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Kevin Kolb=Matt Hasselbeck? and more Kolb speculation

 
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dirtywaterRIP


Joined: 22 Mar 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 11:49 am    Post subject: Kevin Kolb=Matt Hasselbeck? and more Kolb speculation Reply with quote

If Kolb succeeds, I see him most closely resembling Matt Hasselbeck: accurate WCO QB with "average" arm strength.

He's really the closest successful QB I can think of, from the past 10 years. Before the Cover 2 defense, there were a lot of decent QBs who couldn't throw the deep ball, like Bernie Kosar.

Jeff Garcia is another possibility, but Garcia had impeccable timing and this unique ability to improvise. I think if Kolb turned into a young Jeff Garcia, (without the lisp) Eagles fans would be very happy.

On the low end, I see Ty Detmer.

I've always seen a parallel between McNabb/Kolb and Cunningham/Detmer. The same people who wanted Kolb to start said Detmer was better than Randall. Why? Because he was more accurate on short throws, gutsier and knew how to run an offense.


Forget Aaron Rogers, Matt Schaub, Phillip Rivers, Drew Brees or any other strong armed QB. He can correct a lot of his timing-related flaws, like staring down his receiver, throwing behind them or holding on to the ball too long, but he'll never develop a stronger arm.

I'm interested to hear other comps...What do you think about Hasselbeck? Does that sound about right? Would you be happy with that? I think Eagles fans would have to be happy with Kolb, if he turned into a fringe pro-bowl level QB who can properly run the WCO.(like Hasselbeck)

If a young Hasselbeck had a big, talented offensive line, (which the Eagles have, even without any additions) a big, reliable tight end like Celek, (as well as the seam stretching athletic #2 TE in Ingram and perhaps Rucker) a pair of dynamic, play-making wideouts in Maclin & Jackson, a versatile weapon at FB in Weaver and an enormously talented up-and-coming RB with great hands, in Shady McCoy, I think he'd be a pretty dangerous QB.

We're handing Kolb the key to the Ferrari, one of the fastest cars in the race. Lets see if his driving skills are good enough to get the checkered flag. Kevin's had years to prepare, as an understudy to one of the best, with all the support in the world and received the best possible training.(say what you will about Reid's drafting, play-calling, time management and stubborn gameday decisions, but he might be THE BEST at developing a QB. If a team were starting a franchise with all the money in the world, they'd make him the QB coach)

There will be an enormous amount of pressure and expectations will be sky-high. We're impatient, not used to losing and have repeatedly considered 11-5 playoff seasons to be failures. After seasons that other franchises would've considered their best in 20 years, we called for the firing of the coach and star QB.

Even after the 2010 firesale, there will be no rebuilding. Like they say in high school football, championships don't graduate.

Instead of lowering expectations, these high-risk moves will raise them. We won't give Kevin or Andy the benefit of the doubt, we'll criticize them for boring us with an inferior product.

If they're right, this will be the offense Andy Reid always wanted; the young talent will blossom into the best offense we've ever seen in Philly.

If they're wrong, this will be the end of the Reid era, although that end won't come quickly enough for his critics. Reid just signed an extension and won't be fired for another 3 years even if we don't break .500 in that time. This will be the start of the most painful era in Eagles football. It'll be like your long-term supermodel GF dumping you for your former best friend/turned enemy who lives down the block, then not getting laid at all for years.

So, lets hope they're right. I really think Hasselbeck is the closest thing to a best-care scenario comp for Kolb. He could potentially be a little better, due to an elite supporting cast, but we shouldn't expect so much.

What are the chances Vick eventually becomes the starter, even if Kolb is healthy? I don't think its as low as some people think. I'd put it around 30%. What do you think?

BTW - I was the first Kolb supporter on this board after they drafted him. After watching him dominate once on ESPN Thursday night football, I thought he looked like the perfect QB for Andy Reid's system. I didn't turn against him until watching him in training camp, pre-season and the regular season. I attended the Saints game and thought he looked absolutely atrocious, despite his 390 yards.(which i considered a joke at the time) Also, during Kolb's time in Philadelphia, Donovan became more accurate and productive in clutch situations. D-Mac was unable to lead his team on 2nd half comebacks until the last few seasons. So basically, Donovan corrected everything we criticized him for when we drafted Kolb. I really believe this decision was mostly based on money, which is why Reid wanted to keep him.

thoughts?
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philyeagles3


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 12:04 pm    Post subject: Re: Kevin Kolb=Matt Hasselbeck? and more Kolb speculation Reply with quote

dirtywaterRIP wrote:
If Kolb succeeds, I see him most closely resembling Matt Hasselbeck: accurate WCO QB with "average" arm strength.

He's really the closest successful QB I can think of, from the past 10 years. Before the Cover 2 defense, there were a lot of decent QBs who couldn't throw the deep ball, like Bernie Kosar.

Jeff Garcia is another possibility, but Garcia had impeccable timing and this unique ability to improvise. I think if Kolb turned into a young Jeff Garcia, (without the lisp) Eagles fans would be very happy.

On the low end, I see Ty Detmer.

I've always seen a parallel between McNabb/Kolb and Cunningham/Detmer. The same people who wanted Kolb to start said Detmer was better than Randall. Why? Because he was more accurate on short throws, gutsier and knew how to run an offense.


Forget Aaron Rogers, Matt Schaub, Phillip Rivers, Drew Brees or any other strong armed QB. He can correct a lot of his timing-related flaws, like staring down his receiver, throwing behind them or holding on to the ball too long, but he'll never develop a stronger arm.

I'm interested to hear other comps...What do you think about Hasselbeck? Does that sound about right? Would you be happy with that? I think Eagles fans would have to be happy with Kolb, if he turned into a fringe pro-bowl level QB who can properly run the WCO.(like Hasselbeck)

If a young Hasselbeck had a big, talented offensive line, (which the Eagles have, even without any additions) a big, reliable tight end like Celek, (as well as the seam stretching athletic #2 TE in Ingram and perhaps Rucker) a pair of dynamic, play-making wideouts in Maclin & Jackson, a versatile weapon at FB in Weaver and an enormously talented up-and-coming RB with great hands, in Shady McCoy, I think he'd be a pretty dangerous QB.

We're handing Kolb the key to the Ferrari, one of the fastest cars in the race. Lets see if his driving skills are good enough to get the checkered flag. Kevin's had years to prepare, as an understudy to one of the best, with all the support in the world and received the best possible training.(say what you will about Reid's drafting, play-calling, time management and stubborn gameday decisions, but he might be THE BEST at developing a QB. If a team were starting a franchise with all the money in the world, they'd make him the QB coach)

There will be an enormous amount of pressure and expectations will be sky-high. We're impatient, not used to losing and have repeatedly considered 11-5 playoff seasons to be failures. After seasons that other franchises would've considered their best in 20 years, we called for the firing of the coach and star QB.

Even after the 2010 firesale, there will be no rebuilding. Like they say in high school football, championships don't graduate.

Instead of lowering expectations, these high-risk moves will raise them. We won't give Kevin or Andy the benefit of the doubt, we'll criticize them for boring us with an inferior product.

If they're right, this will be the offense Andy Reid always wanted; the young talent will blossom into the best offense we've ever seen in Philly.

If they're wrong, this will be the end of the Reid era, although that end won't come quickly enough for his critics. Reid just signed an extension and won't be fired for another 3 years even if we don't break .500 in that time. This will be the start of the most painful era in Eagles football. It'll be like your long-term supermodel GF dumping you for your former best friend/turned enemy who lives down the block, then not getting laid at all for years.

So, lets hope they're right. I really think Hasselbeck is the closest thing to a best-care scenario comp for Kolb. He could potentially be a little better, due to an elite supporting cast, but we shouldn't expect so much.

What are the chances Vick eventually becomes the starter, even if Kolb is healthy? I don't think its as low as some people think. I'd put it around 30%. What do you think?

BTW - I was the first Kolb supporter on this board after they drafted him. After watching him dominate once on ESPN Thursday night football, I thought he looked like the perfect QB for Andy Reid's system. I didn't turn against him until watching him in training camp, pre-season and the regular season. I attended the Saints game and thought he looked absolutely atrocious, despite his 390 yards.(which i considered a joke at the time) Also, during Kolb's time in Philadelphia, Donovan became more accurate and productive in clutch situations. D-Mac was unable to lead his team on 2nd half comebacks until the last few seasons. So basically, Donovan corrected everything we criticized him for when we drafted Kolb. I really believe this decision was mostly based on money, which is why Reid wanted to keep him.

thoughts?


He is Aaron Rogers 2.0, Rogers doesn't have the prototypical arm of an NFL QB, idk where you got that from. He is similar to Hasselbeck but he is more talented and more athletic.

0% Vick is ever a starter for any team unless its for an injury.

Donovan didn't correct much, granted i did see more comebacks but not many comeback "victories". He still had very bad short range accuracy and thats what annoyed me the most, he never seemed to care about that and the coaches just let him go own sucking at throwing a drag route. Dont you remeber him completely missing a WIDE OPEN Hank Baskett last year and it was a simple drag route that could've gone for a big gain?
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sandalf69


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 12:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Kevin Kolb=Matt Hasselbeck? and more Kolb speculation Reply with quote

dirtywaterRIP wrote:
If Kolb succeeds, I see him most closely resembling Matt Hasselbeck: accurate WCO QB with "average" arm strength.

He's really the closest successful QB I can think of, from the past 10 years. Before the Cover 2 defense, there were a lot of decent QBs who couldn't throw the deep ball, like Bernie Kosar.

Jeff Garcia is another possibility, but Garcia had impeccable timing and this unique ability to improvise. I think if Kolb turned into a young Jeff Garcia, (without the lisp) Eagles fans would be very happy.

On the low end, I see Ty Detmer.

I've always seen a parallel between McNabb/Kolb and Cunningham/Detmer. The same people who wanted Kolb to start said Detmer was better than Randall. Why? Because he was more accurate on short throws, gutsier and knew how to run an offense.


Forget Aaron Rogers, Matt Schaub, Phillip Rivers, Drew Brees or any other strong armed QB. He can correct a lot of his timing-related flaws, like staring down his receiver, throwing behind them or holding on to the ball too long, but he'll never develop a stronger arm.

I'm interested to hear other comps...What do you think about Hasselbeck? Does that sound about right? Would you be happy with that? I think Eagles fans would have to be happy with Kolb, if he turned into a fringe pro-bowl level QB who can properly run the WCO.(like Hasselbeck)

If a young Hasselbeck had a big, talented offensive line, (which the Eagles have, even without any additions) a big, reliable tight end like Celek, (as well as the seam stretching athletic #2 TE in Ingram and perhaps Rucker) a pair of dynamic, play-making wideouts in Maclin & Jackson, a versatile weapon at FB in Weaver and an enormously talented up-and-coming RB with great hands, in Shady McCoy, I think he'd be a pretty dangerous QB.

We're handing Kolb the key to the Ferrari, one of the fastest cars in the race. Lets see if his driving skills are good enough to get the checkered flag. Kevin's had years to prepare, as an understudy to one of the best, with all the support in the world and received the best possible training.(say what you will about Reid's drafting, play-calling, time management and stubborn gameday decisions, but he might be THE BEST at developing a QB. If a team were starting a franchise with all the money in the world, they'd make him the QB coach)

There will be an enormous amount of pressure and expectations will be sky-high. We're impatient, not used to losing and have repeatedly considered 11-5 playoff seasons to be failures. After seasons that other franchises would've considered their best in 20 years, we called for the firing of the coach and star QB.

Even after the 2010 firesale, there will be no rebuilding. Like they say in high school football, championships don't graduate.

Instead of lowering expectations, these high-risk moves will raise them. We won't give Kevin or Andy the benefit of the doubt, we'll criticize them for boring us with an inferior product.

If they're right, this will be the offense Andy Reid always wanted; the young talent will blossom into the best offense we've ever seen in Philly.

If they're wrong, this will be the end of the Reid era, although that end won't come quickly enough for his critics. Reid just signed an extension and won't be fired for another 3 years even if we don't break .500 in that time. This will be the start of the most painful era in Eagles football. It'll be like your long-term supermodel GF dumping you for your former best friend/turned enemy who lives down the block, then not getting laid at all for years.

So, lets hope they're right. I really think Hasselbeck is the closest thing to a best-care scenario comp for Kolb. He could potentially be a little better, due to an elite supporting cast, but we shouldn't expect so much.

What are the chances Vick eventually becomes the starter, even if Kolb is healthy? I don't think its as low as some people think. I'd put it around 30%. What do you think?

BTW - I was the first Kolb supporter on this board after they drafted him. After watching him dominate once on ESPN Thursday night football, I thought he looked like the perfect QB for Andy Reid's system. I didn't turn against him until watching him in training camp, pre-season and the regular season. I attended the Saints game and thought he looked absolutely atrocious, despite his 390 yards.(which i considered a joke at the time) Also, during Kolb's time in Philadelphia, Donovan became more accurate and productive in clutch situations. D-Mac was unable to lead his team on 2nd half comebacks until the last few seasons. So basically, Donovan corrected everything we criticized him for when we drafted Kolb. I really believe this decision was mostly based on money, which is why Reid wanted to keep him.

thoughts?


People keep talking about how Kolb has a weak arm. He may not be a gun slinger, but it certainly doesn't look like he's being limited at all physically.

I like Kolb, and I think your Matt Hasselback comparison is spot on. They both are the kind of players who, Xs and Os-wise at least, have a great understanding of the position. All I've been hearing from the Eagles is that he's a natural. And from what I've seen, I'm inclined to agree.

I also think that with Kolb as the QB instead of McNabb, I think we can expect to see much more focused play calling on Andy Reid's part. I feel like over the past couple years he's been unfocused. Not that he wasn't working hard, but I think it's hard to plan an offense with McNabb at QB (as good as he is, I think we can all agree that he goes through stretches of inconsistency, inaccuracy, and he makes a lot of wacky, unpredictable plays.) I think with Kolb at QB, at least to start out with, I think we'll see a more balanced offense, with better timing, and better play calling. But that's my optimistic view. I understand that Kolb could very well fall flat on his face.

But I think he'll be alright. I gotta say, I'm looking forward to having Kolb at QB. As you already said, our offense is stacked with weapons, and I think with Kolb's accuracy and (sometimes) decision making, he's a better fit than McNabb. Kolb is by far the more accurate of the two.
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PowerElite


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 12:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Kevin Kolb=Matt Hasselbeck? and more Kolb speculation Reply with quote

philyeagles3 wrote:

He is Aaron Rogers 2.0, Rogers doesn't have the prototypical arm of an NFL QB, idk where you got that from.


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dirtywaterRIP


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 12:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Since Kolb supporters will challenge my non-arm strength related criticisms of him, (even his mom would admit his arm's not great) I want to post quotes from his scouting reports coming out of college. I'm taking these quotes from this article on Bleeding Green Nation http://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2007/4/28/194242/416 I'll break it down by criticism.

Struggles to throw the deep ball

NFL Draft Countdown:
Accuracy is dodgy, especially on deep balls

War Room Report:
unlikely to become an elite vertical passer...

...his lack of arm strength will limit his ceiling


Scouts Notebook
...not great arm

too many passes batted down at the line

War Room Report
Kolb has as tendency to go to a three quarters delivery that causes the ball to get batted down at the line of scrimmage

Draft Countdown
Gets too many passes batted down at the line

Stares down his receiver, holds onto ball too long

FF Toolbox
Kolb has to work on his accuracy and holding onto the football.

Sports Illustrated
Tends to direct his throws. Stares down the primary target.

Scout.com
Tends to direct his throws. Stares down the primary target.
(yes they said the exact same thing as SI)

also- McNabb's durability was his biggest flaw, but he hasn't really been hurt since we drafted Kolb.


Note to Mods- I properly sourced all this material, so there's no reason to delete it.


Last edited by dirtywaterRIP on Mon Apr 05, 2010 1:12 pm; edited 1 time in total
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dirtywaterRIP


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 1:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aaron Rogers has a great arm; one of the top 10 in the league. Kolb's arm is in the bottom half of NFL starters. They are absolutely nothing alike.

Their only similarity is waiting behind an elite QB, which means absolutely nothing. Matt Hasselbeck waited behind Brett Favre too.

If Kolb had Aaron Rogers's arm strength, he'd be better than Aaron Rogers.

Watch this throw by Rogers. The ball travels 68 yards in the air:

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d81480cab/Donald-Driver-68-yard-rec

Show me a clip of a Kolb pass not dying around 45 yards like a duck with wingful of buckshot. He might be able to throw around 50 yards, but not accurately; they begin to sail and their trajectory changes. His 50 yard passes are basically jumpballs, whereas thats McNabb's sweetspot.


As far as McNabb "throwing at the dirt", thats due to Andy Reid telling him to throw short passes low. Missing low results in an incompletion. Missing high results in a turnover. If you follow the Eagles you should know their QBs are instructed to throw short passes low. Kevin Kolb will do the same if he's a good quarterback.

...and McNabb throwing behind Baskett? that was Troy Aikman talking **** on the Eagles. That pass was completed for a first down. In the Saints game Kolb threw WAY behind Desean Jackson on a similar crossing route and it was incomplete, despite Jackson making a great adjustment, stopping and jumping backwards. Jackson was wide open and that could've been a touchdown. I recall him doing the same thing in the Ravens game, but don't remember the specifics.
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E-A-G-L-E-S


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 1:22 pm    Post subject: Re: Kevin Kolb=Matt Hasselbeck? and more Kolb speculation Reply with quote

philyeagles3 wrote:
dirtywaterRIP wrote:
If Kolb succeeds, I see him most closely resembling Matt Hasselbeck: accurate WCO QB with "average" arm strength.

He's really the closest successful QB I can think of, from the past 10 years. Before the Cover 2 defense, there were a lot of decent QBs who couldn't throw the deep ball, like Bernie Kosar.

Jeff Garcia is another possibility, but Garcia had impeccable timing and this unique ability to improvise. I think if Kolb turned into a young Jeff Garcia, (without the lisp) Eagles fans would be very happy.

On the low end, I see Ty Detmer.

I've always seen a parallel between McNabb/Kolb and Cunningham/Detmer. The same people who wanted Kolb to start said Detmer was better than Randall. Why? Because he was more accurate on short throws, gutsier and knew how to run an offense.


Forget Aaron Rogers, Matt Schaub, Phillip Rivers, Drew Brees or any other strong armed QB. He can correct a lot of his timing-related flaws, like staring down his receiver, throwing behind them or holding on to the ball too long, but he'll never develop a stronger arm.

I'm interested to hear other comps...What do you think about Hasselbeck? Does that sound about right? Would you be happy with that? I think Eagles fans would have to be happy with Kolb, if he turned into a fringe pro-bowl level QB who can properly run the WCO.(like Hasselbeck)

If a young Hasselbeck had a big, talented offensive line, (which the Eagles have, even without any additions) a big, reliable tight end like Celek, (as well as the seam stretching athletic #2 TE in Ingram and perhaps Rucker) a pair of dynamic, play-making wideouts in Maclin & Jackson, a versatile weapon at FB in Weaver and an enormously talented up-and-coming RB with great hands, in Shady McCoy, I think he'd be a pretty dangerous QB.

We're handing Kolb the key to the Ferrari, one of the fastest cars in the race. Lets see if his driving skills are good enough to get the checkered flag. Kevin's had years to prepare, as an understudy to one of the best, with all the support in the world and received the best possible training.(say what you will about Reid's drafting, play-calling, time management and stubborn gameday decisions, but he might be THE BEST at developing a QB. If a team were starting a franchise with all the money in the world, they'd make him the QB coach)

There will be an enormous amount of pressure and expectations will be sky-high. We're impatient, not used to losing and have repeatedly considered 11-5 playoff seasons to be failures. After seasons that other franchises would've considered their best in 20 years, we called for the firing of the coach and star QB.

Even after the 2010 firesale, there will be no rebuilding. Like they say in high school football, championships don't graduate.

Instead of lowering expectations, these high-risk moves will raise them. We won't give Kevin or Andy the benefit of the doubt, we'll criticize them for boring us with an inferior product.

If they're right, this will be the offense Andy Reid always wanted; the young talent will blossom into the best offense we've ever seen in Philly.

If they're wrong, this will be the end of the Reid era, although that end won't come quickly enough for his critics. Reid just signed an extension and won't be fired for another 3 years even if we don't break .500 in that time. This will be the start of the most painful era in Eagles football. It'll be like your long-term supermodel GF dumping you for your former best friend/turned enemy who lives down the block, then not getting laid at all for years.

So, lets hope they're right. I really think Hasselbeck is the closest thing to a best-care scenario comp for Kolb. He could potentially be a little better, due to an elite supporting cast, but we shouldn't expect so much.

What are the chances Vick eventually becomes the starter, even if Kolb is healthy? I don't think its as low as some people think. I'd put it around 30%. What do you think?

BTW - I was the first Kolb supporter on this board after they drafted him. After watching him dominate once on ESPN Thursday night football, I thought he looked like the perfect QB for Andy Reid's system. I didn't turn against him until watching him in training camp, pre-season and the regular season. I attended the Saints game and thought he looked absolutely atrocious, despite his 390 yards.(which i considered a joke at the time) Also, during Kolb's time in Philadelphia, Donovan became more accurate and productive in clutch situations. D-Mac was unable to lead his team on 2nd half comebacks until the last few seasons. So basically, Donovan corrected everything we criticized him for when we drafted Kolb. I really believe this decision was mostly based on money, which is why Reid wanted to keep him.

thoughts?


He is Aaron Rogers 2.0, Rogers doesn't have the prototypical arm of an NFL QB, idk where you got that from. He is similar to Hasselbeck but he is more talented and more athletic.

0% Vick is ever a starter for any team unless its for an injury.

Donovan didn't correct much, granted i did see more comebacks but not many comeback "victories". He still had very bad short range accuracy and thats what annoyed me the most, he never seemed to care about that and the coaches just let him go own sucking at throwing a drag route. Dont you remeber him completely missing a WIDE OPEN Hank Baskett last year and it was a simple drag route that could've gone for a big gain?




i love quoting the initial post when I'm the first one to respond too.... because no one has read it.



anywho it doesnt really matter who is is gonna be like. i think he has a ceiling that is very high, but is not a proven entitiy. hasselback has a similar arm and plays in a similar west coast system (though the hawks were best pounding it with shaun alexander).
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 1:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dirtywaterRIP wrote:
Aaron Rogers has a great arm; one of the top 10 in the league. Kolb's arm is in the bottom half of NFL starters. They are absolutely nothing alike.

Their only similarity is waiting behind an elite QB, which means absolutely nothing. Matt Hasselbeck waited behind Brett Favre too.

If Kolb had Aaron Rogers's arm strength, he'd be better than Aaron Rogers.

Watch this throw by Rogers. The ball travels 68 yards in the air:

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d81480cab/Donald-Driver-68-yard-rec

Show me a clip of a Kolb pass not dying around 45 yards like a duck with wingful of buckshot. He might be able to throw around 50 yards, but not accurately; they begin to sail and their trajectory changes. His 50 yard passes are basically jumpballs, whereas thats McNabb's sweetspot.


As far as McNabb "throwing at the dirt", thats due to Andy Reid telling him to throw short passes low. Missing low results in an incompletion. Missing high results in a turnover. If you follow the Eagles you should know their QBs are instructed to throw short passes low. Kevin Kolb will do the same if he's a good quarterback.

...and McNabb throwing behind Baskett? that was Troy Aikman talking **** on the Eagles. That pass was completed for a first down. In the Saints game Kolb threw WAY behind Desean Jackson on a similar crossing route and it was incomplete, despite Jackson making a great adjustment, stopping and jumping backwards. Jackson was wide open and that could've been a touchdown. I recall him doing the same thing in the Ravens game, but don't remember the specifics.


This is insulting to anyone here with half a brian. I can find many publications that say Kolb's arm strength is more then strong enough to make every NFL pass. I can give you many publications that say Rodgers was a bust in the making and the best of all I still have a publication that say McNabb was the 4th best QB in the draft when he came out. Here is my other favorite, Ryan Leaf is the most sure fire pick to come into the league in many years. Every QB makes bad throws and the fact you can highlite one is amazing. Fine, McNabb threw them in the dirt. Farve threw interceptions and he will end up in the HOF. The fact is you have no clue what your talking about. Josh Johnson played in more games for the Bucs last year then Kolb played in for the Eagles and they called it growing pains. Simple FACT, around here, if you like a player you stick up for him, if you don't you bash him. Wait and see if the guy can play. When we Drafted Westbrook I said, "what the H@ll are they doing" and look what kind of player he turned out to be. No one, and I mean not one single person, could of called that. Get a grip!
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philyeagles3


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 1:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://gnb.scout.com/a.z?s=61&p=8&c=1&nid=2983568

Quote:
Negatives
Though accurate, lacks top pass placement and has receivers extending vertically to pull the ball out of the air. Must improve his accuracy down the field.


What I mean by his arm, is sure he can throw it downfield like Kolb but the accuracy is questioned. Its very similar.

Quote:
even his mom would admit his arm's not great)


Wtf lmao, good for your mom?

Quote:
Show me a clip of a Kolb pass not dying around 45 yards like a duck with wingful of buckshot

Arrow You dont need to throw 45 yards to play in the NFL

Quote:
As far as McNabb "throwing at the dirt", thats due to Andy Reid telling him to throw short passes low. Missing low results in an incompletion. Missing high results in a turnover. If you follow the Eagles you should know their QBs are instructed to throw short passes low. Kevin Kolb will do the same if he's a good quarterback.


Yeah maybe low to their bodies but not in the dirt behind them. And I have also never heard of that on short passes you supposed to hit them in stride so they can get YAC, if you knew the WCO you would know that.


Quote:
and McNabb throwing behind Baskett? that was Troy Aikman talking **** on the Eagles. That pass was completed for a first down. In the Saints game Kolb threw WAY behind Desean Jackson on a similar crossing route and it was incomplete, despite Jackson making a great adjustment, stopping and jumping backwards. Jackson was wide open and that could've been a touchdown. I recall him doing the same thing in the Ravens game, but don't remember the specifics.


What are you talking about?
Arrow Regular season game vs NFC championship game
Arrow Kolbs first start vs Mcnabbs 5th NFC championship game
Arrow Troy Aikmen for being a former Cowboy is acutally not a bad announcer and is rarely bias.
Arrow And yeah on trying to win on the last drive the Eagle had he missed a wide open Baskett and it could've gone for a first down. And he repeatedly does that. I was trying to agree with you on this subject but your jus tnot making sense
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 1:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dirtywaterRIP wrote:
Since Kolb supporters will challenge my non-arm strength related criticisms of him, (even his mom would admit his arm's not great) I want to post quotes from his scouting reports coming out of college. I'm taking these quotes from this article on Bleeding Green Nation http://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2007/4/28/194242/416 I'll break it down by criticism.

Struggles to throw the deep ball

NFL Draft Countdown:
Accuracy is dodgy, especially on deep balls

War Room Report:
unlikely to become an elite vertical passer...

...his lack of arm strength will limit his ceiling


Scouts Notebook
...not great arm

too many passes batted down at the line

War Room Report
Kolb has as tendency to go to a three quarters delivery that causes the ball to get batted down at the line of scrimmage

Draft Countdown
Gets too many passes batted down at the line

Stares down his receiver, holds onto ball too long

FF Toolbox
Kolb has to work on his accuracy and holding onto the football.

Sports Illustrated
Tends to direct his throws. Stares down the primary target.

Scout.com
Tends to direct his throws. Stares down the primary target.
(yes they said the exact same thing as SI)

also- McNabb's durability was his biggest flaw, but he hasn't really been hurt since we drafted Kolb.


Note to Mods- I properly sourced all this material, so there's no reason to delete it.


Here's one of the most detailed scouting reports of Kolb that I've come across:

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/historical/414742

It shows little, if any, criticism of Kolb's arm strength.

Quote:
Throws the long ball with adequate touch and accuracy, zips the posts and even when he passes off his back foot, he is still able to generate good velocity


Quote:
Compares To: JAY CUTLER-Denver Before his senior season, Kolb was reminiscent of David Carr -- blessed with good arm strength, but too streaky in his performance. With added maturity, a trimmer body and a stronger arm, he has elevated his status to the top of the position.

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philyeagles3


Joined: 01 Nov 2007
Posts: 3555
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Talk all they want about Drew Stanton's arm strength, we'll take a more patient Kevin Kolb over any quarterback in this draft after the two first-rounders (Brady Quinn, JaMarcus Russell) are gone.


^ How funny is that lol back in 05' they said that and it seems to be true haha

And that is from the site posted above
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dirtywaterRIP


Joined: 22 Mar 2007
Posts: 365
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 2:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey I made the 1st thread on this board defending the Kolb pick when they took him. That thread elicted derision by the same people who are now defending him. My criticism of Kolb is just based on watching him play since he got here.

I won't respond to criticisms which use a) horrible grammar b) ad hominem attacks c) illogical arguments. You're allowed poor spelling and two of the three, but not all of them.

Obviously he's nothing like Jay Cutler. That person should be fired. Yeah he's an inaccurate QB, with no pocket presence, poor grasp of how to run an offense and a rocket arm. Might as well compare him to Jamarcus Russell.

I have no problem with Kevin Kolb, but obviously he doesn't have elite arm strength. Thats why I'm comparing him to successful West Coast offense QBs. I'm trying to rationalize this trade and convince myself he can be successful despite lacking prototypical arm strength.

...and yes, an NFL QB needs to be able to throw 45 yards, at least when they're young. Even Chad Pennington could throw 45 yards before his injuries. Most high school starting quarterbacks can throw that far. Kevin Kolb can, but his passes start to sail past that point. That long TD to Desean Jackson at the start of the Saints game wasn't more than 40 yards. Donovan makes that throw on a frozen rope. Kolb's deep ball will never be as accurate or deep as Donovan's. Not even close.
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