Ordonez Or A-Rod Whos Your MVP

[macksb13]

[Big7BenMVP]

[pollino14]

Its not even close A-Rod is the MVP. He's putting up the numbers and without him the Yanks would be in big trouble. He won us many games early on in the season by himself the Yanks would not be in the position that they are in now if it wasnt for A-Rod.
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Adopt-A-Packer: Jermichael Finley

[2105 yards]

Unless Vlad really heats up over the next month and a half then A-Rod should win it quite easily...nothing against Ordonez who I think is deserving as well...but voters tend to pick guys on playoff teams before looking at other players.

[Titans_Matt]

[macksb13]

[Titans_Matt]

[Titans_Matt]

[Big7BenMVP]

1.) Before July 1st, the Detroit Tigers compiled a record of 44-32. Over that time, Gary Sheffield was batting .290/.401/.530 with 18 HR, 52 RBI, 69 R, 50 BB, 30 K, 12 2B, and 11 SB. In that same time, Magglio Ordonez was batting .370/.445/.620 with 13 HR, 68 RBI, 65 R, 41 BB, 36 K, 34 2B, and 2 SB. They both were producing more than any other duo in the league. Since July 1st, the Detroit Tigers have compiled a record of 18-19. Over that time, Gary Sheffield is batting .284/.375/.491 with 6 HR, 18 RBI, 24 R, 6 2B, 15 BB, 13 K, and 7 SB. In that same time, Magglio Ordonez is batting .331/.401/.554 with 8 HR, 34 RBI, 24 R, 16 BB, 22 K, 7 2B, and 0 SB. The Tigers go as Sheffield goes. The stats prove it.

2.) Baseball might not be a one player game, but it certainly can be at times. Do you know what Vladimir Guerrero isn't tops in the league at anything? He gets intentionally walked more than any other player in the American League. He's been intentionally walked twenty (20) more times than Magglio Ordonez. He's been intentionally walked nineteen (19) more times than Alex Rodriguez. He's led the American League each of the last three seasons when it comes to intentional walks. Of all the other players in the top twenty in walks this season, only Brian Roberts and Gary Sheffield have walked more times than they have struck out like Guerrero has. Teams are afraid to pitch to Guerrero. It just proves that. That's how valuable he is.

3.) Batting Average with Runners In Scoring Position does matter, it really does. But so does batting in the Late&Close situation. It proves clutch ability, which Guerrero and Rodriguez both beat Ordonez in. The Clutch rating that I gave earlier highlights what I just said. When picking the Most Valuable Player, you have to take into account a ton of things. Not just batting average, on-base percentage, slugging percentage, home runs, and runs batted in. You have to take into account situations, pure value, win shares above a bench player. Things like that. In all of those things, the three guys being debated over are virtually tied. However, Rodriguez owns the other two in the two categories that seem to matter to voters. And that is home runs and runs batted in.
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[Titans_Matt]

[Big7BenMVP]

1.) Placido Polanco is hitting .378/.412/.575 since July 1st, yet the Tigers are still losing. Maggio Ordonez is hitting .331/.401/.554 since July 1st, yet the Tigers are still losing. Curtis Granderson is hitting .317/.370/.535 since July 1st, yet the Tigers are still losing. And why is that? Because of the fact that Gary Sheffield, Carlos Guillen, and Sean Casey are not hitting. Mainly, Gary Sheffield. He is what made the Tigers go early on. From May 1st to June 31st, Gary Sheffield was on fire. He was hitting .328/.416/.626 with 16 HR, 44 RBI, 47 R, and 7 SB. The Tigers, over that span, went 31-21. That says all it needs to say.

2.) Considering that Vladimir Guerrero is the Angels only legitimate offensive threat, him being walked does matter. He's been intentionally walked twenty-five (25) times. That's ten more times than his next closest competitor in the American League, Travis Hafner (15). He's also the second best out of the three when it comes to "Clutch" ratings. Ordonez was is in third. Guerrero's "Batting" rating was best out of the three, by nearly two full points. Ordonez was second, slightly above Rodriguez. Of the three, Rodriguez had the highest "Fielding" rating by one point over Ordonez, who was slightly above Guerrero. In Win Shares Above Bench (average player), Guerrero was first with seventeen (17) while Ordonez and Rodriguez were tied with sixteen (16). Ironically enough, that would make them pretty much even but Rodriguez's stats would put him above the other two while Guerrero's true value would put him above the other two.

3.) Batting average with runners in scoring position does matter, I've said that numerous times. However, being able to produce in Late&Close situations matters more because it shows who can get the job done when it matters most. In that department, Guerrero and Rodriguez both blow Ordonez out of the water by a considerable margin. Ordonez is not doing good when it comes to clutch situations. He was third among the three in the "Clutch" rating and he was a distant third out of the three in Late&Close situation averages. Ordonez (.246/.333/.377) is bringing up the rear while Guerrero (.339/.435/.539) and Rodriguez (.347/.421/.735) are just a good amount of light years ahead of him. They both --Guerrero (.243/.472/.486) and Rodriguez (.316/.443/.860)-- also have better numbers than Ordonez (.286/.392/.429) when it comes to runners in scoring position with two outs. While Guerrero's average is lower than Ordonez, his OPS is considerably higher.

Alex Rodriguez is the clear leader right now. He is simply getting it done no matter what the situation is. Vladimir Guerrero is second while Magglio Ordonez is third.

My sleeper pick is Ichiro Suzuki. You guys would be blown away if I posted his numbers.
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[Titans_Matt]

[Big7BenMVP]

1.) Gary Sheffield made that offense go early on. The only reason Ordonez is still producing more runs than Sheffield right now is because Sheffield has gone into a very bad slump. It's hindered his stats when it comes to Runs Created Per Game. Gary Sheffield is the most valuable player on the Tigers considering he was their offense and their main contributor early in the season when they were surging. Now that he's gone through a slump, the team has gone through a slump even though Ordonez is still staying hot. While Ordonez was slumping in July, the Tigers still went 15-12 in the month. That doesn't show Ordonez's value. It just shows how he wasn't as valuable as people think.

2.) The "Clutch" rating has nothing to do with how great they are in Late&Close situations. Read the link that I provided and it will tell you everything that it encompasses. It's just one way of looking at clutch hitting. Baseball Prospectus' Equivalent Average ratings point to Alex Rodriguez as the man to beat in the American League. He is either tied for the lead or has the outright lead in all five of those categories listed. That's amazing and should (alone) make him the American League Most Valuable Player. As for what I mean when I say Guerrero's true value, I mean that he means more to his team than stats can dictate. He is the most valuable player in the league, minus perhaps Barry Bonds. There really is no disputing that. In terms of true value, Guerrero is not matched in the American League. He does more for his team than any other player in his league. Without him, the Angels go nowhere. Without Ordonez, the Tigers are still a very good team. Without Rodriguez, the Yankees are in a huge hole to the Red Sox. That would knock Ordonez out of the race, in my book.

3.) The first number is batting average, the second number is on-base percentage, and the third number is slugging percentage. Ordonez is better than the other two when talking about hitting with Runners In Scoring Position. However, he's also last when talking about hitting in Late&Close situations, and that's by a wide margin. When talking about hitting with Runners In Scoring Position with Two Outs, Rodriguez blows the other two away while Guerrero is slightly better than Ordonez because of his OPS in those situations.

4.) While stats matter, it also matters how much value they have to their team. In terms of the true value, it's hard to beat Guerrero. But Alex Rodriguez is the only player that can challenge him when talking about that true value. However, the Yankees are still winning while Alex Rodriguez is struggling. That hurts his value, according to a lot of people. I can justify Vladimir Guerrero over Magglio Ordonez because of the fact that Guerrero just definitely means more to his team's success than Ordonez does. It's quite simple to see, really. Guerrero just doesn't have major run producers batting behind him, therefore it's tough for him to see pitches to hit. A lot of the time, he just swings at pitches out of the zone while trying to make something happen. It works sometimes. It doesn't sometimes. He has to do it, though.

5.) Ichiro Suzuki is one of the most valuable players in the league. When talking about Win Shares Above Bench, Ichiro Suzuki is tied for second in the American League, behind only Vladimir Guerrero. He has sixteen (16) Win Shares Above Bench. When it comes to Win Share Percentage, Ichiro's .964 rating is third behind Vladimir Guerrero (1.060) and Magglio Ordonez (.988) while putting him ahead of Alex Rodriguez (.946). His "Batting" rating is at 22.7, which is second behind Guerrero (24.3) and puts him ahead of Ordonez (22.5) and Rodriguez (22.2). His "Fielding" rating (2.6) is first among the four guys. He leads Rodriguez (2.5), Ordonez (1.5), and Guerrero (1.2). He is creating 8.3 Runs Per Game, which is tied for fifth in the American League with Gary Sheffield. His Value Over Replacement Player is 48.9, which puts him slightly ahead of Guerrero (48.6) and ranks him fourth in the American League behind Rodriguez, Ordonez, and David Ortiz. Ichiro is tied for third in the American League in stolen bases. He's been intentionally walked nine times this season, which is more than Alex Rodriguez and Magglio Ordonez.

Ichiro Suzuki is one hell of a MVP candidate. If they make the playoffs, he could win it. If Ordonez and Rodriguez are out come October, it'll be between Ichrio and Guerrero.
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[Titans_Matt]

[Big7BenMVP]

1.) While the voting stats count, voters have definitely started to take true value under observation and pick some MVPs because of it. For instance, both MVPs last season --Justin Morneau and Ryan Howard-- had more true value to their teams than any other player in consideration for the award. Especially when you look at when MVPs are won, the final two months of the season. In the final two months of 2006, Ryan Howard batted .365/.513/.750 with 23 HR, 62 RBI, 46 R, 58 BB, 26 IBB, and only 1 GDP while the Phillies went 36-22 over that stretch. In the final two months of 2006, Justin Morneau batted .321/.393/.489 with 6 HR, 42 RBI, 35 R, 26 BB, 17 2B, and 3 GDP while the Twins went 35-23 over that stretch. Look at the other major competitors for the award last season, Derek Jeter and Albert Pujols. Over the final two months of 2006, Derek Jeter batted .326/.400/.472 with 7 HR, 32 RBI, 49 R, 13 2B, and 2 GDP while the Yankees went 36-22 over that stretch. His numbers were not better than Morneau's while his team wasn't really better than the Twins. Albert Pujols batted .344/.423/.633 with 16 HR, 50 RBI, 46 R, 31 BB, and 10 GDP while the Cardinals went 24-32 over that stretch. You can see why the voters went with Justin Morneau and Ryan Howard. And that's because their final two months of the season were better than their closest competitor while their teams were either equal to or better than the competitor's team. It really deals with true value.

2.) The stats I showed play a part in determining who the Most Valuable Player is, because it shows true value when talking about the players. The fact that Magglio Ordonez has "way better" stats than Vladimir Guerrero or Ichiro Suzuki doesn't matter. Ichiro is a different player than Ordonez and is really the sole purpose that the Mariners are even challenging the Angels in the American League West. Vladimir Guerrero has had a down year but in terms of pure value, he is tough to beat in the American League. What he brings to the table --arm, bat, heart-- is tough to beat by any player in the American League. If Alex Rodriguez and Magglio Ordonez are watching from the golf course come October, the award will go to someone else and that's only if Alex Rodriguez goes through the slump to end all slumps. He's so far ahead in this award right now that you can barely see him with binoculars. This little "two horse race" that you think it is between Alex Rodriguez and Magglio Ordonez shows how little East Coast fans know about players on the West Coast. I don't blame you guys, you're all just asleep when we're playing. Magglio Ordonez is having a great August but too bad his team is just 4-8. Alex Rodriguez a solid August and his team is having a great August, where they are 10-2 so far. Vladimir Guerrero is having a hot August while the Angels are 7-4 in the month so far. Ichiro Suzuki is having a nice August while his Mariners are 8-3 this month so far. You see how well the other three teams are playing but Magglio's team is not? That'll be the difference in this race.

It's a shame that some people can't acknowledge that there are other players in this league. I question how many games you've seen this season with each player involved. I think you're just looking at the stat sheet too much. You can't judge everything based off of stats. You have to base it off of their value as a player to their team. Hence the phrase "Most Valuable Player". That's what we are voting on. The most valuable player to his team while still having the stats to be a force in this league. I don't think pitchers are afraid of Magglio Ordonez.

Alex Rodriguez, Vladimir Guerrero, Ichiro Suzuki, and Magglio Ordonez.

That would be my list right now, in order, if I were to vote today. This has to deal with stats and true value.
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