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The Cap and cuts 2013 and 2014
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Meeker


Joined: 01 Apr 2006
Posts: 6724
PostPosted: Tue Jul 02, 2013 2:20 pm    Post subject: The Cap and cuts 2013 and 2014 Reply with quote

The Hawks have several players that will be looking for extensions the next couple years and finding the space will be important...listed are players that would save $1m+ towards the cap, not their cap number. Of course thats WITHOUT factoring in who will replace them on the roster and their cap hit, so the listed number won't be the exact amount saved, it will be less.

These numbers are found at http://overthecap.com/teamcap.php?Team=Seahawks&Year=2013

Bolded are players that are safe without much argument

Numbers in millions
$6.10 Sydney Rice
$4.60 Brandon Mebane
$4.00 Zach Miller
$3.50 Breno Giacomini
$3.30 Michael Bennett

$3.00 Paul McQuistan
$2.50 Michael Robinson
$2.33 Chris Clemons
$1.33 Heath Farwell
$1.32 Chris Maragos
$1.30 Jon Ryan
$1.00 Antoine Winfield


Opinions:
Rice - safe, he will get another year to prove he can stay healthy. I know some think his job is in danger, but I doubt it...he provides things that no one else on the roster has proven at this point.
McQuistan - on the edge, will be making a lot for a backup, but he played fairly well at LT when Okung was out. Could take a paycut.
Robinson - safe, I don't buy Ware knocking him off the roster as a rookie with limited experience at the position. Ware was taken to spend the year learning the playbook and get more experience at the position (likely on the PS IMO) before getting his real shot next year.
Farwell - on the edge, one of the best STers...but to be making that much just for that is questionable. Will have to fight for a spot, and largely depends on the play of the younger guys on STs. I think he is gone.
Maragos - gone, primarily a STer and he is not on Farwells level there...


2014

In 2014 we will be looking at re-sign players like Brandon Browner, Golden Tate, Michael Robinson, Breno Giacomini, etc. and extending players like Earl Thomas and Richard Sherman. We will need to make room...

$7.50 Chris Clemons
$7.30 Sydney Rice
$7.00 Cliff Avril
$6.68 Russell Okung
$5.50 Red Bryant
$5.30 Brandon Mebane
$5.00 Zach Miller
$4.00 Marshawn Lynch
$3.83 Earl Thomas
$3.80 Percy Harvin
$2.30 Max Unger
$1.73 Kam Chancellor

$1.50 Heath Farwell
$1.42 James Carpenter
$1.40 Jon Ryan

Clemons - needs to show that the injury isn't a concern going forward, but Irvin and Avril could make that irrelevant anyways...Likely candidate to be asked for a paycut or be cut.
Rice - needs to prove he can stay healthy and produce. Likely candidate to be asked for a paycut or be cut.
Avril - will be given plenty of opportunities to prove himself this year. Something I believe he does, and we move on from Clemons.
Bryant - needs to prove himself again...Likely candidate to be asked for a paycut or be cut. I think he returns to form and is retained.
Okung - health is the only concern...if he doesn't play the whole way through that will make it one year in four that he has remained healthy and put his future with the franchise in question.
Farwell - same question remains, if he even makes this years roster.
Carpenter - no doubt he is worth it...if he remains healthy

I think Clemons is gone and Sydney takes pay cut giving us some room to work with. Who we re-sign is really up in the air.

Browner won't command a lot on the open market IMO as people recognize his flaws and that he can really put his strength to use here, bullying WRs at the line with safety help over the top, something he can't necessarily do on other teams, but we may also lose our 2 (Browner), 3 (Winfield), and 4 (Thurmond) next FA...so that could give Browner some leverage. Bradley might try and lure him away...I think we could get him back at ~4m/y

Tate could command quite a bit on the open market IMO. I think he would have put 1100+ yards and 10+ TDs up with a veteran QB last year...something I believed he would do this year before we got Harvin. Having all these WRs is nice, but it makes retaining them all that much harder...I really want Tate to stay, but it won't be easy and I'm not confident he will.

Robinson is a good FB, not the best blocking, but great all around...but its a FB and we will probably go with someone younger and cheaper. Going to suck losing the RRR Sad

Giacomini is a solid RT, great run blocker, not so great pass blocker. We could bring him back on a similar contract as his first one, but hopefully one of the younger guys steps up *cough* Bowie *cough* or we could look for one in the draft.

Winfield returning will depend on him...whether he will want to return to the NFL or not. He isn't going to cost a lot so money isn't the main factor.


Your thoughts?
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SoS


Joined: 20 Apr 2013
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 07, 2013 12:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

First of all, great work. I was going to make a thread very similar to this, breaking down the teams' upcoming free agents and salary implications and whatnot to show fans that we're really not that tight against the cap as some believe and we should be able to afford multiple elite players.

Anyways. I think 2013 is a make or break year for 5 players, those being Sidney Rice, Golden Tate, Chris Clemons, Cliff Avril, and Breno Giacomini. I include the first 4 because I believe they are directly in competition with one another for a 2014 roster spot. Rice and Tate should use their regular season play to essentially tell this team which one of them is more valuable going forward. Rice has the early edge simply because we KNOW the team views him as a #1 WR (or at least they did at one time) and he's already been guaranteed salary that Golden has not. With that said, if Golden comes out and has a monster 2013 season, I could very easily see us restructuring or cutting Rice, as I've said in the past.

Along those same lines, I feel Clemons and Avril are in direct competition with one another during this season. Considering their 2014 salary is a mere 500k difference (and without knowing any of the other cap implications) you have to believe that the team will keep the player who performs better and will either restructure or cut the guy who does not play as well.

In both instances, the team has almost all of the leverage. They can essentially cherry-pick the guys that are doing what they're paid to do for the team.

Looking at future free agents, I like to think the FO has a plan. Breno will have to show that he's worth starting RT money this season. Personally, I think the team looks to move on from him as he gets starters money elsewhere and he's definitely a player we can improve upon.

Brandon Browner will be a very interesting case to keep an eye on. I think the front office has built incredible depth at the CB position and have put players at the safety position to not require two lockdown CBs, but Browner has been a great player for us and it'd be a shame to lose him. Nonetheless, considering his age and our depth, I'm hoping the team moves on from him and lets a young guy like Tharold Simon step in for a fraction of the cost. People keep talking about the team losing great players dues to pinching pennies, and I think Browner is one of the first casualties we see of that philosophy.

I know you only went 2 years deep, but I think the writing is pretty much on the wall for Marshawn Lynch to be done with this team prior to his contract ending. His guaranteed money is done after this season, so he'll have to perform to stay on the team (which is actually a good thing). But similar to CB, the front office is building great depth at the RB position and Lynch has had lingering back issues that may creep up on him in a serious way if he keeps running the way he does. I think we'll get 2 good years out of Lynch and see an Alexander-like decline to where he's released from the team.

Guys like Mike Robinson shouldn't be on this team by this time next year. Hell, I could make a case for Robinson not making it this year.

I completely agree that McQuistin will need to take a paycut to remain as a veteran utility guy. I like what the staff did late in this past draft to try and find a guy to replace that utility role.

Personally, with all of those moves made, I think the team finds a way to resign both Earl Thomas and Richard Sherman.
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chpjns15


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 08, 2013 3:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dont forget Michael Brockers. He is not necessarily in a competition for a roster spot, but he did only sign a one year contract. I think it is pretty simple with him: if he performs we will resign him long term, otherwise he is going to leave.

SoS wrote:

Brandon Browner will be a very interesting case to keep an eye on. I think the front office has built incredible depth at the CB position and have put players at the safety position to not require two lockdown CBs, but Browner has been a great player for us and it'd be a shame to lose him. Nonetheless, considering his age and our depth, I'm hoping the team moves on from him and lets a young guy like Tharold Simon step in for a fraction of the cost. People keep talking about the team losing great players dues to pinching pennies, and I think Browner is one of the first casualties we see of that philosophy.

I know you only went 2 years deep, but I think the writing is pretty much on the wall for Marshawn Lynch to be done with this team prior to his contract ending. His guaranteed money is done after this season, so he'll have to perform to stay on the team (which is actually a good thing). But similar to CB, the front office is building great depth at the RB position and Lynch has had lingering back issues that may creep up on him in a serious way if he keeps running the way he does. I think we'll get 2 good years out of Lynch and see an Alexander-like decline to where he's released from the team.


I dont see anyway BB is still on this team after this year. IMO he is a product of system (I kind of hate to say it) but we didn't lose a beat when Lane or Maxwell replaced him. He is going to demand a bigger contract and I just doubt we will give it to him.

I saw an interesting stat that showed that RBs who reach 1500 carries in their careers see a huge drop in production after that. Lynch is at 1470. I have a feeling that we will see one more big year out of Lynch, but after this year I think his production is going to drop significantly. However, there are some exceptions to this rule, such as AP, who is now over 1700 carries after last season (but lets be honest, thats AP).
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Meeker


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 09, 2013 9:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thought this thread died without responses for some reason.


SoS wrote:
Anyways. I think 2013 is a make or break year for 5 players, those being Sidney Rice, Golden Tate, Chris Clemons, Cliff Avril, and Breno Giacomini. I include the first 4 because I believe they are directly in competition with one another for a 2014 roster spot. Rice and Tate should use their regular season play to essentially tell this team which one of them is more valuable going forward. Rice has the early edge simply because we KNOW the team views him as a #1 WR (or at least they did at one time) and he's already been guaranteed salary that Golden has not. With that said, if Golden comes out and has a monster 2013 season, I could very easily see us restructuring or cutting Rice, as I've said in the past.

Along those same lines, I feel Clemons and Avril are in direct competition with one another during this season. Considering their 2014 salary is a mere 500k difference (and without knowing any of the other cap implications) you have to believe that the team will keep the player who performs better and will either restructure or cut the guy who does not play as well.

In both instances, the team has almost all of the leverage. They can essentially cherry-pick the guys that are doing what they're paid to do for the team.


Agreed here, although I'd include Red Bryant on the list. Also age will factor in the Clemons vs. Avril, even if Clemons plays better, he could be shown the door if Avril shows enough.


SoS wrote:
Looking at future free agents, I like to think the FO has a plan. Breno will have to show that he's worth starting RT money this season. Personally, I think the team looks to move on from him as he gets starters money elsewhere and he's definitely a player we can improve upon.


I see Breno being gone after this year as well. Even if he plays very well, we have more significant players to pay elsewhere.


SoS wrote:
Brandon Browner will be a very interesting case to keep an eye on. I think the front office has built incredible depth at the CB position and have put players at the safety position to not require two lockdown CBs, but Browner has been a great player for us and it'd be a shame to lose him. Nonetheless, considering his age and our depth, I'm hoping the team moves on from him and lets a young guy like Tharold Simon step in for a fraction of the cost. People keep talking about the team losing great players dues to pinching pennies, and I think Browner is one of the first casualties we see of that philosophy.


Yeah, Browner is likely gone. Unless he is willing to take less, or Sherman takes less than expected to help keep Browner...


SoS wrote:
I know you only went 2 years deep, but I think the writing is pretty much on the wall for Marshawn Lynch to be done with this team prior to his contract ending. His guaranteed money is done after this season, so he'll have to perform to stay on the team (which is actually a good thing). But similar to CB, the front office is building great depth at the RB position and Lynch has had lingering back issues that may creep up on him in a serious way if he keeps running the way he does. I think we'll get 2 good years out of Lynch and see an Alexander-like decline to where he's released from the team.


Agreed here as well...his running style is not conductive to a long career, and we have a FO that looks forward to lessen the blow. Michael will be ready to take over when the time comes.


SoS wrote:
Guys like Mike Robinson shouldn't be on this team by this time next year. Hell, I could make a case for Robinson not making it this year.


I'm not sure they would trust the young FBs at this point, but who knows. Goodbye RRR in the near future.


SoS wrote:
I completely agree that McQuistin will need to take a paycut to remain as a veteran utility guy. I like what the staff did late in this past draft to try and find a guy to replace that utility role.


Good thing most of our youth is versatile and Alvin Bailey has really stepped up at OT...who would have expected that lol. Although he is playing with the 1's atm, I'm sure many don't expect that to last...


SoS wrote:
Personally, with all of those moves made, I think the team finds a way to resign both Earl Thomas and Richard Sherman.


Don't see either going anywhere.


chpjns15 wrote:
Dont forget Michael Brockers. He is not necessarily in a competition for a roster spot, but he did only sign a one year contract. I think it is pretty simple with him: if he performs we will resign him long term, otherwise he is going to leave.


Bennett Wink If he does perform, I see us having a hard time re-signing him along with all of our young guys. We're not in dire straights cap wise, but we don't have a ton of money to throw around either. Next offseason is going to be very interesting...


chpjns15 wrote:
I dont see anyway BB is still on this team after this year. IMO he is a product of system (I kind of hate to say it) but we didn't lose a beat when Lane or Maxwell replaced him. He is going to demand a bigger contract and I just doubt we will give it to him.


Although I think he is gone as well, he may not fetch all that much on the open market as people realize his deficiencies, and we land him back on a pretty friendly deal.
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NFL_Announcer


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2013 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't consider Zach Miller safe at all. He has no competition at the position currently, is not the athletic superfreak mold Carroll/Schneider love, and has been a bit absent for us in certain plays. He's a consistent player that generates production but not a game threat. He's also starting to show injury concerns.

Frankly I see Miller being released this year and Carroll/Schneider making a play to get Sefarian Jenkins. Jenkins will drop to late 1st because of his off field issues. Mocks have him going mid 1st and all I do is laugh at the stupidity of Madden dorks hoping their team drafts him.

He's a liability and has attitude problems and that will scare off teams like the Bucs who need a TE considering all their problem children they just released/traded and various other teams. Seattle doesn't care about off field issues and head cases so it makes perfect sense Jenkins falls to late 20s and Seattle grabs him.

Austin will be a day 1 starter and that will mean goodbye to Miller.
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Meeker


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2013 3:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NFL_Announcer wrote:
I don't consider Zach Miller safe at all. He has no competition at the position currently, is not the athletic superfreak mold Carroll/Schneider love, and has been a bit absent for us in certain plays. He's a consistent player that generates production but not a game threat. He's also starting to show injury concerns.

Frankly I see Miller being released this year and Carroll/Schneider making a play to get Sefarian Jenkins. Jenkins will drop to late 1st because of his off field issues. Mocks have him going mid 1st and all I do is laugh at the stupidity of Madden dorks hoping their team drafts him.

He's a liability and has attitude problems and that will scare off teams like the Bucs who need a TE considering all their problem children they just released/traded and various other teams. Seattle doesn't care about off field issues and head cases so it makes perfect sense Jenkins falls to late 20s and Seattle grabs him.

Austin will be a day 1 starter and that will mean goodbye to Miller.


I'm confused on how the lack of competition points to him being cut? Also, you think he will be cut in 2013? Thats a bit crazy IMO. Like you said, he has no competition at his position and I doubt McGrath or Willson show enough to make Miller expandable next season. I was hoping McCoy would take another leap this year, but that obviously didn't work out. Sorry, but they're not going to hand the starting job to some rookie at a position they seem to value. Miller has proven to be a fantastic blocker and stepped up as a receiver when asked to (like the playoffs). $4m and $5m is not a lot to pay for a TE of his caliber. If they were consider cutting him, they would have done so before he received his $3m roster bonus. $4m (2013) and $5m (2014) is not that much to pay a TE of his caliber.
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SoS


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2013 3:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Meeker is right. Quite frankly, your scenario sounds like wishful thinking for us to land ASJ Laughing

The front office raves about Miller's value to this team and they already paid him his bonus this season. He's 100% a Seahawk this season and he'll likely continue to be a Seahawk for the foreseeable future, ideally on a restructured contract.
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Meeker


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 17, 2013 2:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Meeker wrote:
$4m and $5m is not a lot to pay for a TE of his caliber. If they were consider cutting him, they would have done so before he received his $3m roster bonus. $4m (2013) and $5m (2014) is not that much to pay a TE of his caliber.


In case you were wondering, $4m and $5m is not a lot to pay for a TE of Miller's caliber.

Noticed I said that twice when I re-read my post lol.

Some things have changed since I first made this. Carpenter didn't stay healthy to challenge McQuistan for the LG spot, and McQuistan will likely start the season there. Maragos is at worst, the 4th best safety on the roster and will likely make it. With Maragos and the great play of some younger guys on STs, I think Farwell is gone, despite his good play at LB.
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Pie Romania


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 1:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm going to be completely honest here....

I would love Seferian-Jenkins in a Hawks uniform. He's is very talented, huge and would be an asset to this team. However, if I put on my PC/JS shades, I'm leaning towards Colt Lyerla if I have the choice based on their playing style and what this team has targeted on offense in recent years. Not saying Lyerla is immune to faults; I question his character....but the Hawks have been looking for size, speed, versatility and physicality. Check out some clips of him. He doesn't shy away from contact and refuses to go down in most instances, carrying defenders with him down the field at ease. He's lined up at RB and also has looked outstanding blocking for a guy his size.

ASJ should be picked before Colt Lyerla IMO. I just think, for the Seahawks, Colt Lyerla would fit into their "plan" much better. Mike Evans, WR from Texas A&M would make me happy if we lose Tate or re-sign him and cut Rice, but I'm not sure he declares this early.
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sirensong


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 1:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pie Romania wrote:
I'm going to be completely honest here....

I would love Seferian-Jenkins in a Hawks uniform. He's is very talented, huge and would be an asset to this team. However, if I put on my PC/JS shades, I'm leaning towards Colt Lyerla if I have the choice based on their playing style and what this team has targeted on offense in recent years. Not saying Lyerla is immune to faults; I question his character....but the Hawks have been looking for size, speed, versatility and physicality. Check out some clips of him. He doesn't shy away from contact and refuses to go down in most instances, carrying defenders with him down the field at ease. He's lined up at RB and also has looked outstanding blocking for a guy his size.

ASJ should be picked before Colt Lyerla IMO. I just think, for the Seahawks, Colt Lyerla would fit into their "plan" much better. Mike Evans, WR from Texas A&M would make me happy if we lose Tate or re-sign him and cut Rice, but I'm not sure he declares this early.


I love Sid and he's the leader of that group. But ill be choked if we lose Tate and keep Sidney. If Stephen Williams can breakout out he could replace Sidney while a guy like Tate is much harder to replace and has alot more upside and future.
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Pie Romania


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2013 1:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sirensong wrote:
Pie Romania wrote:
I'm going to be completely honest here....

I would love Seferian-Jenkins in a Hawks uniform. He's is very talented, huge and would be an asset to this team. However, if I put on my PC/JS shades, I'm leaning towards Colt Lyerla if I have the choice based on their playing style and what this team has targeted on offense in recent years. Not saying Lyerla is immune to faults; I question his character....but the Hawks have been looking for size, speed, versatility and physicality. Check out some clips of him. He doesn't shy away from contact and refuses to go down in most instances, carrying defenders with him down the field at ease. He's lined up at RB and also has looked outstanding blocking for a guy his size.

ASJ should be picked before Colt Lyerla IMO. I just think, for the Seahawks, Colt Lyerla would fit into their "plan" much better. Mike Evans, WR from Texas A&M would make me happy if we lose Tate or re-sign him and cut Rice, but I'm not sure he declares this early.


I love Sid and he's the leader of that group. But ill be choked if we lose Tate and keep Sidney. If Stephen Williams can breakout out he could replace Sidney while a guy like Tate is much harder to replace and has alot more upside and future.


Don't get me wrong, I love having Rice on the team and he's a valuable asset to us, but at the same time, like you said, he's easier to replace than Tate and would free up some money in the process. Brandon Coleman or Mike Evans would make me happy as potential replacements if Stephen Williams seems to fizz out.
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chpjns15


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 5:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For both moneys and skills sake, I hope we cut Rice after this season, and give new contracts to both Tate and Baldwin. Both Tate and Baldwin are better players than Rice IMO, are much more reliable and cheaper. Hell, both of them together might still cost less than Rice. Ontop of that:

Tate
Harvin
Kearse
Baldwin

sounds soooo much better than

Rice
Harvin
Kearse
???
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Pie Romania


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 5:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chpjns15 wrote:
For both moneys and skills sake, I hope we cut Rice after this season, and give new contracts to both Tate and Baldwin. Both Tate and Baldwin are better players than Rice IMO, are much more reliable and cheaper. Hell, both of them together might still cost less than Rice. Ontop of that:

Tate
Harvin
Kearse
Baldwin

sounds soooo much better than

Rice
Harvin
Kearse
???


Throw Mike Evans in there too if he declares and is available in the 2nd Razz
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Tatupu_64


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 6:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whether or not we cut Rice depends a lot on how Williams looks throughout the year

And I would see no reason to draft a WR in the second...
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sirensong


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 08, 2013 6:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tatupu_64 wrote:
Whether or not we cut Rice depends a lot on how Williams looks throughout the year

And I would see no reason to draft a WR in the second...


To me its Kearse that will have a chance to take a starting role. Him and Wilson have great chemistry and Kearse is a much more well rounded WR than Williams. I like Williams but he looks like a 1 trick pony.

Tate and Kearse outside, Harvin and Baldwin inside is a very capable and dynamic group going forward in my opinion.
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