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Deja Vu all over again
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Moparguy


Joined: 11 Apr 2009
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 11:12 pm    Post subject: Deja Vu all over again Reply with quote

I swear that those of us that are old enough to remember that this team is eerily similar to something we have seen before.

You have the once in a generational talent Johnson/Sanders

You have a strong Second fiddle Bush/Moore

Wildly inconsistent QB play Stafford/Mitchell

Solid but unspectacular lines. A couple of decent linebackers (Speilman/Tulloch) and a really horrible secondary.

Both teams have some talent. But not enough to truly be contenders. Both teams have a complete inability to handle their successes and lack discipline. And they both can go from dominate to doormat in the course of a week.

And possibly the most important part. Neither team had/has shown any ability to develop players taken in the back half of the draft. Sure they will get the occasional success (Young/Boyd). But will never have the GB/NE or even Dallas ability to take players that give them true depth.

Sadly I see no reason to believe this will turn out any different. There will be some good years and some terrible ones. But I really do not see any path that they have to create any better results. By the end of this offseason when they lock in Suh their salary structure will be pretty much locked in. And their inability to pick and develop the inexpensive draft picks will doom them to the same fate.


I really hope I am wrong on this. But unless there is a radical uptick in their drafting acumen. What we see now is generally what we will see for the next 5-7 years.
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stylish313


Joined: 17 Jan 2009
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 11:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yep, odds are you're spot on.
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diehardlionfan


Joined: 12 Mar 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 12:32 am    Post subject: Re: Deja Vu all over again Reply with quote

Moparguy wrote:
I swear that those of us that are old enough to remember that this team is eerily similar to something we have seen before.

You have the once in a generational talent Johnson/Sanders

You have a strong Second fiddle Bush/Moore

Wildly inconsistent QB play Stafford/Mitchell

Solid but unspectacular lines. A couple of decent linebackers (Speilman/Tulloch) and a really horrible secondary.

Both teams have some talent. But not enough to truly be contenders. Both teams have a complete inability to handle their successes and lack discipline. And they both can go from dominate to doormat in the course of a week.

And possibly the most important part. Neither team had/has shown any ability to develop players taken in the back half of the draft. Sure they will get the occasional success (Young/Boyd). But will never have the GB/NE or even Dallas ability to take players that give them true depth.

Sadly I see no reason to believe this will turn out any different. There will be some good years and some terrible ones. But I really do not see any path that they have to create any better results. By the end of this offseason when they lock in Suh their salary structure will be pretty much locked in. And their inability to pick and develop the inexpensive draft picks will doom them to the same fate.


I really hope I am wrong on this. But unless there is a radical uptick in their drafting acumen. What we see now is generally what we will see for the next 5-7 years.


Wash, rinse repeat.

Sadly having been a Lions fan my entire life I agree. Each week it appears the song remains the same. Every time I think this time will be different the Lions instantly become the gang that couldn't shoot straight.
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diehardlionfan


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 1:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

stylish313 wrote:
Yep, odds are you're spot on.


If it wasn't so sad it would be humorous.

I've sat back and watched the Lions be one of the least successful sports franchises, regardless of sport.

We all have. The only difference amongst us is the amount of years we've been watching.

I'm not praising nor condemning Mayhew but following the termination of Millen and the removal of the coaching staff the Lions were in the position to hire a staff from the GM down that had a history of effective results in building a franchise and winning. In stead they chose to hire a GM who served under Millen and a HC who was a defensive coordinator.

Fans are always trying to be optimistic and as such tend to make excuses for poor franchise performance. The winless season still marks the low water mark and fans keep saying more time, more drafts. Unfortunately we've had the years, the drafts and the marginal increases in performance. There are many teams, including expansion teams that started with nothing that became contenders faster than the Lions have managed to turn things around.

Unfortunately we fans have no option but to continue, watching, waiting and hoping.
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TL-TwoWinsAway


Joined: 19 Feb 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 3:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This thread title seems to be redundantly repeating itself.

I can't disagree with the topic, though. Hopefully we can continue to add pieces to both sides of the ball and become a team that does more than fizzles in the first round of the playoffs.
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diehardlionfan


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 6:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TL-TwoWinsAway wrote:
This thread title seems to be redundantly repeating itself.

I can't disagree with the topic, though. Hopefully we can continue to add pieces to both sides of the ball and become a team that does more than fizzles in the first round of the playoffs.


Right now, a first round fizzle would mark improvement.
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Jrugges


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 11:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not sure what the cap is suppose to be next year but some of us that actually follow the team pretty hard know that they're a few players hitting free agency that are key and we prolly can't pay with our 123 million dollar cap(to start with in the offseason.)

Lots of players including depth.

Most the depth on the O-line.
Brandon Pettigrew
Dominic Riaola
Depth at DT.

We've got medicour players on big deals that will be tough to cut( Burleson/Delmas)

I've been in wait and see mode all year, pretty much dooming this staff from the start because I legitimately don't think they're good in game coaches(Adjustments/time management terrible.) Now, imo, the players have played good enough to bail out the staff for a year again, but during all this Schwartz was extended, Stafford too, and idk I just wouldn't of run things like that.

I'd of waited till "NOW" or right in the offseason to figure out the Stafford situation. Same with Schwartz, and if you fart the playoffs away like they are seemingly going to do then Lions could of fired everyone and started with a clean slate. Though they didn't do that, bad management practices as always pigeonholing themselves to these guys. Always have had bad management. I'm really really starting to believe that this team will never ever win anything under the Ford Family.
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Moparguy


Joined: 11 Apr 2009
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 2:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TL-TwoWinsAway wrote:
This thread title seems to be redundantly repeating itself.


Yea...that was kind of the point. We have see this again and again and again
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Moparguy


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 2:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jrugges wrote:
Not sure what the cap is suppose to be next year but some of us that actually follow the team pretty hard know that they're a few players hitting free agency that are key and we prolly can't pay with our 123 million dollar cap(to start with in the offseason.)

Lots of players including depth.

Most the depth on the O-line.
Brandon Pettigrew
Dominic Riaola
Depth at DT.

We've got medicour players on big deals that will be tough to cut( Burleson/Delmas)

I've been in wait and see mode all year, pretty much dooming this staff from the start because I legitimately don't think they're good in game coaches(Adjustments/time management terrible.) Now, imo, the players have played good enough to bail out the staff for a year again, but during all this Schwartz was extended, Stafford too, and idk I just wouldn't of run things like that.

I'd of waited till "NOW" or right in the offseason to figure out the Stafford situation. Same with Schwartz, and if you fart the playoffs away like they are seemingly going to do then Lions could of fired everyone and started with a clean slate. Though they didn't do that, bad management practices as always pigeonholing themselves to these guys. Always have had bad management. I'm really really starting to believe that this team will never ever win anything under the Ford Family.



I will say that in one aspect the Lions did get screwed by circumstance in this rebuilding phase

They had to pay top dollar for their talent. And not just the FA's. The Lions drafted their best players BEFORE the rookie scale change. The difference in what Stafford and Luck made was a huge bonus to the Colts in their rebuilding. And since those players Stafford/Johnson/Suh were all under the old scale the Lions are behind the 8 ball on that.

That is one of the reasons they are so discouraging. It never really mattered if they drafted properly in the first round. They had to hit on most of the later round picks to help make up for it. But until this year they have not had any consistent play from any players drafted beyond round 1
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Rockcity


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Deja voo is this secondary
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TL-TwoWinsAway


Joined: 19 Feb 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 2:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Moparguy wrote:
TL-TwoWinsAway wrote:
This thread title seems to be redundantly repeating itself.


Yea...that was kind of the point. We have see this again and again and again

It was more of a joke. Deja Vu itself implies something happening "over again". (Which is why I said "redundantly repeating itself", which is also redundant.)
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Moparguy


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 3:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TL-TwoWinsAway wrote:
Moparguy wrote:
TL-TwoWinsAway wrote:
This thread title seems to be redundantly repeating itself.


Yea...that was kind of the point. We have see this again and again and again

It was more of a joke. Deja Vu itself implies something happening "over again". (Which is why I said "redundantly repeating itself", which is also redundant.)


Touche!
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mijags


Joined: 22 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 27, 2013 11:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually the lions had a solid secondary for most of the 90s with blades/Crockett and later Westbrook (before the injury). At the very least, it was light years beyond what we have now.
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Moparguy


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 29, 2013 7:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am very happy the Lions won the GB in such a dominate fashion.

But they seemed to have proved my point. With the exception of turnovers they looked like a SB contender. But which team will show up next week?

I am happy they won this game but until I see some level of consistency from them they still look like if they make the playoffs they will make a quick exit.

They have 4 weeks to shoe (me at least) that they can be more
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theuntouchable


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 29, 2013 7:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Moparguy wrote:
I am very happy the Lions won the GB in such a dominate fashion.

But they seemed to have proved my point. With the exception of turnovers they looked like a SB contender. But which team will show up next week?

I am happy they won this game but until I see some level of consistency from them they still look like if they make the playoffs they will make a quick exit.

They have 4 weeks to shoe (me at least) that they can be more


This. Honestly, Im starting to feel more and more like there needs to be changes to the coaching staff and more specifically the head coach. This team has a lot of talent and honestly I feel like the in game adjustments arent actually bad. Its the initial gameplan in itself that is more often than not lacking.

Discipline. Almost none of them have it. Theres MAYBE a handful of players on this team that arent so damn up and down. Including Suh, Calvin, Stafford as players who are so up and down. If it was isolated to just a handful of players that kept screwing up, then id put on those players. When its damn near everyone that is committing some form of a costly mistake at different times that results in turnovers, bad penalties, big plays etc it HAS to start with the Coach.

I like Jim and I think hes been a helluva lot better than what weve seen in a good while but I dont think hes the guy to get the team there. The discipline of this team has been awful and has not been anywhere near enough progress towards playing good, consistent 60 min football since hes been here.

This team has the talent to play with any other team in the league but they severly lack the discipline needed to stay consistent throughout a game/stretch. It wouldnt shock me to see the Lions get dismantled in the playoffs but at the same time, I do think there is an outside chance they could do some dismantling IF they ever quit the stupid bonehead mistakes. Outside chance though, very very slim. It would take all the luck contained within any old irish tale ever known to anyone across the face of the earth for this team to turn those mistakes off consistently.
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