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Using hindsight, "fix" the Redskins 2017 draft

 
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MikeT14


Joined: 02 Jan 2006
Posts: 10119
PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 10:15 am    Post subject: Using hindsight, "fix" the Redskins 2017 draft Reply with quote

Saw this in the NFL Draft forum, and I liked it. Rules are simple: Using the picks we had in the 2017 draft (no trades, the picks are the picks) redraft this year. I'd be curious too see how it changes.

Round 1, Pick 17 (No. 17 overall): Jonathan Allen, DT, Alabama
My pick: Allen. No brainer.

Round 2, Pick 17 (No. 49): Ryan Anderson, LB, Alabama
My pick: Zach Cunningham, ILB, Vanderbilt. The Ryan pick is growing on me, but I really think we need to get better on the inside too. I've liked Cunningham for awhile, so getting him in the 2nd would be great.

Round 3, Pick 17 (No. 81): Fabian Moreau, CB, UCLA
My pick: Same. With Webb sitting there, it was tempting as a fall back option, but I do really like the Moreau pick. I think he has a bright future.

Round 4, Pick 7 (No. 114, via Jets): Samaje Perine, RB, Oklahoma
My pick: Same. Loved this pick when it happened.

Round 4, Pick 21 (No. 123): Montae Nicholson, S, Michigan State
My pick: Jake Butt, TE, Michigan. We need a safety, but I don't care for this one. Didn't have the TOs I like to see. Butt would be a great compliment to Reed, after he gets healthy.

Round 5, Pick 10, (No. 154, via Saints): Jeremy Sprinkle, TE, University of Arkansas
My pick: Nathan Peterman, QB, Pitt. Don't need Sprinkle after taking Butt. I wanted a QB to take, and this is a good guy to potentially get.

Round 6, Pick 15 (No. 199, from Vikings): Chase Roullier, C, Wyoming
My pick: Same. Seems decent enough risk.

Round 6, Pick 25 (No. 209, via Texans): Robert Davis, WR, Georgia State
My pick: Isaiah Ford, WR, VT. The slide needed to stop. Combine shmombine. Watch his tape.

Round 7, Pick 12 (No. 230, via Vikings, Eagles): Josh Harvey-Clemons, S, Louisville
My pick: Same. Need a potential safety, so I will stick with them here.

Round 7, Pick 17 (No. 235): Joshua Holsey, DB, Auburn
My pick: Ben Boulware, LB, Clemson. Dude just seems like a football player.
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MKnight82


Joined: 04 Mar 2009
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PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 11:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Round 1 - I'd stick with Allen.

Round 2 - DE Tanoh Kpassagnon. I think after a year or two of grooming this guy is going to be a monster.

Round 3 - I'm fine sticking with Moreau.

Round 4 - OG Dorian Johnson. Shore up the LG spot so the RBs we have now will be more effective.

Round 4 - S Desmond King - the safety we should of taken in Round 4. True cover safety not another hybrid linebacker.

Round 5 - I like the Sprinkle pick I'd stick with him.

Round 6 - I'll stick with the Roullier pick as well.

Round 6 - Give me NT Elijah Qualls here.

Round 7 - I'd take WR Malachi Dupre.

Round 7 - OLB Keion Adams with our last pick.
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lavar703


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PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 11:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I loved the picks of Allen, Anderson and Perine. Hated everything else.
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mike23md


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PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Round 1, Pick 17 (No. 17 overall): Jonathan Allen, DT, Alabama
My pick: Allen.
I wouldn't want to change this pick at all.

Round 2, Pick 17 (No. 49): Ryan Anderson, LB, Alabama
My pick: Dalvin Tomlinson, NT, Alabama.
I don't mind Anderson. But, if he were to move inside I would love the pick. We needed a true NT and there were a few in the draft that would have seriously improved the defensive line than the failed veterans we brought in.

Round 3, Pick 17 (No. 81): Fabian Moreau, CB, UCLA
My pick: Same.
I wouldn't change this pick considering what fell afterwards. D'Onta Foreman would be the alternate.

Round 4, Pick 7 (No. 114, via Jets): Samaje Perine, RB, Oklahoma
My pick: Carl Lawson, EDGE, Auburn.
I was not in love with Perine and thought there were better backs than him. Considering I would have not taken Anderson, Lawson was a great option here in the 4th.

Round 4, Pick 21 (No. 123): Montae Nicholson, S, Michigan State
My pick: Jamaal Williams, RB, BYU.
I liked Nicholson but not in the 4th round. I had him ranked that high but I thought he would have fell into the late 5th.

Round 5, Pick 10, (No. 154, via Saints): Jeremy Sprinkle, TE, University of Arkansas
My pick: Anthony Walker Jr., LB, Northwestern.
Compton and Foster are not starters. Needed an upgrade to go with Brown and I liked Walker. Great value in the 5th.

Round 6, Pick 15 (No. 199, from Vikings): Chase Roullier, C, Wyoming
My pick: Bucky Hodges, TE, Virginia Tech.
Not sold on the depth at TE and Niles Paul just cant stay healthy regardless of his ST's abilities.

Round 6, Pick 25 (No. 209, via Texans): Robert Davis, WR, Georgia State
My pick: Elijah Qualls, NT, Washington.
3rd round prospect in the late 6th? Seriously. This is for when Tomlinson needs a rest and the other bums on the roster have been cut.

Round 7, Pick 12 (No. 230, via Vikings, Eagles): Josh Harvey-Clemons, S, Louisville
My pick: Isaiah Ford, WR, Virginia Tech
Yep, the slide stops. Great value here.

Round 7, Pick 17 (No. 235): Joshua Holsey, DB, Auburn
My pick: Kyle Fuller, C, Baylor.
We needed depth at C and Fuller was rated higher than Roullier.

1: Jonathan Allen, DE, Alabama
2: Dalvin Tomlinson, NT, Alabama
3: Fabian Moreau, CB, UCLA
4: Carl Lawson, EDGE, Auburn
4: Jamaal Williams, RB, BYU
5: Anthony Walker Jr., LB, Northwestern
6: Bucky Hodges, TE, Virginia Tech
6: Elijah Qualls, NT, Washington
7: Isaiah Ford, WR, Virginia Tech
7: Kyle Fuller, OC, Baylor
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SeanTayorsaPIMP


Joined: 14 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 12:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Round 1, Pick 17 (No. 17 overall): Jonathan Allen, DT, Alabama
My pick: Allen. Dream pick.

Round 2, Pick 17 (No. 49): Ryan Anderson, LB, Alabama
My pick: Jordan Willis Edge KSU. I love the Ryan Anderson pick, but at the time I was looking at Willis in the pass rushing dept. I think Anderson is probably the better all around player though.

Round 3, Pick 17 (No. 81): Fabian Moreau, CB, UCLA
My pick: Jourdan Lewis, CB, Mich. I had heard that Lewis was probably the best suited slot cornerback in the whole draft. We got killed in the slot last year and I think it's one of the hardest positions to play in today's NFL.

Round 4, Pick 7 (No. 114, via Jets): Samaje Perine, RB, Oklahoma
My pick: Same. I was hoping for him and we in complete shock that they actually took the player I wanted them to in the late rounds. Last time the Skins picked the exact player I wanted late in the drat was Selvish Capers back in 2010. Let's hope this pick pans out better. Cool

Round 4, Pick 21 (No. 123): Montae Nicholson, S, Michigan State
My pick: Carlos Watkins, DT, Clemson. I think this is generally regarded as the worst pick in our draft. This guy seems soft and Watkins was a steal at this point. great pick by the Texans.

Round 5, Pick 10, (No. 154, via Saints): Jeremy Sprinkle, TE, University of Arkansas
My pick: Caleb Brantley, DT, Florida. This would've been the time to take a stab at a top 40 talent.

Round 6, Pick 15 (No. 199, from Vikings): Chase Roullier, C, Wyoming
My pick: Same. I don't know anything about this guy but if we traded up to get him, the coaching staff must like him. Big depth need.

Round 6, Pick 25 (No. 209, via Texans): Robert Davis, WR, Georgia State
My pick: Same. Love this pick, hope he outplays Grant and/or Quick in the training camp and preseason.

Round 7, Pick 12 (No. 230, via Vikings, Eagles): Josh Harvey-Clemons, S, Louisville
My pick: Same. Seems like a good value pick at a hybrid position that is becoming important in today's NFL.

Round 7, Pick 17 (No. 235): Joshua Holsey, DB, Auburn
My pick: Ben Boulware, ILB, Clemson. I'm intrigued to see if he can make a career for himself. Was the heart and soul of Clemson's defense last two years.
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turtle28


Joined: 21 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2017 1:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Using hindsight, "fix" the Redskins 2017 draft Reply with quote

Round 1, Pick 17 (No. 17 overall): Jonathan Allen, DT, Alabama
My pick: Allen. No brainer.

Round 2, Pick 17 (No. 49): Ryan Anderson, LB, Alabama
My pick: Raekwon McMillan, ILB, Ohio State. I loved the Anderson pick and he may, MAY, even be a future ILB for us instead of OLB if Smith progresses and Murphy continues to shine in his role but I really think we needed to get better at ILB more than OLB. I've loved McMillan since he first started at OSU, I just never believed he'd be there for us in round 2. If we had selected him in the 2nd would have been my 1st choice.

Round 3, Pick 17 (No. 81): Fabian Moreau, CB, UCLA
My pick: Same. With Webb sitting there, it was tempting as a fall back option, but I do really like the Moreau pick. I think he has a bright future. [AGREED W/ Mike]

Round 4, Pick 7 (No. 114, via Jets): Samaje Perine, RB, Oklahoma
My pick: Same. Loved this pick when it happened. AGREED w/ Mike

Round 4, Pick 21 (No. 123): Montae Nicholson, S, Michigan State
My pick: Carlos Watkins, DT, Clemson. We need a safety, but I do think we overdrafted Nicholson by a bit but, there's no guarantee he would have fallen to us in round 5 and depth at SS was a bug issue for the defense before his selection - and if still may even be after his selection.

Round 5, Pick 10, (No. 154, via Saints): Jeremy Sprinkle, TE, University of Arkansas
My pick: Anthony Walker, ILB Northwestern. I have never been convinced that TE was a huge need this offseason although, Sprinkle was one of the best available. I've loved Walker since last year and I always considered or did mock him to the Redskins in round 3 and 4. Getting him in round 5 would have been great value imo, but on the flip side I think getting Sprinkle here was good value as well. I just question if Sprinkle can beat out any of our vets and if we put him on the practice squad we may lose him.

Also, Walker got picked by the Colts via the 49ers and that draft pick was originally ours. We traded it for Carrier in 2015 after the season ending injuries to Paul and Paulsen. It turned out to be a needed trade, but I think I'd rather have Sprinkle and Walker now than Carrier and Sprinkle.

Round 6, Pick 15 (No. 199, from Vikings): Chase Roullier, C, Wyoming
My pick: Same. Seems decent enough risk. LOVE IT but don't like the TRADE UP! All in all though, swapping picks in round 7 didn't hurt us because we got JHC who I like as a prospect.

Although, if we hadn't traded up we could have taken Steve Tu'ikolovatu, the huge NT from USC, Issac Rochelle DT from ND or Josh Caraway, DE/OLB from TCU in round 7 instead of JHC.

Round 6, Pick 25 (No. 209, via Texans): Robert Davis, WR, Georgia State
My pick: Isaiah Ford, WR, VT. The slide needed to stop. Combine shmombine. Watch his tape.AGREED W/ Mike

While in not overly upset with the davis pick, he played well vs Wisconsin last year, I think we needed speed at this pick to have someone to develop as a deep threat other than maybe Pryor. We lost DJax and don't have Ross anymore either. We have a void and Ford would have filled the void, along with KD Cannon from Baylor. Instead of taking Ford here though, we could have taken him with our final 7th round pick. Instead of Davis, I would have rather tanken Elijah Qualls (NT from Washington) or Leon McQuay (FS/slot corner from USC)

Round 7, Pick 12 (No. 230, via Vikings, Eagles): Josh Harvey-Clemons, S, Louisville
My pick: Same. Need a potential safety, so I will stick with them here. AGREED W/ Mike

Round 7, Pick 17 (No. 235): Joshua Holsey, DB, Auburn
My pick: Ben Boulware, LB, Clemson. Dude just seems like a football player.[b] I have no problems with the selection of Holsey, he has a lot of skills is extremely athletic and has upside. The thing that pushed him down was two ACL injuries.

If we had taken McQuad in round 6 though instead of Davis, at this pick we could have taken Isaiah Ford (VT), Noah Brown (OSU), Malachi Dupree (LSU), KD Cannon (Baylor), Jarron Jones (DL from ND), Jadar Johnson (S from Clemson), Travis Rudolph (WR from FSU), Atravias Scott (WR from CLE), Bryan Cox, JR. (DE/OLB from FL), Devonte Fields (DE/OLB from Louisville) or William Likely (CB/Return man from MD)
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Last edited by turtle28 on Thu May 11, 2017 2:28 pm; edited 1 time in total
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RSkinGM


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PostPosted: Thu May 11, 2017 9:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apparently, not much needs fixin' !! Did we really nail the draft ?
Read what the Giants reporter has to say .

http://www.espn.com/blog/nfceast/post/_/id/76220/redskins-lead-nfc-east-with-value-picks-throughout-draft
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Thu May 11, 2017 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RSkinGM wrote:
Apparently, not much needs fixin' !! Did we really nail the draft ?
Read what the Giants reporter has to say .

http://www.espn.com/blog/nfceast/post/_/id/76220/redskins-lead-nfc-east-with-value-picks-throughout-draft


Heck, both the Eagles & Giants beat writers wrote favorable reviews of our draft. On paper it looks good, still remains to be seen though.

Quote:
Tim McManus, Philadelphia Eagles reporter: The Redskins landed a top-five prospect in Allen at 17 overall then came back with another top-notch Alabama defensive player, outside linebacker Ryan Anderson, in the second round. UCLA cornerback Fabian Moreau (Round 3) and Oklahoma running back Samaje Perine (Round 4) have a chance to be impact players as well. There are a couple medical issues involved -- Moreau is coming off a torn pec and Allen has shoulder arthritis - but overall, this looks like a strong haul for a Washington front office that spent a good portion of its offseason without a general manager.

Jordan Raanan, New York Giants reporter: The Redskins had the best draft of any team in the NFL this year, even after firing their general manager during the lead-up. They grabbed a top-10 talent in Allen at pick No. 17 and added a pass rusher with first-round talent (Anderson) in the second. Their fourth-round pick, Perine, will be starting at some point this year. Hes a quality player. Fifth-round pick, tight end Jeremy Sprinkle, will also contribute immediately as a blocker. Put simply, the Redskins killed this draft.

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Woz


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PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

With full hindsight:

1.17 - DT Jonathan Allen
[Duh.]

2.17 - ILB Zach Cunningham
[The "value meets need" proposition was too great to pass up on Cunningham. My second choice would have been Justin Evans.]

3.17 - CB Fabian Moreau
[I like this pick. It's risky with the torn pec, but I think it's a decent gamble here in the third. I debated going for D'Onta Foreman here]

4.07 - OG Dorian Johnson
[I don't know how you would expect me to put anything else here.]

4.21 - TE Jake Butt
[This one I struggled with. On one hand, Butt would have been one of the best all around tight ends, had he not gotten hurt in the bowl game. On the other, this is the last time we could get a starting quality free safety in Desmond King.]

5.10 - RB Jeremy McNichols
[Starting to get into the just go for value pick space. Not going to blow your socks off, but outside of pass blocking (becoming a harder and harder skill to find coming out of college), McNichols looks like he can get the job done as runner, receiver, and returner. I thought about Peterman here, but I want to re-sign Cousins. Taking the best available QB here (who fell) would raise too much trouble. Another alternative would be Brian Hill.]

[Note: In my version of this draft, I'm not trading up for Roullier. If the Giants get him, more power to them. I suspect they stay with Bisnowaty, though. All things being equal, it doesn't really matter.]
6.17 - NT Elijah Qualls
[What? An honest to goodness 3-4 nose tackle? We're allowed to draft these guys?! Who knew?!?]


After this point, I started just throwing names out because the previous picks all work for me.

6.25 - WR Robert Davis
[Eh, what the heck. It really came down to him and Isaiah Ford, and the small school prospect wins out. The fact Ford is a Chokie had nothing to do with, no sir (honestly, only a bit).]

7.02 - OC Kyle Fuller
[I thought about taking Ford here, but let's get that backup center now with value.]

7.17 - QB Chad Kelly
[Because, why not?]
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 10:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Desmond King is not a "starting quality free safety." He's what I'd call a project/tweener if they're going to make him play safety and that's why he slipped in the draft. King played corner at Iowa and was a All-American, All- Conference and great at corner for 3 years at Iowa. The scouts/gms/coaches in the NFL think he should be switched to FS for some reason, and I have no clue why to be honest except he's not the greatest athlete, but he's a great football player and plays with great technique. If he had come out after his junior year he was projected to be a 1st round pick.

In 2015 he won the Jim Thorpe Award and was a Consensus All-American. He ranked second in the FBS with eight interceptions. He was also
the Big Ten Defensive Player of the Year. He had 72 tackles and broke up 13 passes. As a senior he was first-team All-Big Ten, because he "only" had three interceptions and seven pass breakups as teams avoided throwing at him.
IMO it was a mistake for teams to pass on him in round 2, 3 and 4 that needed corner help. I think he should be playing corner in the NFL, he was an All-American corner in college, the position change could hurt him.

I do agree we should have drafted him at the point, but I think if we had we should have tried him at corner before moving him to FS.
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Woz


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 30, 2017 1:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

turtle28 wrote:
Desmond King is not a "starting quality free safety." He's what I'd call a project/tweener if they're going to make him play safety and that's why he slipped in the draft. King played corner at Iowa and was a All-American, All- Conference and great at corner for 3 years at Iowa. The scouts/gms/coaches in the NFL think he should be switched to FS for some reason, and I have no clue why to be honest except he's not the greatest athlete, but he's a great football player and plays with great technique. If he had come out after his junior year he was projected to be a 1st round pick.

In 2015 he won the Jim Thorpe Award and was a Consensus All-American. He ranked second in the FBS with eight interceptions. He was also
the Big Ten Defensive Player of the Year. He had 72 tackles and broke up 13 passes. As a senior he was first-team All-Big Ten, because he "only" had three interceptions and seven pass breakups as teams avoided throwing at him.
IMO it was a mistake for teams to pass on him in round 2, 3 and 4 that needed corner help. I think he should be playing corner in the NFL, he was an All-American corner in college, the position change could hurt him.

I do agree we should have drafted him at the point, but I think if we had we should have tried him at corner before moving him to FS.


(*whistles* I've been gone awhile ... it's been a crazy six weeks)

Okay, so what I meant by "starting quality free safety" is that after King, there essentially was nothing beyond role players. While we can debate whether King should be a corner or a safety, the situation was that he was the last one with starting level talent. Given that he was available in the late fourth, I struggled with how to approach that pick. Arguably, he could help us more in the short term (whether we put him at corner or safety), but I eventually selected Butt because I felt like he could help the team long term.

Selecting either gentleman over Nicholson would have been a much better choice.
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