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Aaron Rodgers Severely Underrated Late in Games - Here's Why
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fortdetroit


Joined: 27 Dec 2011
Posts: 1513
PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 11:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also, incognito I don't necessarily think it's a bad thing. It's a risk reward thing with Rodgers and their offense. They risk more sacks but get rewarded with longer time for their receivers to get open which results in a ton of huge passing plays for that offense.

If you look at a lot of the most "mobile qbs" in the NFL it's the same thing. Instead of throwing the ball away or throwing to the hot they are more likely to run around and keep the play alive. That leads to more sacks but in the end it also leads to more chunk pass plays for the offense.

Like I said, don't think it's necessarily a bad thing....it's just a different style of play.
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incognito_man


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 11:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

what's the rank on Time To Sack?
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FourThreeMafia


Joined: 28 Sep 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 11:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pugger wrote:
CornOnDaCobb wrote:
KingofSTATS wrote:
isnt rodgers 6-24 or something in close games decided in the 4th? lol sorry at some point QB deserves alot of the blame. Also Rodgers is NOT the consesus best QB, this isnt 2011 anymore. In this league you cant live off what you did rather what you are doing and this year Rodgers aint even top 5.


Are you trolling?


Usually.


He only shows up to run his mouth and slurp on Rivers when his team is doing well. Huge fairweather fan.
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TheChosen186


Joined: 07 Sep 2013
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 11:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This free PFF article is probably going to be helpful when talking about Rodgers sack issue.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/11/07/signature-stat-snapshot-time-to-throw/

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/11/07/signature-stat-snapshot-time-to-throw/2/
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Last edited by TheChosen186 on Sat Oct 05, 2013 11:26 pm; edited 1 time in total
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KingofSTATS


Joined: 29 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 11:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CornOnDaCobb wrote:
KingofSTATS wrote:
isnt rodgers 6-24 or something in close games decided in the 4th? lol sorry at some point QB deserves alot of the blame. Also Rodgers is NOT the consesus best QB, this isnt 2011 anymore. In this league you cant live off what you did rather what you are doing and this year Rodgers aint even top 5.


Are you trolling?


top 5 was a bit much, this year he's not top 3. Peyton, Rivers and Romo have been better and maybe Brees.

if its not just about this year, the. id say Rodgers is definitely top 3. Top 4 at worst.
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Pugger


Joined: 01 May 2010
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 11:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fortdetroit wrote:
incognito_man wrote:
fortdetroit wrote:
To think a ton of the sacks aren't on Rodgers is ridiculous.


proof?


Watch the games? He consistently looks for the big play. That requires holding the ball longer. O-linemen can't hold their blocks forever.

2012: 5th longest average time to throw
2011: 3rd longest average time to throw

Packers fans are seriously insecure on here. Just because he is arguably the best QB in the NFL doesn't mean he can't have weaknesses in his game or areas of deficiency compared to other QBs.

He may have a poor oline but holding the ball longer (relative to most QBs) doesn't do them any favors.


Of course he has weaknesses - just like every other player in the league. He does hold the ball too long and doesn't take the underneath stuff and it drives me crazy. I hold my breath every time he gets hit. But if these are the worst thing he does I'll take that all day long and twice on Sundays. I don't get all excited if some folks think he isn't the best QB in the game. All I know is I wouldn't trade him for ANY OTHER QB including Brady, Brees and Manning. Those 3 great QBs are nearer to the end of their careers than AR.
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KingofSTATS


Joined: 29 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 11:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

FourThreeMafia wrote:
Pugger wrote:
CornOnDaCobb wrote:
KingofSTATS wrote:
isnt rodgers 6-24 or something in close games decided in the 4th? lol sorry at some point QB deserves alot of the blame. Also Rodgers is NOT the consesus best QB, this isnt 2011 anymore. In this league you cant live off what you did rather what you are doing and this year Rodgers aint even top 5.


Are you trolling?


Usually.


He only shows up to run his mouth and slurp on Rivers when his team is doing well. Huge fairweather fan.


yeah cause i wasnt here in 2011, troll.
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fortdetroit


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 11:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

incognito_man wrote:
what's the rank on Time To Sack?


2012: 8th longest time to sack
2011: 13th longest time to sack
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Ambrose


Joined: 04 Sep 2013
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 11:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KingofSTATS wrote:
CornOnDaCobb wrote:
KingofSTATS wrote:
isnt rodgers 6-24 or something in close games decided in the 4th? lol sorry at some point QB deserves alot of the blame. Also Rodgers is NOT the consesus best QB, this isnt 2011 anymore. In this league you cant live off what you did rather what you are doing and this year Rodgers aint even top 5.


Are you trolling?


top 5 was a bit much, this year he's not top 3. Peyton, Rivers and Romo have been better and maybe Brees.

if its not just about this year, the. id say Rodgers is definitely top 3. Top 4 at worst.


Nope. Not to mention it took Rodgers worst game in like 3 years just to get him down to a QB rating of 105.1 (3rd in the NFL). Only Rivers and Manning have outplayed him this year. One of those will soon change. Only Manning has an argument as to who is better overall right now. Brady was worse last year and has been outplayed even further this year.

For the record, Rodgers is missing his left tackle, has had all three active RB's on his roster hurt, missed his starting TE for a half and both of his top 2 WR's are dealing with/recovering from injury.
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fortdetroit


Joined: 27 Dec 2011
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 11:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Found this good article based on 2012 season:

Who’s to Blame for Aaron Rodgers’ Record High Sacks?

SUSPECT #2: Aaron Rodgers, the Quarterback

A common criticism of our beloved quarterback throughout the years has been his propensity to hold on to the ball in trying to extend plays. Whether he ends up scrambling for a first down or hitting a receiver on an improvised route, there have been numerous times where Aaron Rodgers’ has saved failing plays. Yet we are ever so reluctant to take the bad with the good.

Kevin Seifert over at the ESPN NFC North Blog recently shared some statistics about the division quarterbacks and their “time in pocket.” (This was actually the impetus for my blog post.) According to ESPN Stats and Information, Rodgers spent an average of 2.82 second in the pocket, which was longer than 34 other quarterbacks. He also had the highest sack rate per drop-back in the NFC North.



Really, this is some fairly damning evidence. It doesn’t take into account plays made outside of the pocket or even the average sack speed, but it does clearly show that Aaron Rodgers took longer to throw the ball than most quarterbacks in 2012.

The major counterpoint is that Rodgers more than makes up for this with the successful extended plays and that he balances out the productivity with fewer interceptions from forced throws. Rodgers is, after all, the only quarterback in NFL history to have been sacked 50+ times in two separate seasons while still maintaining a 100+ passer rating in each. Still, we’re not talking about productivity, we’re talking about sacks, and we want to know whom to blame.

http://jerseyal.com/GBP/2013/05/20/whos-to-blame-for-aaron-rodgers-record-high-sacks/
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Revel8


Joined: 14 Aug 2013
Posts: 451
PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 11:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fortdetroit wrote:
To think a ton of the sacks aren't on Rodgers is ridiculous. He loves the big play and looking for the big play so consistently is inherently going to lead to standing in the pocket longer and hence more sacks.

It's not necessarily a bad thing...the reward of the big plays is definitely worth the higher risk of a sack as the Packers always have a good offense. Sacks are just as much on the oline as they are on the type of scheme and the QB...that applies to every team in the NFL.



So then it seems you're calling Troy Aikman's analysis in the 2009 season ridiculous? It's not like Rodgers got any worse from that point in time...

I haven't analyzed the fault of every single sack like Aikman, but to think that most the sacks aren't on the blocking and playcalling is the product of not paying attention.

McCarthy is typically calling deep routes, even when the Oline can't sustain them. Packers fans have been complaining about this for a while now. Even when both OTs went down with injury, McCarthy still called the same deep routes. I can understand their frustration.

I remember one point a couple seasons ago the announcers said the Packers offense had around 20% more deep play calls than any other team in the league. Deep routes take longer to develop than dinking and dunking. You're naturally going to seem to hold onto the ball longer when you're throwing so many deep passes.
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Revel8


Joined: 14 Aug 2013
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 11:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KingofSTATS wrote:
Revel8 wrote:
KingofSTATS wrote:
Revel8 wrote:
KingofSTATS wrote:
isnt rodgers 6-24 or something in close games decided in the 4th? lol sorry at some point QB deserves alot of the blame. Also Rodgers is NOT the consesus best QB, this isnt 2011 anymore. In this league you cant live off what you did rather what you are doing and this year Rodgers aint even top 5.


The above post demonstrates every single close loss and also unequivocally proves you wrong.

As was mentioned previously:

"Rodgers actually deserves credit for his team losing close games. He's the one that's keeping them in games in the first place. That's why when the Packers do lose, they typically lose by a slim margin, 1 score or less."


Thats such a cope out. 6-24 is 6-24, if it was like 6-10 i could see defenses choking late game leads or kickers missing, trust me my team has had a ton of them. but 6-24 is pretty iron clad to denote the qb is coming up short in some capacity. Especially if its a reoccurig event, GB's coaches must be completely oblivious or Rodgers must be, to their "defenses" woes. So deflecting all blame from Rodgers to anyone else is typical, 6-24; sorry but Rodgers deserves alot of that blame.


What you're saying is the cop out. Otherwise wins and losses would be solely the responsibility of the QB. This of course isn't the case; thereby proving the fundamental flaw in your argument.

As was mentioned previously, I posted a link to every single close game with Rodgers at the helm. Now someone who has watched nearly every single Green Bay game at least twice shouldn't need this, but it seems you do:


Aaron Rodgers: Un-clutch?

Quote:


There was an article written for ESPN Insider this week following the Packers ugly loss at Cincinnati that asserted that Aaron Rodgers was not a clutch player.

The article cited a 5-24 record when Rodgers has had the ball in the fourth quarter in games where his team was down 1-8 points.

....

Of the 24 games, seven times Rodgers gave his team the lead, only to see the defense cough it up. Four times, Mason Crosby has missed winning field goals. Twice, he has scored on do-or-die plays only to see the team fail him.

Also, this counts the Fail Mary game.

Let's take a look at those 24 losses in further depth, shall we?

....


http://www.beloitdailynews.com/sports/blog/aaron-rodgers-un-clutch/article_5b679792-25ef-11e3-9de3-0019bb2963f4.html



again doesnt matter, it still falls on the qb, they could always do more to secure the win. Even if and its a big if we completely deflect blame from the 11 games mentioned above, thats still 13 which cant use the same formula of excuses.


My qb has lost 8 games in the final 30 seconds when having a lead in the 4th and i still blame him and the defense, both take blame. Offense could of converted 3rd downs got another 1st down, could of ran the clock out more. There is always more a qb can do to secure late close game wins.


I think you've established that you're going to believe nothing less than QBs being the sole reason for every win and loss a team ever has.

Not sure if you're not mentally able to enough to understand how flawed that is or what, but whatever. Believe that QBs win games and teams dont if you'd like. Believe whatever you want. Hasn't stopped you before.
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TheChosen186


Joined: 07 Sep 2013
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 06, 2013 12:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Revel8 wrote:
So then it seems you're calling Troy Aikman's analysis in the 2009 season ridiculous? It's not like Rodgers got any worse from that point in time...

I haven't analyzed the fault of every single sack like Aikman, but to think that most the sacks aren't on the blocking and playcalling is the product of not paying attention.

Steve Young in that very same season said even if his o-line was weak, he could still avoid sacks. He used an example saying that his o-line was weak in the 49ers at some point but he just got rid of it quicker.

To act like Rodgers is 100% innocent here and does nothing wrong is ludicrous.
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Revel8


Joined: 14 Aug 2013
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 06, 2013 12:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TheChosen186 wrote:
Revel8 wrote:
So then it seems you're calling Troy Aikman's analysis in the 2009 season ridiculous? It's not like Rodgers got any worse from that point in time...

I haven't analyzed the fault of every single sack like Aikman, but to think that most the sacks aren't on the blocking and playcalling is the product of not paying attention.

Steve Young in that very same season said even if his o-line was weak, he could still avoid sacks. He used an example saying that his o-line was weak in the 49ers at some point but he just got rid of it quicker.

To act like Rodgers is 100% innocent here and does nothing wrong is ludicrous.


Well I agree. Did I not point out that Aikman said Rodgers was at* fault a few times in the 2009 season? Nobody is perfect, but Rodgers is just about as close as it gets.
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KingofSTATS


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 06, 2013 12:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Revel8 wrote:
TheChosen186 wrote:
Revel8 wrote:
So then it seems you're calling Troy Aikman's analysis in the 2009 season ridiculous? It's not like Rodgers got any worse from that point in time...

I haven't analyzed the fault of every single sack like Aikman, but to think that most the sacks aren't on the blocking and playcalling is the product of not paying attention.

Steve Young in that very same season said even if his o-line was weak, he could still avoid sacks. He used an example saying that his o-line was weak in the 49ers at some point but he just got rid of it quicker.

To act like Rodgers is 100% innocent here and does nothing wrong is ludicrous.


Well I agree. Did I not point out that Aikman said Rodgers was at* fault a few times in the 2009 season? Nobody is perfect, but Rodgers is just about as close as it gets.



And thats how Rodgers is most overrated in sports. No, he's not close to perfect.
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