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5 first round prospects that Loomis could shock us with:

 
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whodatworm23


Joined: 23 Dec 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 4:28 am    Post subject: 5 first round prospects that Loomis could shock us with: Reply with quote

First let me be clear that I am in no way advocating the selection of any of these players… just looking at the state of this franchise and the history of Loomis and Payton on draft day with an unbiased opinion.



1. Lache Seastrunk//RB//Baylor

I can just imagine some of your faces if Goodell approaches the podium and spouts out the name of another running back in the 1st round! All kidding aside though, Seastrunk is worthy of a late first round selection. I currently have him rated the 34th overall player on my big board. As we all know and discussed many times, former 1st rounder Mark Ingram is simply not a fit in Sean Payton’s offense. Whether Ingram is a bust or not can be argued but what can’t be is that is has been a bust here in New Orleans. Maybe a fresh start elsewhere in an offense more tailored to his skill set he can flourish but only time will tell and speaking of time, Ingram in my opinion has run out of it here.

So what becomes of the position?

We as fans can all hoop and holla till the cows come home that running backs are not worth a 1st round pick… Obviously Loomis and Payton believe they are. I don’t see the failure of Ingram in any way deterring this staff from pulling the trigger on another running back in the top round if they have a high grade and good conviction on the player.

So why Seastrunk?

Simple… Explosion! Lache Seastrunk reminds me of an extremely more athletic Pierre Thomas. He’s adept at running at what he sees and exploding through the hole with lighting quick acceleration. Built in the same mold of Panthers running back DeAngleo Williams, Seastrunk is an impressive specimen who will likely turn a few heads at the NFL combine. He possesses untapped potential as a receiver out of the backfield and is already and adequate blocker in pass pro. When I look at the current state at the running back position in New Orleans, I am not impressed in the least. Pierre Thomas is a good pro, a though try hard runner who gives you all he has and he’s exceptional in screens but as a runner he’s nothing special. Thomas is also crossing the dreaded 30 mark for running backs so long-term thinking will come into play, it’s part of the same thinking that brought Ingram to the Big Easy. Speaking of Mark Ingram, there is simply no way around it… dude’s a bust! We need to forget about what it cost to draft him and what we might get in return on a trade. The guy isn’t worth much and best case scenario is the front office realizes this and moves on. Darren Sproles really isn’t a running back more so than the dreaded “offensive weapon”. He’s currently 32 years of age and was heavily used during his time in San Diego and first year in New Orleans so wear and tear is a concern with him. For as dynamic as he is in the passing game, Sproles offers little in the rushing department. Most Saints fans have grown to love undrafted rookie free agent Khiry Robinson out of West Texas. I to have become enamored with the first year back but my outlook on him is a lot different than most Saints fans. I believe Robinson has everything needed to be a very capable and solid backup running back in this league. Most take that as a slight to Robinson but considering where he’s come from and how he got here that is high praise in my book. Robinson is a tough hard-nosed runner who fights through contact but as a full time back his running style will eventually lead to injuries in the NFL. Besides, the NFL these days is a two back league and there is nothing wrong with calling Khiry Robinson your #2. Now, Tavares Cadet… I hate to keep this brief but he’s just a guy.

Adding all this up… what I see at the running back position is an aging dwindling unit with one promising young backup whose rushing style is a concern. The Saints brass seen this and tried to address it with the selection of Mark Ingram but that has not worked out to their liking but that’s not to say they won’t try again.




2. DeAnthony Thomas//OW-RB//Oregon

The term “offensive weapon” is increasingly gaining steam in the NFL and I would argue that no team in the league relies on this position as much as the New Orleans Saints. Sean Payton has basically had the OW as not only a feature of his offensive system but as a staple of it. In 2006 with his first ever draft selection with the Saints, Payton selected USC running back Reggie Bush who while is considered a bust to some due to the absurd expectations he arrived with as the #2 pick overall, was actually a very good player for the Saints in this vital role in Payton’s offense. After Bush departed the Saints quickly filled the role with another dynamic space player in Darren Sproles who currently has a strangle hold on the position but at age 32 as stated above is likely on the downside of his career as he heads into the final year of his contract.

In the 2013 NFL draft, the Saints were rumored to be enamored with West Virginia WR/OW Tavon Austin. As the draft drew closer most media national media outlets were reporting the Saints would go defense with their top selection, Georgia linebacker Jarvis Jones, Texas safety Kenny Vaccaro & Florida State corner Xavier Rhodes were the logical selections but local reports surfaced that if Austin would somehow slip to the 15th pick where the Saints were sitting they would pull the trigger. One can only assume that the thinking behind this would be the long-term outlook at a position that has become a cornerstone to Payton’s genius and Austin would have fit in like a glove. However, Austin didn’t slip and Vaccaro became the pick. Still, the fact that it was so widely discussed is proof that there is logic behind this thinking.

DeAnthony Thomas is not the muscle ball that Darren Sproles is but neither was Austin. What Thomas does have in common with both players though is game changing speed and quickness and the ability to play in space. While Thomas’s draft stock range’s from the late 1st round to early 3rd he’s clearly a player teams will value differently and if the Saints and Sean Payton are truly serious about the future of the position that in some ways is the key to what the Saints do offensively… Thomas will be considered.




3. Odell Beckham Jr.//WR-OW-KR//Louisiana State

Much in the same fashion as DeAnthony Thomas, Odell Beckham Jr. is a very similar player to that of Tavon Austin except for being a tad bit less explosive. Both players are elite athletes and great players in space, however I feel Beckham Jr. is a much more polished receiver with better hands than Austin was coming out of West Virginia. Both players are dangerous kick returners and have experience taking handoffs out of the backfield. Beckham is a local product who would be a fan favorite around New Orleans but once again the lure to a player such as this would be his versatility and ability to fill the OW role once Darren Sproles days are done in the Big Easy.



4. Austin Seferian-Jenkins//TE//Washington

Two things, one I’m sure of and one I’m not… I’m not sure if Austin Seferian-Jenkins lack of production and subsequent DUI arrest will cause him to slip to the end of the 1st round but what I am sure of is the fact that if it does, Jenkins will likely be one of the best talents on the board at the time.

If this turns out to be the selection, I think it should and would be cause for panic in the WhoDat Nation. For one I don’t see a quick resolution to Jimmy Grahams contract situation and if it carries on into the offseason I’m quite sure we will see the franchise tag be utilized. If so, I fully expect a contract squabble to ensue. Jimmy Graham has clearly outplayed his current rookie contract tenfold and deserves to be made the highest paid tight end in the History of the NFL. The problem with that is the fact that early reports suggest that Grahams agents aren’t seeking top tight end money by top receiver money and you wanna know what the scary part is… they are right to seek it!

Jimmy Graham is considered one of the NFL’s best tight ends (if not the best) but he plays the majority of his snaps out of the revciever and slot positions. His agent has strong argument for his client to be paid for what he does and the facts are that Sean Payton can call Jimmy a tight end but he uses him as a receiver and the Saints Mickey Loomis will look to get the best cap friendly deal he can, while Grahams agent will search for the best deal period.

If Graham is tagged, it will be as a tight end which is a substantial difference from being tagged as a wide receiver. This would be a power play and is the most leverage Loomis has against Grahams agent. If this were to happen, and while it does not seem in Jimmy’s nature… after suffering another injury in which he will be force to play through pain in his foot this season, I fully expect Jimmy Graham to hold out if he does not receive the contract he seeks.

The selection of Seferian-Jenkins would not mean the end of Jimmy Graham as a Saint because this is a two tight end league now and Ben Watson is quickly approaching the end of his career. What it would signal is the fact that the Saints expect a lengthy hold out from Jimmy and that the sides are far apart in negations. Jenkins could pair with Watson in the absence of Graham while eventually pairing with the superstar upon his return to give the Saints the best tight end tandem in football or in the worst case scenario be asked to replace him.

Yes this seems extremely far-fetched, but ask yourself… If Loomis is willing to take Drew Brees and his contract down to the wire, what makes you think he won’t short change Jimmy Graham?




5. Cyril Richardson//OG//Baylor

It’s no secret that the offensive line play in New Orleans has been suspect this season. The question though is which area is in the most need of upgrading? The answer to this question is simple… the disappointing player whose the highest paid will always come under the microscope when a team is up against the cap like the Saints are. It’s one thing if a player in underperforming with a moderate salary but when a player is not producing while being paid top pay… that my friend is a problem. Jahari Evans & Benn Grubbs are currently two of the highest paid players on the Saints roster. While both players production have been adequate at best this season, the Saints aren’t paying them to be average… there paying them to be good and both thus far have not held up their end of the bargain. Cyril Richardson is a monster, much in the mold that Carl Nicks was but Richardson is a far superior athlete for his size than Nicks. The guard play is essential in New Orleans because it allows Drew Brees the ability to step up into the pocket to avoid the outside rush and kick slide out of trouble. This season the pocket has been collapsing from the interior which has now exposed the Saints shoddy tackle play that has been covered up in years past. Richardson can bring back the dominance of the Saints interior offensive line but it would cost one of the Saints most expensive players their roster spot.



Who Dat !!!
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navysaintsfan


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 7:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If we pick an offensive position that is not OLine, I will scream. And not positive things. The only thing I would be able to make sense of would be if a QB fell to us that we projected as a starter in the next couple seasons.
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FLOODx


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 9:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

navysaintsfan wrote:
If we pick an offensive position that is not OLine, I will scream. And not positive things. The only thing I would be able to make sense of would be if a QB fell to us that we projected as a starter in the next couple seasons.


Agreed
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SaintsBeast


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 10:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wouldn't be upset with Seastrunk. I've met the guy, watched him play, and even played against him unofficially (just like a scrimmage)... Dude is like lightning. He's like jogging when he hits the hole, then a single step later he's at full speed. And he's not like Ingram. Ingram's like the ocean. He slowly but surely pounds away at you until you're tired, then it's game over. Seastrunk... He doesn't require all that. He can come in off the bench and explode downfield for 40 yards. It's scary, and I believe he could tempt SP and Loomis into being picked.

Not saying i wouldn't rather have an OL, or a DE/OLB, or a good strong physical corner. But i wouldn't be throwing my tv if we selected this guy, for sure.
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krewebrees


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 11:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I actually like the idea of a taking a running back. Some of our 2015 Free Agents: Pierre Thomas, Darren Sproles, Mark Ingram, Travaris Cadet. Not to mention 2 (Ingram and Cadet) have no business being one of our top two backs, and 2 (Sproles and Thomas) are getting old for a RB already, just wait two years.

DeAnthony Thomas is the guy I've been thinking of, to replace Sproles, but also we're really good at getting UDFA power backs Ivory, Robinson, Thomas(if you want to put him in this category). But we have other needs for a first round pick. If he's available in the second I'd take him no questions.
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Magnifico


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 1:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Didn't know where else to put this but might as well stick it here.

Do you guys think Armstead will be ready to play Tackle [be it right or left] next season? Admittedly we have no idea how good he'll be but if he can play one of the two positions suddenly O-Line isn't as big a need.

Although I still want a O-lineman in the first two rounds I still want a great pass rusher.
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whodatworm23


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 4:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most of us automatically think need in terms of the first round but while that isn't a bad thing, NFL franchise's don't see it like that for the most part. Filling needs is what free agency is for, even with limited cap space veteran players can be found in these flooded markets. Team's will always elect to go BPA especially in the 1st round, sometimes it works out to where the BPA is at a position of need and sometimes it doesn't but I for one understand that a prospect will not be selected simply due to the Saints need of the position he plays.

Since Sean Payton and Mickey Loomis have paired up, this is how I see they treat the draft...

Round 1
They select whom they feel is the top talent on the board that they feel fits there scheme regardless of position.

Round 2-3
Saints elect to go with boom or bust players with potential and high upsides.

Round 4-5
Here is where the Saints like to address needs or depth with highly productive college players.

Round 6-7
Saints typically target and take chances on small school prospects, trying to uncover gems.

As with all prospects, the Saints place a tremendous value on high character, work ethic and love of football. So it's not as easy as saying, well we need an OT or OLB and this is the best guy on the board. Remember the Vaccaro pick while Jarvis Jones was there? The Saints staff really does their homework and all the above player from what I have been able to find out have high characters. The Saints will more than likely be selecting at the back end of the 1st round and in that slot, many of the top talented players at positions of so called need will already be gone and the Saints are in no position to trade picks away to move up.

Therefore it comes down to talent level... Is the 4-5th best OT or 3-4th best OLB really a better player than the top HB? Are those guys better than maybe the 2nd best wide out on the board? These are the decisions the staff and scouting dept get paid the big bucks for... interesting to see how it all plays out.
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krewebrees


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 5:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Magnifico wrote:
Didn't know where else to put this but might as well stick it here.

Do you guys think Armstead will be ready to play Tackle [be it right or left] next season? Admittedly we have no idea how good he'll be but if he can play one of the two positions suddenly O-Line isn't as big a need.

Although I still want a O-lineman in the first two rounds I still want a great pass rusher.


Honestly I don't think it matters if he's ready or not he may be forced into the position. Brown, Strief, DeLaPuente, and Harris are all free agents this offseason. As tight to the cap as we are I don't see all of these guys resigning. He looked good in preseason, not great but he is a rookie. I think he'll be good enough to start.
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whodatworm23


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 7:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

krewebrees wrote:
Magnifico wrote:
Didn't know where else to put this but might as well stick it here.

Do you guys think Armstead will be ready to play Tackle [be it right or left] next season? Admittedly we have no idea how good he'll be but if he can play one of the two positions suddenly O-Line isn't as big a need.

Although I still want a O-lineman in the first two rounds I still want a great pass rusher.


Honestly I don't think it matters if he's ready or not he may be forced into the position. Brown, Strief, DeLaPuente, and Harris are all free agents this offseason. As tight to the cap as we are I don't see all of these guys resigning. He looked good in preseason, not great but he is a rookie. I think he'll be good enough to start.


To be honest, this is how I see our offensive line eventually shaking out...

Charles Brown is a "stop gap" player. NFL teams around the NFL are desperate these days for young veteran offensive lineman that they can plug and play. Especially now after seeing high picks like Eric FIsher and Luke Joeckel struggle as rookies. Brown won't get a big deal but any deal he gets this offseason will likely be more than what the Saints will be willing to pay for a player they deem injury prone and the fact that they feel they have a better option behind him.

In 2007 Jermon Bushrod was drafted in the 4th round out of Towson and due to injury was our starting LT by 2009. I see a similar outlook for Terron Armstead. In many ways Armstead is similar to Bushrod coming out of Towson... small school athletic run blocker with potential as a pass protector. I feel Armstead's development will be thrust into high gear like Bushrod's was to to nessesity. I feel Terron Armstead will be the Saints starting LT in 2014 and Charles Brown will be on another football team.

At guard, Evans and Grubbs isn't going anywhere. Even if the Saints wanted to make a move it woulf be counterproductive cost/cap wise. The back up guard spot could be addressed in the draft.

At center I see De La Puente resigning with the Saints... not that I agree with it, but that's what I see happening.

At right tackle Sean Payton seems to value Strief's ability to protect Brees in Pass Pro enough to overlook his inability to get any push whats so ever in the ground game. I expect Strief back in 2014 on a short term 2 year extention but I also expect the Saints to actively address the future of this position through the draft. The only way I see Strief not starting next season is if an offensive tackle prospect falls to the Saints in the 1st round that they never expected to. If not, look for Streif to once again be the starting RT with a rookie 3rd or 4th round prospect developing behind him much like Armstead did this season behind Brown. I also expect Bruce Harris back as he is a valuable flex left and right tackle reserve.
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jcvoodoo


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 31, 2013 5:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

whodatworm23 wrote:
krewebrees wrote:
Magnifico wrote:
Didn't know where else to put this but might as well stick it here.

Do you guys think Armstead will be ready to play Tackle [be it right or left] next season? Admittedly we have no idea how good he'll be but if he can play one of the two positions suddenly O-Line isn't as big a need.

Although I still want a O-lineman in the first two rounds I still want a great pass rusher.


Honestly I don't think it matters if he's ready or not he may be forced into the position. Brown, Strief, DeLaPuente, and Harris are all free agents this offseason. As tight to the cap as we are I don't see all of these guys resigning. He looked good in preseason, not great but he is a rookie. I think he'll be good enough to start.


To be honest, this is how I see our offensive line eventually shaking out...

Charles Brown is a "stop gap" player. NFL teams around the NFL are desperate these days for young veteran offensive lineman that they can plug and play. Especially now after seeing high picks like Eric FIsher and Luke Joeckel struggle as rookies. Brown won't get a big deal but any deal he gets this offseason will likely be more than what the Saints will be willing to pay for a player they deem injury prone and the fact that they feel they have a better option behind him.

In 2007 Jermon Bushrod was drafted in the 4th round out of Towson and due to injury was our starting LT by 2009. I see a similar outlook for Terron Armstead. In many ways Armstead is similar to Bushrod coming out of Towson... small school athletic run blocker with potential as a pass protector. I feel Armstead's development will be thrust into high gear like Bushrod's was to to nessesity. I feel Terron Armstead will be the Saints starting LT in 2014 and Charles Brown will be on another football team.

At guard, Evans and Grubbs isn't going anywhere. Even if the Saints wanted to make a move it woulf be counterproductive cost/cap wise. The back up guard spot could be addressed in the draft.

At center I see De La Puente resigning with the Saints... not that I agree with it, but that's what I see happening.

At right tackle Sean Payton seems to value Strief's ability to protect Brees in Pass Pro enough to overlook his inability to get any push whats so ever in the ground game. I expect Strief back in 2014 on a short term 2 year extention but I also expect the Saints to actively address the future of this position through the draft. The only way I see Strief not starting next season is if an offensive tackle prospect falls to the Saints in the 1st round that they never expected to. If not, look for Streif to once again be the starting RT with a rookie 3rd or 4th round prospect developing behind him much like Armstead did this season behind Brown. I also expect Bruce Harris back as he is a valuable flex left and right tackle reserve.


Where do you see guys like Lelito and Jones fitting in or going?
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unfsaint


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 31, 2013 12:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Richardson wouldn't surprise me. A LG to replace Grubbs is probablyour biggest team need...and Richardson would be a beast
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whodatworm23


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 31, 2013 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Where do you see guys like Lelito and Jones fitting in or going?


A lot is made of the fact that the Saints have so many UDRFA make the team, and while some are deserving we need to face facts and realize that another reason for it is because the Saints are so top heavy on the cap with few players coming in to the back end of back loaded deals that UDRFA are basically all we can afford on the bottom end of our roster.

That is where I see Lelito at... sure he could develop into a decent prospect but for now he's a very marginal player who won Payton over with his toughness and fight much like Brian De La Puente did a few years back. Marcel Jones is a player I feel can eventually take over the backup right tackle gig once Strief is not retained, while Bryce Harris flips over to back up the left side.
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