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A quarterback at 27 What if & why not???
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Raves


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

whodatworm23 wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Yeah WRs really aren't that hard to find now a days it seems. Is it hard to find a Calvin, Julio or AJ Green? Yes. Good, but not great WRs, are a dime a dozen though. Especially with a guy like Payton calling plays.


True and this draft is littered with guys through the 2nd-4th rounds that Payton and Drew can make look like 1st rounders.


Well if Drew isn't here anymore, then do you think theses later round picks will continue to look like 1st round picks? So my point would be we draft the guys we need going forward to help alleviate any kind of transition we might have. Also 1st round talent might look like top 5 talent if Brees can make late round talents look like 1st rounders...

Just saying...
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whodatworm23


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2014 4:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Raves wrote:
whodatworm23 wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Yeah WRs really aren't that hard to find now a days it seems. Is it hard to find a Calvin, Julio or AJ Green? Yes. Good, but not great WRs, are a dime a dozen though. Especially with a guy like Payton calling plays.


True and this draft is littered with guys through the 2nd-4th rounds that Payton and Drew can make look like 1st rounders.


Well if Drew isn't here anymore, then do you think theses later round picks will continue to look like 1st round picks? So my point would be we draft the guys we need going forward to help alleviate any kind of transition we might have. Also 1st round talent might look like top 5 talent if Brees can make late round talents look like 1st rounders...

Just saying...


Who ever said Drew wouldn't be here? Even with the Saints selecting a QB early most would believe that Brees has at least 3 years remaining with the Saints so wouldn't it be better to continue to draft players at value positions that Drew would make look a lot better and when he's done your QB can hit the ground running and then you go into FA or the draft looking for that #1 receiver which would be a lot easier to find than a franchise QB at the last minute?

Just saying...
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Raves


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2014 5:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

whodatworm23 wrote:
Raves wrote:
whodatworm23 wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Yeah WRs really aren't that hard to find now a days it seems. Is it hard to find a Calvin, Julio or AJ Green? Yes. Good, but not great WRs, are a dime a dozen though. Especially with a guy like Payton calling plays.


True and this draft is littered with guys through the 2nd-4th rounds that Payton and Drew can make look like 1st rounders.


Well if Drew isn't here anymore, then do you think theses later round picks will continue to look like 1st round picks? So my point would be we draft the guys we need going forward to help alleviate any kind of transition we might have. Also 1st round talent might look like top 5 talent if Brees can make late round talents look like 1st rounders...

Just saying...


Who ever said Drew wouldn't be here? Even with the Saints selecting a QB early most would believe that Brees has at least 3 years remaining with the Saints so wouldn't it be better to continue to draft players at value positions that Drew would make look a lot better and when he's done your QB can hit the ground running and then you go into FA or the draft looking for that #1 receiver which would be a lot easier to find than a franchise QB at the last minute?

Just saying...


#1 WR are about as easy to find as franchise QBs... and by that I mean true #1 WRs.... I'm talking about the AJ Greens, the Julio Jones, the Megatrons, etc, those are just the 1st rounders. Now finding the guys that make a team run offensively at the WR position, the Wes Welkers, the Anquan Boldens, the Marques Colstens... I mean in this FA what #1 WR was available? What #1 QB was available? The answer is actually none to both. Truthfully high caliber offensive players are less likely to see free agency than potentially high caliber defensive players. I mean why else were we able to sign Keenan Lewis and Jarius Byrd? It sure as hell wasn't because they weren't top players at their position, especially Byrd who is arguably the best FS in the NFL...

So we draft players that will work on offense, and Brees might have 3 years, if we draft a QB by the time he is a starter he fills in for one year and then wants a big payday and doesn't provide anything to the team. Or we draft WRs and in 4 years they've been producing, they can help a new QB transition, and in the end if they leave, that's fine, we got tons of potential going forward and options to draft another WR.
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whodatworm23


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2014 5:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Raves wrote:
whodatworm23 wrote:
Raves wrote:
whodatworm23 wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Yeah WRs really aren't that hard to find now a days it seems. Is it hard to find a Calvin, Julio or AJ Green? Yes. Good, but not great WRs, are a dime a dozen though. Especially with a guy like Payton calling plays.


True and this draft is littered with guys through the 2nd-4th rounds that Payton and Drew can make look like 1st rounders.


Well if Drew isn't here anymore, then do you think theses later round picks will continue to look like 1st round picks? So my point would be we draft the guys we need going forward to help alleviate any kind of transition we might have. Also 1st round talent might look like top 5 talent if Brees can make late round talents look like 1st rounders...

Just saying...


Who ever said Drew wouldn't be here? Even with the Saints selecting a QB early most would believe that Brees has at least 3 years remaining with the Saints so wouldn't it be better to continue to draft players at value positions that Drew would make look a lot better and when he's done your QB can hit the ground running and then you go into FA or the draft looking for that #1 receiver which would be a lot easier to find than a franchise QB at the last minute?

Just saying...


#1 WR are about as easy to find as franchise QBs... and by that I mean true #1 WRs.... I'm talking about the AJ Greens, the Julio Jones, the Megatrons, etc, those are just the 1st rounders. Now finding the guys that make a team run offensively at the WR position, the Wes Welkers, the Anquan Boldens, the Marques Colstens... I mean in this FA what #1 WR was available? What #1 QB was available? The answer is actually none to both. Truthfully high caliber offensive players are less likely to see free agency than potentially high caliber defensive players. I mean why else were we able to sign Keenan Lewis and Jarius Byrd? It sure as hell wasn't because they weren't top players at their position, especially Byrd who is arguably the best FS in the NFL...

So we draft players that will work on offense, and Brees might have 3 years, if we draft a QB by the time he is a starter he fills in for one year and then wants a big payday and doesn't provide anything to the team. Or we draft WRs and in 4 years they've been producing, they can help a new QB transition, and in the end if they leave, that's fine, we got tons of potential going forward and options to draft another WR.


It sounds like were on the same side of the argument just different ends of it.

PS: With all due respect to Jarius Byrd... he's the 2nd best FS in the NFL. Earl Thomas has earned that respect.
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Raves


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2014 6:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the argument between Byrd and Thomas could go one for forever. Byrd has more of a proven record, Thomas is more of the upcoming promising player, and truthfully this upcoming season will probably be the deciding factor. I could easily relate this to Revis vs Scramble and Peterson vs LdT.

Regardless at the very worse Byrd is the #2 overall FS in the NFL... that's the 2nd best player at a position hitting FA... do you think you see that on the offensive side of the ball with a skill position player? I consider QB a skill position player btw. Brees was a player that had shown flashes and was coming off a major injury, that's why we got him. Manning was coming off what would normally be considered a career ender, and truthfully he puts his life on the line every time he gets hit, so that's why Denver was able to get him. Outside of major concerns premier skill position players are not hitting the NFL honestly.

I mean we can go back and forth and debate the QB vs receiving options and we both could be right and wrong. Guys like Brady, Brees, and Manning can make good receivers great, but then you get guys like Ryan, Wilson, Kaepernick, Flacco that need the WRs to make them look better, but would still look good with average WRs... So you get your team good receiving options then regardless of the QB you should at least be adequate at the position as they can help make up for the QB. That's why I'm very high on Jordan Matthews, much more than Allen Robinson truthfully, as even without good QB play he's been able to simply dominate and show that he is a player that you can rely on making plays. Robinson has also done the same but with a better QB and a much better system so it's harder to decipher his true ability. You could actually argue the Wisconsin WR might be even more of a talent, even with a slower 40 etc, due to his ability to perform in an offense that doesn't put a spotlight on him.

Also I love Aaron Murray in this draft, I wouldn't be upset with us "reaching" on him in the 2nd, or trading up in the 3rd to get him if we were afraid of him getting drafted ahead of us as he has what I feel are the needed qualities of an NFL QB, at least under Payton, but the injury concerns should let us get him at a better value than his otherwise 1st round talent would suggest.
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whodatworm23


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2014 6:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Raves wrote:
I think the argument between Byrd and Thomas could go one for forever. Byrd has more of a proven record, Thomas is more of the upcoming promising player, and truthfully this upcoming season will probably be the deciding factor. I could easily relate this to Revis vs Scramble and Peterson vs LdT.

Regardless at the very worse Byrd is the #2 overall FS in the NFL... that's the 2nd best player at a position hitting FA... do you think you see that on the offensive side of the ball with a skill position player? I consider QB a skill position player btw. Brees was a player that had shown flashes and was coming off a major injury, that's why we got him. Manning was coming off what would normally be considered a career ender, and truthfully he puts his life on the line every time he gets hit, so that's why Denver was able to get him. Outside of major concerns premier skill position players are not hitting the NFL honestly.

I mean we can go back and forth and debate the QB vs receiving options and we both could be right and wrong. Guys like Brady, Brees, and Manning can make good receivers great, but then you get guys like Ryan, Wilson, Kaepernick, Flacco that need the WRs to make them look better, but would still look good with average WRs... So you get your team good receiving options then regardless of the QB you should at least be adequate at the position as they can help make up for the QB. That's why I'm very high on Jordan Matthews, much more than Allen Robinson truthfully, as even without good QB play he's been able to simply dominate and show that he is a player that you can rely on making plays. Robinson has also done the same but with a better QB and a much better system so it's harder to decipher his true ability. You could actually argue the Wisconsin WR might be even more of a talent, even with a slower 40 etc, due to his ability to perform in an offense that doesn't put a spotlight on him.

Also I love Aaron Murray in this draft, I wouldn't be upset with us "reaching" on him in the 2nd, or trading up in the 3rd to get him if we were afraid of him getting drafted ahead of us as he has what I feel are the needed qualities of an NFL QB, at least under Payton, but the injury concerns should let us get him at a better value than his otherwise 1st round talent would suggest.


I actually... (personally) see the Saints coming away from this draft with Aaron Murray one way or another, I just see him as a ideal fit in Payton's offense.

Jordan Matthews is a player I'm also very high on... He dominated in the SEC at Vanderbilt, that's saying something! Colorado's Paul Richardson is also very high on my board, I think he's a sleeping giant that will become a DeSean Jackson clone without the diva attitude.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2014 12:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

whodatworm23 wrote:
QB Connoisseur wrote:
No...

This team is on the cusp of becoming a Super Bowl team again. Drafting a quarterback does nothing to improve our chances of winning another ring.

Will things be rough when Drew retires? YES! Doesn't matter if we win another championship though; it'll be totally worth it.


and if we don't...


What kind of mindset is that? We have a Hall of Fame quarterback and potentially a top 10 defense. If the FO isn't doing everything they can to improve this team now then we won't win another one, but it's definitely worth a shot.

Yeah, there's nothing wrong with planning for the future, but right now we're in a ~2-3 year window where we NEED to win.
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Harper41


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2014 12:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ew. If we even consider drafting Aaron Murray I'll flip. Especially in the 2nd.

The guys an UDFA QB. He's garbage. People just see short QB now and try and compare him to Brees. He has no arm, makes TERRIBLE decisions and his accuracy is good but not great. He'll be nothing but an average backup QB in the NFL.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2014 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think that if Jimmy G is there in the 2nd...he will be a Saint.

If you don't have a QB...you really have nothing. Especially in Payton's offense.

You can allude to all the offensive talent all you want...but I have a feeling that if you take an elite QB away, all of a sudden most of them will look like regular guys.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 29, 2014 9:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do you guys actually believe that Jimmy G has the talent to be a starting NFL quarterback? Because that's the only way that it's justifiable to draft him, and frankly I don't think he will ever be an NFL starter.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 2:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

QB Connoisseur wrote:
Do you guys actually believe that Jimmy G has the talent to be a starting NFL quarterback? Because that's the only way that it's justifiable to draft him, and frankly I don't think he will ever be an NFL starter.


Does he have the physical tools... YES!

Will they translate to the NFL... WHo Knows

All I know is that I'll put my faith in any quarterback Payton opts to draft high because that would prove to me that he feels strongly about that player.
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Raves


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 12:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the one QB that I would be ok with us drafting at #27 if he is there after listening to some of things reports coming out would be Derek Carr. Already used to playing in a pass heavy offense, John Gruden believes he is the best QB in this draft, has all the physical tools to get the job done, so I would be ok with picking up up and maybe look to do a Joe Montana type deal with Brees near the end of his contract to let Carr take over the team and get some return on Brees instead of just releasing him outright.
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