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Kiwanuka vs Hali
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detfan782004


Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Posts: 57792
Location: Omaha
PostPosted: Sun Apr 16, 2006 10:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Kiwanuka vs Hali Reply with quote

Ice wrote:
detfan782004 wrote:
Who would you rather have if we traded to around 18-20?

Just pure debate...which one is the better fit for Detroit?

He wants opinions here not reality.Neither will likely be the Lions pick but if you had to take one of these two who would you take? And please not Mr. Trade Down he is overrated Laughing Laughing Laughing


I just wnated to know which one would be better fot Detroit and it ended up being better topic than I thought.
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osiris


Joined: 16 Mar 2005
Posts: 217
PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 2:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hali. Kiwi has always been rated highly and has always underperformed. I'd rather take someone who has shown ability on the field.
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qball8001


Joined: 22 Nov 2005
Posts: 7934
PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kiwi is a feel good story, but I doubt he lives up to where he is taken.
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goblue42


Joined: 12 Oct 2004
Posts: 673
Location: Ft Myers Beach, Florida
PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 10:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good question that I happened to just toss around the other day in another forum. First off I think there is a very good chance that both of these guys will be there at #40. They are on the fringe! I think some of the above threads like Ice summed it up pretty well. I think Kiwi may have more upside but Hali is a tough harnosed guy with a high motor. Its pretty darn close if they were both there at #40 and we were deciding between the two I would be totally torn. I will flip a coin and go with Hali!
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classythomasj


Joined: 30 Jan 2006
Posts: 355
Location: Novi
PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 10:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would take hali too at 40 if he was there over KIWI...Kiwi has a cute story but being in Michigan I have seen Tamba play a lot against these offences and I really like his game. Especially his bowl performance was really good.
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c-rog


Joined: 17 Jan 2006
Posts: 150
PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 11:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hali is not underized. You just think that conpared to maro williams and kiwi. The best DE's in the league are his size. look at kearse, freeney, strahan.
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Idi Amin


Joined: 05 Mar 2005
Posts: 721
Location: Long Beach, Cali
PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2006 6:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hali IS undersized 6-2 1/2, 263 is short and he needs another 10 lbs

Kiwanuka has NOT always underperformed, he did last year both before and after his knee got cut, but the year before he had great stats and that is why he was so hyped for this past season

Hali also had probably the worst combine of anybody...he put up DT speed and quickness with S strength. He has NO explosion. Scouts have a formula, bench + vertical + broad jump = explosion and Hali's was a joke. Here are his numbers, however there are no splits for 10 and 20 yards. Hali was not even in the top 20 for DEs in 40, bench, vertical, or broad jump

40 - 4.86
Bench - 18
Vertical - 29 1/2
Broad Jump - 8-10
Shuttle - 4.31 13th among DEs
Cone - 7.28 18th among DEs
Wonderlic - 17

to put that into perspective lets see how he ranked against DTs

Vertical - T-24
Broad Jump - T-18
Shuttle - T-2
Cone - 1 (by 0.01)

This is as a 260 pounder against 300-340 pounders
Bench + Vertical + Broad
Bunkley - 44 + 32 1/2 + 9-5
Ngata - 37 + 31 1/2 + 9-2

I could throw numbers up all day - Winston Justice's Shuttle and Cone were 4.42 and 7.27 and we all know how he did with his vertical and bench

Hali is gonna be a NCAA guy, not an NFL guy...its too bad, I like his story, but his showing was pathetic especially considering that he is slightly undersized.

That said, Kiwanuka, for me is a better story, but he also had an bad combine, but nowhere near as atrocious as Hali
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Idi Amin


Joined: 05 Mar 2005
Posts: 721
Location: Long Beach, Cali
PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2006 10:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

osiris wrote:
Hali. Kiwi has always been rated highly and has always underperformed. I'd rather take someone who has shown ability on the field.


2003 (So) 83 tackles, 16 TFL, 13 sacks

2004 (Jr) 67 tackles, 24.5 TFL, 2 INT, 11.5 sacks (T-5 nationally)

2005 (Sr) 51 tackles, 16.5 TFL, 9.5 sacks (missed nearly 2 full games)

2005 first-team All-America

finished his collegiate career with a school-record 37.5 sacks

Underperformed and hasn't shown ability on field my @ss...known what you are talking about
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X_Factor_40


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Joined: 24 Oct 2005
Posts: 20204
Location: Hockeytown
PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2006 11:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Idi Amin wrote:
osiris wrote:
Hali. Kiwi has always been rated highly and has always underperformed. I'd rather take someone who has shown ability on the field.


2003 (So) 83 tackles, 16 TFL, 13 sacks

2004 (Jr) 67 tackles, 24.5 TFL, 2 INT, 11.5 sacks (T-5 nationally)

2005 (Sr) 51 tackles, 16.5 TFL, 9.5 sacks (missed nearly 2 full games)

2005 first-team All-America

finished his collegiate career with a school-record 37.5 sacks

Underperformed and hasn't shown ability on field my @ss...known what you are talking about


I saw a few BC games this year. I was really impressed with Kiwi. In one game I saw he had 12 tackles and 2 sacks. That dosent sound like underperforming to me.
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nb5005


Joined: 01 Feb 2006
Posts: 1030
Location: Michigan
PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 3:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Like I said before if Kiwa would of came out last year he would of been a top 20 pick easily. Now if he falls down to the Lions we almost have to take him Smile
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