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Who Starts Week 1?
Tom Savage
42%
 42%  [ 6 ]
Deshaun Watson
57%
 57%  [ 8 ]
Total Votes : 14

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Pastor Dillon


Joined: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 17011
Location: Melbourne, Arkansas
PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 10:40 am    Post subject: Texans QB battle Reply with quote

This is going to be be a summer long question, probably doesn't get answered until the week of the 3rd pre season game.

BOB and Rick are both saying what you would expect, that Tom Savage is still the starter and they are comfortable with him, and love his potential.

Of course we all know that is just talk. If they thought Savage had any potential then we wouldn't have used 2 First round picks on Watson. I could see picking Watson at 25 if he fell, but going up to get him clearly indicates that we don't believe in Savage.

That said we need Savage to play if Watson isn't ready. I think everyone is hoping that Watson picks stuff up quickly and starts week 1. If the competition is close, then Watson has to be the starter. There is no substitute for game experience and so unless Watson is just not going to get it done, he should start week 1.
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mse326


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PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 12:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know who will start but there are only two ways I'd start Savage

1. Our O-line is so beyond atrocious we'd be getting Watson killed even with his escapability. This would require a significant decline in our play there as bad as we were it wasn't that bad and Watson's movement could be valuable there.

2. Savage is just so far ahead of Watson that he has to play given our playoff aspirations. This is a possibility.

I've made it clear how much I hated the Watson pick and think he won't succeed. But if they are even close then you give it to Watson and hope he can improve to be the better QB over the course of the season since Savage hasn't shown anything to indicate he'll be able to take us where we want to go. This would also give us a jump on knowing what we have in Watson.
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Pastor Dillon


Joined: 12 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 3:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One thing that I think will play a factor is that you cant bench Watson. If Savage struggles then you can go to Watson, but once you go with Watson, he is the guy for the rest of that season and the next season. You dont put him on the bench and then go back to him. Once its his job, its his job
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Texansfan713


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PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 3:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Assuming Savage isn't hurt during camp and preseason he will go into the season as the starter. He will definitely have a short leash if he starts the season being terrible. THe fans fans will call for Watson quick.

As for the OL point MS3 posted about. You fail to mention 1 thing. Unlike Savage, Watson doesn't have a deep in the headlights look when the pocket breaks down. One of the things I like about him is that he doesn't seemed scared when that happens. Lance Z posted that as well in his draft profile for Watson if you want to look. Being sacked only 32 times in 1,182 drop backs is a very good ratio.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2017/profiles/deshaun-watson?id=2558063
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dsorc


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PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I voted for Savage as the starter for Week 1. But I imagine his leash will not be that long. Expecting Savage to get hurt and replaced by Watson mid year.
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Pastor Dillon


Joined: 12 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 6:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Savage gonna turn into Tom Brady
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jch1911


Joined: 21 Mar 2009
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PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 7:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pastor Dillon wrote:
Savage gonna turn into Tom Brady


You know I was not a huge supporter of the Watson pick, but the thing which gives me hope (again!) is that O'Brien saw in Watson's intangibles (desire to win, preparation, leadership, etc.) the things he saw when he worked with Tom Brady.

That is the type of thing which cannot be measured and is the reason IMHO Brady fell to the 6th round. So I'll take Brady 2.0 Laughing
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Apollo Stallion


Joined: 06 Feb 2008
Posts: 6548
Location: Austin, TX
PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 9:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What, no love for Brandon Weeden around here? Honestly, I can't stand these "prediction" polls. Its maddening enough watching the dumb decisions this team makes play out, I don't care to speculate what their next dumb decision will be. It's like predicting Bill O'Brien will run the ball up the middle on 3 and 8 or that we won't draft a safety in the first 4 rounds for the 14th time. I am much more interested in people's opinions of what we SHOULD do or more accurately telling people MY opinion.

So, here it is. If Tom Savage is our starting QB, we SHOULD fire Rick Smith and Bill O'Brien on the spot. There is absolutely NOTHING to be gained by trotting out an injury prone project that has never thrown a friggin TD in the NFL when we just mortgaged our future on ditching Brock and bringing in Watson for essentially a 1st and 2nd round pick. This is not Alex Smith who has a track record of success or even Mike Glennon who has 30 TDs and a $45 million contract in front of a guy who barely started a year in college. Tom Savage is at best a backup QB and considering his fragility, not even a good one since he can't be relied upon. He is in the final year of his rookie deal, so any time invested in him is a waste anyway since if he shows anything he leaves as a FA to try to start somewhere and if he stinks, why would we want him back. If anything, the Texans should be trying to TRADE Tom Savage to get a pick back for next year as we're going to need to likely go find a vet backup and a developmental #3 as if Bouye and Simon weren't worth retaining, Savage and Weeden certainly aren't.

I absolutely understand SAYING Savage is the starter and making Watson "earn" the job as handing rookie's jobs never goes well in the locker room or the press, but if Deshaun Watson is not ready to be your QB from jump street after two national championship games vs Bama, what the heck are more garbage preseason games from Tom Savage supposed to prove? Reps are so limited these days, you can only realistically develop one QB so Watson should be getting ALL the starter reps preparing to "lead" a playoff team from day one. Sure give him the confidence boost of earning the job, much like Hoyer "earned" the job, but unless Watson is horrible, the job HAS to be his and O'Brien can NEVER waffle on his QBs ever again. If O'Brien's "system" is too complicated for a guy we burned this much draft equity to acquire, then O'Briens system sucks and he needs to go - PERIOD. Design your system to maximise what your FRANCHISE QB can do from DAY ONE or plan on getting your resume ready. If Watson DOES bomb in the preseason, then Rick Smith HAS to go. Absolutely ridiculous that he survived the Osweiler deal with his dubious draft history, so he is already the short stack and has gone "all in" on Watson.

I would rather LOSE a few games due to rookie mistakes that will be learned from than win a few games with Savage managing 20 dumpoffs and Watson carrying a clipboard. If we were going to just stick with another mediocre QB managing games to get us to 9-7 for another season, then roll with Savage or bring in Cutler and keep your first rounder to fix it in 2018 as your fallback plan with a pick likely higher than 25. I think we made the right call, but waffling now is like punting inside the 40 on 4th and 1 inside 2 minutes. We've been doing that for 15 seasons now - the Watson pick says we are finally going for it!
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amazingandre


Joined: 16 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 9:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apollo Stallion wrote:
What, no love for Brandon Weeden around here? Honestly, I can't stand these "prediction" polls. Its maddening enough watching the dumb decisions this team makes play out, I don't care to speculate what their next dumb decision will be. It's like predicting Bill O'Brien will run the ball up the middle on 3 and 8 or that we won't draft a safety in the first 4 rounds for the 14th time. I am much more interested in people's opinions of what we SHOULD do or more accurately telling people MY opinion.

So, here it is. If Tom Savage is our starting QB, we SHOULD fire Rick Smith and Bill O'Brien on the spot. There is absolutely NOTHING to be gained by trotting out an injury prone project that has never thrown a friggin TD in the NFL when we just mortgaged our future on ditching Brock and bringing in Watson for essentially a 1st and 2nd round pick. This is not Alex Smith who has a track record of success or even Mike Glennon who has 30 TDs and a $45 million contract in front of a guy who barely started a year in college. Tom Savage is at best a backup QB and considering his fragility, not even a good one since he can't be relied upon. He is in the final year of his rookie deal, so any time invested in him is a waste anyway since if he shows anything he leaves as a FA to try to start somewhere and if he stinks, why would we want him back. If anything, the Texans should be trying to TRADE Tom Savage to get a pick back for next year as we're going to need to likely go find a vet backup and a developmental #3 as if Bouye and Simon weren't worth retaining, Savage and Weeden certainkly aren't.

I absolutely understand SAYING Savage is the starter and making Watson "earn" the job as handing rookie's jobs never goes well in the locker room or the press, but if Deshaun Watson is not ready to be your QB from jump street after two national championship games vs Bama, what the heck are more garbage preseason games from Tom Savage supposed to prove? Reps are so limited these days, you can only realistically develop one QB so Watson should be getting ALL the starter reps preparing to "lead" a playoff team from day one. Sure give him the confidence boost of earning the job, much like Hoyer "earned" the job, but unless Watson is horrible, the job HAS to be his and O'Brien can NEVER waffle on his QBs ever again. If O'Brien's "system" is too complicated for a guy we burned this much draft equity to acquire, then O'Briens system sucks and he needs to go - PERIOD. Design your system to maximise what your FRANCHISE QB can do from DAY ONE or plan on getting your resume ready. If Watson DOES bomb in the preseason, then Rick Smith HAS to go. Absolutely ridiculous that he survived the Osweiler deal with his dubious draft history, so he is already the short stack and has gone "all in" on Watson.


Yea, what he said Exclamation
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PAtexansFAN99


Joined: 04 Jan 2007
Posts: 4824
PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 10:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apollo Stallion wrote:
What, no love for Brandon Weeden around here? Honestly, I can't stand these "prediction" polls. Its maddening enough watching the dumb decisions this team makes play out, I don't care to speculate what their next dumb decision will be. It's like predicting Bill O'Brien will run the ball up the middle on 3 and 8 or that we won't draft a safety in the first 4 rounds for the 14th time. I am much more interested in people's opinions of what we SHOULD do or more accurately telling people MY opinion.

So, here it is. If Tom Savage is our starting QB, we SHOULD fire Rick Smith and Bill O'Brien on the spot. There is absolutely NOTHING to be gained by trotting out an injury prone project that has never thrown a friggin TD in the NFL when we just mortgaged our future on ditching Brock and bringing in Watson for essentially a 1st and 2nd round pick. This is not Alex Smith who has a track record of success or even Mike Glennon who has 30 TDs and a $45 million contract in front of a guy who barely started a year in college. Tom Savage is at best a backup QB and considering his fragility, not even a good one since he can't be relied upon. He is in the final year of his rookie deal, so any time invested in him is a waste anyway since if he shows anything he leaves as a FA to try to start somewhere and if he stinks, why would we want him back. If anything, the Texans should be trying to TRADE Tom Savage to get a pick back for next year as we're going to need to likely go find a vet backup and a developmental #3 as if Bouye and Simon weren't worth retaining, Savage and Weeden certainly aren't.

I absolutely understand SAYING Savage is the starter and making Watson "earn" the job as handing rookie's jobs never goes well in the locker room or the press, but if Deshaun Watson is not ready to be your QB from jump street after two national championship games vs Bama, what the heck are more garbage preseason games from Tom Savage supposed to prove? Reps are so limited these days, you can only realistically develop one QB so Watson should be getting ALL the starter reps preparing to "lead" a playoff team from day one. Sure give him the confidence boost of earning the job, much like Hoyer "earned" the job, but unless Watson is horrible, the job HAS to be his and O'Brien can NEVER waffle on his QBs ever again. If O'Brien's "system" is too complicated for a guy we burned this much draft equity to acquire, then O'Briens system sucks and he needs to go - PERIOD. Design your system to maximise what your FRANCHISE QB can do from DAY ONE or plan on getting your resume ready. If Watson DOES bomb in the preseason, then Rick Smith HAS to go. Absolutely ridiculous that he survived the Osweiler deal with his dubious draft history, so he is already the short stack and has gone "all in" on Watson.

I would rather LOSE a few games due to rookie mistakes that will be learned from than win a few games with Savage managing 20 dumpoffs and Watson carrying a clipboard. If we were going to just stick with another mediocre QB managing games to get us to 9-7 for another season, then roll with Savage or bring in Cutler and keep your first rounder to fix it in 2018 as your fallback plan with a pick likely higher than 25. I think we made the right call, but waffling now is like punting inside the 40 on 4th and 1 inside 2 minutes. We've been doing that for 15 seasons now - the Watson pick says we are finally going for it!


I agree trading Savage would make sense, and maybe playing him a few games could launch his stock into the Jimmy Garrapposphere, but at the end of the day I don't think anyone will be able to deny that Watson is simply better in every way. I dunno if we should FIRE Rick Smith if Watson stumbles in the preseason, that seems a little intense.

I'm just thinking like, after Watson wins the Superbowl his rookie year, will it have been TOO MUCH TOO SOON?

Like, I'm thinking like are we gonna be able to repeat in 2018? Think
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Wolf6151


Joined: 11 Feb 2008
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PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2017 1:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If Watson is starting in week 1 then we're in trouble because that means Savage is hurt again, and I don't know if O'Brien can dumb down his MIT offense enough for a rookie to run it effectively.
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Pastor Dillon


Joined: 12 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2017 9:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You start the QB who is most prepared to win games. There is nothing worse than trading a future 1st and that pick falling in the top 10.

We have a playoff team and a super bowl defense. We need to start the QB that can win the most games.

Savage was not impressive at all last season. he looked scared, not quite as much as he did those few snaps he took his rookie season, but still. We did manage to clinch the post season with his 2 starts.

the Major thing for me, and i think this is going to be true of our staff as well, is whether or not Watson can calm down the INTs. The guy tries to win the game on every play and threw a lot of picks in college. Savage didnt throw a TD, but he also didnt throw an INT.

I want Watson to be the starter from day 1. He can win rookie of the year. I dont want to ruin Watson by playing him before he is ready and putting all the pressure on him of tanking of the Texans.

Another thing about Watson is that he was a great runner in college. Ran for almost 2,000 yards and 26 TDs in his career. He cant do that in the pros. He is way too small to even try. He can extend plays and stuff, but if they are calling designed runs then Watson will have a short career. He measured out at 6'3 and 221. Thats not tiny, but thats not the 230 or 235 that he needs to be in order to run the ball.

here is what gives me hope, what he did to one of the best college Defenses of all time was a thing of beauty. he destroyed bama, two years in role. 420 yards and 3 TDs and no INTs against that defense was impressive. His will to win after falling short the year before says a lot about his character.

im all in on the Watson train!
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amazingandre


Joined: 16 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2017 10:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wolf6151 wrote:
If Watson is starting in week 1 then we're in trouble because that means Savage is hurt again, and I don't know if O'Brien can dumb down his MIT offense enough for a rookie to run it effectively.


If you think Savage can provide anything Watson can't, you are mistaken. Savage has missed a ton of time in his 3 years on this team. It isn't like he was constantly available and taking reps in practice. He isn't that much farther ahead than Watson will be.
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ManInTheMirror


Joined: 02 Aug 2013
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PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2017 2:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Texans QB battle Reply with quote

Pastor Dillon wrote:
If they thought Savage had any potential then we wouldn't have used 2 First round picks on Watson. I could see picking Watson at 25 if he fell, but going up to get him clearly indicates that we don't believe in Savage.


Seems like they think he has potential but..................injuries. So they'd like to see what he can do but they are more than aware that he could go down at any moment.
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Pastor Dillon


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PostPosted: Fri May 26, 2017 4:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's hard to tell because 1. It's early early early on in the process and 2. The guys who cover the Texans are horrible at judging QBs because "on paper" the Texans have been so much better at the QB position every off season. But it looks like Watson is having rookie struggles and Savage is looking good.
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