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SoS


Joined: 20 Apr 2013
Posts: 3762
Location: Sleepless in Seattle
PostPosted: Sat Sep 28, 2013 10:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Meeker wrote:
SoS wrote:
Meeker wrote:
SoS wrote:
Meeker wrote:
imani wrote:
I don't think turbin fitz here TBH. He's a good RB, but he's slow to the hole, has poor footwork and I can't remember the last time i saw him break a tackle


But he is our best 3rd down RB, going no where until Michael figures out his blocking. He is on a 4th round rookie deal, no reason to trade him.


Yea, that's why I said I really don't think it's feasible.

However, playing devil's advocate, Turbin's value likely won't get any higher than it is right now.


Problem is, a good 3rd down back is worth at least that value.


I would tend to agree, but with the way this team drafts in the middle rounds, they may value that pick higher than a good 3rd down back. Spencer Ware could be groomed as the 3rd down back.


Ware wouldn't be bad, but I'd rather have someone with more speed.


Speed.......and Turbin? Laughing
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Pie Romania


Joined: 23 Aug 2012
Posts: 1828
Location: Seattle, WA
PostPosted: Sat Sep 28, 2013 11:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SoS wrote:
Meeker wrote:
SoS wrote:
Meeker wrote:
SoS wrote:
Meeker wrote:
imani wrote:
I don't think turbin fitz here TBH. He's a good RB, but he's slow to the hole, has poor footwork and I can't remember the last time i saw him break a tackle


But he is our best 3rd down RB, going no where until Michael figures out his blocking. He is on a 4th round rookie deal, no reason to trade him.


Yea, that's why I said I really don't think it's feasible.

However, playing devil's advocate, Turbin's value likely won't get any higher than it is right now.


Problem is, a good 3rd down back is worth at least that value.


I would tend to agree, but with the way this team drafts in the middle rounds, they may value that pick higher than a good 3rd down back. Spencer Ware could be groomed as the 3rd down back.


Ware wouldn't be bad, but I'd rather have someone with more speed.


Speed.......and Turbin? Laughing


I'd say Turbin has the best top end speed of anyone on our roster @ the RB/FB positions IMO. Michael has the most burst/acceleration and agility and Lynch is the bruiser. Didn't Turbin run in the 4.4's? Without pads is obviously different, but that speed translates from what I have seen. His biggest problem is those chicken legs and a gust of wind taking him to the ground. I think on a couple plays one of the D-Linemen farted and Turbin got knocked off his feet and flew forward for a couple yards.

If Red continues to look good this year, I hope he's willing to restructure. Sidney's contract will make it impossible to trade him IMO unless we accept a 6th or 7th. If he restructures, then it might be a different story? *shrugs* I have no idea though, lol.
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imani


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Location: Harlem, NY
PostPosted: Sun Sep 29, 2013 2:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pie Romania wrote:
SoS wrote:
Meeker wrote:
SoS wrote:
Meeker wrote:
SoS wrote:
Meeker wrote:
imani wrote:
I don't think turbin fitz here TBH. He's a good RB, but he's slow to the hole, has poor footwork and I can't remember the last time i saw him break a tackle


But he is our best 3rd down RB, going no where until Michael figures out his blocking. He is on a 4th round rookie deal, no reason to trade him.


Yea, that's why I said I really don't think it's feasible.

However, playing devil's advocate, Turbin's value likely won't get any higher than it is right now.


Problem is, a good 3rd down back is worth at least that value.


I would tend to agree, but with the way this team drafts in the middle rounds, they may value that pick higher than a good 3rd down back. Spencer Ware could be groomed as the 3rd down back.


Ware wouldn't be bad, but I'd rather have someone with more speed.


Speed.......and Turbin? Laughing


I'd say Turbin has the best top end speed of anyone on our roster @ the RB/FB positions IMO. Michael has the most burst/acceleration and agility and Lynch is the bruiser. Didn't Turbin run in the 4.4's? Without pads is obviously different, but that speed translates from what I have seen. His biggest problem is those chicken legs and a gust of wind taking him to the ground. I think on a couple plays one of the D-Linemen farted and Turbin got knocked off his feet and flew forward for a couple yards.

If Red continues to look good this year, I hope he's willing to restructure. Sidney's contract will make it impossible to trade him IMO unless we accept a 6th or 7th. If he restructures, then it might be a different story? *shrugs* I have no idea though, lol.


I'd restructure him and trade him to the pats for a 3rd-4th
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Tatupu_64


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 29, 2013 9:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SoS wrote:
Meeker wrote:
SoS wrote:
Meeker wrote:
SoS wrote:
Meeker wrote:
imani wrote:
I don't think turbin fitz here TBH. He's a good RB, but he's slow to the hole, has poor footwork and I can't remember the last time i saw him break a tackle


But he is our best 3rd down RB, going no where until Michael figures out his blocking. He is on a 4th round rookie deal, no reason to trade him.


Yea, that's why I said I really don't think it's feasible.

However, playing devil's advocate, Turbin's value likely won't get any higher than it is right now.


Problem is, a good 3rd down back is worth at least that value.


I would tend to agree, but with the way this team drafts in the middle rounds, they may value that pick higher than a good 3rd down back. Spencer Ware could be groomed as the 3rd down back.


Ware wouldn't be bad, but I'd rather have someone with more speed.


Speed.......and Turbin? Laughing
Turbin is definitely faster than Ware. I too think he's the fastest back on the team in terms of top end speed. However, he doesn't start very quickly, where as Michael is at top speed in no time.
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Tooki


Joined: 28 Apr 2009
Posts: 10744
PostPosted: Sun Sep 29, 2013 10:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tatupu_64 wrote:
SoS wrote:
Meeker wrote:
SoS wrote:
Meeker wrote:
SoS wrote:
Meeker wrote:
imani wrote:
I don't think turbin fitz here TBH. He's a good RB, but he's slow to the hole, has poor footwork and I can't remember the last time i saw him break a tackle


But he is our best 3rd down RB, going no where until Michael figures out his blocking. He is on a 4th round rookie deal, no reason to trade him.


Yea, that's why I said I really don't think it's feasible.

However, playing devil's advocate, Turbin's value likely won't get any higher than it is right now.


Problem is, a good 3rd down back is worth at least that value.


I would tend to agree, but with the way this team drafts in the middle rounds, they may value that pick higher than a good 3rd down back. Spencer Ware could be groomed as the 3rd down back.


Ware wouldn't be bad, but I'd rather have someone with more speed.


Speed.......and Turbin? Laughing
Turbin is definitely faster than Ware. I too think he's the fastest back on the team in terms of top end speed. However, he doesn't start very quickly, where as Michael is at top speed in no time.


I agree. Michael accelerates very quickly, but Turbin doesn't do so because he is so bulky and he has minimal agility.
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NFL_Announcer


Joined: 31 Mar 2010
Posts: 694
PostPosted: Sun Sep 29, 2013 11:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Would not trade Breno unless we get a great replacement for him (like Albert which is frankly too expensive of an option). Breno brings some flags and technical faults, but he also brings pure power and a mean streak. You gotta have a nasty O-Lineman that roughs it up and gets in defenders heads...

IMO Seattle's O-Line ranks as follows:

1) Okung
2) Unger
3) Giac
4-5) Whoever is playing guard

I don't get the hate on Giac. Yes he gets beat by technical edge rushers but he's a mammoth in the run game and he forces defenders to do stupid things. He's also CHEAP.

It's the one player I disagree on in terms of releasing/trading with most Seahawks fans.
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sirensong


Joined: 13 Mar 2007
Posts: 1152
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 29, 2013 11:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NFL_Announcer wrote:
Would not trade Breno unless we get a great replacement for him (like Albert which is frankly too expensive of an option). Breno brings some flags and technical faults, but he also brings pure power and a mean streak. You gotta have a nasty O-Lineman that roughs it up and gets in defenders heads...

IMO Seattle's O-Line ranks as follows:

1) Okung
2) Unger
3) Giac
4-5) Whoever is playing guard

I don't get the hate on Giac. Yes he gets beat by technical edge rushers but he's a mammoth in the run game and he forces defenders to do stupid things. He's also CHEAP.

It's the one player I disagree on in terms of releasing/trading with most Seahawks fans.


3.5mill isnt exactly cheap.... Sure hes not a huge contract but hes overpaid...

Hes a good run blocker, lets not overrate that. Good not great. Hes a below average pass protector.

I dont think anyone is calling for him to be released, he is the best option we have and hes not the weak link on that line.

But like I've said before on a contending team he should be your weak link, not your 3rd best guy.

The OL is not good enough when completely healthy, and now its just laughable.

Also have been completely unimpressed with Carp this year, Ive seen him get bullied and run over. Hes not a starting caliber guard.

And of course Sweezy... Oh Sweezy.... Ill be nice and just say that hes PS material and nothing else.
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NFL_Announcer


Joined: 31 Mar 2010
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 29, 2013 11:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sirensong wrote:
NFL_Announcer wrote:
Would not trade Breno unless we get a great replacement for him (like Albert which is frankly too expensive of an option). Breno brings some flags and technical faults, but he also brings pure power and a mean streak. You gotta have a nasty O-Lineman that roughs it up and gets in defenders heads...

IMO Seattle's O-Line ranks as follows:

1) Okung
2) Unger
3) Giac
4-5) Whoever is playing guard

I don't get the hate on Giac. Yes he gets beat by technical edge rushers but he's a mammoth in the run game and he forces defenders to do stupid things. He's also CHEAP.

It's the one player I disagree on in terms of releasing/trading with most Seahawks fans.


3.5mill isnt exactly cheap.... Sure hes not a huge contract but hes overpaid...

Hes a good run blocker, lets not overrate that. Good not great. Hes a below average pass protector.

I dont think anyone is calling for him to be released, he is the best option we have and hes not the weak link on that line.

But like I've said before on a contending team he should be your weak link, not your 3rd best guy.

The OL is not good enough when completely healthy, and now its just laughable.

Also have been completely unimpressed with Carp this year, Ive seen him get bullied and run over. Hes not a starting caliber guard.

And of course Sweezy... Oh Sweezy.... Ill be nice and just say that hes PS material and nothing else.


I can get behind everything you posted Siren. I just don't think Giac is trade material at the moment. We have the money to hang onto him this year and let's do just that. If we're putting anyone on the trade block I'd like to see:

a) Turbin (he's done here... get Michael the reps, that's great Turbin can receive but whatever... not that big of a part of our game. He's no Sproles)

b) Maxwell (he's been torched a few times this year and does not have the physicality imo we are looking for. All depends on price we can get. CBs always seem to demand higher picks than normal. Passing league... supply vs. demand)

c) Carpenter (fat/slow/not much push consider that is his strength. I always considered this pick to be a bust... and it's showing on the field. Needs to happen after we get some players back though).

That's about it. Rest of the players I'd like to keep. But the above 3 are getting their name called as they hurt production on the team.
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imani


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 3:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SoS and I had a brief discussion on rice's trade value.

What do you guys thing we can get for Sidney? Is he even worth trading?
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Pie Romania


Joined: 23 Aug 2012
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 3:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

imani wrote:
SoS and I had a brief discussion on rice's trade value.

What do you guys thing we can get for Sidney? Is he even worth trading?


If he restructures to a realistic deal based on what he's done on the field lately, we might be able to get an early 4th out of him. MAYBE. If someone's desperate, potentially a late 3rd, but I don't see that happening.

As it stands now, with the contract he has, late 6th or 7th.
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Tooki


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I see a 5th or 6th at best for Sidney. He's clearly not 100% and he will never be as good as he was in 2009 IMO.

He's not worth trading until Percy is back and he looks healthy.
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canucks9314


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 4:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

imani wrote:
SoS and I had a brief discussion on rice's trade value.

What do you guys thing we can get for Sidney? Is he even worth trading?


Value is probably a 6th. Rather keep him and release/restructure next year. He does add an element to our receiving corps that the others don't. All of our other receivers are too similar.
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imani


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 5:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

canucks9314 wrote:
imani wrote:
SoS and I had a brief discussion on rice's trade value.

What do you guys thing we can get for Sidney? Is he even worth trading?


Value is probably a 6th. Rather keep him and release/restructure next year. He does add an element to our receiving corps that the others don't. All of our other receivers are too similar.


really? I would say height is the only similarity between the 4

Baldwin-Possession WR with great hands, great IQ, and good Route running
Tate-Playmaking WR with great YAC ability, above average hands, high vertical and solid speed
Kearse-Deep threat with solid speed and hands
Harvin-Pure playmaker with Elite Speed, Elite YAC ability, average hands, below average route running
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Tatupu_64


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 7:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

imani wrote:
canucks9314 wrote:
imani wrote:
SoS and I had a brief discussion on rice's trade value.

What do you guys thing we can get for Sidney? Is he even worth trading?


Value is probably a 6th. Rather keep him and release/restructure next year. He does add an element to our receiving corps that the others don't. All of our other receivers are too similar.


really? I would say height is the only similarity between the 4

Baldwin-Possession WR with great hands, great IQ, and good Route running
Tate-Playmaking WR with great YAC ability, above average hands, high vertical and solid speed
Kearse-Deep threat with solid speed and hands
Harvin-Pure playmaker with Elite Speed, Elite YAC ability, average hands, below average route running
Let's put it this way.

None of them are the big bodied possession receiver Rice is and even though Rice has sucked, none of them have the size to get that ball Rice tip-toed in on Sunday either.

With all that said, I'd want Rice to be playing at somewhere around 2.5M a year with how he's playing.
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imani


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 9:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tatupu_64 wrote:
imani wrote:
canucks9314 wrote:
imani wrote:
SoS and I had a brief discussion on rice's trade value.

What do you guys thing we can get for Sidney? Is he even worth trading?


Value is probably a 6th. Rather keep him and release/restructure next year. He does add an element to our receiving corps that the others don't. All of our other receivers are too similar.


really? I would say height is the only similarity between the 4

Baldwin-Possession WR with great hands, great IQ, and good Route running
Tate-Playmaking WR with great YAC ability, above average hands, high vertical and solid speed
Kearse-Deep threat with solid speed and hands
Harvin-Pure playmaker with Elite Speed, Elite YAC ability, average hands, below average route running
Let's put it this way.

None of them are the big bodied possession receiver Rice is and even though Rice has sucked, none of them have the size to get that ball Rice tip-toed in on Sunday either.

With all that said, I'd want Rice to be playing at somewhere around 2.5M a year with how he's playing.


Obviously, but as you said, that can be had for much less. We've gone without a big possession receiver for over a decade in seattle (unless you want to count Williams or Jurevicious), it's not a huge need in a west coast offense.
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