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TT as great GM must do this...
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NCPackFan


Joined: 12 Jan 2013
Posts: 2000
Location: Kinston, NC
PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 1:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Setting up the deep play and multiple formations/alignments from the same personnel is more from that school than slants and swing passes.[/quote]

Then how do you set up the deep play withOUT slants and swing passes?

I understand what you're trying to say here, but I think the bigger issue with the offense was the ZBS; it was way too inconsistent. The issue I have with McCarthy's play-calling is that he calls for too many deep passes consistently and abandons what works from time to time.

Someone needs to have a come-to-Jesus moment and let him know that he's better off mixing up the play calls instead of calling the same play or two over and over and over and over again. Kinda predictable...
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PackFan4Life


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 1:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NCPackFan wrote:
Setting up the deep play and multiple formations/alignments from the same personnel is more from that school than slants and swing passes.


Then how do you set up the deep play withOUT slants and swing passes?

I understand what you're trying to say here, but I think the bigger issue with the offense was the ZBS; it was way too inconsistent. The issue I have with McCarthy's play-calling is that he calls for too many deep passes consistently and abandons what works from time to time.

Someone needs to have a come-to-Jesus moment and let him know that he's better off mixing up the play calls instead of calling the same play or two over and over and over and over again. Kinda predictable...[/quote]

Every play has at least one deep route. On the 5 wide set-ups, there is usually at least 2. Sometimes 3. There is 1 or 2 underneath routes and 1-2 intermediate routes as well. When they are 3 wide, there is a run option.

In the end, which throw gets made depends on which route A-rod determines to be open and is worth his risk/reward. A-rod needed to be reigned in earlier this season to make the adjustment and run the run instead of the pass in more of the run-pass options. The middle of the field was open. I am sure A-rod would choose the run option more if he had someone other than Saturday up front earlier in the season and he had more confidence in who he was handing off too. I think everyone is well aware and hoping that more talent at RB is added this offseason.
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ugLymayNe


Joined: 31 Oct 2006
Posts: 12358
Location: Wisconsin
PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 1:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So as a great GM, Ted Thompson has to channel his inner Jerry Jones? Seriously? That is the best you can come up with? Our offense was a revolving door on the OL and at RB - injuries are no excuse but we had Ryan Grant taking carries at the end of the year....a busted, old, slow Ryan Grant. We were also without Jennings for majority of the season, Jordy for parts, and had drops galore from the TE position for the first half as well. We were down to our 4th OT and back up center by the end of the year.

I could see someone blaming McCarthy for not having a physical offensive line(you can be physical and use the ZBS, you know...) but that offense didn't lose us a playoff game this year.


And PF4L, I completely agree with you about Saturday and who Rodgers was handing the ball off to. There is a reason why we saw the ball on the ground much more once EDS was at center. Part of the reason we didn't see the ball in the middle of the field much in the first half of the season was because of Finley's case of the dropsies and Rodgers completely ignoring him for games on end. I'm hoping Green comes back strong this year because his knee clearly broke down towards the end of the year. Add another RB to the mix, hopefully a downhill runner that can pick up a blitz or two(Stepfan Taylor is the guy I think would be a perfect fit) and that is three backs I can trust(Green/Harris/new guy).
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spilltray


Joined: 09 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NCPackFan wrote:
Then how do you set up the deep play withOUT slants and swing passes?

I understand what you're trying to say here, but I think the bigger issue with the offense was the ZBS; it was way too inconsistent. The issue I have with McCarthy's play-calling is that he calls for too many deep passes consistently and abandons what works from time to time.

Someone needs to have a come-to-Jesus moment and let him know that he's better off mixing up the play calls instead of calling the same play or two over and over and over and over again. Kinda predictable...


It's combo routes, more outs and underneath than quick hitter slants or dump off swing passes.
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KManX89


Joined: 25 Oct 2012
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Location: Charlotte, North Carolina
PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 2:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HyponGrey wrote:
Don't we already have a "Take the playcalling away from MM" Thread? If I remember right the general consensus was roaring laughter.

Found it:
http://www.footballsfuture.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=510850
There was also this one:
http://www.footballsfuture.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=511678


I didn't say they should take the playcalling away from MM, I said the OC should get more involved, as in actually discuss each play with MM via headset like any OC is supposed to do (heck, many teams even give the entirety of playcalling to the OC). Like I said, it just doesn't feel like Clements has had the same level of involvement in the plays as Philbin last year because of the noticeable dropoff in stats from the year before. Yes, there were the injuries to OL and WR, but even when Rodgers has had sufficient time in the pocket (or sometimes, even all the time in the world), he's had trouble reading routes at times this year, whereas last year, the ball was in and out of his hands instantly and completed downfield. IDK if that's because of the difference in schemes between Philbin and Clements, or whatever, but like I said, it just doesn't have the same feel.
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PackFan4Life


Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Posts: 4061
Location: De Pere, WI
PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 2:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KManX89 wrote:
HyponGrey wrote:
Don't we already have a "Take the playcalling away from MM" Thread? If I remember right the general consensus was roaring laughter.

Found it:
http://www.footballsfuture.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=510850
There was also this one:
http://www.footballsfuture.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=511678


I didn't say they should take the playcalling away from MM, I said the OC should get more involved, as in actually discuss each play with MM via headset like any OC is supposed to do (heck, many teams even give the entirety of playcalling to the OC). Like I said, it just doesn't feel like Clements has had the same level of involvement in the plays as Philbin last year because of the noticeable dropoff in stats from the year before. Yes, there were the injuries to OL and WR, but even when Rodgers has had sufficient time in the pocket (or sometimes, even all the time in the world), he's had trouble reading routes at times this year, whereas last year, the ball was in and out of his hands instantly and completed downfield. IDK if that's because of the difference in schemes between Philbin and Clements, or whatever, but like I said, it just doesn't have the same feel.


You do know that Philbins primary responsibility for the offense was to help scout and divise strategy moreso than add to calling plays? I do not think that role changed with Clements moving in. MM is pretty much the sole play caller based on the strategy agreed upon.
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Kampman74


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 7:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think getting an improved oline (early center in the draft) or getting a good RB early, which sucks cause it doesn't seem like they are any studs in the draft or improving the pass rush are the things that TT should do and then we will be just fine.
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GreenGold12


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 9:29 pm    Post subject: Re: TT as great GM must do this... Reply with quote

CentralFC wrote:
Pack177AN wrote:
CentralFC wrote:
Pack177AN wrote:
I fully believe in TT and MM as General Manager and Head Coach respectively. MM is the right HC for the future going forward, however IMO he needs to put his ego aside on this one.

IMO this would never happen but id like TT to sit with MM and have them agree to bring in an offensive coordinator. MM's offensive play calling has not been bad but its not been great by any means. And not just an OC to bounce ideas off, but to actually take over play calling. I mean lets face both teams in the Super Bowl have an OC and DC.

So if TT was a smart GM and asked for thoughts on possible OC canidates. Who would you like to see fill that position? College or someone within the NFL? The NFC whooped the AFC in the probowl. If im not mistaken the Packers assistant coach was calling the plays.

What do you think??


Logical fallacies galore.



CentralFC let me ask you were you happy with the offensive this year? If its a possibility of no then you have to at least entertain the thought. Thats TT's job.


Again, logical fallacies galore.

- Aaron played sub par by his monstrous standards.
- We should punish those who play sub par.
- Therefore we should release Aaron Rodgers.

See where this creates quite a dilemma? This offense was the best in the league given its circumstances.


Since you keep bringing up logical fallacies I'll point out that the way you applied your argument was a textbook logical fallacy in itself, reductio ad absurdum.
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TheGreatZepp


Joined: 27 Jan 2010
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 9:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There are so many moving parts and really no one has more scouting film and gets to see in game adjustments more then McCarthy does. How cute do you really want to get with the football? McCarthy's a good mix of traditional smash mouth and modern creative spread.

Bash the "predictable" play calling. the third and one FB dives and the like but those are bread and butter plays that the great teams win on a regular basis and those start with the line. You need to believe your line can get you two yards on any play, that was not the case until the end of the year with the Dietrich-Smith, Sitton, Barclay side of the line. If you can't win the battle up front, you're playing with fire.

The quick slant... that's Jennings' play and formerly Driver's. It's dangerous if you aren't completely in sync as it can get jumped. Cobb had a great year but he doesn't provide the same route crispness and sideline threat that Jennings does. That ability in my opinion is what made Jennings so dangerous in the slot and slants. You can't bite on the slant or Jennings will take you over the top.

The seemingly bizarre fake punts and gimmick plays... they don't always work but they always give opponents yet another play to scout and game plan for.
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incognito_man


Joined: 11 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 9:41 pm    Post subject: Re: TT as great GM must do this... Reply with quote

GreenGold12 wrote:


Since you keep bringing up logical fallacies I'll point out that the way you applied your argument was a textbook logical fallacy in itself, reductio ad absurdum.


pssshhh...how would YOU know? Do you have a degree in mathematics or logic? If not, your stance is almost certainly incorrect.
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svp


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 11:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looks fallic from a distance.
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RashaanSalaami


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 11:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

incognito_man wrote:
It HAD been too long since a TT ego post Laughing


2 years since the Super Bowl? Not a bad run.
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