesn't mean he gets to treat people that way when most show good sportsmanship. This last act shows him to be a bad loser.

Here's a clip on the way the end of the game unfolded and it shows him clearly walking on to the field with time on the clock.

http://sports.aol.com/fanhouse/2008/02/03/bill-belichick-leaves-field-before-game-ends/


Last edited by JDBrocks on Mon Feb 04, 2008 5:26 pm; edited 1 time in total
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disaacs


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 3:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you want to really be accurate, the clock should have actually stopped at about 2 seconds left, because the pass was incomplete. The clock continued to run after the pass hit the ground.
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since72


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 5:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Can anyone explain what Moss was trying to communicate with his touchdown celebrating (sort of a swimming motion)?
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Enrage


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 5:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

since72 wrote:
Can anyone explain what Moss was trying to communicate with his touchdown celebrating (sort of a swimming motion)?


Supermanning dat -?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sLGLum5SyKQ

1:20 into the movie.
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El Raymundo


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 6:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

<respectfully>

Belichek isn't Tony Dungy: he's never going to be Mister Warm and Fuzzy.

Regarding the Spygate business, Belichek is innocent until proven guilty. He was found guilty early-on in the season and punished. If he is found guilty of greater infractions in the off-season, I'm sure he'll be punished. When I get stopped for speeding, go to court and the judge finds me guilty I don't go to everyone I know and don't know and tell them how bad I was for breaking the law and admit guilt all over the place. No, I take my punishment and try to put it behind me. I assume Belichek did the same thing.

Regarding the clock, I saw it go to 00:00. I remember commenting about it to my wife. Then time was put back on the clock.

Regarding walking off the field, I have no problem with it. Except for a kneel-down, the game was over. It's making a great leap of assumption to say Belichek was going away to pout. If it were me I would try to get to the locker room as quickly as possible to collect my thoughts knowing in very quick succession I would have to deal with the media, my players, my staff and the towel-snapping-guy. It's possible all those thoughts were going through his mind when he went into the tunnel.

Regarding Moss walking off the field, I have no problem with that either. We were kicking off to the Redskins and yes, I suppose we could have recovered the kick and run one play in the two remaining seconds (which, as I recall, is how much time was on the clock when Randy walked away). But all that happening in two seconds was unlikely. Furthermore, I was at that game, and Randy could have easily been fetched had we recovered the kick. He wasn't in the tunnel when the onside kick happened.

Furthermore, before the "walk-off" game, Randy was playing catch with fans in the stands and talking with the fans - being an ambassador of the game. Then he did one thing that a bunch of media talking heads jump on him about (a la Joe Buck and the mooning incident) and his reputation takes another hit.

How many times has anyone here walked away from a friend or loved one during an argument because they were so pissed-off they couldn't see straight? I know I have. Does that mean I don't love or respect or support my friends or wife or family? Not at all. Was it the right thing to do? Perhaps. Perhaps not. But it happens and none of use are bad people or professionals because of it.

Anyway, to sum up, none of us were there up-close-and-personal at any of those events and can provide eyewitness accounts of the happenings, meaning that none of us really knows what was going on. I understand people may like or dislike an individual, but that does not mean we instantly understand why that individual did or did not do certain things. I'll let everyone draw their own conclusions from there.

</respectfully>
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JDBrocks


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 7:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

El Raymundo wrote:
<respectfully>

Belichek isn't Tony Dungy: he's never going to be Mister Warm and Fuzzy.

Regarding the Spygate business, Belichek is innocent until proven guilty. He was found guilty early-on in the season and punished. If he is found guilty of greater infractions in the off-season, I'm sure he'll be punished. When I get stopped for speeding, go to court and the judge finds me guilty I don't go to everyone I know and don't know and tell them how bad I was for breaking the law and admit guilt all over the place. No, I take my punishment and try to put it behind me. I assume Belichek did the same thing.

Regarding the clock, I saw it go to 00:00. I remember commenting about it to my wife. Then time was put back on the clock.

Regarding walking off the field, I have no problem with it. Except for a kneel-down, the game was over. It's making a great leap of assumption to say Belichek was going away to pout. If it were me I would try to get to the locker room as quickly as possible to collect my thoughts knowing in very quick succession I would have to deal with the media, my players, my staff and the towel-snapping-guy. It's possible all those thoughts were going through his mind when he went into the tunnel.

Regarding Moss walking off the field, I have no problem with that either. We were kicking off to the Redskins and yes, I suppose we could have recovered the kick and run one play in the two remaining seconds (which, as I recall, is how much time was on the clock when Randy walked away). But all that happening in two seconds was unlikely. Furthermore, I was at that game, and Randy could have easily been fetched had we recovered the kick. He wasn't in the tunnel when the onside kick happened.

Furthermore, before the "walk-off" game, Randy was playing catch with fans in the stands and talking with the fans - being an ambassador of the game. Then he did one thing that a bunch of media talking heads jump on him about (a la Joe Buck and the mooning incident) and his reputation takes another hit.

How many times has anyone here walked away from a friend or loved one during an argument because they were so pissed-off they couldn't see straight? I know I have. Does that mean I don't love or respect or support my friends or wife or family? Not at all. Was it the right thing to do? Perhaps. Perhaps not. But it happens and none of use are bad people or professionals because of it.

Anyway, to sum up, none of us were there up-close-and-personal at any of those events and can provide eyewitness accounts of the happenings, meaning that none of us really knows what was going on. I understand people may like or dislike an individual, but that does not mean we instantly understand why that individual did or did not do certain things. I'll let everyone draw their own conclusions from there.

</respectfully>


Unfortunately I am not very good at breaking up qoutes and such Embarassed , so I will try to address this post as best I can.

I don't buy the speeding ticket thing as you are not a very public figure on the best team in the highest grossing sport in America. The least he could have done was answer questions when they were asked. Other public figures get lambasted when they dodge or avoid answering questions, but somehow "Belichick just being Belichick" is a good enough reason for him to be able to avoid it? A little remorse would have gone a long way to prevent people from making pictures like this:



Regarding the clock. It did hit zero, but time was put back on the clock before Belichick went on the field. He could have easily waited until the game was over as the rules required him to. He wouldn't have walked onto the field had the roles been reversed (I know you are going to say that I can't be sure of that but I'll say it anyway). He would've waited and then ran to celebrate.

Regarding the exit, Belichick said nothing to the press. He refused to acknowledge the Giants superiority. He said "they made a few more plays than we did". His answers were never longer than eight words. He didn't have anything to say to his players either (at least thats what several of his players said). His players showed alot more class than he did, tipping their hats to the Giants. For a guy that spent his whole season preaching "60 minutes, 60 minutes" creating a mantra of sorts. He then leaves his players early after drilling that into their heads for a year?

I can't understand why Belichick can act so crassly and get a free pass because "that's just his demeanor". He cheated and thought that he wouldn't get caught, that he was beyond the rules. He halted the game before it was over because he still thinks he is beyond the rules.

It doesn't have to offend you or anyone else, but his actions certainly offended me. It was just another classless thing to add to his heap of classless acts. There's a reason why people like Tony Dungy is so well respected. Bill Belichick does not exhibit those respected qualities and does not deserve the respect he seems to think he commands.
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JDBrocks


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2008 12:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Justin Fragas, Travelle Wharton, and former Vikings RB Michael Bennett have all resigned with their teams (Raiders, Panthers, Bucs respectively).

Jordan Gross is reportedly going to be franchised because Wharton got the contract.

But the Panthers are over the cap, and NFL sirius radio is speculating that they might try to restructure Julius Peppers' deal to free up money.

ESPN is also reporting that the Panthers are shopping DeSean Foster as trade bait.

Any comments or interest on the subject?

I don't think that any of this will have an effect on the Vikings, but I thought it was interesting to see the way that teams like the Panthers and the Dolphins are cleaning house...
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The Gnat


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2008 12:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think that it was a smart move for the Raiders to lock up Fargas. He did a very good job for them this past season, and they have more pressing needs to address this off season then trying to find a new RB, if he had left.
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