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Is Jay Cutler the guy?
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GOGRIESE


Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 12:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

1_two_3_forte wrote:
Just a sad era in Bears town right now.

Cutler will be gone after this year.

McCown is going to continue to play well enough to win against the Rams and Vikings (because both opposing offenses are horrible).

Cutler will come back and play against a healthy Cowboys team and throw multiple picks - and then, the beginning of the end of the Cutler/Bears era will transpire with the team going with McCown as the starter the week after.

We will cut ties. And then, we will realize how stupid of a decision it was to get rid of him.

Guys - in this league - the drafting of a quarterback is a freaking lottery. You BOMB on the lottery - and you set back the franchise for 5 years.

Look at our offesne. Our window isn't even shutting - it's WIDE OPEN. I can't think of any other offense in the league, that has this many playmakers at a young age.

Forte / Alshon / Marshall / Bennett / 2 extremely promising offensive lineman on the right side. A good/great Quarterback with this group and you got an offense that can grow together and blossom in a great system for 6-7 years. You have a better chance of dreaming of a perfect opportunity for an offense rather than it actually happening.

Missing on a quarterback via draft ruins it all.
Qb plays bad/near average year 1? Lets draft another? Nah. Stick with him. We dont want to get rid of him only for him to come into his own and end up turning into a brady/brees/rodgers/manning later.

Qb plays bad/near average year 2? Lets get rid of him? Nah. Lets not waste our draft pick like that? Stick with him another year. He will get better in the system.

Qb plays bad/near average year 3? Eh. Give another shot. On and on and on.

Cut ties after year 4? Guess what? Forte / Jeffrey / Marshall / Bennett = 4 years older - Questions about the coach arise due to losing.

You dont believe me? Look at the Jaguars and Blaine Gabbert. Do we really want to risk setting the franchise back another 5 years to 8 years by drafting a Blaine Gabbert? All because we weren't satisfied with the Good play of Cutler and wanted to be greedy and reach for a chance at greatness via somewhere else?

Its not worth it. And based upon past trends of Chicago - we will make the wrong decision at the Qb spot . . .


Like we always do.


While I agree that the draft is a crap shoot....your talking like we dont actually have competent management right now
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KG1187


Joined: 16 Jan 2013
Posts: 243
PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 12:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

GOGRIESE wrote:
1_two_3_forte wrote:
Just a sad era in Bears town right now.

Cutler will be gone after this year.

McCown is going to continue to play well enough to win against the Rams and Vikings (because both opposing offenses are horrible).

Cutler will come back and play against a healthy Cowboys team and throw multiple picks - and then, the beginning of the end of the Cutler/Bears era will transpire with the team going with McCown as the starter the week after.

We will cut ties. And then, we will realize how stupid of a decision it was to get rid of him.

Guys - in this league - the drafting of a quarterback is a freaking lottery. You BOMB on the lottery - and you set back the franchise for 5 years.

Look at our offesne. Our window isn't even shutting - it's WIDE OPEN. I can't think of any other offense in the league, that has this many playmakers at a young age.

Forte / Alshon / Marshall / Bennett / 2 extremely promising offensive lineman on the right side. A good/great Quarterback with this group and you got an offense that can grow together and blossom in a great system for 6-7 years. You have a better chance of dreaming of a perfect opportunity for an offense rather than it actually happening.

Missing on a quarterback via draft ruins it all.
Qb plays bad/near average year 1? Lets draft another? Nah. Stick with him. We dont want to get rid of him only for him to come into his own and end up turning into a brady/brees/rodgers/manning later.

Qb plays bad/near average year 2? Lets get rid of him? Nah. Lets not waste our draft pick like that? Stick with him another year. He will get better in the system.

Qb plays bad/near average year 3? Eh. Give another shot. On and on and on.

Cut ties after year 4? Guess what? Forte / Jeffrey / Marshall / Bennett = 4 years older - Questions about the coach arise due to losing.

You dont believe me? Look at the Jaguars and Blaine Gabbert. Do we really want to risk setting the franchise back another 5 years to 8 years by drafting a Blaine Gabbert? All because we weren't satisfied with the Good play of Cutler and wanted to be greedy and reach for a chance at greatness via somewhere else?

Its not worth it. And based upon past trends of Chicago - we will make the wrong decision at the Qb spot . . .


Like we always do.


While I agree that the draft is a crap shoot....your talking like we dont actually have competent management right now


Lovie and JA aren't here nor is Wanny or Jauron for that matter. How cant McCowns strong play evoke a faith in Tresmans ability to development a rookie QB?
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WindyCity


Joined: 26 Jun 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 12:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can say 1 thing about the Cutler situation because I have no idea what we are going to do.

I trust Phil Emery and Marc Trestman to make the right decision.

And damn does it feel good.
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Madmike90


Joined: 25 Jan 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 12:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

1_two_3_forte wrote:
Just a sad era in Bears town right now.

Cutler will be gone after this year.

McCown is going to continue to play well enough to win against the Rams and Vikings (because both opposing offenses are horrible).

Cutler will come back and play against a healthy Cowboys team and throw multiple picks - and then, the beginning of the end of the Cutler/Bears era will transpire with the team going with McCown as the starter the week after.

We will cut ties. And then, we will realize how stupid of a decision it was to get rid of him.

Guys - in this league - the drafting of a quarterback is a freaking lottery. You BOMB on the lottery - and you set back the franchise for 5 years.

Look at our offesne. Our window isn't even shutting - it's WIDE OPEN. I can't think of any other offense in the league, that has this many playmakers at a young age.

Forte / Alshon / Marshall / Bennett / 2 extremely promising offensive lineman on the right side. A good/great Quarterback with this group and you got an offense that can grow together and blossom in a great system for 6-7 years. You have a better chance of dreaming of a perfect opportunity for an offense rather than it actually happening.

Missing on a quarterback via draft ruins it all.
Qb plays bad/near average year 1? Lets draft another? Nah. Stick with him. We dont want to get rid of him only for him to come into his own and end up turning into a brady/brees/rodgers/manning later.

Qb plays bad/near average year 2? Lets get rid of him? Nah. Lets not waste our draft pick like that? Stick with him another year. He will get better in the system.

Qb plays bad/near average year 3? Eh. Give another shot. On and on and on.

Cut ties after year 4? Guess what? Forte / Jeffrey / Marshall / Bennett = 4 years older - Questions about the coach arise due to losing.

You dont believe me? Look at the Jaguars and Blaine Gabbert. Do we really want to risk setting the franchise back another 5 years to 8 years by drafting a Blaine Gabbert? All because we weren't satisfied with the Good play of Cutler and wanted to be greedy and reach for a chance at greatness via somewhere else?

Its not worth it. And based upon past trends of Chicago - we will make the wrong decision at the Qb spot . . .


Like we always do.


Yes drafting a QB is risky…the same as drafting any other position is risky…the last thing you can do is go into the draft or offseason as a whole scared of making a mistake…you trust in the people you have in place to make the right decisions…Emery & Trestman have barely put a foot wrong since taking over here…you trust that if these guys identify a QB they feel can come in and not only start but elevate the level of play at the position then you go with it…

You outline what happens if a rookie comes in and sucks for 4 years and the rest of the talent ages but you don’t look at from the perspective of what if Cutler continues to get hurt and we are paying him around $18 million a year to stand on the sideline and because of that cap investment we don’t have the resources to improve the rest of the team…there is a business side to this decision as well…

Also comparing us to the Jags is way off…they don’t have nearly the same level of talent at the skill position as we do outside of the QB position…and for every Gabbert there is a Russell Wilson…as I said before you can’t go into the offseason scared of making a mistake…

Right now I don’t see us having any reason to resign Cutler to a long term contract…I think we should tag him for the year with the precursor that he is our undisputed starter next season which gives him the opportunity to show us that he should be resigned for the longer term…we should also draft a QB to develop for the year who will be out #3 all season which gives Trestman time to decide if he thinks that guy can start year two if Cutler doesn’t play to the level we are looking for…if Cutler excels we have a QB with trade value for the future and if he fails we have a year two starter who has been around the programme and learned the playbook for an entire season before he is expected to start.
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topwop1


Joined: 08 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Unless Cutler comes back and ignites a spark that gets this team into the playoffs and potentially as far as the SB then I think the best course of action this off season is to slap the tag on him and then draft a developmental guy in rounds 2-4.

I think that both sides will prefer to go the one year franchise tag route because if they tried to do something long term, Emery would probably offer something to which Jay wouldn't deem worthy; and on the other hand Jay would probably command a lot more than the Bears are willing to pay at this point.

The franchise tag offers both sides a fair and reasonable one year deal to further evaluate the situation and see what Jay's true value is.

In any case I think that drafting a developmental QB is absolutely paramount this offseaon considering Jay's injury history and also that McCown won't be around too much longer to serve as the #2.
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WindyCity


Joined: 26 Jun 2009
Posts: 9731
PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 2:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

QB Plan

Franchise Tag Jay Cutler [17 million]
Re-sign Joshn McCown [1.5 million]
Draft [2nd/3rd round] Aaron Murray [750K]

19.25 million invested

Still leaves 41.75 million for free agency and other draft picks.

2014

-Jay Cutler thrives and makes the Pro Bowl and gets the Bears to the playoffs. [Re-signed Long Term]

-Jay Cutler struggles to be consistent, Replaced by Josh McCown [Not Re-signed, allowed to walk]

-Jay Cutler gets injured, replaced by Josh McCown [Not Re-signed Long Term]

-Aaron Murray shows ability in limited starts or in practice [Jay Not Re-signed Long Term]
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Madmike90


Joined: 25 Jan 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 2:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

WindyCity wrote:
QB Plan

Franchise Tag Jay Cutler [17 million]
Re-sign Joshn McCown [1.5 million]
Draft [2nd/3rd round] Aaron Murray [750K]

19.25 million invested

Still leaves 41.75 million for free agency and other draft picks.

2014

-Jay Cutler thrives and makes the Pro Bowl and gets the Bears to the playoffs. [Re-signed Long Term]

-Jay Cutler struggles to be consistent, Replaced by Josh McCown [Not Re-signed, allowed to walk]

-Jay Cutler gets injured, replaced by Josh McCown [Not Re-signed Long Term]

-Aaron Murray shows ability in limited starts or in practice [Jay Not Re-signed Long Term]


Change out Murray for McCarron and we are there.
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WindyCity


Joined: 26 Jun 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 2:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Madmike90 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
QB Plan

Franchise Tag Jay Cutler [17 million]
Re-sign Joshn McCown [1.5 million]
Draft [2nd/3rd round] Aaron Murray [750K]

19.25 million invested

Still leaves 41.75 million for free agency and other draft picks.

2014

-Jay Cutler thrives and makes the Pro Bowl and gets the Bears to the playoffs. [Re-signed Long Term]

-Jay Cutler struggles to be consistent, Replaced by Josh McCown [Not Re-signed, allowed to walk]

-Jay Cutler gets injured, replaced by Josh McCown [Not Re-signed Long Term]

-Aaron Murray shows ability in limited starts or in practice [Jay Not Re-signed Long Term]


Change out Murray for McCarron and we are there.


Give me Murray, I will sacrifice 2" of height for a better arm and more athletc ability.

But I get what you are saying.
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Madmike90


Joined: 25 Jan 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 3:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

WindyCity wrote:
Madmike90 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
QB Plan

Franchise Tag Jay Cutler [17 million]
Re-sign Joshn McCown [1.5 million]
Draft [2nd/3rd round] Aaron Murray [750K]

19.25 million invested

Still leaves 41.75 million for free agency and other draft picks.

2014

-Jay Cutler thrives and makes the Pro Bowl and gets the Bears to the playoffs. [Re-signed Long Term]

-Jay Cutler struggles to be consistent, Replaced by Josh McCown [Not Re-signed, allowed to walk]

-Jay Cutler gets injured, replaced by Josh McCown [Not Re-signed Long Term]

-Aaron Murray shows ability in limited starts or in practice [Jay Not Re-signed Long Term]


Change out Murray for McCarron and we are there.


Give me Murray, I will sacrifice 2" of height for a better arm and more athletc ability.

But I get what you are saying.


Stronger arm…not sure I would say better tho…Murray can be inconsistent…

My other concern is his leadership ability and lack of wins for Georgia despite all the talent they have had over the past few years…Murray’s career record as a starter is 34-17 which isn’t great…bit too much Rex Grossman in his game for my liking.
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ForteOz


Joined: 03 Sep 2013
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If the Bears spend a 2nd round pick on a QB, with all of the needs they have on defense, that tells me the organization is ready to move on. Even if he is franchised and plays well, I just can't see it being a situation where we develop a guy for 3-4 years.

I don't get how watching the offense running with McCown behind center excites people. The only way I can make sense of it is that people are seeing the 250 2/0 lines and thinking 'If we had that when our Defense was good, we'd have been competing for Super Bowls.' Which is true, but guys, those days are over.

I have faith that whatever route Emery and Trestman go with will be the right one. If you don't have faith in them to get decisions like this right, then the team has bigger problems than Jay.

I just think it will make their job harder. They already need to rebuild the Defense and Special Teams, and now they have to develop a rookie QB within the 3-4 year window of our offensive playmakers' peak?
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Madmike90


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 4:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ForteOz wrote:
If the Bears spend a 2nd round pick on a QB, with all of the needs they have on defense, that tells me the organization is ready to move on. Even if he is franchised and plays well, I just can't see it being a situation where we develop a guy for 3-4 years.

I don't get how watching the offense running with McCown behind center excites people. The only way I can make sense of it is that people are seeing the 250 2/0 lines and thinking 'If we had that when our Defense was good, we'd have been competing for Super Bowls.' Which is true, but guys, those days are over.

I have faith that whatever route Emery and Trestman go with will be the right one. If you don't have faith in them to get decisions like this right, then the team has bigger problems than Jay.

I just think it will make their job harder. They already need to rebuild the Defense and Special Teams, and now they have to develop a rookie QB within the 3-4 year window of our offensive playmakers' peak?


Yeah it’s difficult to watch a QB who looks in total command of the offence which not making stupid throws or turning the ball over lol…

As for the 250 yard 2/0 stat line you do realises that is pretty much so what Cutler has been doing when we have been winning right?...against New Orleans where he throw for 358 yards and 2 TD with 0 INTs has he been above that average but it was a loss…against the Lions he throw for 317 yards with 2 TDs…but also 3 INTs in another loss…even his 3rd highest yards total of the year against the Vikings at 293 yards came with 3 TDs but another 2 INTs in a game we had to pull out at the last second…the rest of the season he has been at 242 yards 2 TDs/1 INT…262 yards 2 TDs/0 INTs…250 yards 1 TD/1 INT…159 1 TD/1INT.
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WindyCity


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 5:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ForteOz wrote:
If the Bears spend a 2nd round pick on a QB, with all of the needs they have on defense, that tells me the organization is ready to move on. Even if he is franchised and plays well, I just can't see it being a situation where we develop a guy for 3-4 years.

I don't get how watching the offense running with McCown behind center excites people. The only way I can make sense of it is that people are seeing the 250 2/0 lines and thinking 'If we had that when our Defense was good, we'd have been competing for Super Bowls.' Which is true, but guys, those days are over.

I have faith that whatever route Emery and Trestman go with will be the right one. If you don't have faith in them to get decisions like this right, then the team has bigger problems than Jay.

I just think it will make their job harder. They already need to rebuild the Defense and Special Teams, and now they have to develop a rookie QB within the 3-4 year window of our offensive playmakers' peak?


Considering we have 61 million in cap space and 7 draft picks I don't see how spending a 2nd round pick hurts our chances of rebuilding our defense?

Most 2nd round picks are not stars year 1 anyway.

We have more than enough money and picks to rebuild the defense and still invest in the most important position on the team.
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Last edited by WindyCity on Wed Nov 20, 2013 5:24 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Madmike90


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

WindyCity wrote:
ForteOz wrote:
If the Bears spend a 2nd round pick on a QB, with all of the needs they have on defense, that tells me the organization is ready to move on. Even if he is franchised and plays well, I just can't see it being a situation where we develop a guy for 3-4 years.

I don't get how watching the offense running with McCown behind center excites people. The only way I can make sense of it is that people are seeing the 250 2/0 lines and thinking 'If we had that when our Defense was good, we'd have been competing for Super Bowls.' Which is true, but guys, those days are over.

I have faith that whatever route Emery and Trestman go with will be the right one. If you don't have faith in them to get decisions like this right, then the team has bigger problems than Jay.

I just think it will make their job harder. They already need to rebuild the Defense and Special Teams, and now they have to develop a rookie QB within the 3-4 year window of our offensive playmakers' peak?


Considering we have 61 million in cap space and 7 draft picks how spending a 2nd round pick hurts our chances of rebuilding our defense?

Most 2nd round picks are not stars year 1 anyway.

We have more than enough money and picks to rebuild the defense and still invest in the most important position on the team.


I fully expect Emery to create more than 7 picks come draft day...he will be trying to trade down like crazy.
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blkwdw13


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 5:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

^^^^^^^^

I was just going to say this. MCCown is doing what Cutler was minus the interceptions.
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WindyCity


Joined: 26 Jun 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 5:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Madmike90 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
ForteOz wrote:
If the Bears spend a 2nd round pick on a QB, with all of the needs they have on defense, that tells me the organization is ready to move on. Even if he is franchised and plays well, I just can't see it being a situation where we develop a guy for 3-4 years.

I don't get how watching the offense running with McCown behind center excites people. The only way I can make sense of it is that people are seeing the 250 2/0 lines and thinking 'If we had that when our Defense was good, we'd have been competing for Super Bowls.' Which is true, but guys, those days are over.

I have faith that whatever route Emery and Trestman go with will be the right one. If you don't have faith in them to get decisions like this right, then the team has bigger problems than Jay.

I just think it will make their job harder. They already need to rebuild the Defense and Special Teams, and now they have to develop a rookie QB within the 3-4 year window of our offensive playmakers' peak?


Considering we have 61 million in cap space and 7 draft picks how spending a 2nd round pick hurts our chances of rebuilding our defense?

Most 2nd round picks are not stars year 1 anyway.

We have more than enough money and picks to rebuild the defense and still invest in the most important position on the team.


I fully expect Emery to create more than 7 picks come draft day...he will be trying to trade down like crazy.


How many new bodies do people want on defense because I expect 7-8 starters and depth is a lot and we can easily add that.

3 Free Agents
4 draft picks
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