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Hakeem Nicks (almost) a Lion?
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MurfDLions


Joined: 28 Feb 2007
Posts: 789
Location: Jersey
PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 11:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The fact of the matter is that none of know what Nicks is worth to both the GMen and the Lions. My guess would be he is worth more to us than the GMen. That doesn't mean we will get him for nothing but I think a fair value would be:

Nicks for Leshoure and a conditional 2nd/3rd round pick based on playing time/impact.

At this point, I am pretty sure this is just a rumor; however, another game like at Carolina, and I don't see this as unrealistic. The fact he is a FA to be says a lot. Leshoure would provide a good compliment to Wilson in the backfield and I wouldn't be surprised if the Giants want to get back to smash mouth football considering the struggles on offense. The defense hasn't been terrible but when you are on the field after every three and out it wears on the D.

Fact is, Leshoure has good value to the Giants and Nicks has good value to the Lions. If the GMen lose this weekend don't be surprised if a trade like this goes down.
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IR0NM1KE


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 11:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

FootballPhreak wrote:
Good! So read the bolded which applies to "savvy" FO's Wink


Not good. Great. Cool

At 25, Nicks' best football is still ahead of him. He has a similar skill set to a young Anquan Boldin. He would be a great compliment to Calvin Johnson. There is a reason why everyone in your forum was excited about this fraudulent story. You don't just get that caliber of player for a pedestrian RB and a 3rd rounder. Perhaps we place a higher value on him than you guys, but that is because we have got to see him at his best and know how crucial he is to our team. And perhaps you are undervaluing him because it would be great to 'steal' a player like this for what amounts to player that serves no purpose to your team (Leshoure) and a complete unknown in the form of a 3rd rounder.

No hard feelings. Wink
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IR0NM1KE


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 11:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MurfDLions wrote:
The fact of the matter is that none of know what Nicks is worth to both the GMen and the Lions. My guess would be he is worth more to us than the GMen. That doesn't mean we will get him for nothing but I think a fair value would be:

Nicks for Leshoure and a conditional 2nd/3rd round pick based on playing time/impact.

At this point, I am pretty sure this is just a rumor; however, another game like at Carolina, and I don't see this as unrealistic. The fact he is a FA to be says a lot. Leshoure would provide a good compliment to Wilson in the backfield and I wouldn't be surprised if the Giants want to get back to smash mouth football considering the struggles on offense. The defense hasn't been terrible but when you are on the field after every three and out it wears on the D.

Fact is, Leshoure has good value to the Giants and Nicks has good value to the Lions. If the GMen lose this weekend don't be surprised if a trade like this goes down.


The issue with our offense is our OL. We can't run block, and we can't pass block long enough to get our WRs down field. I don't care who we have running the ball, it won't be pretty until we resolve that issue. AP would have a tough time behind this mess of a line, so why would Leshoure be useful to us? RBs like him are a dime a dozen.
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ThugCityGrunt


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

IR0NM1KE wrote:
FootballPhreak wrote:
IR0NM1KE wrote:
While a trade is unlikely, acquiring Hakeem Nicks for scraps is impossible. You guys will have to be willing to part with your 1st round pick in 2014 and probably another early pick in 2015. Hate to burst any bubbles, but you don't get something for nothing. Regarless of what highly accredited sources like Mike Ortiz say. Laughing We are clearing up cap space after this season and can pay Nicks if we want to do so. The Giant's front office is very savvy, they won't let a player of his ability go without proper compensation.

A player with Nicks injury history is not going to garner a 1rd much less a 1rd+. Like it or don't, a 2rd or 3rd plus player(s) is not scraps. If the NYG FO was nearly as savvy as you seem to believe, their record over the past few years would be much better overall than it has been. A savvy FO would take what they could get for a player that has a history of not being on the field and has lost his importance to the point of receiving 0 targets last week. Unless he can find a way to remain on the field for once in his career, Nicks value will never be higher than it is right now and a savvy FO would know that. And that value does not include 1rd compensation.

Hate to burst your bubble.


A front office that has helped field 2 Super Bowl Championship teams since 2007 sounds pretty savvy to me. Or is that not up to your standards in Detroit?


Clearly the Lions are a "Super Bowl or bust" type of franchise. Don't be silly.
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FootballPhreak


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 11:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

IR0NM1KE wrote:
FootballPhreak wrote:
Good! So read the bolded which applies to "savvy" FO's Wink


Not good. Great. Cool

At 25, Nicks' best football is still ahead of him. He has a similar skill set to a young Anquan Boldin. He would be a great compliment to Calvin Johnson. There is a reason why everyone in your forum was excited about this fraudulent story. You don't just get that caliber of player for a pedestrian RB and a 3rd rounder. Perhaps we place a higher value on him than you guys, but that is because we have got to see him at his best and know how crucial he is to our team. And perhaps you are undervaluing him because it would be great to 'steal' a player like this for what amounts to player that serves no purpose to your team (Leshoure) and a complete unknown in the form of a 3rd rounder.

No hard feelings. Wink

Never hard feelings brother. Why take life serious, won't get out alive anyhow Wink

Naw, just looking at it from a historical perspective. Usually injury histories place a marked devalue on players. And the value you are speaking is nearly what I would expect out of a player Calvin Johnson's caliber. Of which I think we can both agree Nicks is not. Certainly without the injury history I would expect him to garner a 1rd. But that is not the case. Of course there are always outliers. Roy Williams being one such case, but really his career up to the point of the trade was comparable to Nicks and everyone including Lions fans thought the Boys paid far too much at the time.(even moreso looking back).

And the truth is a conditional 3rd, for all we know could go up to a 1rd with an all pro season. Not to mention the article said directly they were unsure of the compensation. Add in players(the one mentioned was a 2rd pick not long ago and younger than Nicks.) and I don't think the value is actually far from what you are thinking.

Also, while I think the article is wrong, the site does not strike me as a completely irresponsible one. While the trade may not have happened, I do believe wholeheartedly that something leaked out in order for this to be reported. I would nearly bet that there are at least talks between the 2 parties right now. Mayhew is known for looking into all possibilities as well, so even before this article I would have bet on him having been on the horn to at least inquire. Whether anything ever comes of it could be an entirely different story, but I bet the talks are there.
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Rockcity


Joined: 06 Jan 2013
Posts: 1241
PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 11:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

IR0NM1KE wrote:
MurfDLions wrote:
The fact of the matter is that none of know what Nicks is worth to both the GMen and the Lions. My guess would be he is worth more to us than the GMen. That doesn't mean we will get him for nothing but I think a fair value would be:

Nicks for Leshoure and a conditional 2nd/3rd round pick based on playing time/impact.

At this point, I am pretty sure this is just a rumor; however, another game like at Carolina, and I don't see this as unrealistic. The fact he is a FA to be says a lot. Leshoure would provide a good compliment to Wilson in the backfield and I wouldn't be surprised if the Giants want to get back to smash mouth football considering the struggles on offense. The defense hasn't been terrible but when you are on the field after every three and out it wears on the D.

Fact is, Leshoure has good value to the Giants and Nicks has good value to the Lions. If the GMen lose this weekend don't be surprised if a trade like this goes down.


The issue with our offense is our OL. We can't run block, and we can't pass block long enough to get our WRs down field. I don't care who we have running the ball, it won't be pretty until we resolve that issue. AP would have a tough time behind this mess of a line, so why would Leshoure be useful to us? RBs like him are a dime a dozen.
he's about on par with the running backs you guys got. I'd love to give yall ravioli lol. Wouldn't you rather get something than nothing? You think u guys can turn it around great. If you wanna have a crap ton of paid load at wr great whatever. I see nicks being a fa next year regaurdless. Imo your team has a lot of needs a wr ain't one.
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IR0NM1KE


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 12:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rockcity wrote:
IR0NM1KE wrote:
MurfDLions wrote:
The fact of the matter is that none of know what Nicks is worth to both the GMen and the Lions. My guess would be he is worth more to us than the GMen. That doesn't mean we will get him for nothing but I think a fair value would be:

Nicks for Leshoure and a conditional 2nd/3rd round pick based on playing time/impact.

At this point, I am pretty sure this is just a rumor; however, another game like at Carolina, and I don't see this as unrealistic. The fact he is a FA to be says a lot. Leshoure would provide a good compliment to Wilson in the backfield and I wouldn't be surprised if the Giants want to get back to smash mouth football considering the struggles on offense. The defense hasn't been terrible but when you are on the field after every three and out it wears on the D.

Fact is, Leshoure has good value to the Giants and Nicks has good value to the Lions. If the GMen lose this weekend don't be surprised if a trade like this goes down.


The issue with our offense is our OL. We can't run block, and we can't pass block long enough to get our WRs down field. I don't care who we have running the ball, it won't be pretty until we resolve that issue. AP would have a tough time behind this mess of a line, so why would Leshoure be useful to us? RBs like him are a dime a dozen.
he's about on par with the running backs you guys got. I'd love to give yall ravioli lol. Wouldn't you rather get something than nothing? You think u guys can turn it around great. If you wanna have a crap ton of paid load at wr great whatever. I see nicks being a fa next year regaurdless. Imo your team has a lot of needs a wr ain't one.


I have to disagree. We all love Cruz, but without a player like Nicks outside he is not nearly as effective. He is great in the slot, possibly the best in the game. However, he works off of Nicks. Not the other way around. Randle shows promise, but is still unproven. We can't just assume he is going to be a legit #1/outside receiver. We do have a lot of needs. Basically a completely new offensive line and all new LBs. If we are looking to trade it will be with a team that can satisfy those needs. Look at the LBs we run out on Sunday. It is an utter joke. As is our OL. If they don't shape up soon, Eli's active games streak may come to an ugly end.
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sparty


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 12:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

All of you Giants fans realize Nicks is not coming back to NY next year, right? Nor would he resign with the lions, given the money tied up by stafford/Calvin already. Leshoure and a 3rd for a 13 game rental is hardly a steal for Detroit.
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IR0NM1KE


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 1:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sparty wrote:
All of you Giants fans realize Nicks is not coming back to NY next year, right? Nor would he resign with the lions, given the money tied up by stafford/Calvin already. Leshoure and a 3rd for a 13 game rental is hardly a steal for Detroit.


What makes you so certain about that. Do you have some info hat we are not privy to? Facts are:
-We know Cruz is not a true #1WR. He is great at what he does, but can't be expected to line up outside and dominate.
-The Giants are a pass first team. As long as we have Eli Manning, we will remain a pass first offense.
-We do have some contracts coming off our payroll after 2013 which will provide ample room to sign Nicks to a competitive contract.
-The minor comments made out of frustration are vastly blown out of proportion. He has never been a problem in the locker room. He just made an honest comment out of frustration in a 'homecoming' game where he was a total non-factor.

I'm just wondering how you're so sure we don't lock up our 25yr old #1 WR.
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Rockcity


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 1:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IR0NM1KE wrote:
sparty wrote:
All of you Giants fans realize Nicks is not coming back to NY next year, right? Nor would he resign with the lions, given the money tied up by stafford/Calvin already. Leshoure and a 3rd for a 13 game rental is hardly a steal for Detroit.


What makes you so certain about that. Do you have some info hat we are not privy to? Facts are:
-We know Cruz is not a true #1WR. He is great at what he does, but can't be expected to line up outside and dominate.
-The Giants are a pass first team. As long as we have Eli Manning, we will remain a pass first offense.
-We do have some contracts coming off our payroll after 2013 which will provide ample room to sign Nicks to a competitive contract.
-The minor comments made out of frustration are vastly blown out of proportion. He has never been a problem in the locker room. He just made an honest comment out of frustration in a 'homecoming' game where he was a total non-factor.

I'm just wondering how you're so sure we don't lock up our 25yr old #1 WR.
question since you guys think he's worth a 1st plus. How much you think you will be able to sign him for? Its gonna be a lot right?
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Maverick12


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 3:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IDOG_det wrote:
Maverick12 wrote:
Obviously Im still very skeptical about this rumor, but Incarcerated Bob is somewhat of a reliable source on twitter and he's reporting things between Nicks and Detroit are heating up.

Again, take it for what you want, but this rumor is really spreading like wildfire.
Laughing Incarcerated Bob is the least reliable source on twitter. He was the guy that reported that Nnamdi Asomugha had signed with the Jets, about a month before he signed with the Eagles.


False.

Again, I didn't take it too seriously, but he's broke accurate news before Schefter, Mortenson, etc...

Not like he's not well known either...
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diehardlionfan


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can appreciate Nicks ability however some of the values being discussed for him are simply unrealistic.

He has NEVER played a complete season. Nicks is talented but not a top level player. Multiple high picks simply wouldn't happen given injury history, contract status and production. Currently he's simply a rental player.
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bigc421


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 5:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

not saying this will happen in fact it probably wont but the major media outlets do have a history of being pretty petty when it comes to lesser knowns breaking the news before them
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El Duderino


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 5:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bigc421 wrote:
not saying this will happen in fact it probably wont but the major media outlets do have a history of being pretty petty when it comes to lesser knowns breaking the news before them


Yeah ESPN was like that with Deadspin.
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IDOG_det


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 8:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maverick12 wrote:
IDOG_det wrote:
Maverick12 wrote:
Obviously Im still very skeptical about this rumor, but Incarcerated Bob is somewhat of a reliable source on twitter and he's reporting things between Nicks and Detroit are heating up.

Again, take it for what you want, but this rumor is really spreading like wildfire.
Laughing Incarcerated Bob is the least reliable source on twitter. He was the guy that reported that Nnamdi Asomugha had signed with the Jets, about a month before he signed with the Eagles.


False.

Again, I didn't take it too seriously, but he's broke accurate news before Schefter, Mortenson, etc...

Not like he's not well known either...
Trust me on this, he is not legit. He is not a legit journalist, his sources are not real or credible, and while he may be "well known", over 80% of his twitter followers are fake. He even has multiple twitter accounts just to back himself up on things that he has made up or isn't true.

If you don't believe me, ask Reality_Check about Incarcerated Bob.
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