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Apollo's Midway Mock

 
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apollo14000


Joined: 07 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2013 10:55 pm    Post subject: Apollo's Midway Mock Reply with quote

Ok we're halfway through the season so we have a better understanding of what what/who is doing well and what/who can be upgraded. This is a pretty deep class of QBs and OTs so I think it's very possible we see arguably our two biggest needs addressed in round 1 and 2. With that in mind, I have alternate picks for the first 2 rounds.

1. Blake Bortles/QB/Central Florida

He has the size, arm strength, and mobility that you look for. What I like about him is that he's composed in the pocket unlike many other college QBs. He plays in a pro style offense that requires him to make multiple reads and you can see on tape Bortles goes through his progressions quickly. Also, he does well not to stare down his receivers. One thing he needs to work on is his deep ball. He's got the arm strength but not the accuracy. It could be he's not asked to make many of those throws in his UCF's offense. E.J. Manuel and Andrew Luck had similar issues coming out of their college offenses.

ALTERNATE PICK: Taylor Lewan/OT/Michigan

2. James Hurst/OT/North Carolina

Sowell needs to be upgraded badly. With that in mind, Hurst is a solid LT prospect who does well in the run and pass game. He's going to get some questions about whether he can play LT in the NFL but I think he can. He gets the most out of his good athleticism by playing with good technique. Plus, I like the fact that him and Cooper played side by side for a number of years.

ALTERNATE PICK: Derek Carr/QB/Fresno State

3. Kyle Fuller/CB/Virginia Tech

Powers is getting beat too often and with teams weary of throwing against PP, we need a legit #2 CB. Fuller has good size (6'0" 190) and athleticism. He comes from a school renowned for producing good secondary players and is coached by Frank Beamer so it's no surprise that he excels on STs. Fuller is having a breakout season as an outside CB. He is very good in zone and off man coverage. He is very instinctive and jumps on routes and breaks up a lot of passes. He also has the speed to stick with receivers on go routes. He's is very aggressive in run support and an excellent tackler for a CB. Where Fuller could use work is using his hands in press coverage and not biting on so many double moves. I have a 2nd round grade on Fuller.

4. Tyler Larson/C/Utah State

I think it's time to move on from Lyle because a) he's just average-below average most of the time and b) this is the year to do it. This is a pretty deep class of centers. Larson is a well-built center (6'4" 315) and 4 year starter who can hopefully start right away. He's a powerful run blocker and solid in pass protection. I haven't scouted centers a lot so there could be better options than Larson out there on day 3.

5. Jimmie Ward/SS/Northern Illinois

We have a good stable of free safeties in Mathieu, Jefferson, and Johnson but we need an enforcer in the run game at strong safety that also isn't a liability in coverage like the aging Bell. Ward is one of my sleepers in the draft. He's a little undersized for a SS (5'11" 195) but he hits like a linebacker. He's experienced at playing in the box and takes good angles to the runner and wraps up well. He regularly lines up against receivers in man coverage and does pretty well. He needs to shed blocks better but other than that, I think he deserves a lot more hype. He doesn't get much hype playing for Northern Illinois but I have a 3rd round grade on him.

6. Jacob Pederson/TE/Wisconsin

This is a pick I really like. Pederson has decent size (6'4" 240) and good athleticism and receiving skills. Unfortunately, he's underutilized in Wisconsin's run heavy scheme. Fortunately, that's allowed him to develop in a surprisingly good blocker. He's won't drive guys up the field but he's a good positional blocker.

7. Dee Ford/OLB/Auburn

Undersized but he's been fairly productive in the SEC so good enough to be a 7th round pick.
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LuckyNumber11


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2013 11:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've gotta say I love what you've done in rounds 3-5 I really love that part. 6-7 no real huge complaints, they're 7th rounders so I really can't. But I still don't like Hurst. He's really just a right tackle and nothing more I still can't see him at LT which is why I don't like the pick. Bortles I'm really back and forth on. I'll have days where I love him, days where I hate him. I'm pretty vanilla on him right now, so I'd be content
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apollo14000


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2013 11:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LuckyNumber11 wrote:
I've gotta say I love what you've done in rounds 3-5 I really love that part. 6-7 no real huge complaints, they're 7th rounders so I really can't. But I still don't like Hurst. He's really just a right tackle and nothing more I still can't see him at LT which is why I don't like the pick. Bortles I'm really back and forth on. I'll have days where I love him, days where I hate him. I'm pretty vanilla on him right now, so I'd be content


Yeah Fuller and Larson could catch on quick and start right away. Fuller would push Powers inside where he's probably better off. Larson is just bigger and more powerful than Sendlein. Huge difference in physical talent between those two.

I can see why Hurst at LT would cause some hesitancy. If you don't like Bortles or Hurst would you prefer LT round 1 then QB round 2? If so who would you go with?
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DJ_Fka


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2013 11:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Love picks 3 - 5 as well.

Not sure Bortles comes out this year and I dont like Carr, Tackles are fine in their place, especially if we are in mid teens in first round for Lewan, his stock has dropped (anyone watch MSU & ND games, wasnt outstanding at all).

Havent heard of the other picks, had to look them up, so no issue there.
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IAmPacman


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 04, 2013 1:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like it but I would prefer Erving in the first and Bortles in the second Cool
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khodder


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 04, 2013 1:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Right now I don't see Fuller getting out of the first round of the draft, so if we were able to get him in 3 I would be amazed.

Quote:
But I still don't like Hurst. He's really just a right tackle and nothing more I still can't see him at LT which is why I don't like the pick.


What exactly is he going to do at LT that he won't at RT? There really is no difference between the two tackle positions anymore with teams moving their best pass rushers all over the formation.

Why would Hurst be a RT and not a LT?
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apollo14000


Joined: 07 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 04, 2013 1:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

khodder wrote:
Right now I don't see Fuller getting out of the first round of the draft, so if we were able to get him in 3 I would be amazed.

Quote:
But I still don't like Hurst. He's really just a right tackle and nothing more I still can't see him at LT which is why I don't like the pick.


What exactly is he going to do at LT that he won't at RT? There really is no difference between the two tackle positions anymore with teams moving their best pass rushers all over the formation.

Why would Hurst be a RT and not a LT?


The whole idea behind needing a great LT is because a right-handed QB literally can't see when his LT gets beat and therefore can't account for that when it happens and adjust his position in the pocket. You need that LT so your QB can play without having to worry about his blind spot. So I do think it's more important that LTs can handle the speed rush for that reason. There's not a lot of big guys that can move that fast.

I do think Hurst is a good enough athlete though.

Fuller doesn't have the hype of some of the other guys but it's possible he goes in the 1st round. Hard to say at this point in the process.
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apollo14000


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 04, 2013 1:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DJ_Fka wrote:
Not sure Bortles comes out this year and I dont like Carr, Tackles are fine in their place, especially if we are in mid teens in first round for Lewan, his stock has dropped (anyone watch MSU & ND games, wasnt outstanding at all).


Carr is a tricky evaluation. Last year you saw a Kevin Kolb-esque QB. He didn't handle pressure well or look comfortable in the pocket. This year I see lots of improvements in that area and the guy already has the physical tools you like at that position. I wish he had played in a more pro style offense though with reads, progressions, and downfield throws because he seems like a smart guy who spends a lot of time studying film.

Unfortunately, Kevin Kolb is a great comparison for him in terms of their play style and college career. But then again, if Kolb never had those injuries and he definitely could have turned out better.
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DJ_Fka


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 04, 2013 3:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fuller is a stud, his brother is better but a freshman, he could be there in third, only just

I have seen a few Carr games, not impressed

Hurst is a good tackle, not elite, but better than Sowell
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khodder


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 04, 2013 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

apollo14000 wrote:
khodder wrote:
Right now I don't see Fuller getting out of the first round of the draft, so if we were able to get him in 3 I would be amazed.

Quote:
But I still don't like Hurst. He's really just a right tackle and nothing more I still can't see him at LT which is why I don't like the pick.


What exactly is he going to do at LT that he won't at RT? There really is no difference between the two tackle positions anymore with teams moving their best pass rushers all over the formation.

Why would Hurst be a RT and not a LT?


The whole idea behind needing a great LT is because a right-handed QB literally can't see when his LT gets beat and therefore can't account for that when it happens and adjust his position in the pocket. You need that LT so your QB can play without having to worry about his blind spot. So I do think it's more important that LTs can handle the speed rush for that reason. There's not a lot of big guys that can move that fast.

I do think Hurst is a good enough athlete though.

Fuller doesn't have the hype of some of the other guys but it's possible he goes in the 1st round. Hard to say at this point in the process.


And what I'd your QB is going through reads one and two on the left hand side of the field?Then he cannot see if your RT has been beaten or nit.
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apollo14000


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 04, 2013 5:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

khodder wrote:
apollo14000 wrote:
khodder wrote:
Right now I don't see Fuller getting out of the first round of the draft, so if we were able to get him in 3 I would be amazed.

Quote:
But I still don't like Hurst. He's really just a right tackle and nothing more I still can't see him at LT which is why I don't like the pick.


What exactly is he going to do at LT that he won't at RT? There really is no difference between the two tackle positions anymore with teams moving their best pass rushers all over the formation.

Why would Hurst be a RT and not a LT?


The whole idea behind needing a great LT is because a right-handed QB literally can't see when his LT gets beat and therefore can't account for that when it happens and adjust his position in the pocket. You need that LT so your QB can play without having to worry about his blind spot. So I do think it's more important that LTs can handle the speed rush for that reason. There's not a lot of big guys that can move that fast.

I do think Hurst is a good enough athlete though.

Fuller doesn't have the hype of some of the other guys but it's possible he goes in the 1st round. Hard to say at this point in the process.


And what I'd your QB is going through reads one and two on the left hand side of the field?Then he cannot see if your RT has been beaten or nit.


Due to the right-handed QB stance, your back is never completely turned away from pass rushers on the right side, just your head, so theoretically you should be able to turn your head faster to see what's to the right of you then what's to the left of you where you'd have to turn your whole body.

Disclaimer: I've never played QB so what do I know:lol:
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LuckyNumber11


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 04, 2013 5:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

khodder wrote:
apollo14000 wrote:
khodder wrote:
Right now I don't see Fuller getting out of the first round of the draft, so if we were able to get him in 3 I would be amazed.

Quote:
But I still don't like Hurst. He's really just a right tackle and nothing more I still can't see him at LT which is why I don't like the pick.


What exactly is he going to do at LT that he won't at RT? There really is no difference between the two tackle positions anymore with teams moving their best pass rushers all over the formation.

Why would Hurst be a RT and not a LT?


The whole idea behind needing a great LT is because a right-handed QB literally can't see when his LT gets beat and therefore can't account for that when it happens and adjust his position in the pocket. You need that LT so your QB can play without having to worry about his blind spot. So I do think it's more important that LTs can handle the speed rush for that reason. There's not a lot of big guys that can move that fast.

I do think Hurst is a good enough athlete though.

Fuller doesn't have the hype of some of the other guys but it's possible he goes in the 1st round. Hard to say at this point in the process.


And what I'd your QB is going through reads one and two on the left hand side of the field?Then he cannot see if your RT has been beaten or nit.


Textbook example: Joe Theisman broken leg play. He's looking down field and bam, hit from behind- blind sided. Never saw it coming. That's why the left tackle is more important, not necessarily because of the hits that he's going to take but the unexpected hits he's going to take those need to be limitied more than the ones on the right side, which is why the less athletic, more run blocking centered tackles play on the right side.

That how I've always viewed it at least
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