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When Will Society Collapse?
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When?
Before 2020
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
By 2040
24%
 24%  [ 8 ]
By 2100
18%
 18%  [ 6 ]
Not Within 100 Years
30%
 30%  [ 10 ]
Never; We'll Figure It Out
27%
 27%  [ 9 ]
Total Votes : 33

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SteelKing728


Joined: 23 Aug 2008
Posts: 23505
Location: PGH
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HorizontoZenith wrote:
Rolling Eyes

Anybody thinking Shaun of the Dead style zombies could cause a civilization collapse. Even in The Walking Dead, where if you die you become a zombie, there is no way slow walking zombies could possibly cause the collapse of society.

People would turn that into a reality show so fast it wouldn't even be funny. Only thing slow walking zombies would do is MAYBE get rid of morbidly obese and elderly, maybe some children. America would get free target practice out of it and that's about all it would manage to do.


The initial onslaught would hit hard without proper understanding.

That is, sick people go to hospital, die, reanimate, kill in close corridors.

Or people dying at home, reanimate to a loved one holding the body only to get their throat ripped out in a second.

Sooo I think some damage could be done!
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eagles101


Joined: 15 Feb 2005
Posts: 10793
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 6:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SteelKing728 wrote:
HorizontoZenith wrote:
Rolling Eyes

Anybody thinking Shaun of the Dead style zombies could cause a civilization collapse. Even in The Walking Dead, where if you die you become a zombie, there is no way slow walking zombies could possibly cause the collapse of society.

People would turn that into a reality show so fast it wouldn't even be funny. Only thing slow walking zombies would do is MAYBE get rid of morbidly obese and elderly, maybe some children. America would get free target practice out of it and that's about all it would manage to do.


The initial onslaught would hit hard without proper understanding.

That is, sick people go to hospital, die, reanimate, kill in close corridors.

Or people dying at home, reanimate to a loved one holding the body only to get their throat ripped out in a second.

Sooo I think some damage could be done!


But just in a limited area. The government would quarantine an area in a heart beat if zombies appeared. A single person starting a zombie apocalypse is extremely hard to believe.

Now the walking dead style everyone who dies turns into a zombie would get crazy fast.
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vikingsvikings wrote:

I don't understand most of that, but I can tell it's probably inaccurate.
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DavidatMIZZOU


Joined: 09 Apr 2009
Posts: 15984
Location: The ZOU
PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 3:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SMashMouthMike wrote:
Well, humans are not omniscient, but they are clever. To assume that we will fight climate change at the same rate and with the same means is folly to me. Is it possible, yes, I guess. It just seems ridiculously unlikely...to me.

Now an asteroid, combined with influenza, an emp, nuclear war, supervolcano, super strains of bacteria, massive social unrest and civil wars ... I think that might about do us in.


I'm not sure that an asteroid or super volcano need much in combination. They will do a lot of initial damage. They also will have ejecta that if it blocks out the sun for extended periods of time will seriously hamper agriculture. Would humans be extinct? Maybe some survive. But society as we know it would be gone.
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GO PACK GO!

mistakebytehlak wrote:

My god it must be so terrible to have three teams that consistently make the playoffs

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SMashMouthMike


Joined: 01 Dec 2005
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 11:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You are probably right.
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Thanks Lyasr 529
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LuckyNumber11


Joined: 01 Aug 2011
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 12:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The dollar or Chinese economy will fall before climate change screws us all
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#JDI
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raiderrocker18


Joined: 09 Dec 2014
Posts: 5046
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 3:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

if there's a major religious revival (beyond the mideast) in a nuclear world... could be sooner than we'd hope

climate change won't end civilization. it will screw over a lot of people, be ridiculously expensive, cause large scale migration/refugee problems. i think we'll have better technology to deal with crop failures and such. but not a humanity ender. would certainly be cheaper and less painful if we were smart about it now, but doesn't seem that way.

common denominator between those two is putting superstition/feelings above reason
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eagles101


Joined: 15 Feb 2005
Posts: 10793
PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 8:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

LuckyNumber11 wrote:
The dollar or Chinese economy will fall before climate change screws us all


How would those collapse society?
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vikingsvikings wrote:

I don't understand most of that, but I can tell it's probably inaccurate.
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cddolphin


Joined: 23 Mar 2009
Posts: 12478
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 9:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

eagles101 wrote:
LuckyNumber11 wrote:
The dollar or Chinese economy will fall before climate change screws us all


How would those collapse society?


My favorite question.

The dollar collapsing without an alternative system ready to go immediately would essentially cause global / international trade to collapse completely. This means resource scarcity in various areas (food, fuel). The chances of international conflict escalating as a result of this scarcity are high.

Whether enough of society consumes itself into oblivion before re-stabilizing under another system of trade is the question.

"But why is the dollar so important?" To be brief, the dollar is what backs pretty much every currency in the world. It used to be gold, but you can't print unlimited gold. Long story short, if hyperinflation hits the dollar (which is a near mathematical certainty at one point), you're looking at almost every currency worldwide becoming worth nothing, except maybe to burn as a heat source.

"But that's silly. How can a failing currency have such broad negative effects?" The reach of the dollar is historically unprecedented. For about 7,000 years humans bartered. Then for roughly 5,000 years they traded with precious metals (coins, or paper directly backed by precious metals). However, for the past 46 years, we have been trading globally and electronically using dollars, more of which get printed every day, adding to the huge gap between "total dollars" and "actual, tangible dollars". Right now there's about $0.02 in real tangible dollars for every $1.00 that shows up on a bank's computer. Globally, we all rely on the dollar retaining actual value based on faith. Eventually the bankers will dig us deeply enough that the bottom falls out.
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huzzah
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eagles101


Joined: 15 Feb 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 9:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cddolphin wrote:
eagles101 wrote:
LuckyNumber11 wrote:
The dollar or Chinese economy will fall before climate change screws us all


How would those collapse society?


My favorite question.

The dollar collapsing without an alternative system ready to go immediately would essentially cause global / international trade to collapse completely. This means resource scarcity in various areas (food, fuel). The chances of international conflict escalating as a result of this scarcity are high.

Whether enough of society consumes itself into oblivion before re-stabilizing under another system of trade is the question.

"But why is the dollar so important?" To be brief, the dollar is what backs pretty much every currency in the world. It used to be gold, but you can't print unlimited gold. Long story short, if hyperinflation hits the dollar (which is a near mathematical certainty at one point), you're looking at almost every currency worldwide becoming worth nothing, except maybe to burn as a heat source.

"But that's silly. How can a failing currency have such broad negative effects?" The reach of the dollar is historically unprecedented. For about 7,000 years humans bartered. Then for roughly 5,000 years they traded with precious metals (coins, or paper directly backed by precious metals). However, for the past 46 years, we have been trading globally and electronically using dollars, more of which get printed every day, adding to the huge gap between "total dollars" and "actual, tangible dollars". Right now there's about $0.02 in real tangible dollars for every $1.00 that shows up on a bank's computer. Globally, we all rely on the dollar retaining actual value based on faith. Eventually the bankers will dig us deeply enough that the bottom falls out.


But that collapses the economy, not society. There will still be goods, there will still be people to buy and sell them. It might collapse our international economy but i dont see how society collapses. Thats a pretty big doomsday effect just from just an economic collapse.
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vikingsvikings wrote:

I don't understand most of that, but I can tell it's probably inaccurate.
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cddolphin


Joined: 23 Mar 2009
Posts: 12478
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 10:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

eagles101 wrote:
But that collapses the economy, not society. There will still be goods, there will still be people to buy and sell them. It might collapse our international economy but i dont see how society collapses. Thats a pretty big doomsday effect just from just an economic collapse.


What happens when massive swathes of the population have no access to food, or water, or the power grids go down because there is no domestic fuel production? Certain areas will be in more imminent danger than others, sure. But everywhere will be affected. If it can't be acquired and processed locally, there will be a shortage of it.

What do you think NY city will be like after a few days with no food or power? Delhi? London? How about major ports /canals like Panama or Suez?
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huzzah
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eagles101


Joined: 15 Feb 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 10:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cddolphin wrote:
eagles101 wrote:
But that collapses the economy, not society. There will still be goods, there will still be people to buy and sell them. It might collapse our international economy but i dont see how society collapses. Thats a pretty big doomsday effect just from just an economic collapse.


What happens when massive swathes of the population have no access to food, or water, or the power grids go down because there is no domestic fuel production? Certain areas will be in more imminent danger than others, sure. But everywhere will be affected. If it can be acquired and processed locally, there will be a shortage of it.

What do you think NY city will be like after a few days with no food or power? Delhi? London? How about major ports /canals like Panama or Suez?


But why would there be no food or water? The people producing food just decides to let it rot and the countries do nothing about it?

I dont see how, even if money disappeared, people would let the world fall into anarchy just because money is gone. I think the only way it would be possible is if humans were horrible and allowed the world to crumble if not for money.
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vikingsvikings wrote:

I don't understand most of that, but I can tell it's probably inaccurate.
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cddolphin


Joined: 23 Mar 2009
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 10:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

eagles101 wrote:
cddolphin wrote:
eagles101 wrote:
But that collapses the economy, not society. There will still be goods, there will still be people to buy and sell them. It might collapse our international economy but i dont see how society collapses. Thats a pretty big doomsday effect just from just an economic collapse.


What happens when massive swathes of the population have no access to food, or water, or the power grids go down because there is no domestic fuel production? Certain areas will be in more imminent danger than others, sure. But everywhere will be affected. If it can be acquired and processed locally, there will be a shortage of it.

What do you think NY city will be like after a few days with no food or power? Delhi? London? How about major ports /canals like Panama or Suez?


But why would there be no food or water? The people producing food just decides to let it rot and the countries do nothing about it?


How do you think food gets to major metropolitan areas? It's grown and raised hundreds or thousands of miles away. Why would international / inter-regional shipping continue if the money stops flowing? How would it even get shipped if the trucks and boats have no fuel? You're also forgetting about the power grid. When the coal, oil, and natural gas stops arriving on time.. how does the existing food supply stay refrigerated? How does the water continue to be pumped into homes?

Walk into your local gas station and/or grocery store and figure out where exactly the overwhelming majority of that product comes from. It's not from down the street.

If the trucks starting coming to your local city, how long do you think the existing product lasts?
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huzzah
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eagles101


Joined: 15 Feb 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 12:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cddolphin wrote:
eagles101 wrote:
cddolphin wrote:
eagles101 wrote:
But that collapses the economy, not society. There will still be goods, there will still be people to buy and sell them. It might collapse our international economy but i dont see how society collapses. Thats a pretty big doomsday effect just from just an economic collapse.


What happens when massive swathes of the population have no access to food, or water, or the power grids go down because there is no domestic fuel production? Certain areas will be in more imminent danger than others, sure. But everywhere will be affected. If it can be acquired and processed locally, there will be a shortage of it.

What do you think NY city will be like after a few days with no food or power? Delhi? London? How about major ports /canals like Panama or Suez?


But why would there be no food or water? The people producing food just decides to let it rot and the countries do nothing about it?


How do you think food gets to major metropolitan areas? It's grown and raised hundreds or thousands of miles away. Why would international / inter-regional shipping continue if the money stops flowing? How would it even get shipped if the trucks and boats have no fuel? You're also forgetting about the power grid. When the coal, oil, and natural gas stops arriving on time.. how does the existing food supply stay refrigerated? How does the water continue to be pumped into homes?

Walk into your local gas station and/or grocery store and figure out where exactly the overwhelming majority of that product comes from. It's not from down the street.

If the trucks starting coming to your local city, how long do you think the existing product lasts?


First of all people will move. People in new york arnt stuck there with cement. If there is food to be had somewhere else, why would they stay in ny and starve.

But the overall point im saying is humans would have to be overwhelmingly awful, self destructive monsters to choose to let the world collapse than do something without getting a fair pay for it. The only way a collapse like this actually breaks down the society level of how humanity is if, as a group, we decided to do nothing about it. I have a hard time imaging the government not find a way to compensate people for not letting the world collapse AND people actively choosing to not help one another until the whole thing is resolved.
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vikingsvikings wrote:

I don't understand most of that, but I can tell it's probably inaccurate.
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scoobz


Joined: 05 Jun 2017
Posts: 5
PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 1:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

eagles101 wrote:
cddolphin wrote:
eagles101 wrote:
cddolphin wrote:
eagles101 wrote:
But that collapses the economy, not society. There will still be goods, there will still be people to buy and sell them. It might collapse our international economy but i dont see how society collapses. Thats a pretty big doomsday effect just from just an economic collapse.


What happens when massive swathes of the population have no access to food, or water, or the power grids go down because there is no domestic fuel production? Certain areas will be in more imminent danger than others, sure. But everywhere will be affected. If it can be acquired and processed locally, there will be a shortage of it.

What do you think NY city will be like after a few days with no food or power? Delhi? London? How about major ports /canals like Panama or Suez?


But why would there be no food or water? The people producing food just decides to let it rot and the countries do nothing about it?


How do you think food gets to major metropolitan areas? It's grown and raised hundreds or thousands of miles away. Why would international / inter-regional shipping continue if the money stops flowing? How would it even get shipped if the trucks and boats have no fuel? You're also forgetting about the power grid. When the coal, oil, and natural gas stops arriving on time.. how does the existing food supply stay refrigerated? How does the water continue to be pumped into homes?

Walk into your local gas station and/or grocery store and figure out where exactly the overwhelming majority of that product comes from. It's not from down the street.

If the trucks starting coming to your local city, how long do you think the existing product lasts?


First of all people will move. People in new york arnt stuck there with cement. If there is food to be had somewhere else, why would they stay in ny and starve.

But the overall point im saying is humans would have to be overwhelmingly awful, self destructive monsters to choose to let the world collapse than do something without getting a fair pay for it. The only way a collapse like this actually breaks down the society level of how humanity is if, as a group, we decided to do nothing about it. I have a hard time imaging the government not find a way to compensate people for not letting the world collapse AND people actively choosing to not help one another until the whole thing is resolved.


But where would they move? If a farm of 100+ acres is growing the food, where are the people moving? How are they moving? How can they afford a new place without money? How are the traveling if they can't buy gasoline? Where are these places they'll move to that are unoccupied?
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eagles101


Joined: 15 Feb 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

scoobz wrote:
eagles101 wrote:
cddolphin wrote:
eagles101 wrote:
cddolphin wrote:
eagles101 wrote:
But that collapses the economy, not society. There will still be goods, there will still be people to buy and sell them. It might collapse our international economy but i dont see how society collapses. Thats a pretty big doomsday effect just from just an economic collapse.


What happens when massive swathes of the population have no access to food, or water, or the power grids go down because there is no domestic fuel production? Certain areas will be in more imminent danger than others, sure. But everywhere will be affected. If it can be acquired and processed locally, there will be a shortage of it.

What do you think NY city will be like after a few days with no food or power? Delhi? London? How about major ports /canals like Panama or Suez?


But why would there be no food or water? The people producing food just decides to let it rot and the countries do nothing about it?


How do you think food gets to major metropolitan areas? It's grown and raised hundreds or thousands of miles away. Why would international / inter-regional shipping continue if the money stops flowing? How would it even get shipped if the trucks and boats have no fuel? You're also forgetting about the power grid. When the coal, oil, and natural gas stops arriving on time.. how does the existing food supply stay refrigerated? How does the water continue to be pumped into homes?

Walk into your local gas station and/or grocery store and figure out where exactly the overwhelming majority of that product comes from. It's not from down the street.

If the trucks starting coming to your local city, how long do you think the existing product lasts?


First of all people will move. People in new york arnt stuck there with cement. If there is food to be had somewhere else, why would they stay in ny and starve.

But the overall point im saying is humans would have to be overwhelmingly awful, self destructive monsters to choose to let the world collapse than do something without getting a fair pay for it. The only way a collapse like this actually breaks down the society level of how humanity is if, as a group, we decided to do nothing about it. I have a hard time imaging the government not find a way to compensate people for not letting the world collapse AND people actively choosing to not help one another until the whole thing is resolved.


But where would they move? If a farm of 100+ acres is growing the food, where are the people moving? How are they moving? How can they afford a new place without money? How are the traveling if they can't buy gasoline? Where are these places they'll move to that are unoccupied?


They move to where the food is. if there is no money and farmers have food they cant really move easy fix is they would work on the farm. Even family farms have use help and if they can board people for free labor they will do it.

How are they moving? How did they move before cars? People have feet. They use those feet to move. Or they hitch rides with people.

This is my whole problem with this being a doomsday scenario. Would it suck, yes, but the all the problems mentioned are easily solved by people just trying. Do you really think people will just sit in there gasless cars crying till they starve to death instead of trying to find food? Do you really think the government wont either a) use the loyal military to keep there gas production going b) people wouldn't willingly work on the gas lines for food and shelter. Literally nothing is lost in this doomsday situation besides the NORMAL means of payment. Bartering will replace the dollar in seconds of a collapse. And, at least for america, we can sell sustain ourselves for years without outside help.
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vikingsvikings wrote:

I don't understand most of that, but I can tell it's probably inaccurate.
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