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FourThreeMafia


Joined: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 63655
Location: East of Sixburgh
PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 9:59 pm    Post subject: Why is it that... Reply with quote

...alot of you are saying, "If we draft so-and-so in the 1st round, Colbert needs to be fired" and things of that nature?

I understand what our needs our, but I also understand that the best method in the draft is taking the BPA that fills a need on your team. Obviously, you wouldnt take Reggie Nelson or LaRon Landry at 15 because we have Troy. But, if we dont trade down, and there are no real tweeners, LB's, or OL to take at 15, you go to your next needs. If that was the case, Id probably take Chirs Houston or Leon Hall at 15. If for some reason they are gone too, I wouldnt mind seeing them taking Meachem, Bower or even Lynch here. I know that we already have Willie, but if Willie went down, Davenport isnt going to cut it. Plus, that would be a wicked 1-2 punch. Not that I really want Lynch, but if he is there and those other players arent, and we cant trade down, we take him.

Obviously, trading down would be the best option at this point, (or trading up, possibly?) but alot of you seem like you'd rather reach than take a guy who will probably be more prodcutive as a football player.

You dont reach for a player just because you have a need at that position. You have to have a strategy in the draft, but not that much. BPA is the best way to go in most cases.
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Cutwolf


Joined: 04 Feb 2006
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 10:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If we draft QB, WR, RB, or CB in round 1, we have serious front office problems.
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FourThreeMafia


Joined: 28 Sep 2006
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Location: East of Sixburgh
PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 10:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

*
Cutwolf wrote:
If we draft QB, WR, RB, or CB in round 1, we have serious front office problems.


Uh, we have needs at WR and CB. Maybe nmot crucial, but if they took a WR or CB at 15, and there are no tweeners, LB's or OL worth taking at 15, this is a good pick. And no, it doesnt mean we have front office issues, it just means the Steelers are smart enough not to reach.
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Cutwolf


Joined: 04 Feb 2006
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 10:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We have needs at CB?

McFadden is a stud. Ike is a stud. Ike didn't deserve to be benched. We need a replacement for Deshea. You dont draft a #3 CB in round 1.


We have needs at WR?

Our top 3 WRs are all set. You don't draft a #4 WR in round 1. Ward has 2-3 good years left in him. Holmes is a stud. Nate Washington was the #5 3rd WR in the NFL in his first real year.

Even if we were to draft a WR to replace Washington, you don't draft a #3 WR in round 1.


There are two forms of reaching. Reaching based on the players talent or reaching based on an overhyped perceived need.

Drafting a WR, CB, or HB in round 1 fills a need, but its reaching to fill that need no matter who we pick.

This is the draft to trade up in. Jamaal Anderson if we plan to go 4-3 sooner rather than later.

The only WR worth it in 1 is Calvin Johnson, and while I'd be willing to give up our #1,2,3 + our #1 next year just to go up and get him (he's THAT good), it won't happen.
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SteelProven


Joined: 20 Apr 2005
Posts: 12212
Location: Ramstein, Germany
PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:15 pm    Post subject: Re: Why is it that... Reply with quote

FourThreeMafia wrote:
...alot of you are saying, "If we draft so-and-so in the 1st round, Colbert needs to be fired" and things of that nature?

I understand what our needs our, but I also understand that the best method in the draft is taking the BPA that fills a need on your team. Obviously, you wouldnt take Reggie Nelson or LaRon Landry at 15 because we have Troy. But, if we dont trade down, and there are no real tweeners, LB's, or OL to take at 15, you go to your next needs. If that was the case, Id probably take Chirs Houston or Leon Hall at 15. If for some reason they are gone too, I wouldnt mind seeing them taking Meachem, Bower or even Lynch here. I know that we already have Willie, but if Willie went down, Davenport isnt going to cut it. Plus, that would be a wicked 1-2 punch. Not that I really want Lynch, but if he is there and those other players arent, and we cant trade down, we take him.

Obviously, trading down would be the best option at this point, (or trading up, possibly?) but alot of you seem like you'd rather reach than take a guy who will probably be more prodcutive as a football player.

You dont reach for a player just because you have a need at that position. You have to have a strategy in the draft, but not that much. BPA is the best way to go in most cases.


If W. Parker went down we'd be just fine with the combination of backs that we have or acquire. Because when Bettis went down and Staley went down did anybody on this forum expect W. Parker to emerge like he has. Before Bettis the Steelers have always had a unknown RB, B. Foster, E. Pegram, L. Thompson, and B. Morris.

The Steelers need to fill needs that can get this team back into the playoffs and back to the Super Bowl. If the Steelers draft BPA then that's going to leave a lot of needs unmet. The Steelers draft BPA last year and known of those players are know longer on the roster. But if the Steelers would of drafted based on need then might of retain more 2nd day talent. This year is a defining point in the growth of the Steelers future.
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FourThreeMafia


Joined: 28 Sep 2006
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Location: East of Sixburgh
PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cutwolf wrote:
We have needs at CB?

McFadden is a stud. Ike is a stud. Ike didn't deserve to be benched. We need a replacement for Deshea. You dont draft a #3 CB in round 1.


We have needs at WR?

Our top 3 WRs are all set. You don't draft a #4 WR in round 1. Ward has 2-3 good years left in him. Holmes is a stud. Nate Washington was the #5 3rd WR in the NFL in his first real year.

Even if we were to draft a WR to replace Washington, you don't draft a #3 WR in round 1.

There are two forms of reaching. Reaching based on the players talent or reaching based on an overhyped perceived need.

Drafting a WR, CB, or HB in round 1 fills a need, but its reaching to fill that need no matter who we pick.

This is the draft to trade up in. Jamaal Anderson if we plan to go 4-3 sooner rather than later.

The only WR worth it in 1 is Calvin Johnson, and while I'd be willing to give up our #1,2,3 + our #1 next year just to go up and get him (he's THAT good), it won't happen.


For one, Id be willing to trade up to get Anderson or Adams, but Im just assuming thats not going to happen.

CB....Ike and Bryant arent "studs". Bailey and Clements are "studs" and Ike and Bryant arent even close to them. Ike got burned all last year, and while Im hoping he'll improve, there is no guarantee. McFadden is young, and has looked good, but he still has to improve alot. After that, we have Townsend, who is just average, and aging, and Coclough...dont get me started on him. While not our biggest need, bringing in a CB in the 1st round could have two benifits. 1, it could push Ike and Bryant to work harder and raise their game due to competition, and two, the rookie could step up and be better than both of them. So taking a CB in the first round makes alot of sense.

WR...we are set at 1 and 2, thats it, and thats just short term. I am not big on drafting another WR in the first round either, but its not out of the question. Lets look at our corps...

1. Hines Ward: The face of this WR corps. He is embedded as our No 1 guy. But, as 2006 proved, he is getting older and the wear and tear is catching up to him. At 31, he has 2 or 3 good years ahead of him, if we are lucky.

2. Santonio Holmes: Looks to be a solid #2 and maybe even our #1 once Ward leaves. Still has alot to improve on, but Im not worried.

After that, its a steep drop off...

3 Nate Washington: He has better hands, but he is pretty much Quincy Morgan Jr. Not very physical, not very fast, and doesnt have great instincts. Drops too many easy catches. Has potential, but is not as good as some Steelers fans make him out to be.

4: Cedric Wilson: Short, not physical, and maybe the worst field awareness Ive seen on a WR. He has some elusiveness and catches all the easy passes, but will not make the tough sideline catches or make a difference. I honestly dont know whehter to put him ahead of Nate or not.

5. Willie Reid: Why, oh why is he even really being mentioned? HE HAS NEVER BEEN A GOOD WR! At Florida State, he was herealded for being a great return guy, not his recieving skills. Just like Devin Hester is not known for his CB skills.

6. Walter Young...no comment. I hope I dont need to ellaborate here...

Bringing in a 1st round WR is not out of the question when you look at that. You can preach to me about all these players with potetial, but if it doesnt amount to anything, then what? Coaches dont rely on potential that long. They want talented players that can get the job done. At this point, the only WR's I trust to get the job done are Ward and Holmes, and while I blieve are CB's are talented enough to take their game to the next level, a little competition from another talented CB would only help in that effort.
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Cutwolf


Joined: 04 Feb 2006
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes. Let's waste a #1 pick on a #3 WR. Good logic.

Why did our CBs get exposed last year? Hint: It has to do with QB pressure


P.S. ask Chad Johnson how bad Ike Taylor sucks.
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big--ben7


Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 49
Location: FL
PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I feel the same way do not stretch. Take best available, no matter what position. I don't want to trade up though. I don't want to give up any of our picks. If anything trade down and get more picks.
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Cutwolf


Joined: 04 Feb 2006
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Colbert never drafted BPA if it didn't address a need. EVER.

Last edited by Cutwolf on Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:55 pm; edited 1 time in total
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treat88


Joined: 03 Mar 2006
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cutwolf, I actually agree with you, but I don't get why it's all got to be so argumentative, sarcastic, and condescending. It really negates the very good, well-thought out point you are making.
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Cutwolf


Joined: 04 Feb 2006
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

treat88 wrote:
Cutwolf, I actually agree with you, but I don't get why it's all got to be so argumentative, sarcastic, and condescending. It really negates the very good, well-thought out point you are making.


I apologize. I just get frustrated at things that to me are obvious.

I'm from New Jersey. Patience isn't a strong point. Laughing

I don't mean any harm.
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porterfarrior55


Joined: 15 Mar 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2007 1:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is no way we draft WR in the first. Maybe we do have a slight need for a WR but definetly not one to justify using the number 15 pick in the draft. Especially since there isn't any real elite WRs this year. Aside from CJ that is.
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skywlker32


Joined: 14 Mar 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2007 1:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cutwolf wrote:
Colbert never drafted BPA if it didn't address a need. EVER.


The only problem that I have with this is that Cowher was given a lot of control in the draft as well before. They may not have been going with BPA because Cowher wanted his guy.
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Cutwolf


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2007 1:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cowher and Colbert share the same power ratio as Tomlin Colbert.
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skywlker32


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2007 1:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cutwolf wrote:
Cowher and Colbert share the same power ratio as Tomlin Colbert.


Cowher was, from what I've heard, given the benefit of the doubt when there was any discrepancies in who should be drafted, especially early on. I can try to find a link on it, but I am almost positive, and a new coach is less likely to be pushy with who he wants in the draft so as to not disrupt a balance.
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