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So is Crennel going to run a 2-gap?
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jch1911


Joined: 21 Mar 2009
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Location: West Palm Beach, FL
PostPosted: Mon Feb 03, 2014 5:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apollo Stallion wrote:
ServantofYHWH wrote:
Kareem should play S dag nab it


I still don't understand this thought on him. I assume the logic is that physical corners who have trouble in man to man coverage can become above average coverage safeties. It worked for Glover Quin to an extent, but in reality, he still played CB in nickel situations and on other downs was basically just a CB tasked with covering TE's rather than a traditional dual purpose SS. Quin is also considerably bigger than KJ at 6' 0", 210 while KJ tops out at 5' 10", 188. 2 inches and 30 lbs may not seem like much, but it sure is when you figure he'd be giving up 8 inches and 75 lbs to a guy like Gronk with most other TE's being 6' 4" - 6' 7" 240-270. If you are considering him as a FS, I think you are ignoring his primary weaknesses are deep coverage, deep speed, poor hands, penalty prone, and lack of playmaking skills. I fail to see anything that would indicate that he would be better off playing even deeper which would lead to even LONGER penalties to his league lead this year.

Devin McCourty may be the closest success story for a smallish converted safety, but he's more Bob Sanders-ish as he's got a compact muscular frame and plays 10 lbs heavier than KJ who is quite thin. I think Kareem's speed was VASTLY overrated by the combine as he clearly plays much slower than his clocked time, so the last thing you want him doing is bulking up and getting even slower. I continue to maintain that Kareem would make a decent nickle corner (like Quin) as his coverage skills in the first 10-15 are quite good, he just can't hang deep without grabbing (often times while catching up at the last second and not locating the ball). I maintain the Texans still desperately need a #2 corner with deep speed particularly in a division where we still have no answer for TY Hilton, Kendall Wright, or Cecil Shorts better yet Erik Decker, Torrey Smith, Josh Gordon, Antonio Brown. When Rod Streater and Eddie Royal go off on you, you have serious problems beyond your #1 CB.


I think you may have hit it. Those who want to salvage KJ (a former 1st round pick) know that without a fierce pass rush to protect him, he is far from a quality #2 CB. Those of us who wanted him moved to S were hoping that instead of having to catch up to a play (that would result in a penalty or a catch) that KJ would have success if he gets to watch the play develop in front of him.

Alas, I had come to the same conclusion you did awhile ago and know that another CB likely needs to be brought in. Most of Rick's success on DBs comes from FA, so let's hope he goes back to that well. If KJ has a sideline to help him, he has a shot. But, lord, watch out if the WR gets a step on him because it is bye-bye birdie. It's also a reason that I think KJ will be gone if another team offers a 4th or better on him (and with the dearth of quality CBs in the league - someone just might).
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ServantofYHWH


Joined: 25 Jan 2010
Posts: 13659
Location: Clutch City
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2014 12:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apollo Stallion wrote:
ServantofYHWH wrote:
Kareem should play S dag nab it


I still don't understand this thought on him. I assume the logic is that physical corners who have trouble in man to man coverage can become above average coverage safeties. It worked for Glover Quin to an extent, but in reality, he still played CB in nickel situations and on other downs was basically just a CB tasked with covering TE's rather than a traditional dual purpose SS. Quin is also considerably bigger than KJ at 6' 0", 210 while KJ tops out at 5' 10", 188. 2 inches and 30 lbs may not seem like much, but it sure is when you figure he'd be giving up 8 inches and 75 lbs to a guy like Gronk with most other TE's being 6' 4" - 6' 7" 240-270. If you are considering him as a FS, I think you are ignoring his primary weaknesses are deep coverage, deep speed, poor hands, penalty prone, and lack of playmaking skills. I fail to see anything that would indicate that he would be better off playing even deeper which would lead to even LONGER penalties to his league lead this year.

Devin McCourty may be the closest success story for a smallish converted safety, but he's more Bob Sanders-ish as he's got a compact muscular frame and plays 10 lbs heavier than KJ who is quite thin. I think Kareem's speed was VASTLY overrated by the combine as he clearly plays much slower than his clocked time, so the last thing you want him doing is bulking up and getting even slower. I continue to maintain that Kareem would make a decent nickle corner (like Quin) as his coverage skills in the first 10-15 are quite good, he just can't hang deep without grabbing (often times while catching up at the last second and not locating the ball). I maintain the Texans still desperately need a #2 corner with deep speed particularly in a division where we still have no answer for TY Hilton, Kendall Wright, or Cecil Shorts better yet Erik Decker, Torrey Smith, Josh Gordon, Antonio Brown. When Rod Streater and Eddie Royal go off on you, you have serious problems beyond your #1 CB.


He can hit and cover slower recieving options. As a safety back in a deep zone id like to see how he could do helping over the top rather than just trying to stick with his man stride for stride
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dsorc


Joined: 16 Jan 2008
Posts: 2351
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2014 11:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What do we need at OLB? As part of the draft discussion, I see mention of Kyle Van Noy who is a great talent and would be good value in the second round. But the more I think about the more I'm drawn to that original question. Van Noy, in the limited sample that I have found of his play, seems to have played as 3-4 Sam and would have little experience playing with his hand down. He's more of a balanced LB than a pure pass rusher.

As I try to think about scheme, the roles of the DL seem easier to predict. We need a big nose and DEs that command/demand double teams. But then again, that only holds for when we are playing base which should be only about half of the snaps. On passing down, those DEs will likely be asked to generate inside pass rush while the NT will likely be on the sidelines. In that sense, it makes sense to have one OLB that is a pure pass rusher and one that is more balanced in base 3-4 sets. But I imagine that both OLBs will be asked to be pure pass rushers in passing downs. This is the challenge for a guy like Brooks Reed, who even though he was a DE in college, has been unable to generate any pressure as a pass rusher.

Would a guy like Van Noy end up being a slightly better Brooks Reed? Should we be looking for more if a pure pass rusher like Dee Ford? Obviously, having two pure pass rushers at OLB would make us slightly more vulnerable in coverage but those two pass rushers would not be asked to cover in passing downs. A more important question, I would argue, is whether this pass rushers (Mercilus plus draft picks) could stop the run to the outside from a stand up set. The type of OLBs we use also likely has implication on how we use our safeties. If we have two pure pass rushers, I would imagine that we would want to use the SS in the box more to help defend TEs. Alternatively we might want our 2 ILBs to be good in pass coverage as another way to counter the fact that our OLBs are deficient in that area.

Just stuff to think about in the offseason. We will know soon enough the type of players and scheme we will actually be using.
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Chiefer


Joined: 19 Nov 2009
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 06, 2014 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey so came over from the Chiefs forum because I got curious about Crennel over in Screwston and reading the quotes I get an eery feeling like deja vu.

Patriots West, I'm sorry guys. I remember those days, Cassel at QB, Crennel at DC. Bleh

Well there is hope, you've got the 1st pick in a LOADED draft. I hate you, btw we get Eric Fisher when we get the 1st pick.

Actually discussing trading such a valuable commodity, I'm taking Teddy/Bortles/Clowney/BPA and running. Well unless the Browns pull a Ditka and give me a whole draft.

Oh yeah back to the defense, Clowney would be great on the outside next to Watt. Clowney(potentially)>>>>>>>>>> Tamba Hali from my perspective. Clowney next to Watt, Clowney next to Watt, awesome stuff.

Also Crennel doesn't always two-gap, when you switch to sub-packages its more of a one-gap philosophy and its eating time. Thing is Crennel is bland, and doesn't blitz. Its a safe gameplan, bend don't break. All you get is a 4 man rush pretty much the whole game, and your secondary drops into zones they protect.

Although it all depends on O'Brien really. He's calling the shots, he's gonna make changes to the Defense, nothing that ever happened in KC. Plus he's gotta accomodate for JJ right? Like Richard Seymour, now find a NT. Nix might just be there in the 2nd, I'm sure you guys have noticed. So like I said, there's hope Texans fans.
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kenney


Joined: 24 Dec 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 06, 2014 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chiefer wrote:
Hey so came over from the Chiefs forum because I got curious about Crennel over in Screwston and reading the quotes I get an eery feeling like deja vu.

Patriots West, I'm sorry guys. I remember those days, Cassel at QB, Crennel at DC. Bleh

Well there is hope, you've got the 1st pick in a LOADED draft. I hate you, btw we get Eric Fisher when we get the 1st pick.

Actually discussing trading such a valuable commodity, I'm taking Teddy/Bortles/Clowney/BPA and running. Well unless the Browns pull a Ditka and give me a whole draft.

Oh yeah back to the defense, Clowney would be great on the outside next to Watt. Clowney(potentially)>>>>>>>>>> Tamba Hali from my perspective. Clowney next to Watt, Clowney next to Watt, awesome stuff.

Also Crennel doesn't always two-gap, when you switch to sub-packages its more of a one-gap philosophy and its eating time. Thing is Crennel is bland, and doesn't blitz. Its a safe gameplan, bend don't break. All you get is a 4 man rush pretty much the whole game, and your secondary drops into zones they protect.

Although it all depends on O'Brien really. He's calling the shots, he's gonna make changes to the Defense, nothing that ever happened in KC. Plus he's gotta accomodate for JJ right? Like Richard Seymour, now find a NT. Nix might just be there in the 2nd, I'm sure you guys have noticed. So like I said, there's hope Texans fans.


Nope, what you had with Crennel is what we will. O'Brien is a Gary Kubiak redux in that he seems keen to essentially bury his nose in an offensive playbook and ignore anything resembling personal responsibility with the defense, leaving it up to one of his cronies to try and do "well enough" with it so he doesn't have to concern himself with being anything more than an offensive coordinator with lots of input on personnel.

Everything I've heard out of this regime so far has been a disappointment.
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Chiefer


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 6:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kenney wrote:

Nope, what you had with Crennel is what we will. O'Brien is a Gary Kubiak redux in that he seems keen to essentially bury his nose in an offensive playbook and ignore anything resembling personal responsibility with the defense, leaving it up to one of his cronies to try and do "well enough" with it so he doesn't have to concern himself with being anything more than an offensive coordinator with lots of input on personnel.

Everything I've heard out of this regime so far has been a disappointment.

Why are all the Belicheck disciples like this?

Well, Crennel's a solid coordinator. Old school system, but you've got better pieces then we did. Having Watt alone is going to be a boost.
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